Protestants and the Veil

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HailMary

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If protestants are so into reading the bible and trying to do what it says, how do they explain why the vast majority of protestant women do not wear veils?

1 Cor 11:1-6
Be ye followers of me, as I also am of Christ.
Now I praise you, brethren, that in all things you are mindful of me: and keep my ordinances as I have delivered them to you.
But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
Every man praying or prophesying with his head covered, disgraceth his head.
But every woman praying or prophesying with her head not covered, disgraceth her head: for it is all one as if she were shaven.
For if a woman be not covered, let her be shorn. But if it be a shame to a woman to be shorn or made bald, let her cover her head.
 
It is usually small sects that wear head coverings in response to 1Cor.11. They are extremely conservative and narrowly interpret the scriptures.

I was curious about the whole head covering issue so I did a search, just using the phrase ‘head coverings.’ A ton of stuff popped up, including entire websites devoted to the subject, as well as on-line stores for purchase of said veils.
 
Many of them are Jewish, and there is one seller on eBay who is Catholic and makes veils specifically for ladies to wear to Mass.

~Liza
 
HailMary said:
If protestants are so into reading the bible and trying to do what it says, how do they explain why the vast majority of protestant women do not wear veils?
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Because they recognize that Paul was speaking to that there Corinthian culture, rather than making a statement for all times and all places.
 
I asked All for Him that once, and never got an answer, but a protestant minister did give me harrasing PMS.

She had to check with her pastor.:rolleyes:
HailMary said:
If protestants are so into reading the bible and trying to do what it says, how do they explain why the vast majority of protestant women do not wear veils?

1 Cor 11:1-6
Be ye followers of me, as I also am of Christ.
Now I praise you, brethren, that in all things you are mindful of me: and keep my ordinances as I have delivered them to you.
But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
Every man praying or prophesying with his head covered, disgraceth his head.
But every woman praying or prophesying with her head not covered, disgraceth her head: for it is all one as if she were shaven.
For if a woman be not covered, let her be shorn. But if it be a shame to a woman to be shorn or made bald, let her cover her head.
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scottm said:
Because they recognize that Paul was speaking to that there Corinthian culture, rather than making a statement for all times and all places.
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Even if that was the case, one point I wanted to squeeze out of my protestant brethren was, lets say I agree with what you said, that it was a culture thing, how did the text reveal that? By using Sola Scriptura, you could not substantiate that because you had to go to a extra-biblical source.
 
When Paul wrote his epistles, they were addressing problems in the specific early churches at the time he was writing them. That’s where I get the idea that it is a culture issue.

However, when someone is a Sola Scripture person, whatever was written then is applicable today; sort of like doing a cut-and-paste from Paul’s day to our day, without taking into consideration that times change.

It’s a question of first things first and second things second. The first things (the basics of the Christain faith, for ex) should not be changed to fit the world around them; but the second things, which don’t impact one’s salvation or doctrines of the faith, certainly can be changed.

Just MHO.
 
There are many Protestant sects that order their women to wear veils in Church, but most of them are small and rigidly hostile. Of the ones I have seen, they often cite the lack of a veil in their list of reasons their church is “the only church following the Bible.”

That being said, are Catholics supposed to wear the veil in church? I used to think the answer was yes, but just a couple weeks ago I was in St. Patrick’s, and while there were hundreds of women, I don’t think I saw a single one with her hair covered. 😦

By the way, to HailMary, I see Qorbono in your sig. Are you a Maronite? If so, do Maronite women supposed to cover their hair in Church? I’ve been to Syrian Orthodox services, and can testify that almost every woman covers her hair there (even in American churches, like St. Mark’s in Teaneck, NJ!).

Finally, HailyMary, I have another question: is there a version of the Hail Mary in Syriac? If so, could you point me towards where I could see it? Thanks!
 
HailMary said:
Even if that was the case, one point I wanted to squeeze out of my protestant brethren was, lets say I agree with what you said, that it was a culture thing, how did the text reveal that? By using Sola Scriptura, you could not substantiate that because you had to go to a extra-biblical source.
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Ah, but Protestants define “sola scriptura” to allow cultural, sociological, and anthropological studies of biblical people and places. We have to grant them their definition before we attack, see.
 
scottm said:
Ah, but Protestants define “sola scriptura” to allow cultural, sociological, and anthropological studies of biblical people and places. We have to grant them their definition before we attack, see.
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So then, by that definition, which is not the definition that Martin Luther put forth, is a admission that the bible does not contain everything you need to understand it properly and that is it not “self-explaining” since you would have to have go to other sources.
 
scottm said:
Because they recognize that Paul was speaking to that there Corinthian culture, rather than making a statement for all times and all places.
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Would that not violate one of the principle “proofs” texts for Sola Scriptura that my separated brethren usually quote?

2 Tim 3:16
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness
 
HailMary said:
Would that not violate one of the principle “proofs” texts for Sola Scriptura that my separated brethren usually quote?

2 Tim 3:16
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness
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No, it wouldn’t.
 
HailMary said:
So then, by that definition, which is not the definition that Martin Luther put forth, is a admission that the bible does not contain everything you need to understand it properly and that is it not “self-explaining” since you would have to have go to other sources.
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None of the credal statements on sola scriptura claim that everything you need to know in order to understand the scriptures is contained within the scriptures themselves. Sola scriptura does not eliminate the church, elders, history, teachers, etc.

BTW, can you post what it is that Martin Luther put forth for us?
 
HailMary said:
So then, by that definition, which is not the definition that Martin Luther put forth, is a admission that the bible does not contain everything you need to understand it properly and that is it not “self-explaining” since you would have to have go to other sources.
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I disagree with your claim about Martin Luther’s definition. He and the Reformers included outside influences in their “sola scriptura” readings of the Bible.
 
Many African-American Baptist women wear hats to church. Veils are not popular, but hats are.
 
Calvinator said:
None of the credal statements on sola scriptura claim that everything you need to know in order to understand the scriptures is contained within the scriptures themselves. Sola scriptura does not eliminate the church, elders, history, teachers, etc.

BTW, can you post what it is that Martin Luther put forth for us?
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Thats another thread which I care not to discuss but I will simply quote this and leave it at that. And anyways does it even matter?
Protestants like yourself today, can simply modify his teachings as they wish and add or subtract to it, as suits them since that is the spirit and fruits of Protestantism.

The truth is, you can’t explain why your women violate this, which appears to be a very harsh mandate, WITHOUT appeal to history or whatever article you want to mix into the “definition” of Sola Scriptura.

Can you prove to me from the bible alone that this command by St. Paul is no longer valid? Isn’t that the usual question you hear when Protestants question things like Infant Baptism, Perpetual Virginity of Mary, the Papacy, etc?
 
HailMary said:
Thats another thread which I care not to discuss but I will simply quote this and leave it at that. And anyways does it even matter?
Protestants like yourself today, can simply modify his teachings as they wish and add or subtract to it, as suits them since that is the spirit and fruits of Protestantism.
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You have made your misunderstanding of sola scriptura a major part of this thread. It is a complete and utter cop out to not back up your claims. Please don’t send me to some catholic apologetics site that discusses their misconceptions of sola scriptura, post something from Luther or the credal statements on sola scriptura to back up your (baseless) claims.

Martin Luther is not some kind of protestant pope where everyone has to be in lock step w/ his every opinion. But, that said, you have yet to post what Luther taught on the subject. You have made grandiose claims w/out any back up.

I susect you have no idea what was taught during the reformation and are relying on catholic pop apologetics but maybe I am wrong, so please prove me wrong. Go to Luther, the Westminster Confession, the London Baptist Confession, etc.
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hailmary:
The truth is, you can’t explain why your women violate this, which appears to be a very harsh mandate, WITHOUT appeal to history or whatever article you want to mix into the “definition” of Sola Scriptura.
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But as of yet you haven’t posted a single thing from any of the credal statments on sola scriptura or Luther that would disallow one to go outside the Bible for help. Please don’t send me to someones opinion on what sola scriptura is, post something from Luther or the credal statements on sola scriptura to back up your baseless claims about the doctrine.
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hailmary:
Can you prove to me from the bible alone that this command by St. Paul is no longer valid? Isn’t that the usual question you hear when Protestants question things like Infant Baptism, Perpetual Virginity of Mary, the Papacy, etc?
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I’m not sure I can prove anything to you if you if I can’t prove your definition of sola scriptura isn’t what was taught during the reformation.

You have made your misunderstanding of sola scriptura a major part of the thread. You should either back up your claims or admit that your definition of sola scriptura is much more stringent than what was taught at the reformation.
 
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