Protestants coming home slowly but surely

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Donald Charles Lacy, a retired United Methodist minister, author, teacher and ecumenist says, “It is devotion to the Blessed Mother that helps unite us as Christians. When Protestants lose their widespread hang-up that Roman Catholics have worshipped and do worship her, they can perceive by the power of the Holy Spirit an authentic ecumenism that calls us to be one.”
The following is by: Daniel R. Gangler

We will soon enter the season of Advent culminating in the 12 days of Christmas leading to Epiphany. Like Roman Catholics and Orthodox Christians, our devotion is to Jesus Christ who we believe to be part of the triune God – Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

Unlike Roman Catholics and Orthodox Christians, we, as Protestants, give little devotion to who they call the Blessed Virgin Mary, Mother of God. As important as Jesus is, being the center of Christian faith, His mother takes a role second only to Him with most Christians in the world.

Why does Mary take an almost subservient role in Protestant Christianity (with 647 million members worldwide), when the overwhelmingly dominate Roman Catholic Church (1.1 billion members) and Christian Orthodox churches (300 million members), venerate her as the Blessed Virgin Mary?

According to the Rev. Dr. Donald Charles Lacy of Muncie, a retired Indiana United Methodist pastor and scholar about Mary, she continued to be the second most prominent person in Christianity at the beginning of the Protestant Reformation (begun 1517). The Virgin Mary as the Mother of God was part of Martin Luther’s (1483-1546), John Calvin’s (1509-1564) and many other reformation leaders’ faith.

“As Protestant faith gained strength and moved away from Catholicism, second and third generation Protestant leaders moved away from devotion to Mary. Yes, she is the mother of Jesus, but for the vast majority of Christians in the world, she also is venerated and called the Mother of God.”

For Lacy, if we, as Protestants in general and United Methodists in particular, would renew our historic devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary, such a move could act as a bridge to ecumenical union with the rest of the “one holy catholic (universal) and apostolic church” (referred to in the Nicene Creed found in the United Methodist Hymnal on page 880).

Even as far back as 1983, Lacy wrote, “It is devotion to the Blessed Mother that helps unite us as Christians. When Protestants lose their widespread hang-up that Roman Catholics have worshipped and do worship her, they can perceive by the power of the Holy Spirit an authentic ecumenism that calls us to be one.”

In a recent interview with Together, Lacy said, “United Methodists and Protestant Christians need to join their Catholic and Orthodox siblings in paying devotion to her – not worshipping her, but giving her the rightful place as second only to her Son.”

Why?
Lacy says and has said for four decades, “with the primacy of these two historic groups (Catholic and Orthodox), because of them coming directly from the wellsprings of the ancient Church of Christ and the Apostles and their special emphasis on the Blessed Virgin Mary for centuries, we have an ecumenical barrier to overcome.”

How important is it to overcome this barrier?
Lacy says, “To fulfill the ‘call to be one’ in the seventeenth chapter of John’s Gospel, we must look humbly and sincerely at her place among all those who profess the name of her Son. This is an imperative issue needing resolution for the sake of Christian unity in a world that desperately needs for us to be united to confront those who would destroy us and have the means to do so.”

When asked if we pay more attention to Mary, will our behavior strengthen our ecumenical ties to Catholicism and Orthodoxy? – Lacy said, “Yes.” He further said fragmented Christian faith is a concern in order to deal with other ideologies and theologies such as radical Islamic groups who are especially anti-Christian. That’s a compelling reason why Lacy believes this is an imperative issue.

Those seven actions include:

Putting aside wearisome academia and dull theology,
Opening the door for mainline Protestants to catch a glimpse of Mary’s importance,
Bringing Anglicans, Catholics and Orthodox Christians into our churches for presentations about Mary,
Bringing the strongest female personage to the stage for Christ’s people,
Elevating “our Blessed Mother’s” significance in Protestant churches,
Bringing presentations about the Virgin Mary to civic groups, and
Bringing Mary into partnership in the Faith as one leading others to her Son.
Lacy says, “Mary is a necessary and integral part of our theology and has nothing to do with worshipping her… She is part of our Christian faith, is a strong image of feminism and is only second to Jesus Christ in power and influence – her power comes from her holiness.”

For more information, visit THE ECUMENICAL SOCIETY OF THE BLESSED VIRGIN MARY www.esbvm.org.uk/. Readers can contact Dr. Lacy at DLacy33@msn.com. The book Mary for the Love & Glory of God is available at www.amazon.com.

Dr. Donald Charles Lacy is a retired United Methodist minister, author, teacher and ecumenist. He is a native of Henry County; a graduate of Center High School in Delaware County; received a BS and MA from Ball State Teachers College; and was granted the MDIV and DMIN degrees from Christian Theological Seminary.

My protestant brothers and sisters - keep your “ship” in tight formation with the Catholic flagship of St. John Bosco’s vision.
 
Donald Charles Lacy, a retired United Methodist minister, author, teacher and ecumenist says, “It is devotion to the Blessed Mother that helps unite us as Christians. When Protestants lose their widespread hang-up that Roman Catholics have worshipped and do worship her, they can perceive by the power of the Holy Spirit an authentic ecumenism that calls us to be one.”
The following is by: Daniel R. Gangler

We will soon enter the season of Advent culminating in the 12 days of Christmas leading to Epiphany. Like Roman Catholics and Orthodox Christians, our devotion is to Jesus Christ who we believe to be part of the triune God – Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

Unlike Roman Catholics and Orthodox Christians, we, as Protestants, give little devotion to who they call the Blessed Virgin Mary, Mother of God. As important as Jesus is, being the center of Christian faith, His mother takes a role second only to Him with most Christians in the world.

Why does Mary take an almost subservient role in Protestant Christianity (with 647 million members worldwide), when the overwhelmingly dominate Roman Catholic Church (1.1 billion members) and Christian Orthodox churches (300 million members), venerate her as the Blessed Virgin Mary?

According to the Rev. Dr. Donald Charles Lacy of Muncie, a retired Indiana United Methodist pastor and scholar about Mary, she continued to be the second most prominent person in Christianity at the beginning of the Protestant Reformation (begun 1517). The Virgin Mary as the Mother of God was part of Martin Luther’s (1483-1546), John Calvin’s (1509-1564) and many other reformation leaders’ faith.

“As Protestant faith gained strength and moved away from Catholicism, second and third generation Protestant leaders moved away from devotion to Mary. Yes, she is the mother of Jesus, but for the vast majority of Christians in the world, she also is venerated and called the Mother of God.”

For Lacy, if we, as Protestants in general and United Methodists in particular, would renew our historic devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary, such a move could act as a bridge to ecumenical union with the rest of the “one holy catholic (universal) and apostolic church” (referred to in the Nicene Creed found in the United Methodist Hymnal on page 880).

Even as far back as 1983, Lacy wrote, “It is devotion to the Blessed Mother that helps unite us as Christians. When Protestants lose their widespread hang-up that Roman Catholics have worshipped and do worship her, they can perceive by the power of the Holy Spirit an authentic ecumenism that calls us to be one.”

In a recent interview with Together, Lacy said, “United Methodists and Protestant Christians need to join their Catholic and Orthodox siblings in paying devotion to her – not worshipping her, but giving her the rightful place as second only to her Son.”

Why?
Lacy says and has said for four decades, “with the primacy of these two historic groups (Catholic and Orthodox), because of them coming directly from the wellsprings of the ancient Church of Christ and the Apostles and their special emphasis on the Blessed Virgin Mary for centuries, we have an ecumenical barrier to overcome.”

How important is it to overcome this barrier?
Lacy says, “To fulfill the ‘call to be one’ in the seventeenth chapter of John’s Gospel, we must look humbly and sincerely at her place among all those who profess the name of her Son. This is an imperative issue needing resolution for the sake of Christian unity in a world that desperately needs for us to be united to confront those who would destroy us and have the means to do so.”

When asked if we pay more attention to Mary, will our behavior strengthen our ecumenical ties to Catholicism and Orthodoxy? – Lacy said, “Yes.” He further said fragmented Christian faith is a concern in order to deal with other ideologies and theologies such as radical Islamic groups who are especially anti-Christian. That’s a compelling reason why Lacy believes this is an imperative issue.

Those seven actions include:

Putting aside wearisome academia and dull theology,
Opening the door for mainline Protestants to catch a glimpse of Mary’s importance,
Bringing Anglicans, Catholics and Orthodox Christians into our churches for presentations about Mary,
Bringing the strongest female personage to the stage for Christ’s people,
Elevating “our Blessed Mother’s” significance in Protestant churches,
Bringing presentations about the Virgin Mary to civic groups, and
Bringing Mary into partnership in the Faith as one leading others to her Son.
Lacy says, “Mary is a necessary and integral part of our theology and has nothing to do with worshipping her… She is part of our Christian faith, is a strong image of feminism and is only second to Jesus Christ in power and influence – her power comes from her holiness.”

For more information, visit THE ECUMENICAL SOCIETY OF THE BLESSED VIRGIN MARY www.esbvm.org.uk/. Readers can contact Dr. Lacy at DLacy33@msn.com. The book Mary for the Love & Glory of God is available at www.amazon.com.

Dr. Donald Charles Lacy is a retired United Methodist minister, author, teacher and ecumenist. He is a native of Henry County; a graduate of Center High School in Delaware County; received a BS and MA from Ball State Teachers College; and was granted the MDIV and DMIN degrees from Christian Theological Seminary.

My protestant brothers and sisters - keep your “ship” in tight formation with the Catholic flagship of St. John Bosco’s vision.
I find this rather compelling. 👍

Jon
 
Protestants think we worship the Blessed Virgin Mary as a goddess of some sort. I have heard Protestants say very horrible things about Her that I don’t wish to repeat. I don’t understand their logic. They worship Jesus, but at the same time they speak so badly about His mother…🤷
Ok now if someone really wants to get on your good side and impress you, I don’t think the best thing for them to do is insult to your mother…
Protestants need to realize that the truth is that we Catholics honor and respect and love the Blessed Virgin Mary, along with the other Saints in Heaven. They help us by praying for us to God, our Creator. We only worship God (Father + Son + Holy Spirit = 1 God), and we ask the Blessed Virgin Mary and other Saints to pray for us. We love and have a special relationship with the Blessed Mother, but that does not mean we worship or put Her above God.
 
I love the article it shows progress and understanding by our separated brethren of our true Catholic faith in the blessed Virgin Mary.

The blessed Virgin Mary is instrumental in bringing Jesus to the Eastern hemisphere of the world by giving birth to Jesus, and She is instrumental in bringing Jesus to the Western hemisphere of the world from her heavenly aparition when she appeared as the “Virgin of Guadalupe”.

We cannot leave Islam out of the equation because these also have a belief in the Blessed Virgin Mary and some have a devotion to the blessed Virgin Mother Mary, from their processions to “fatima”. Though misunderstandings of the blessed Virgin Mary exist also in Islam as well as protestantism.

The blessed Virgin Mary Mother of God continues to bring her son Jesus to the world.
 
Protestants think we worship the Blessed Virgin Mary as a goddess of some sort. I have heard Protestants say very horrible things about Her that I don’t wish to repeat. I don’t understand their logic. They worship Jesus, but at the same time they speak so badly about His mother…🤷
Ok now if someone really wants to get on your good side and impress you, I don’t think the best thing for them to do is insult to your mother…
Protestants need to realize that the truth is that we Catholics honor and respect and love the Blessed Virgin Mary, along with the other Saints in Heaven. They help us by praying for us to God, our Creator. We only worship God (Father + Son + Holy Spirit = 1 God), and we ask the Blessed Virgin Mary and other Saints to pray for us. We love and have a special relationship with the Blessed Mother, but that does not mean we worship or put Her above God.
I think this is especially sensitive this time of the year obviously. Members from my Old Church are calling me and messaging me on facebook with there Tracts against our belief in Her and it is mostly a simple misunderstanding. I actually am getting tired of the debate. I know what I believe and what the Church Teaches…Just as they often mis interpret the bible , they do the same with the Church. I do know that the debate that I have had with them has done 2 things, #1 made my faith in the Church stronger and #2 made them have to really look into what there talking about, maybe it was lead them home to one day. Be blessed
 
The Protestants who say Catholics worship Mary as a goddess are generally the non-intellectual sort. None of the learned Protestants I have ever known actually thought Catholics worshiped Mary. They just think that the veneration is unnecessary. Now I can’t say anything about mainline Protestants, as I have never attended a mainline church. My experience comes from evangelical churches (SBC, PCA, EPC). When I asked my Presbyterian minister why Catholics pay so much attention to Mary, he explained it like this: God chose Mary to bear Jesus in the same way He chose Abraham, Moses, the Jewish people in general, and each of us (see the Calvinism there 😉 ). Their view is that Mary was just some girl who God chose to use for His glory, and that there was nothing special about her. They view the idea of ‘Theotokos’ as a medieval invention and they believe that praying to the saints is useless because they can’t hear us. Before we can expect Protestants to show devotion to the Blessed Mother, we must first convince them that Mary is special and that the dead in Christ can hear us.
 
I think this is especially sensitive this time of the year obviously. Members from my Old Church are calling me and messaging me on facebook with there Tracts against our belief in Her and it is mostly a simple misunderstanding. I actually am getting tired of the debate. I know what I believe and what the Church Teaches…Just as they often mis interpret the bible , they do the same with the Church. I do know that the debate that I have had with them has done 2 things, #1 made my faith in the Church stronger and #2 made them have to really look into what there talking about, maybe it was lead them home to one day. Be blessed
That’s really good that you are not only standing strong, but you are being strengthened as well.

Something that occurred to me though, and I hope you don’t mind me mentioning it, is that putting a capital letter with ‘Her ‘, instead of ‘her’, could cause confusion for non-Catholics, as capitalising pronouns is reserved for God - ‘He’, Him’, His’. It’s little things like that that can give the wrong message, making it seem that we are treating Our Lady as a goddess.

It could be, of course, that the ‘Her’ you were referring to in your post was actually, the Church, and not Our Lady at all, in which case, disregard this.
 
Lot of very good people out here who happen to be Protestant. I stay in close contact with many. Its abundantly clear to us if we don’t stand up together we will certainly lose the current battle.

The mud-slinging for no good reason simply will not help. Thats a fact of life in any walk of life.

Peace.
 
Here’s my take on it & Its that How are you going to Worship & Praise Jesus & Talk about His Mother , to me personally I have never Understood why More Religions Have never Included Mary God’s Mother , After all If Mary wasn’t Blessed to Have Jesus There wouldn’t Be A Jesus So in All We should Include God’s Mother Mary & Honor her as well after all She is Part of Jesus & Jesus’s Mother .[BIBLEDRB][/BIBLEDRB]
 
Donald Charles Lacy, a retired United Methodist minister, author, teacher and ecumenist says, “It is devotion to the Blessed Mother that helps unite us as Christians. When Protestants lose their widespread hang-up that Roman Catholics have worshipped and do worship her, they can perceive by the power of the Holy Spirit an authentic ecumenism that calls us to be one.”
The following is by: Daniel R. Gangler

We will soon enter the season of Advent culminating in the 12 days of Christmas leading to Epiphany. Like Roman Catholics and Orthodox Christians, our devotion is to Jesus Christ who we believe to be part of the triune God – Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

Unlike Roman Catholics and Orthodox Christians, we, as Protestants, give little devotion to who they call the Blessed Virgin Mary, Mother of God. As important as Jesus is, being the center of Christian faith, His mother takes a role second only to Him with most Christians in the world.

Why does Mary take an almost subservient role in Protestant Christianity (with 647 million members worldwide), when the overwhelmingly dominate Roman Catholic Church (1.1 billion members) and Christian Orthodox churches (300 million members), venerate her as the Blessed Virgin Mary?

According to the Rev. Dr. Donald Charles Lacy of Muncie, a retired Indiana United Methodist pastor and scholar about Mary, she continued to be the second most prominent person in Christianity at the beginning of the Protestant Reformation (begun 1517). The Virgin Mary as the Mother of God was part of Martin Luther’s (1483-1546), John Calvin’s (1509-1564) and many other reformation leaders’ faith.

“As Protestant faith gained strength and moved away from Catholicism, second and third generation Protestant leaders moved away from devotion to Mary. Yes, she is the mother of Jesus, but for the vast majority of Christians in the world, she also is venerated and called the Mother of God.”

For Lacy, if we, as Protestants in general and United Methodists in particular, would renew our historic devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary, such a move could act as a bridge to ecumenical union with the rest of the “one holy catholic (universal) and apostolic church” (referred to in the Nicene Creed found in the United Methodist Hymnal on page 880).

Even as far back as 1983, Lacy wrote, “It is devotion to the Blessed Mother that helps unite us as Christians. When Protestants lose their widespread hang-up that Roman Catholics have worshipped and do worship her, they can perceive by the power of the Holy Spirit an authentic ecumenism that calls us to be one.”

In a recent interview with Together, Lacy said, “United Methodists and Protestant Christians need to join their Catholic and Orthodox siblings in paying devotion to her – not worshipping her, but giving her the rightful place as second only to her Son.”

Why?
Lacy says and has said for four decades, “with the primacy of these two historic groups (Catholic and Orthodox), because of them coming directly from the wellsprings of the ancient Church of Christ and the Apostles and their special emphasis on the Blessed Virgin Mary for centuries, we have an ecumenical barrier to overcome.”

How important is it to overcome this barrier?
Lacy says, “To fulfill the ‘call to be one’ in the seventeenth chapter of John’s Gospel, we must look humbly and sincerely at her place among all those who profess the name of her Son. This is an imperative issue needing resolution for the sake of Christian unity in a world that desperately needs for us to be united to confront those who would destroy us and have the means to do so.”

When asked if we pay more attention to Mary, will our behavior strengthen our ecumenical ties to Catholicism and Orthodoxy? – Lacy said, “Yes.” He further said fragmented Christian faith is a concern in order to deal with other ideologies and theologies such as radical Islamic groups who are especially anti-Christian. That’s a compelling reason why Lacy believes this is an imperative issue.

Those seven actions include:

Putting aside wearisome academia and dull theology,
Opening the door for mainline Protestants to catch a glimpse of Mary’s importance,
Bringing Anglicans, Catholics and Orthodox Christians into our churches for presentations about Mary,
Bringing the strongest female personage to the stage for Christ’s people,
Elevating “our Blessed Mother’s” significance in Protestant churches,
Bringing presentations about the Virgin Mary to civic groups, and
Bringing Mary into partnership in the Faith as one leading others to her Son.
Lacy says, “Mary is a necessary and integral part of our theology and has nothing to do with worshipping her… She is part of our Christian faith, is a strong image of feminism and is only second to Jesus Christ in power and influence – her power comes from her holiness.”

For more information, visit THE ECUMENICAL SOCIETY OF THE BLESSED VIRGIN MARY www.esbvm.org.uk/. Readers can contact Dr. Lacy at DLacy33@msn.com. The book Mary for the Love & Glory of God is available at www.amazon.com.

Dr. Donald Charles Lacy is a retired United Methodist minister, author, teacher and ecumenist. He is a native of Henry County; a graduate of Center High School in Delaware County; received a BS and MA from Ball State Teachers College; and was granted the MDIV and DMIN degrees from Christian Theological Seminary.

My protestant brothers and sisters - keep your “ship” in tight formation with the Catholic flagship of St. John Bosco’s vision.
Very good post, mangy dog. Thanks for posting it. 🙂
 
The Protestants who say Catholics worship Mary as a goddess are generally the non-intellectual sort. None of the learned Protestants I have ever known actually thought Catholics worshiped Mary. They just think that the veneration is unnecessary. Now I can’t say anything about mainline Protestants, as I have never attended a mainline church. My experience comes from evangelical churches (SBC, PCA, EPC). When I asked my Presbyterian minister why Catholics pay so much attention to Mary, he explained it like this: God chose Mary to bear Jesus in the same way He chose Abraham, Moses, the Jewish people in general, and each of us (see the Calvinism there 😉 ). Their view is that Mary was just some girl who God chose to use for His glory, and that there was nothing special about her. They view the idea of ‘Theotokos’ as a medieval invention and they believe that praying to the saints is useless because they can’t hear us. Before we can expect Protestants to show devotion to the Blessed Mother, we must first convince them that Mary is special and that the dead in Christ can hear us.
Welcome to the journey Home!

A funny thing is that Calvin venerated her as “theotokos”, Mother of God.
 
the rejection of the title “Theotokos” for Mary by some in protestantism is utterly baffling to me… 😦
 
The Protestants who say Catholics worship Mary as a goddess are generally the non-intellectual sort. None of the learned Protestants I have ever known actually thought Catholics worshiped Mary.
:rolleyes:
 
the rejection of the title “Theotokos” for Mary by some in protestantism is utterly baffling to me… 😦
It baffles me as well. I spent almost 4 pages arguing on a non-denominational (as in the forum didn’t cater to any specific denomination), but Evangelical dominated forum about the title of Theotokos. The only argument they had for 4 pages was that the title Theotokos implied that Mary created Christ’s divinity. Needless to say after much explanation on my part the people I was arguing with still did not accept the title, but many of the fence sitters in the discussion were convinced that the title of Theotokos was in fact correct, thanks be to God.

Basically much of the Protestant opposition to the title of Theotokos can be boiled down to “it sounds Catholic”. The only people that still rejected the title after it had been explained to them also had an anti-Catholic streak (as in the Pope is the anti-Christ kind), so I think it’s tied up with anti-Catholicism as well.
 
It baffles me as well. I spent almost 4 pages arguing on a non-denominational (as in the forum didn’t cater to any specific denomination), but Evangelical dominated forum about the title of Theotokos. The only argument they had for 4 pages was that the title Theotokos implied that Mary created Christ’s divinity. Needless to say after much explanation on my part the people I was arguing with still did not accept the title, but many of the fence sitters in the discussion were convinced that the title of Theotokos was in fact correct, thanks be to God.

**Basically much of the Protestant opposition to the title of Theotokos can be boiled down to “it sounds Catholic”. **The only people that still rejected the title after it had been explained to them also had an anti-Catholic streak (as in the Pope is the anti-Christ kind), so I think it’s tied up with anti-Catholicism as well.
If you think about it, one would have to say it sound catholic, because the title and doctrine are long before the schism.

She is the Holy Theotokos, Mother of God, the God bearer.

Jon
 
I would imagine, the reasons for Protestants “Crossing the Tiber” are wide and varied with respect to subject and the time it takes to finally make the decision. For me, it was 18 years of reading, study, inquiry, stubbornness, and prayer. Further, the degree of ease or difficulty to make the break varies. I was born into the LCMS and for 26 years, dedicated. The theological schism in the LCMS that began to brew in 1969, came to full boil in 1973 and lasted for some time. I don’t know if it lasted beyond 1981 because that was the year I left the LCMS for good. I did not take sides simply because I did not know who was right. All I could see were two factions of folks fighting like the devil for what they thought was their heavenly cause. I spent about 10 years in the Episcopal church until Episcopal Bishop John S. Spong writes an article that the resurrection never happened. I was gone from that church in a New York minute. The rest of the Episcopal church took no action on Spong as he should have been severely censured at a minimum. After that departure, I was cautious. I considered myself a two time loser at being a Protestant and so the third time, I would take my time. My lovely wife is a cradle Catholic and so we decided to attend the CC and raise our daughter in the Church. Father Barron in the Forward of his book ‘Catholicism’ says it best in the Introduction of the book titled, “The Catholic Thing.”

“I realize that an objection might be forming in your mind. Certainly the doctrine of Incarnation separates Christianity from the other great world religions, but how does it distinguish Catholicism from other Christian churches? Don’t Protestants and the Orthodox hold just as firmly to the conviction that the Word became flesh? they do indeed, but they don’t I would argue, embrace the doctrine in its fullness. They don’t see all the way to the bottom of it or draw out all of its implications.”

On these points, I am in full agreement with Father Barron and these points contributed to my decision to finally Cross the Tiber.
 
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