Which brought to mind the other side of the faith/moral teachings infallibility coin.
I would very much like to respond to this in a serious fashion, but of course in such a manner that doesn’t place me in the middle of a dog fight. The Catholic church begun to run far off the tracks by the 1500’s. Selling indulgences to folks who could dispense them on loved ones to supposedly shorten their stay in Purgatory was a serious issue that the Reformers took to task. They found it not only non-biblical, but also an abuse propagated by the church to profit form those who were in a state of worry for their loved ones who had passed on. By this time in history, the mass had become something very separating between the clergy and the lay people. The clergy constantly had their backs to the members and celebrated mass in such a way that closely resembled a play being performed in front of an audience. This is certainly not something Jesus would have condoned.
This late? Most Protestants say around 300-400.
I agree the sale of indulgences is immoral. The Church also affirms this. So at least you, me, and the Church agree here.
I don’t know of many plays (or speeches) where the actors (or speakers) keep their backs to the people. But whatever.
The Church DID go wrong with a moral teaching - the sale of indulgences! When they made the Temple a marketplace, Jesus got angry. The Church in Saxony was also in bed with the politicians and rulers of the time. Those two things, more than anything else, were the major impetus behind the Reformation. “Selling God” and “selling out” were the two most heinous crimes against Christ… and are the things that the Christians must always be the most vigilent not to repeat.
Well, respectfully speaking I’m not here to jump through hoops. I will say that during the Reformation, much was pointed out to the church and its authority that had all but abadoned the teachings of scripture. Transubstantiation- no biblical proof or link, The Cathechism’s teaching that Mary is the purest realization of faith when in fact in scripture it is Jesus Christ who is the purest realization of faith. Abortion, euthenasia and so on are all issues in which the Church has spoken on very strongly that one can agree with but still be Protestant.
Ever heard of the term Hocus Pocus? It applies here for sure.
I never heard of the term before…How this apply to the page?
Your beating the deadest horse there is.
Neither is the sale of indulgences. But the flag burning thing was just a joke. Though I’d lighten the mood.
indulgences, sexual immorality by the clergy, unbiblical teachings and practices, do we need to continue to spell it all out for you?
yes, please.
AC-
That’s a pretty big statement, you should try re-reading your Bible. So says the Southern Baptist who shouldn’t believe in transubstantiation but does.
I’m not Catholic, but I’m pretty sure Catholic’s place Jesus higher than Mary. I’ve only been to Mass twice, but each time I’ve gone they have only even mentioned Mary a couple of times. And yes I have read what the Catechism speaks of about Mary. This quote is some ridiculous anti-Catholic Protestant jargon (Protestants who argue this way make me ashamed sometimes to call myself Baptist). This is in line with saying Catholic’s worship Mary and the Saints and statues.
In regards to Transubstantiation, I suggest you read John 6.
How about contraception? Do protestants agree?
As I said, I don’t believe the Church is guilty of abuse where indulgences is concerned anymore.
I believe in the Real Presence of Christ - Scripture is pretty clear about that. But I don’t believe scripture formulated a dogma from 11th century Aristotelianism and Thomism.
For example? Because this is pretty sweeping. :tsktsk: I find it incredible that anyone who calls themselves Christian would lay an accusation of this generality, & against fellow Christians at that.
We could argue the means by which Jesus’ Real Presence in the elements of Holy Communion occurs, but when the rubber hits the road, it is those who claim only a “symbolic presence” who are left with egg on their faces. Because, you see, the Bible says “This** is** My Body” & “This is My Blood”. Not,
“this is merely a symbol of Me, so don’t get bent out of shape over it, and don’t bother with it more than once or twice a year”.Ummm…OK. Where did you get this one??? Let me guess: Jack Chick? William Webster?
Somebody-else-whose-“gospel”-isn’t-in-the-Bible??Well, that’s
nice to know. At least you think that Catholics got something right…
The Church no longer sell indulgence. It’s teachings on morals is very Biblical and at times will resort to the guidance of the Holy Spirit.
The word transubstantiation was not written out in detail until the 13th century. But the early Church Fathers believed in it in its entirety. Here is only but a few: