S
sambos671
Guest
Singinbeauty,
You’re jumping around a bit. Let me take this one step at a time so that you understand what I’m saying. First I believe that we must believe in Jesus, I believe that we must ask him into our heart. I’m not saying you don’t need to do that. You do. Catholics believe this. But it doesn’t stop there. To believe in Jesus is to do his will and to believe everything he says. Which I believe is reflected in the magesterium of the Church and the Churches view of Soteriology. So (just like most protestants) saying the “sinners prayer” is something we do as a result of repentance. Yet Jesus tells us to be baptised. Its an obenient step in following him. Catholics believe baptism does what it represents. Most protestants don’t. Yet Jesus informs us that it does as he speaks to Nicademus. Baptism isn’t the only thing he tells us to do. We are given the Sacraments to participate in and as we live in obedience to Jesus and participate in his Sacraments in community with the Church we become more like him. Not to do these is not believing in Jesus by doing what he says. For instance the parable which son is more obedient the one who said Yes father I will do it but doesn’t or the one who say’s no but does it? To believe in Jesus is to do what he says. Not just say I believe and thats it.
Now with “lumping” protestants together. You may be right I’ve said generalized things using baptist as a model. There is a reason for this. I’m most familiar with them. However, to be fair there are so many protestants with so many diverse soterioligical views I can’t lump them in together. I like the baptist because of their emphasis on the serious study of the word. And even baptist have soteriolgical divides. Most are reformed theologians (follow Calvin view) some of these are strict 5 point calvinist most are not. The Presbeterians though through Knox have a reformed view as well have become a little “high” protestant for most evangelicals. Many baptist are evangelical though there is a strong baptist movement that is fundementalist. This Fundalmentalist movement was started at the turn of the century starting at the Niagra Conferrance but later became spelled out by certain fundelmentalist Princeton theologians. And of these Fundalmentalist many are extreme King James Only bible (as the (name removed by moderator)ired word of God) and of these there are some who believe that only the 1611 version of the King James bible is truely the authorized inspired word of God. There are also Free will baptist that are not reformed but hold to Armenius view with regard to soteriology. Since baptist covered a wide range of beliefs I thought I’d use them. But certaintly there are Anglicans and Lutherans that are closely related to Catholics that have a closer view of Catholic Soteriology but not quite. These cannot be considered with the evangelicals. Pentecostals primarily influenced by those who were influenced by Wesley also are more Armenius in their perspective to salvation. Yet they believe in 2 baptisms. One symbolic one being “filled” with the spirit. Usually the second one involves an undeterminate amout of aquired “holiness” to be in effect. Thus they come from the “holiness” movement at the turn of the century (BTW when I say this I mean the 20th not the 21st). There were two coinciding movements that started Pentecostalism one on the boarder of Kentucky and Tennessee and the other in California at Azuza st. Some pentecostals have gone of the deep end and become Jesus Only which emphasizes the unity of God and falls in the error of modalism. We could discuss Methodism but even the Methodist aren’t even sure what positions they hold (Charles Wesley would be turning over in his grave). However, even these theological differences all claim to use the bible as their Primary source to determine all truths and already you see confusion. There has always been one faith from the begining. And a set of truths established. The Catholic Church has been consistent.
You’re jumping around a bit. Let me take this one step at a time so that you understand what I’m saying. First I believe that we must believe in Jesus, I believe that we must ask him into our heart. I’m not saying you don’t need to do that. You do. Catholics believe this. But it doesn’t stop there. To believe in Jesus is to do his will and to believe everything he says. Which I believe is reflected in the magesterium of the Church and the Churches view of Soteriology. So (just like most protestants) saying the “sinners prayer” is something we do as a result of repentance. Yet Jesus tells us to be baptised. Its an obenient step in following him. Catholics believe baptism does what it represents. Most protestants don’t. Yet Jesus informs us that it does as he speaks to Nicademus. Baptism isn’t the only thing he tells us to do. We are given the Sacraments to participate in and as we live in obedience to Jesus and participate in his Sacraments in community with the Church we become more like him. Not to do these is not believing in Jesus by doing what he says. For instance the parable which son is more obedient the one who said Yes father I will do it but doesn’t or the one who say’s no but does it? To believe in Jesus is to do what he says. Not just say I believe and thats it.
Now with “lumping” protestants together. You may be right I’ve said generalized things using baptist as a model. There is a reason for this. I’m most familiar with them. However, to be fair there are so many protestants with so many diverse soterioligical views I can’t lump them in together. I like the baptist because of their emphasis on the serious study of the word. And even baptist have soteriolgical divides. Most are reformed theologians (follow Calvin view) some of these are strict 5 point calvinist most are not. The Presbeterians though through Knox have a reformed view as well have become a little “high” protestant for most evangelicals. Many baptist are evangelical though there is a strong baptist movement that is fundementalist. This Fundalmentalist movement was started at the turn of the century starting at the Niagra Conferrance but later became spelled out by certain fundelmentalist Princeton theologians. And of these Fundalmentalist many are extreme King James Only bible (as the (name removed by moderator)ired word of God) and of these there are some who believe that only the 1611 version of the King James bible is truely the authorized inspired word of God. There are also Free will baptist that are not reformed but hold to Armenius view with regard to soteriology. Since baptist covered a wide range of beliefs I thought I’d use them. But certaintly there are Anglicans and Lutherans that are closely related to Catholics that have a closer view of Catholic Soteriology but not quite. These cannot be considered with the evangelicals. Pentecostals primarily influenced by those who were influenced by Wesley also are more Armenius in their perspective to salvation. Yet they believe in 2 baptisms. One symbolic one being “filled” with the spirit. Usually the second one involves an undeterminate amout of aquired “holiness” to be in effect. Thus they come from the “holiness” movement at the turn of the century (BTW when I say this I mean the 20th not the 21st). There were two coinciding movements that started Pentecostalism one on the boarder of Kentucky and Tennessee and the other in California at Azuza st. Some pentecostals have gone of the deep end and become Jesus Only which emphasizes the unity of God and falls in the error of modalism. We could discuss Methodism but even the Methodist aren’t even sure what positions they hold (Charles Wesley would be turning over in his grave). However, even these theological differences all claim to use the bible as their Primary source to determine all truths and already you see confusion. There has always been one faith from the begining. And a set of truths established. The Catholic Church has been consistent.
The best word i can think of is… well, i won’t use that one… 
but anyway, there are things that are (best word!!) UNCHRISTIAN!!! and frankly, i feel that it is THIS problem that keeps many non-C’s away from the Church… they see this - and that - and think, Well, i am right to stay where i’m at… but you know the saying: you cant judge a bk by its cover… and you definitely cna’t judge a Church by the people in it… becasuse if you did, you would never be in a Church… & the Bible says not to forsake the fellowshipping of yourselves together (one version’s way of putting it). Anyway, I’ve had it happen over and over in my life, so many times can’t count… that i thought thus & so was the right way to go… felt SO strongly… only to find later that that was NOt the right way to go… can’t trust feelings… I know feelings are not all you are going by in your decision to stay where you are at… but i know that feelings usually have a lot to do with the way i (initially) choose to react to some “problem” or other… My feelings in particular can’t be trusted because i am messed up over the things i went through in the past… (as everyone is)… Anyway…
i agree there is too much hostility…sometimes its just because - or mostly because people are passionate about what they believe in… and Jesus is wroth being passionate about… 
