Protestants: do you ever wish the Eucharist was more than just a symbol to you?

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twohumble said:
I do believe that by partaking in Communion/The Lords Supper, that there is a mysterious presence, and a real means of Grace present in the sacrament.
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I could probably take a guess as to where you stand with this comment of yours but just so we are clear as mud; when you eat the bread and drink the wine at your church do you believe you are literally eating the body and blood of our Lord? Consubstantiation or Transubstantiation aside, is it the literal body and blood of Christ?

God bless you
 
Paul3144 said:
That’s fine but your profile says you’re Catholic. The CC teaches transubstantiation. Care to elaborate?

Paul
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Nancy stated in a previous post in this thread that she was Catholic but went back to a Protestant church. She probably needs to change her profile to prevent this confusion in the future but maybe hasn’t gotten around to it 🤷

God bless
 
Roman_Catholic said:
Nancy stated in a previous post in this thread that she was Catholic but went back to a Protestant church. She probably needs to change her profile to prevent this confusion in the future but maybe hasn’t gotten around to it 🤷

God bless
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Thank You , You are right and i did change it back, I appoligize if i caused confussion, i was eraly side tracted because i am back to the church 8 weeks and i am trying to get stronger and, well i thought Paul ment having the presence of Christ yes his presence is there in his body and his blood and i was agreeing because that is what i thought he ment. When we recieve the Eucharist He is there, realy there, That is the mystery of the Sacrement of the Euchraist. Love of Christ Nancy
 
HeWillProvide said:
I thought Protestants didn’t believe it really is Jesus but that it is instead a representation. You are a Protestant who believes it truly IS Jesus?
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You are over-generalizing/stereotyping Protestants. Methodists, Anglicans, and Lutherans (and some others) believe that Christ is present in a spiritual or mystical sense in the bread and wine (even “grape juice”). Cranmer said that Christ is present in a “heavenly manner” and the “wicked receive him not”. With the exception of Lutherans, who use much more substantialist language, that about sums up the Protestant belief. Only the most Calvinist/Reformed deny any kind of presence in the Eucharist.
 
Roman_Catholic said:
I could probably take a guess as to where you stand with this comment of yours but just so we are clear as mud; when you eat the bread and drink the wine at your church do you believe you are literally eating the body and blood of our Lord? Consubstantiation or Transubstantiation aside, is it the literal body and blood of Christ?

God bless you
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Absolutely not, for all the reasons stated in this thread. There just is no scriptural basis that is sound that would lead me to believe that. (refer to my earlier posts)

It is, however, a real means of Grace and there is mystery surrounding this sacrament.
 
Daedelus76 said:
You are over-generalizing/stereotyping Protestants. Methodists, Anglicans, and Lutherans (and some others) believe that Christ is present in a spiritual or mystical sense in the bread and wine (even “grape juice”). Cranmer said that Christ is present in a “heavenly manner” and the “wicked receive him not”. With the exception of Lutherans, who use much more substantialist language, that about sums up the Protestant belief. Only the most Calvinist/Reformed deny any kind of presence in the Eucharist.
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Actually spiritual presence is the Reformed view. It’s only some Baptists and all Pentecostals (and some smaller groups) that reject any presence.
 
Hello Again! I am a Catholic and not a Protestant and this is getting confusing, because RealCatholic did not know i came back to the faith.I left for one day and fell short as we all know can happen because i was not understandng some people nad that is all i care to explain for the moment. please forgive me if i confussed anyone. love of Christ Nancy He is present in the Eucharist! Praise God.
 
Daedelus76 said:
You are over-generalizing/stereotyping Protestants. Methodists, Anglicans, and Lutherans (and some others) believe that Christ is present in a spiritual or mystical sense in the bread and wine (even “grape juice”). Cranmer said that Christ is present in a “heavenly manner” and the “wicked receive him not”. With the exception of Lutherans, who use much more substantialist language, that about sums up the Protestant belief. Only the most Calvinist/Reformed deny any kind of presence in the Eucharist.
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Not to forget those Anglicans who think that Trent, Session XIII, canon 1, is about right.

GKC

Anglicanus Catholicus
 
Daedelus76 said:
You are over-generalizing/stereotyping Protestants. Methodists, Anglicans, and Lutherans (and some others) believe that Christ is present in a spiritual or mystical sense in the bread and wine (even “grape juice”). **Cranmer said that Christ is present in a “heavenly manner” and the “wicked receive him not”. **With the exception of Lutherans, who use much more substantialist language, that about sums up the Protestant belief. Only the most Calvinist/Reformed deny any kind of presence in the Eucharist.
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Anabaptists and American “evangelicals” deny it, too.

The part I bolded is a big difference we have with Cranmer, just as Judas received the true body and blood at the last supper, and the bread and wine actually become the body and blood, we believe the wicked receive the body and blood to their own condemnation.

Generally, though, I would agree with your comment about over-generalizing.

Jon
 
JonNC said:
Sorry, Paul. I stand corrected. Any particular group(s), or are you speaking of individual belief?

Jon
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Jon,

I hope I didn’t come across as harsh in my last post. There are differences about this within Baptist denominations. As one example, in Article XXXII, Section 7 of the 1742 Philadelphia Confession it says:
Worthy receivers outwardly partaking of the visible elements in this ordinance, do them also inwardly by faith, really and indeed, yet not carnally and corporally, but spiritually receive, and feed upon Christ crucified and all the benefits of His death: the body and blood of Christ being then not corporally, or carnally, but spiritually present to the faith of believers in that ordinance, as the elements themselves are to their outward senses.
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Here’s a link to the whole article: reformedreader.org/ccc/pc32.htm

Slightly OT- I know Lutherans have optional individual confession with a priest. Just out of curiosity, do you use that and, if so, is it held in a confessional or some other place?
 
When I was still living in NC the Lutheran pastor heard confessions at Christmas Easter and Pentacost and it was by appointment and always in his office witht he door closed as for the real presence he made that very well known each and every Sunday we had communion and it was never with grape juice
 
Roman_Catholic said:
Depends on the believer. Most will affirm the Real Presence. Those who deny it are in the minority.

God bless you
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It’s true and depends on the believer even for catholics some of them are not sure about it and still think that it’s just symbol, if they believe it’s real presence, they will respect when they receive it. I don’t mean to judge them but just don’t feel confortable when i see people seem don’t respect when they receive it
 
twohumble said:
Pipper, it does not need to negate something that is not there. Jesus taught parabolically, symbolically and metaphorically all the time. He, in His Apostles presense had proclaimed Himself to be a gate, living water and a number of other symbols representing His role in the Trinity, in relation to us (husband, brother), His relation to our Salvation (lamb) and in each instance the symbol had great cultural meaning and understanding (sheep need more care than any other domestic heard,we are not sheep accidentally, yet we are not really sheep, but symbolically)

The teaching of His disciples the meaning of Passover by saying ‘this is my body’ is a clear reference to the 2nd loaf of unleavened bread and its clearly an explanation, just as when he raises the ‘Cup of Salvation’ and says 'this is My blood", He is teaching the meaning of a rite or ritual that the Jews practiced for 2000 yrs and never really understood, because they never had the context until Jesus came to explain it.

Jesus constanty showed how He was the fulfillment of OT imagery/prophesy and promises.
Here are some more: the Serpent in the Desert , He was the Rock that gave water in the wilderness (the rock that was struck as a judgement with the rod of Moses , this rod struck Jesus as He provided for them…symbolically Paul explains Jesus was the Rock that stood in place of Moses for judgement before the people, He took the Rod…again, a foreshadowing of things to come)

Jesus constantly showed exactly like what he taught at the last supper: He is the fulfillment of what was symbolized in all the OT rites/rituals/imagery that the Jews were familiar with for over 2000 yrs.

So, in summary, ‘in Rememberance’ does not negate the real presense (I believe in a real presense, just not a transformation of the elements) but it does not have to negate something that is not implied in the text except in the minds of those who have decided for some unknown reason, to take this clearly metaphorical phrase, and decide its literal rather than metaphor. Its only this eisegesis or imposition on the text that requires any explanation.

The entire ministry of Jesus was showing the Jews how He was the embodiment of all the OT imagery given by God to them for centuries.
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sorrytoohumble I must dissagree with you inseveral ways.

To begin with I am a Catholic Christian, no “messianic Jew” in fact “messianic judaism” had not even raised it’s head yet in Protestant Pop theology when I converted, so much of what you say is beyond my comprehension. I belonged to a so called “New Testament” church where the Old Testament was mostly ignored except when qouted in proof texts.

May I note that when Our Lord instituted the Holy Eucharist he completely transformed the Passover seder, he was not continuing it. And our Lord plainly said, “This IS my body” he was not speaking parabolically, symbolicly, or metaphoricaly, he was speaking literally.

Remember the 6th chapter of John where Our Lord said he was giving us his flesh to eat, and his blood to drink? Many of his disciples turned away and stopped following him. If the disciples thought he was only speaking in symbols or metaphoricaly why would they have said “this is a hard saying?” No they turned from him in the same manner that many do today because they can’t accept Jesus’ hard saying that he is giving us his very body and blood. Instead they try and explain away the very clear teaching of Jesus. And turn it into This is NOT my body, it is merely a symbol and nothing more.
 
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