Protestants, how can this be possible?

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Statistics show the number of Protestant secs at well in excess of 30,000!

I am befuddled, confused, bewildered how this can be a fact [a rapidly growing fact] and yet it does not seem to register with non-Catholics that something is obviously wrong.

I am very sincere in not being able to comprehend the lack of concern that seems to indicate that this is fine, it’s somehow God’s Will. There can only be ONE truth on any particular issue. So how can this be:shrug:

I do not mean this as a disparagement of any type. I simply am confounded that this does not raise a “red flag” and questions? Can you enlighten me?

I have been faithfully answeing your questions for more more than a year. Help me out here:rolleyes:

Love and prayers,
Pat
 
I’ve heard that the 30,000 number is… slightly inflated, to say the least. Apparantly, if you were to use the same method in counting Catholic churches, one woudl end up wiht several hundred Catholic “denominations”.

Regardless of this, PJM’s point would seem to stand. How can so many different groups have sprouted from the Protestant Reformation, none of them agreeing on much except that Rome is bad?

Yeah, sure, I’m still drawing with a broad brush, but… 🤷
 
PJM and Tim,
It is a sad situation for Christ’s Church that we are so divided, in direct contradiction of His call for unity. Whether it be 30,000 or 2, the ministry of His Church is wounded by division, and we all share a level of responsibility for it, and an obligation to pray for and work for unity.

Jon
 
JonNC said:
PJM and Tim,
It is a sad situation for Christ’s Church that we are so divided, in direct contradiction of His call for unity. Whether it be 30,000 or 2, the ministry of His Church is wounded by division, and we all share a level of responsibility for it, and an obligation to pray for and work for unity.

Jon
Click to expand...
some where in all of our bibles it memtions the price which must be paid for anyone leading astray any of the Lanb of the Lord.

The cost of running a roman catholic parish is great, mostly because we support the poor parishes and the missioms and the vatican.
If you have a large group of followers and you are not responsible to what you do with the money, that could be one reason to be independent, some times not being so serious aboput sins, or divorse. or personal sins are overlooked, so the church is really not a church just a gathering of sinners supporting eachother. the sermons are to make you feel good about yourself. they make you feel happy at what you are doing, every thing is okay. Godl loves you, there is no hell!! praying is okay if you feel like it, no formal prayers
allowed.
Luther, Calvin, wanted to get rid of the pope and by doing so created 30,000 new ones, great work:(:(:(😦
 
And the means of this unity was established by God: the Catholic Church. I’m not sure what the point of dialogue is if this is overlooked.
 
PJM said:
Statistics show the number of Protestant secs at well in excess of 30,000!

I am befuddled, confused, bewildered how this can be a fact [a rapidly growing fact] and yet it does not seem to register with non-Catholics that something is obviously wrong.

I am very sincere in not being able to comprehend the lack of concern that seems to indicate that this is fine, it’s somehow God’s Will. There can only be ONE truth on any particular issue. So how can this be:shrug:

I do not mean this as a disparagement of any type. I simply am confounded that this does not raise a “red flag” and questions? Can you enlighten me?

I have been faithfully answeing your questions for more more than a year. Help me out here:rolleyes:

Love and prayers,
Pat
Click to expand...
I ran a thread here on trying to determine Actual Doctrinal Belief Systems in order to get a more accurate number of “Different Denominations” and came up with a number somewhat under 200. The Thread Is Here
If you look about halfway down page two you’ll see taht we came up with about 17 different criteria. Of course this is merely a “Straw-poll” type of thing, but it clearly demonstrates a fallicy in the whole 30,000 number that keeps being tossed about.

That being said, even one split in His Church is wounding to Christ.

So many sins He had to bear - Even that one - That His children should fight and be splintered and estranged to each other.

Peace
James
 
PJM said:
Statistics show the number of Protestant secs at well in excess of 30,000!

I am befuddled, confused, bewildered how this can be a fact [a rapidly growing fact] and yet it does not seem to register with non-Catholics that something is obviously wrong.

I am very sincere in not being able to comprehend the lack of concern that seems to indicate that this is fine, it’s somehow God’s Will. There can only be ONE truth on any particular issue. So how can this be:shrug:

I do not mean this as a disparagement of any type. I simply am confounded that this does not raise a “red flag” and questions? Can you enlighten me?

I have been faithfully answeing your questions for more more than a year. Help me out here:rolleyes:

Love and prayers,
Pat
Click to expand...
The first question would be this: What are the 30,000+ denominations?

Secondly, what are their doctrines and beliefs and how are they different from one another?

Third, what was the underlying reason that they became their own sect?

When you truly come to these conclusions you will find that there really are only a handful and that most of them became autonymous for reasons of conduct and not a difference of Bible interpretation.
 
the funny thing here is some of them band together but refuse to band with Catholics
 
PJM said:
Statistics show the number of Protestant secs at well in excess of 30,000!

I am befuddled, confused, bewildered how this can be a fact [a rapidly growing fact] and yet it does not seem to register with non-Catholics that something is obviously wrong.

I am very sincere in not being able to comprehend the lack of concern that seems to indicate that this is fine, it’s somehow God’s Will. There can only be ONE truth on any particular issue. So how can this be:shrug:

I do not mean this as a disparagement of any type. I simply am confounded that this does not raise a “red flag” and questions? Can you enlighten me?

I have been faithfully answeing your questions for more more than a year. Help me out here:rolleyes:

Love and prayers,
Pat
Click to expand...
Tree’s got a lot of leaves.

:grouphug:
 
30K is high if you look at major denominations or families of denominations that supposedly share the same basic theology and approach to Scripture, salvation, etc. All Presbyterians, for example are supposed to be guided by the same confessions and approaches to major theological questions, but are nominally in a lot of different organizations: PCUSA, PCA, EPC, RCA,…

But, having said that, the 30K number may, in a way, be a gross underestimate. Being free to interpret the Bible for one’s self (in all ways, not just ones that don’t have an official interpretation) means that even in one small congregation, there can be different, sometimes warring, theologies. Sometimes its just the strongest voice, not necessarily the pastor’s, that defines a local church’s beliefs.

A mess? You betcha! :sad_yes:

It has driven many Protestants to the Catholic Church (that may be a good thing). The gross changes being made by many Protestant groups are driving people from Christ (bad thing). (Hey, if I’m free to make up my own religion, what do I need some old church for?)
 
Justy90 said:
Did you ever think that maybe it’s the Catholic church that won’t band with them?:eek:
Click to expand...
Oh yeah, sure… like we would be happy to see Pope Benedict sit down as an equal with Katharine Jefferts Schori, mano a mano. :whacky:
 
I believe that there are many denominations of “Bible Believing Christianity” because we cannot agree on all doctrines. And that is the truth. Their is nothing to hide there or to be ashamed of.

As for me, I cannot find a Christian Church here in Phoenix that
  1. Worships on the Seventh Day
  2. Acknowledges that Yeshua is God
  3. That doesn’t speak in tongues that can’t be interpreted
  4. That doesn’t have a high priest or prophet that everybody bears testimony to other then Yeshua
  5. That doesn’t have a big steeple piercing the sky (I know I’m a weirdo) 😊
  6. That preaches meat and not milk
  7. That doesn’t preach prosperity.
I’m lonesome! lol

But Glory to Yahweh for he has left me his comforter and his word.
 
Firstly 30,000 plus non-Catholic denominations is not an outrageous figure when you consider that 5 new ones are registered in the US every working day, that is an extra 1,100 every year (and some of them use the word ‘catholic’ in their registered name)!
Secondly, some non-Catholics talk about numerous ‘catholic’ churches but every church that uses “catholic” in its title but is not in union with Rome is in fact a Protestant Church and many of them are quite new and much more akin to Anglicanism anyway (and many are more liberal than the Anglicans).
Also when thinking about numbers consider the many, many different beliefs that non Catholic Christian churches espouse (for example):
Some believe in the Trinity some don’t
Some believe in adult baptism only, some don’t
Some deny the necessity for baptism at all, most don’t
Some believe in the ‘rapture’, some don’t
Some believe in ‘once saved always saved’, some don’t
Some believe in a kind of ‘real presence’ (some Lutherans and Anglicans) most don’t
Some believe in weekly communion, some annual
Some believe in 2 sacraments, others more, others less others none at all
Some believe in apostolic succession and government by bishops, some don’t
Some believe in congregational government, others by an elected body.
Some believe that Jesus came only for the Jews and Paul for the Gentiles, others don’t.
and it goes on and on and on because their only authority is the Bible (given to it by the Church!) and, because it is open to many interpretations and combinations of interpretations, the splits will continue ad infinitum.
 
gepnav said:
Oh yeah, sure… like we would be happy to see Pope Benedict sit down as an equal with Katharine Jefferts Schori, mano a mano. :whacky:
Click to expand...
I didn’t mean that Catholics should adhere to every single so called church out there. I meant that maybe if they tried to be a bit more inclusive, there could be some serious strides made toward some meaningful dialogue especially with most Anglicans (not Episcopalians).
 
JonNC said:
PJM and Tim,
It is a sad situation for Christ’s Church that we are so divided, in direct contradiction of His call for unity. Whether it be 30,000 or 2, the ministry of His Church is wounded by division, and we all share a level of responsibility for it, and an obligation to pray for and work for unity.

Jon
Click to expand...
As usual Jon, you hit the nail on the head and put it into perspective in the simplest of terms. I appreciate it, Thanks 👍
 
StevieD said:
Firstly 30,000 plus non-Catholic denominations is not an outrageous figure when you consider that 5 new ones are registered in the US every working day, that is an extra 1,100 every year (and some of them use the word ‘catholic’ in their registered name)!
Secondly, some non-Catholics talk about numerous ‘catholic’ churches but every church that uses “catholic” in its title but is not in union with Rome is in fact a Protestant Church and many of them are quite new and much more akin to Anglicanism anyway (and many are more liberal than the Anglicans).
Also when thinking about numbers consider the many, many different beliefs that non Catholic Christian churches espouse (for example):
Some believe in the Trinity some don’t
Some believe in adult baptism only, some don’t
Some deny the necessity for baptism at all, most don’t
Some believe in the ‘rapture’, some don’t
Some believe in ‘once saved always saved’, some don’t
Some believe in a kind of ‘real presence’ (some Lutherans and Anglicans) most don’t
Some believe in weekly communion, some annual
Some believe in 2 sacraments, others more, others less others none at all
Some believe in apostolic succession and government by bishops, some don’t
Some believe in congregational government, others by an elected body.
Some believe that Jesus came only for the Jews and Paul for the Gentiles, others don’t.
and it goes on and on and on because their only authority is the Bible (given to it by the Church!) and, because it is open to many interpretations and combinations of interpretations, the splits will continue ad infinitum.
Click to expand...
Some Catholics believe in birth control, some don’t (even though the church teaches that it is wrong.)

Some Catholics are pro-choice, some are not. (even though it is not condoned by Rome)
Some Catholics don’t believe in the Real Presence, others do (even though the Church teaches it)
Some Catholics believe that your are saved by faith alone, others do not.
 
Follow_Yeshua said:
I believe that there are many denominations of “Bible Believing Christianity” because we cannot agree on all doctrines. And that is the truth. Their is nothing to hide there or to be ashamed of.

As for me, I cannot find a Christian Church here in Phoenix that
  1. Worships on the Seventh Day
  2. Acknowledges that Yeshua is God
  3. That doesn’t speak in tongues that can’t be interpreted
  4. That doesn’t have a high priest or prophet that everybody bears testimony to other then Yeshua
  5. That doesn’t have a big steeple piercing the sky (I know I’m a weirdo) 😊
  6. That preaches meat and not milk
  7. That doesn’t preach prosperity.
I’m lonesome! lol
Click to expand...
 
Justy90 said:
I didn’t mean that Catholics should adhere to every single so called church out there. I meant that maybe if they tried to be a bit more inclusive, there could be some serious strides made toward some meaningful dialogue especially with most Anglicans (not Episcopalians).
Click to expand...
In the years since Vatican II the Church has made many strides toward being more inclusive. This is reflected in many of her documents and teachings.
Use to be that a Catholic was not permitted to even ENTER a protestant Church building, let alone attend a protestant service. Today we have ecumenical services and events regularly.
The Church has admitted to and apolgized for the overzealous actions of it’s members in past injustices.
The Church has been in dialog with the EO, The Lutherens, and the Anglicans with an eye toward drawing closer together and eventually reunification.

The thing that the Church cannot and will not do is “sell out” the deposit of Faith. The best she can do is, look at and study the doctrines of the other Churches and see if there are areas of common “meaning” even if “terminology” etc. is different.
I find this is a common issue here at CAF with Lutherens. Once we really get down to “brass tacks” we agree on most everything with the main differences being ones of terminology and the “weight” given to this or that piece of the salvic equation.

The Church does and will continue to reach out to our seperated bretheren in Love.

Peace
James
 
Justy90 said:
Some Catholics believe in birth control, some don’t (even though the church teaches that it is wrong.)

Some Catholics are pro-choice, some are not. (even though it is not condoned by Rome)
Some Catholics don’t believe in the Real Presence, others do (even though the Church teaches it)
Some Catholics believe that your are saved by faith alone, others do not.
Click to expand...
Some Catholics believe in Garabandel and some don’t
Some Catholics speak in tongues some don’t
Some Catholics pray to Mary some don’t
Some Catholics follow the Pope some Don’t

it goes on and on…for both Catholic and Protestant.
 
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