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heiscominginthe
Guest
The printing press was not created until the 1500’s I believe. So if they didn’t have a press, scripture would of had to been hand written.
Protestants: How Do You Know That Your Interpretation of the Bible is the Right one? Part II
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heiscominginthe
Guest
So catholics have more authority over the OT then the Jews who actually lived it? I don’t think so.
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heiscominginthe
Guest
Please give me a list of exact quotes by Jesus that are in the apocrypha?
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MrS
Guest
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MrS
Guest
No, Catholics had and have the authority of what is canon. End of story.
Afterall, it is the Book of the Catholic Church
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MrS
Guest
Other than Paul quoting Jesus on the Reality and importance of the Real Presence, please give me a list of any quotes where Paul quotes Jesus. Or should we consider tossing much of the Gospels because our St Paul did not quote them.??
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ckempston
Guest
No kidding. Obviously, my comment was tongue in cheek. The gospel was spread by word of mouth primarily in the first century. People became Christians AND THEN the Apostles wrote letters to them. The church existed prior to all known New Testament scriptures. This is self-evident. Paul could not write a letter to a church unless a church already existed.
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JRKH
Guest
I posted the link to this earlier - AND remeinded you of that link at least one other time.
But since you do not wish to look at it, here is the list of the DC’s being referenced in the NT
I just tried to do a cut and paste from the site to this post, but since it is over 9000 characters long I decided not to use up so much space. HERE AGAIN IS THE LINK
Below are just a few from that page.
Matt. 2:16 - Herod’s decree of slaying innocent children was prophesied in Wis. 11:7 - slaying the holy innocents.
Matt. 6:19-20 - Jesus’ statement about laying up for yourselves treasure in heaven follows Sirach 29:11 - lay up your treasure.
Matt… 7:12 - Jesus’ golden rule “do unto others” is the converse of Tobit 4:15 - what you hate, do not do to others.
Matt. 7:16,20 - Jesus’ statement “you will know them by their fruits” follows Sirach 27:6 - the fruit discloses the cultivation.
Matt. 9:36 - the people were “like sheep without a shepherd” is same as Judith 11:19 - sheep without a shepherd.
Mark 9:48 - description of hell where their worm does not die and the fire is not quenched references Judith 16:17.
John 6:35-59 - Jesus’ Eucharistic discourse is foreshadowed in Sirach 24:21.
John 15:6 - branches that don’t bear fruit and are cut down follows Wis. 4:5 where branches are broken off.
Rom. 1:20 - specifically, God’s existence being evident in nature follows Wis. 13:1.
1 Cor. 10:20 - what pagans sacrifice they offer to demons and not to God refers to Baruch 4:7.
1 Cor. 15:29 - if no expectation of resurrection, it would be foolish to be baptized on their behalf follows 2 Macc. 12:43-45.
The list at the link is MUCH longer.
Peace
James
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ckempston
Guest
Are you claiming that a book must be quoted by Jesus to be in the Canon? Just trying to clarify. (Actually, just trying to give you enough rope to hang yourself). There are five Old Testament books that are never once quoted in the New Testament, and I believe Jesus only directly quotes 24 of them, so this can’t possibly be the only criteria. You are severely oversimplifying.
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heiscominginthe
Guest
Acts 13:49 And the word of the Lord was published throughout all the region.
Acts 10:37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;
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ckempston
Guest
Do you often repeat yourself after being refuted? “Published” does not mean written. It does not even imply that writing was used.
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heiscominginthe
Guest
And weren’t these five books you speak of recognized by the Jews as God’s Word?
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heiscominginthe
Guest
I am speaking of exact quotes James.
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ckempston
Guest
Look, my friend, you need to learn some basic logic here. Stop trying to shift the burden of proof, and stop answering with more questions.
Is quoting by Jesus the only criteria for being canonical or not? Because your question suggested that is what you believe.
I suggest you go read about the Council of Jamnia (a.k.a. Jabneh). When the Jews “decided” their canon, part of their “problem” was refuting belief in Jesus as the Christ. Are you sure that’s who you want to use as your authority?
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1beleevr
Guest
SDcatholic: I believe that, originally, of course, Jesus was speaking to His disciples in reference to sending the Advocate(Holy Spirit). But ultimately, because we believe, and are saved, by the blood of Christ, every Word that is spoken in the Holy Bible, is also directed to us
Somone once told me that in Jeremiah 29:11, this only applied to the Israelites
I replied, "Well, yes, at the time, that’s who this promise was directed at! But, because we have been grafted in(Romans 11:17). So, when you read, “Be still, and know that I am God,” He’s talking to you also!
Somone once told me that in Jeremiah 29:11, this only applied to the Israelites I replied, "Well, yes, at the time, that’s who this promise was directed at! But, because we have been grafted in(Romans 11:17). So, when you read, “Be still, and know that I am God,” He’s talking to you also!
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1beleevr
Guest
On Friday, April 3, my wife and I watched the Glory of Easter, a production about the last week of Jesus’s life! In it, they portrayed such things as the healing of the blind man(John 9), the meeting with the accused adulteress, and the scene in the Temple, wher Jesus overturned the moneychanger’s tables. During the scene, depicting the Last Supper, Jesus , of course broke the bread, blessed it and gave each disciple a piece. He then drank from the cup and passed it around for each disciple to drink of.My wife turned to me, and asked,“If the catholic church believes that John 6:51-62, is the basis for how they do communion, then why don’t they hold their own bread(wafer), and why is the priest the only one who drinks the wine?” I told her I didn’t know for sure, but would put the question out for discussion on the forum
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MDK
Guest
See, you’re already off on the wrong track… demonstrating the type of problem that occurs from private interpretation, and reinforcing exactly why this thread was formed.
M
MDK
Guest
Actually, there is no error in official Catholic teaching. There is great error in what people assume (wrongly) that the Catholic Church teaches.
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SD_Catholic
Guest
I believe Jesus told certain people certain things for a reason, I wonder why Jesus didn’t invite everyone up for the transifiguration or for the last supper… Some things perhaps but I think you are reaching a lonnnnnng way to make it seem right… certainly all who claim to be guided without error by the Holy Spirit haven’t lived up to what the HS would guide… SO if he meant that we would all be guided by the HS without error than I’m affraid he has some explaining to do.SDcatholic: I believe that, originally, of course, Jesus was speaking to His disciples in reference to sending the Advocate(Holy Spirit). But ultimately, because we believe, and are saved, by the blood of Christ, every Word that is spoken in the Holy Bible, is also directed to us
SD
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MDK
Guest
Peter was so right on… the ignorant twist Scriptures to their own destruction. Sadly, it affects many who may otherwise really like to know Christ.
2 Peter 3:16 “As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are certain things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, to their own destruction.”
I thank God that He established His one true Church, and has protected her from error in teaching faith and morals. This is truly a wonderful blessing. We are not left to flounder and flail about, with error upon error. We who humbly honor what He established are able to truly know Him as much as He has revealed in public revelation. I thank God for the Catholic Church, His Body, His Bride.
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