Protestants, SHOW YOUR LOVE FOR MARY!!!

[justasking4]

Either you show you have love for Her or you don’t. Do you and are you willing to show your understanding of how in this thread?

Your are assuming a relationship with her that the Scriptures never speak nor encourage. The only spiritual relationship we are to have is with Christ. It is Him alone we are to love and be devoted to and no other. In this world we are to love each other but never do the Scriptures command us to love those who have died.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Mary is not your neighbor. Loving your neighbor as yourself has to do with your relationships in this world and not the next.

Wow, that is quite the interpretation. Somehow I cannot seem to find it in my Bible, though. Would you mind supplying chapter and verse which states clearly that “Loving your neighbor as yourself has to do with your relationships in this world and not the next?”

Mary is the Mother of Christ, Second Person of the Trinity. She had no other children of her womb on earth. However, we know that Christ was made to ‘be the first of many brothers (and sisters)’ in the Lord.

So please answer me. Is Christ your brother, yes or no.
Is God your father, yes or no.

If Christ is your brother and Mary is His Mother, why is she not your mother in exactly the same sense that Christ is your brother (though not of the womb) and God is your father (through adoption)?

Why did Christ have a human Mother? To show His humanity.
A Divine Father? To show his divinity.

As humans, we ‘share’ His mother, in our humanity. She was ‘given’ to us at the foot of the Cross.

You are in for a very sticky time when you reach the pearly gates and suddenly realize that you spent your life denying the Mother of the Lord, and just what that will mean. Ignorance may excuse you somewhat. . . honest lack of comprehension as well. But you especially have been given much instruction which you have (to your and our sorrow) passed by cavalierly, too intent on stating your OWN doctrines and your OWN opinions to listen to anything different from what you have already ‘determined’ that you WILL believe.

 

[Harpazo]

Your are assuming a relationship with her that the Scriptures never speak nor encourage. The only spiritual relationship we are to have is with Christ. It is Him alone we are to love and be devoted to and no other. In this world we are to love each other but never do the Scriptures command us to love those who have died.

Shlom lokh,

When a family member dies, do you cease from loving them any longer? And assuming they are in Heaven, do you suppose they cease loving you? According to your logic, you nor they are under no obligation to love the other. Could you explain to me why and show me from Scripture (since you want to throw the Scripture card out there)?

Alloho minokhoun,
Andrew

 

[adstrinity]

Your are assuming a relationship with her that the Scriptures never speak nor encourage. The only spiritual relationship we are to have is with Christ. It is Him alone we are to love and be devoted to and no other. In this world we are to love each other but never do the Scriptures command us to love those who have died.

So, when we are all dead in Heaven, we wont be commanded to love anybody?

No, nevermind, please don’t answer that. Either you were either willing to answer the question as is, or you weren’t. Perhaps you do not understand, perhaps your pride will not let you admit love, but, this is the topic, you have seen how others have answered, do not go off on a tangent. If you love Her and have a way to show us, I implore you to show us. If not, this is not the thread for you.

 

[Henning]

Your are assuming a relationship with her that the Scriptures never speak nor encourage. **The only spiritual relationship we are to have is with Christ. It is Him alone we are to love and be devoted to and no other. **In this world we are to love each other but never do the Scriptures command us to love those who have died.

a little off topic and not to nitpick JA4 but…
Christians also have love for, spiritual relation with, and devotion to heavenly Father…Abba.

 

[justasking4]

Tantum ergo;4312762
Quote:
Mary is not your neighbor. Loving your neighbor as yourself has to do with your relationships in this world and not the next.

Tantum ergo
]Wow, that is quite the interpretation. Somehow I cannot seem to find it in my Bible, though. Would you mind supplying chapter and verse which states clearly that “Loving your neighbor as yourself has to do with your relationships in this world and not the next?”

This is something you need to do since you believe you have continuing relationship with the dead. I know in every case in the Scriptures does it ever teach us that it extends to those in the next life.

Mary is the Mother of Christ, Second Person of the Trinity. She had no other children of her womb on earth. However, we know that Christ was made to ‘be the first of many brothers (and sisters)’ in the Lord.

So please answer me. Is Christ your brother, yes or no.
Is God your father, yes or no.

Yes to both since they are both working in the world.

If Christ is your brother and Mary is His Mother, why is she not your mother in exactly the same sense that Christ is your brother (though not of the womb) and God is your father (through adoption)?

The Scriptures do not teach that these relationship continue in the next world. Remember what Jesus taught in Matthew 22:30 about marriage relationships.
Do you believe that married people are still married in heaven to each other?

Why did Christ have a human Mother? To show His humanity.
A Divine Father? To show his divinity.

True

As humans, we ‘share’ His mother, in our humanity. She was ‘given’ to us at the foot of the Cross.

Not so. We don’t share in “His mother, in our humanity”. That is an unbliblical idea.

You are in for a very sticky time when you reach the pearly gates and suddenly realize that you spent your life denying the Mother of the Lord, and just what that will mean. Ignorance may excuse you somewhat. . . honest lack of comprehension as well. But you especially have been given much instruction which you have (to your and our sorrow) passed by cavalierly, too intent on stating your OWN doctrines and your OWN opinions to listen to anything different from what you have already ‘determined’ that you WILL believe.

I’m actually more concerned about those who teach these things and are being led astray from devotion to Christ. See 2 Corinthians 11:3.

 

[justasking4]

a little off topic and not to nitpick JA4 but…
Christians also have love for, spiritual relation with, and devotion to heavenly Father…Abba.

True. This is Scriptural.

 

[justasking4]

Shlom lokh,

When a family member dies, do you cease from loving them any longer? And assuming they are in Heaven, do you suppose they cease loving you? According to your logic, you nor they are under no obligation to love the other. Could you explain to me why and show me from Scripture (since you want to throw the Scripture card out there)?

Alloho minokhoun,
Andrew

Love requires an ongoing relationship otherwise it does not exist. Even when a loved dies that relationhip is no longer a real part of us even though we grieve. Take Moses as an example. After he died the Israel mourned for him for 30 days and then had to pursue the tasks God had ordained. Nowhere do we find in any accounts of the OT where the people are encouraged to have some kind of relationship with him now that he is dead. There is not one prayer to him for anything. The only spiritual relationship that the people are commanded to have is with the Living God who alone will take care of them. Thats why we don’t see anyone praying to the dead, exhorted to continue to love them or maintain some kind of relationship with them. It ceases at death.

 

[ChristianKnight]

lol, how about: Catholics, SHOW YOUR LOVE FOR OTHERS!!!

…

I believe Mary was the woman who gave birth to Jesus, but I am not going to put her out specially just cause, my list goes:

Trinity/Disciples/Others

 

[SIA]

Just like the title says, let us see how you love Her and show respect to Jesus by loving Her.

You say we misunderstand how you view Her, so, show us your understanding. Whether personal devotions to Her or quotes from the Bible, show us how you love Mary.

Amen.

I Love Mary! She was the mother of our Lord, chosen by God and gave her resounding yes to Gabriel! Mary is the greatest woman who ever lived, no doubt about it. She is what all Christians should have as their role model. Her faith in God was unwavering. She would have to be foremost of all the saints in Heaven.

 

[LilyM]

I Love Mary! She was the mother of our Lord, chosen by God and gave her resounding yes to Gabriel! Mary is the greatest woman who ever lived, no doubt about it. She is what all Christians should have as their role model. Her faith in God was unwavering. She would have to be foremost of all the saints in Heaven.

:yup: :getholy: and that’s exactly the rightful pedestal that we Catholics put her on :flowers: - not the same level as God but certainly by far the foremost of all the saints.

 

[SIA]

:yup: :getholy: and that’s exactly the rightful pedestal that we Catholics put her on :flowers: - not the same level as God but certainly by far the foremost of all the saints.

cool.

 

[Hajnalcsillag]

Love requires an ongoing relationship otherwise it does not exist. Even when a loved dies that relationhip is no longer a real part of us even though we grieve. Take Moses as an example. After he died the Israel mourned for him for 30 days and then had to pursue the tasks God had ordained. Nowhere do we find in any accounts of the OT where the people are encouraged to have some kind of relationship with him now that he is dead. There is not one prayer to him for anything. The only spiritual relationship that the people are commanded to have is with the Living God who alone will take care of them. Thats why we don’t see anyone praying to the dead, exhorted to continue to love them or maintain some kind of relationship with them. It ceases at death.

I agree wholeheartedly. Maybe it’s just my Protestant heathenism speaking up again, but continuing to forge a spiritual relationship with the dead is something normally seen in tribalism that focuses on ancestor worship.

I loved my late grandfather. I wish he was still around; he was basically a self-taught master chef. But when I use one of his old recipes, I don’t ask him to guide me to the right way to do something. I believe that I honor his memory by conducting myself in the kitchen the way that he would…even if it means changing an ingredient here or there. (Seriously, the guy had 21 different recipes for split pea soup stapled together!)

 

[With_Questions]

Just like the title says, let us see how you love Her and show respect to Jesus by loving Her.

You say we misunderstand how you view Her, so, show us your understanding. Whether personal devotions to Her or quotes from the Bible, show us how you love Mary.

Amen.

With all due respect, I don’t even know if it is possible to even love a deceased human that I have never known. Let’s think about it.

Maybe I can say I love alive humans, like say people in Nigeria, that I don’t know. But I can do something tangible like giving money, to express this love.

I can say I love dead humans, like my grandmother, that I used to know. Certainly if my wife were to die, I would still love her. But love is an action. How can I really love both perople?.

I can say I love God. But even though I can’t see Him, I am in a relationship with Him.

I can say I love reading about a physicall dead human I have never known. I can say I love their accomplishments and love their character. But here love does not really seem to be the right word.

Can I really say that I love a physically dead person? First I don’t even know if I am commanded in the Bible to love them? I can’t see where? Second of all, I do not have any idea how I can tangibly express this love?

I think I will stick to “loving” physically alive people.

 

[gcnuss]

Just like the title says, let us see how you love Her and show respect to Jesus by loving Her.

You say we misunderstand how you view Her, so, show us your understanding. Whether personal devotions to Her or quotes from the Bible, show us how you love Mary.

As I read the title, I was reminded of the emails I receive from friends and acquaintances that have a religious message (not always of the soundest theology) and then end with something like “if you truly love Jesus and are not ashamed of him, forward this message to everyone you know.” Does that mean that if I don’t do what the sender has suggested that I do not love Jesus and that I am ashamed of him? Of course not!!

Like some others upstream, I don’t know if I can express “love” for Mary but I can certainly express admiration and respect.

I admire Mary because, as a young teenager, she was able to respond “let it be with me according to your word” instead of “no way!!! Ewwwwwwww!” She is a model of faith and obedience in following God’s will.

I respect Mary as the Theotokos, the bearer of the second person of the Holy Trinity. She had a unique and necessary role in the incarnation of the one who is the source of our salvation. She was blessed by her calling to be the Mother of God and, because she accepted that role, we are blessed with the salvation which comes through Christ, our Lord.

I hope that this makes some sense.

 

[murtad]

Mary is blessed because God chose her to bear the Lord Jesus and bring Him into the world. However this does not mean we are to love her.

What!? You hate Mary! Blasphemy!! Even the Bible, in Book of Romans, Chapter 16, Verse 6 clearly commands us to venerate Mary.

TNIV: Venerate Mary who worked hard among you.
NRSV: Pray with Mary who worked hard among you.
KJV: Salute Mary who worked hard among you.
NIV: Greet Mary who worked hard among you.

This is why not only Roman Catholics but also Eastern Orthodox, Monophysites and Nestorians deeply venerate Mary, or if you prefer pray to the glorious Queen of Heaven.

Prayer is to Mary is not idolatry as even Saint Paul prayed to Her for he tells us that there is no salvation for Jesus-alone and we need intercession from Mary and the saints. In his book of Romans, he ends the book with salutations, greetings, or venerations of saints. This is why Catholic Church even today canonises saints, and once canonised adherents will venerate them, as we follow the Bible.

 

[Scientiphic]

What!? You hate Mary! Blasphemy!! Even the Bible, in Book of Romans, Chapter 16, Verse 6 clearly commands us to venerate Mary.

TNIV: Venerate Mary who worked hard among you.
NRSV: Pray with Mary who worked hard among you.
KJV: Salute Mary who worked hard among you.
NIV: Greet Mary who worked hard among you.

This is why not only Roman Catholics but also Eastern Orthodox, Monophysites and Nestorians deeply venerate Mary, or if you prefer pray to the glorious Queen of Heaven.

Prayer is to Mary is not idolatry as even Saint Paul prayed to Her for he tells us that there is no salvation for Jesus-alone and we need intercession from Mary and the saints. In his book of Romans, he ends the book with salutations, greetings, or venerations of saints. This is why Catholic Church even today canonises saints, and once canonised adherents will venerate them, as we follow the Bible.

Christians are to love everybody, even their enemies. Why only Mary???

 

[Hajnalcsillag]

What!? You hate Mary! Blasphemy!! Even the Bible, in Book of Romans, Chapter 16, Verse 6 clearly commands us to venerate Mary.

TNIV: Venerate Mary who worked hard among you.
NRSV: Pray with Mary who worked hard among you.
KJV: Salute Mary who worked hard among you.
NIV: Greet Mary who worked hard among you.

This is why not only Roman Catholics but also Eastern Orthodox, Monophysites and Nestorians deeply venerate Mary, or if you prefer pray to the glorious Queen of Heaven.

Prayer is to Mary is not idolatry as even Saint Paul prayed to Her for he tells us that there is no salvation for Jesus-alone and we need intercession from Mary and the saints. In his book of Romans, he ends the book with salutations, greetings, or venerations of saints. This is why Catholic Church even today canonises saints, and once canonised adherents will venerate them, as we follow the Bible.

Hang on a sec. Romans 16 is full of requests for personal greetings. And when it comes to Mary, there are six different Marys in the New Testament. How do we know this refers to the mother of Jesus? Most of the personal greetings are directed toward folks with Roman names…was Mary, mother of Jesus, in Rome at the time?

 

[a_mirror_dimly]

What!? You hate Mary! Blasphemy!! Even the Bible, in Book of Romans, Chapter 16, Verse 6 clearly commands us to venerate Mary.

TNIV: Venerate Mary who worked hard among you.
NRSV: Pray with Mary who worked hard among you.
KJV: Salute Mary who worked hard among you.
NIV: Greet Mary who worked hard among you.

This is why not only Roman Catholics but also Eastern Orthodox, Monophysites and Nestorians deeply venerate Mary, or if you prefer pray to the glorious Queen of Heaven.

Prayer is to Mary is not idolatry as even Saint Paul prayed to Her for he tells us that there is no salvation for Jesus-alone and we need intercession from Mary and the saints. In his book of Romans, he ends the book with salutations, greetings, or venerations of saints. This is why Catholic Church even today canonises saints, and once canonised adherents will venerate them, as we follow the Bible.

I’m unsure of which translations you’re quoting. I just looked them up, and the TNIV, NRSV, KJV, and NIV all translate Romans 16:6a as “Greet Mary, …”

More important of course is the Greek word, aspazomai. I’ll be the first to admit that I’m not a Greek scholar, but the definitions I can find all indicates that it means to greet or embrace. It can also be translated “salute”, adding some additional connotation of respect to the greeting. Nowhere was I able to find support for the translations “venerate” or “pray with”. From context Paul is almost certainly referring to a Mary who was a member of the church in Rome rather than Mary the Mother of Jesus.

 

[LilyM]

Hang on a sec. Romans 16 is full of requests for personal greetings. And when it comes to Mary, there are six different Marys in the New Testament. How do we know this refers to the mother of Jesus? Most of the personal greetings are directed toward folks with Roman names…was Mary, mother of Jesus, in Rome at the time?

So much the more proof of the point if he ISN’T referring to the Mother of Jesus!

If Paul requests others to ‘venerate’ ‘pray with’ or ‘salute’, in other words show such respect to, some other ordinary woman who he happened to come across in Rome, how much MORE should we be willing to do so for Mary the Mother of Jesus (God), who is as far above any other human being as the sun the moon (of course even she is as far below God as the moon is below the sun)