Protestants & Sola Scriptura/Problems with Coherence

[YendisAgev]

Question: is “jut” an accidental misspelling of “just”? If so, then my justified anger wasn’t directed at you, as I said. It was directed at the offensive title. You claim that the author put forth that title to draw attention, but that in no way makes it right.

Amen.

“but many do not follow Christ alone.”

And that is not a judgment on someone… how?

As am I.

There are no contradictions between Catholic teaching and Sacred Scripture, especially since the Catholic Church put compiled the Sacred Scriptures. If you feel otherwise, then please start a separate thread on each respective teaching you feel contradicts Scripture so we can discuss it.

As if you never made a typo.

 

[YendisAgev]

Sorry to butt in but (no pun intended), who’s in charge of this website? Please inform the founder thanks.

Quite dubious imo.

MJ

Excommunicate me. That’s just wrong. You should be kinder.

 

[Pheonix]

As if you never made a typo.

Wait, what? I never claimed I didn’t make typos. I am human, after all.

As you can clearly see in my reply, I asked if it was an accidental misspelling. I can assure you that I am not a grammar/spelling Nazi, mind you. My question was asked as a clarification, as I wanted to make sure I making a proper response. Is that really so bad?

 

[YendisAgev]

Wait, what? I never claimed I didn’t make typos. I am human, after all.

As you can clearly see in my reply, I asked if it was an accidental misspelling. I can assure you that I am not a grammar/spelling Nazi, mind you. My question was asked as a clarification, as I wanted to make sure I making a proper response. Is that really so bad?

My apologies. It’s the internet, sometimes, as you know, there are those kind of people.

I meant just.

 

[MartinJordan]

Excommunicate me. That’s just wrong. You should be kinder.

My dear friend, I asked who is the founder of bible.ca that’s all. Can you trust them and why?

Thanks

MJ

 

[Eric_Hilbert]

Thread pruned.
Please, when we have anti-Catholic overnight trolls, report them.

 

[tqualey]

Hi, Rob,

I have been on vacation … and ever so slowly getting back to the internet… Yours is the first CAF note I have responded to - there are quite a few…hopefully, I will do justice to them. Now to your questions.

The Catholic Church is not like a civic club (Rotary, Lions, Kawanis, etc.) where I can believe what I want and still be a ‘good member’ of the civic club (now, if I don’t pay my dues, it is doubtful that they will be keeping me on their roles for very long! ) What is required of me to be a practicing Catholic is that I believe what the Catholic Church teaches. If I were to stop believing in these truths (e.g., the Seven Sacraments, the Canon of Scriputre, the teaching authority of the Magisterium, the infallibility of the Pope, etc.) then I voluntarily leave the Catholic Church - I excommunicate myself. So, in answer to your question, if Luther were alive today and did what he did in the 16th Century, I have no doubt he would get a similar response.

Stop a minute and look at the Church at the time of Luther 95 Thesis. No doubt there were major problems, people giving public scandal and reform was needed. Go further back in time to the life of St. Catherine of Siena (1380 - here is a link: newadvent.org/cathen/03447a.htm ) and we see the Church had other - and, dare I say, more serious problems - Luther only had one Pope …! ) But, don’t stop there - go all the way back… and here we have the Leader of the Apostles - deny Christ Himself! From the very beginning, the Catholic Church has had leaders who fell short of the mark. Some publicly returned to Christ and others we are not too sure about! But, this Church founded by Christ on Peter is not sustained by human strength, wit or manipulation - rather the Holy Spirit is constantly keeping it from being dashed against the rocks. Luther could have easily taken his lead from Catherine - both saw problems and the need for reform… but Luther decided to do things his way. Christ did not return to Earth, tell Luther a mistake had been made and that the Church was being taken away from Peter and his successors and handed to Luther. That never happened.

The results are quite obvious today - and this is where we have the origin of 30,000+ competing groups all contradicting one another and all claiming to be the way to Christ! Knowing no more than that - such a position is simply impossible!

In my opinion, there is no ‘common sense’ approach to SS - and the reason for this is that with the multitude of conflicting interpretations - what possible answer could common sense provide? We know the shortest distance between two points is a straight line - but, the proper path to Christ can not have 30,000+ routes. As long as denying the power of the Holy Spirit to guide Christ’s Chruch is the hallmark of Protestantism, then it will always fall short of the mark. Personal interpretation of Scripture leads to nothing but chaos - and you know who is in charge of chaos…

God bless

tqualey,

I think it is unfair to say Martin Luther left the church volunarily. He was exommunicated and most do not even know why specificallly. Do you really think he would have been excommunicated today?

I dont think any of that disqualifies the common sense of SS. It simply means that scripture alone is sufficient to understand the Gospel Message and how to find salvation.

After all scripture is the Word of God and not any doctrines taught by any church. It is the words of Jesus and the apostles. Why is that not sufficient?

Rob

 

[mrjinx777]

Introduction:

Jesus quoted from 24 different Old Testament books.
The New Testament as a whole quotes from 34 books of the Old Testament Books. These 5 books are never quoted in the New Testament: Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon.
It is not significant that these books: Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon, were never quoted in the New Testament, because they were part of “collections” of Old Testament books. Since other books within the same collection were quoted, this shows them too to be inspired.
The New Testament never quotes from the any of the apocryphal books written between 400 - 200 BC. What is significant here is that NONE of the books within the “apocryphal collection” are every quoted. So the Catholic argument that “the apocryphal books cannot be rejected as uninspired on the basis that they are never quoted from in the New Testament because Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon are also never quoted in the New Testament, and we all accept them as inspired.” The rebuttal to this Catholic argument is that “Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther” were always included in the “history collection” of Jewish books and “Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon” were always included in the “poetry collection”. By quoting one book from the collection, it verifies the entire collection. None of the apocryphal books were ever quoted in the New Testament. Not even once! This proves the Catholic and Orthodox apologists wrong when they try to defend the apocrypha in the Bible.
bible.ca/b-canon-jesus-favored-old-testament-textual-manuscript.htm

continues.

And where exactly, in the Bible, did Jesus and His Apostles say anything about the Canon they had, in other words the Septuagint? Not Josephus, Origen, etc, etc. On the Bible Alone, where do Jesus and the Apostles complain about the Scriptures they had?

And, Does your Bible have ALL the books Paul was referring to in 2 Tim 3:16? What is Paul referring to when He says all Scripture is breathed by God? Since Jesus and the Apostles quote from the Septuagint about 85% of the time approx. (300/350 quotes).

If Sola Scriptura was… well… Scriptural. How come it didn’t include a list of books?

However, Scriptures does say that there is a Church. The revealed mystery hidden for ages and generations (1 Col 24-26), the pillar and buttress of Truth (1 Tim 3:15), and the highest authority to resolve matters among the faithful (Matt 18:15-17).

Thanks.

 

[mrjinx777]

Continuation:

A. What books were in each of the three collections:

The Law (Torah) - Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy
The Prophets (Neviim) - Joshua, Judges, 1 & 2 Samuel (one volume), 1 & 2 Kings (one volume), Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, the 12 Minor Prophets (one volume)
The Writings (Kethubim) - Psalms, Proverbs, Job, Ruth, Song of Solomon, Ecclesiastes, Lamentations, Esther, Daniel, Ezra and Nehemiah (one volume), 1 & 2 Chronicles (one volume)
B. Jesus and the Old Testament:

Jesus, like all the Jews of the first century, divided the Old Testament into three “collections”: the law, the prophets, the psalms. Jesus said: “These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled.” (Luke 24:44)
Sometimes the sum of the Old Testament was referred to as two collections: the law and the prophets. Intestingly, Jesus referred to Psalm 82:6 as “Law”: "Jesus answered them, “Has it not been written in your Law, ‘I said, you are gods’?” John 10:34. This may explain why most of the time there were two collections referred to as a sum for the whole.

"Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill. Matthew 5:17
"For all the prophets and the Law prophesied until John. Matthew 11:13
"The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John; since that time the gospel of the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is forcing his way into it. Luke 16:16
Philip found Nathanael and said to him, “We have found Him of whom Moses in the Law and also the Prophets wrote—Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.” John 1:45
After the reading of the Law and the Prophets the synagogue officials sent to them, saying, “Brethren, if you have any word of exhortation for the people, say it.” Acts 13:15
"But this I admit to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect I do serve the God of our fathers, believing everything that is in accordance with the Law and that is written in the Prophets; Acts 24:14
bible.ca/b-canon-jesus-favored-old-testament-textual-manuscript.htm

And where exactly, in the Bible, did Jesus and His Apostles say anything about the Canon they had, in other words the Septuagint? Not Josephus, Origen, etc, etc. On the Bible Alone, where do Jesus and the Apostles complain about the Scriptures they had?

And, Does your Bible have ALL the books Paul was referring to in 2 Tim 3:16? What is Paul referring to when He says all Scripture is breathed by God? Since Jesus and the Apostles quote from the Septuagint about 85% of the time approx. (300/350 quotes).

If Sola Scriptura was… well… Scriptural. How come it didn’t include a list of books?

However, Scriptures does say that there is a Church. The revealed mystery hidden for ages and generations (1 Col 24-26), the pillar and buttress of Truth (1 Tim 3:15), and the highest authority to resolve matters among the faithful (Matt 18:15-17).

Thanks.

 

[mrjinx777]

Continuation:

Did Jesus Recognize a Specific Text of Scripture?

Did Jesus recognize a specific text form of scripture? It does not appear so, for his usage of scripture is allusive, paraphrastic, and-so far as it can be ascertained-eclectic. We find agreement with the proto-Masoretic text, with the Hebrew under-lying the Septuagint (perhaps even the Septuagint itself), and with the Aramaic para-phrase. Several examples from each category will illustrate the phenomena. The examples that are chosen are the most obvious, in that they stand over against the readings in the other versions.

A. Agreements with the Proto-Masoretic Text

Some of Jesus’ quotations and allusions to scripture agree with the proto-Masoretic text against the Septuagint. In the parable of the Growing Seed (Mark 4:26-29) Jesus alludes to Joel 4:13 (ET 3:13): “he puts in the sickle, because the harvest has come.” Mark’s therismos (“harvest”) renders literally the Hebrew gsyr, unlike the Septuagint’s trygetos (“vintage”). In Matt 11:29 Jesus bids his hearers to take his yoke upon them: “and you will find rest [anapausin] for your souls.” The saying alludes to Jer 6:16 in the Hebrew, where the Lord speaks through his prophet: “walk in (the good way), and find rest (nirgw`] for your souls”; and not to the Septuagint, which renders the passage: “and you will find purification [hagnismon] for your souls.” In Mark 13:8 Jesus warns his disciples that in the tribulation that lies ahead “nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom.” He alludes to Isa 19:2 in the Hebrew, which in part reads: “city against city, kingdom against kingdom”; the Septuagint, in contrast, reads: “city against city, province against province.” In Luke 16:15 Jesus asserts that “what is exalted among humans is an abomination [bdelygrna] in the sight of God.” This alludes to Prov 16:5 in the Hebrew, where the wise man claims: “Every one who is arrogant is an abomination [tw’bh] to the LORD”; not to the Septuagint: “Every arrogant person is unclean [akathartos] before God.” Finally, In the words of institution, Jesus speaks of his blood, “which is poured out [ekchynnomenon] for many” (Mark 14:24), which alludes to Isa 53:12 in the Hebrew: “he poured out [h’rh] his soul to death”; not in the Septuagint: “his soul was given over (paredothe] to death.”

B. Agreements with the Septuagint

Jesus’ scripture quotations and allusions sometime agree with the Septuagint against the proto-Masoretic Hebrew. Jesus’ quotation of Isa 29:13 is quite septuagintal, both in form and meaning (cf. Mark 7:6-7). The identification of John the Baptist as Elijah who “restores” (apokathistanei) all things (Mark 9:12) seems dependent on the Septuagint form (apokatastesei), or at least a Septuagintal form of Hebrew, not the proto-Masoretic Hebrew, which reads hshyb (“return” or “turn back”). Curiously, both of these elements are found in Sir 48:10, in which the returning Elijah is expected “to turn [Septuagint: epistrepsai; Hebrew: lush},b] the heart of the father to the son, and to restore [Septuagint: katastesai; Hebrew: lhkyn] the tribes of Jacob.” Both elements may well have been present in the original Hebrew version of Sirach.22 The quotation of Ps 8:3 (ET 8:2) in Matt 21:16 follows the Septuagint. But this may be the work of the evangelist. Finally, the highly important allusions to phrases from Isa 35:5-6; 26:19; and 61:1 in Matt 11:5 = Luke 7:22 agree in places with the Septuagint. Of course, agreements with the Septuagint no longer require us to think that Jesus read or quoted the Septuagint .23 Thanks to the Bible scrolls of the Dead Sea region, we now know that there were Hebrew Vorlagen underlying much of the Greek Old Testament. Indeed, there are examples where Jesus’ quotations of and allu-sions to scripture agree with some Greek versions against others. Jesus’ use of the Bible attests the diversity of the textual tradition that now, thanks to the Scrolls, is more fully documented.
bible.ca/b-canon-jesus-favored-old-testament-textual-manuscript.htm

And where exactly, in the Bible, did Jesus and His Apostles say anything about the Canon they had, in other words the Septuagint? Not Josephus, Origen, etc, etc. On the Bible Alone, where do Jesus and the Apostles complain about the Scriptures they had?

And, Does your Bible have ALL the books Paul was referring to in 2 Tim 3:16? What is Paul referring to when He says all Scripture is breathed by God? Since Jesus and the Apostles quote from the Septuagint about 85% of the time approx. (300/350 quotes).

If Sola Scriptura was… well… Scriptural. How come it didn’t include a list of books?

However, Scriptures does say that there is a Church. The revealed mystery hidden for ages and generations (1 Col 24-26), the pillar and buttress of Truth (1 Tim 3:15), and the highest authority to resolve matters among the faithful (Matt 18:15-17).

Thanks.

 

[tqualey]

Hi, Mrjinx,

Would you kindly supply a reference for the 24 different OT books? Thanks.

Now, I have two questions - and they are really quite straight forward:

1.) Who (or by what authority) were the books in the Canon determined - and kindly provide the date this took place in your response.

2.) One of the biggest challenges of SS (at least for me) is not which books are or are not included - but, that those who support SS uniformly support personal interpretation of Scripture. Since this activity is specifically prohibited in Scripture, who (or by what authority) is personal interpretation allowed - and kindly prove the date this took place in your response.

Looking forward to hearing from you.

God bless

Introduction:

Jesus quoted from 24 different Old Testament books.
The New Testament as a whole quotes from 34 books of the Old Testament Books. These 5 books are never quoted in the New Testament: Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon.
It is not significant that these books: Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon, were never quoted in the New Testament, because they were part of “collections” of Old Testament books. Since other books within the same collection were quoted, this shows them too to be inspired.
The New Testament never quotes from the any of the apocryphal books written between 400 - 200 BC. What is significant here is that NONE of the books within the “apocryphal collection” are every quoted. So the Catholic argument that “the apocryphal books cannot be rejected as uninspired on the basis that they are never quoted from in the New Testament because Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon are also never quoted in the New Testament, and we all accept them as inspired.” The rebuttal to this Catholic argument is that “Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther” were always included in the “history collection” of Jewish books and “Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon” were always included in the “poetry collection”. By quoting one book from the collection, it verifies the entire collection. None of the apocryphal books were ever quoted in the New Testament. Not even once! This proves the Catholic and Orthodox apologists wrong when they try to defend the apocrypha in the Bible.
bible.ca/b-canon-jesus-favored-old-testament-textual-manuscript.htm

continues.

 

[mrjinx777]

Continuation:

C. Agreements with the Aramaic

There are also several important examples of agreement with the Aramaic tradition, which arose in the synagogue and eventually assumed written form as the Targum. These examples will be treated in more detail.

There are significant examples in which Jesus’ language agrees with the Aramaic tradition. The paraphrase of Isa 6:9-10 in Mark 4:12 concludes with " . . . and it be forgiven them." Only the Isaiah Targum reads this way.zb The Hebrew and the Septuagint read “heal.” The criterion of dissimilarity argues for the authenticity of this strange saying, for the tendencies in both Jewish-’’ and Christian 21 circles were to understand this Isaianic pas-sage in a way significantly different from the way it appears to be understood in the Markan tradition. The saying, “All those grasping a sword by a sword will perish” (Matt 26:52), has dictional agreement with Targum Isaiah 50:11: “Behold, all you who kindle a fire, who grasp a sword! Go, fall in the fire which you kindled and on the sword which you grasped!” The items that the targum has added to the Hebrew text are the very items that lie behind Jesus’ statement. Jesus’ saying on Gehenna (Mark 9:47-48), where he quotes part of Isa 66:24, again reflects targumic diction. The Hebrew and the Septuagint say nothing about Gehenna, but the targum has: " . . . will not die and their fire shall not be quenched, and the wicked shall be judged in Gehenna. . . ." The verse is alluded to twice in the Apocrypha (Jdt 16:17; Sir 7:17), where, in contrast to Hebrew Isaiah, it seems to be looking beyond temporal punishment toward eschatological judgment. But the implicit association of Gehenna with Isa 66:24 is distinctly targumic. And, of course, the targumic paraphrase is explicitly eschatological, as is Jesus’ saying.

bible.ca/b-canon-jesus-favored-old-testament-textual-manuscript.htm

And where exactly, in the Bible, did Jesus and His Apostles say anything about the Canon they had, in other words the Septuagint? Not Josephus, Origen, etc, etc. On the Bible Alone, where do Jesus and the Apostles complain about the Scriptures they had?

And, Does your Bible have ALL the books Paul was referring to in 2 Tim 3:16? What is Paul referring to when He says all Scripture is breathed by God? Since Jesus and the Apostles quote from the Septuagint about 85% of the time approx. (300/350 quotes).

If Sola Scriptura was… well… Scriptural. How come it didn’t include a list of books?

However, Scriptures does say that there is a Church. The revealed mystery hidden for ages and generations (1 Col 24-26), the pillar and buttress of Truth (1 Tim 3:15), and the highest authority to resolve matters among the faithful (Matt 18:15-17).

Thanks.

 

[mrjinx777]

Continuation:

The distinctive reading found in Targwn Pseudo-Jonathan Lev 22:28, “My people, children of Israel, as our Father is merciful in heaven, so shall you be merciful on earth,” lies behind Jesus’ statement in Luke 6:36: “Become merciful just as your Father is merciful.” While it is unlikely that Jesus has quoted the Targum,21 and even less plausible that the Targum has quoted him '30 the parallel demands explanation. Most probably the Targum and Jesus both repeat a saying that circulated in first-century Palestine (cf. y Ber. 5:3; y. Meg. 4:9).

There are other instances of thematic and exegetical coherence between Jesus’ use of scripture and the Aramaic tradition. The parable of the Wicked Vineyard Tenants (Mark 12:1-12 par.) is based on Isaiah’s Song of the Vineyard (Isa 5:l-7), as the dozen or so words in the opening lines of the Markan parable demonstrate. But Isaiah’s parable was directed against the “house of Israel” and the “men of Judah” (cf. Isa 5:7). In contrast, Jesus’ parable is directed against the “ruling priests, scribes, and elders” (cf. Mark 11:27), who evidently readily perceived that the parable had been told “against them” and not against the general populace (cf. Mark 12:12). Why was this parable so understood, when it is obviously based on a prophetic parable that spoke to the nation as a whole? The answer is found once again in the Isaiah Targum, which in place of “tower” and “wine vat” reads “sanctuary” and “altar” (cf. Isa 5:2 and Tg. Isa 5:2),3’ institutions which will be destroyed (cf. Isa 5:5 and Tg. Isa 5:5). The Isaiah Targum has significantly shifted the thrust of the prophetic indictment against the priestly establishment. Jesus’ parable seems to reflect this orientation: the prob-lem does not lie with the vineyard; it lies with the caretakers of the vineyard. A few of these components appear outside of the New Testament and the Isaiah Targum. In 1 Eiioch 89:66-67 the temple is referred to as a “tower.” Its first destruction is referred to, but with-out any apparent allusion to Isa 5. This Enochic tradition appears in Barnabas 16:l-5, where it is applied to the second destruction, but without reference to either Isa 5 or Mark 12. Thus the coherence between Targum Isaiah 5 and Mark 12 is distinctive, and probably cannot be explained away as coincidence. 4Q500, which dates to the first century B.C.E., alludes to Isaiah’s parable of the Vineyard and applies it to the Temple, demonstrating the antiquity of the exegetical orientation presupposed later in Jesus and later still in the Targum.

bible.ca/b-canon-jesus-favored-old-testament-textual-manuscript.htm

And where exactly, in the Bible, did Jesus and His Apostles say anything about the Canon they had, in other words the Septuagint? Not Josephus, Origen, etc, etc. On the Bible Alone, where do Jesus and the Apostles complain about the Scriptures they had?

And, Does your Bible have ALL the books Paul was referring to in 2 Tim 3:16? What is Paul referring to when He says all Scripture is breathed by God? Since Jesus and the Apostles quote from the Septuagint about 85% of the time approx. (300/350 quotes).

If Sola Scriptura was… well… Scriptural. How come it didn’t include a list of books?

However, Scriptures does say that there is a Church. The revealed mystery hidden for ages and generations (1 Col 24-26), the pillar and buttress of Truth (1 Tim 3:15), and the highest authority to resolve matters among the faithful (Matt 18:15-17).

Thanks.

 

[mrjinx777]

Continuation:

Even the problematic quotation of Ps 118:22-23 may receive some clarification from the targum. Klyne Snodgrass has argued plausibly that its presence is due to a play on words between “the stone” (h’bn) and “the son” (hbn), which probably explains the read-ing in Targiini Ps 118:22: "The son which the builders rejected. . . ."3’ This kind of word play is old and is witnessed in the New Testament (cf. Matt 3:9 par.: “from these stones God is able to raise up children [which in Aramaic originally could have been “sons”] to Abraham”; cf. Luke 19:40) and in Josephus (B.J. 5.6.3 §272). The quotation was assimi-lated to the better known Greek version, since it was used by Christians for apologetic and christological purposes (cf. Acts 4:11; 1 Pet 2:4, 7), and possibly because second generation Christians were unaware of the original Aramaic word play.

Perhaps most important of all is Jesus’ proclamation of the kingdom of God: “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God has drawn near; repent, and believe in the good news” (Mark 1:15). Jesus’ “good news” (etiangelion) harks back to the “good news” (bgr) of Isaiah, but not in the Hebrew: “O Zion, you that bring good news … say, Behold, your God"' (40:9); or "who proclaims good news of good ... who says to Zion, Your God reigns”’ (52:7); rather, in the Aramaic: “prophets who proclaim good news to Zion … say, The kingdom of your God is revealed"' (Tg. Isa. 40:9); or "who proclaims good news ... who says to ... Zion, The kingdom of your God is revealed”’ (Tg. Isa. 52:7).

bible.ca/b-canon-jesus-favored-old-testament-textual-manuscript.htm

And where exactly, in the Bible, did Jesus and His Apostles say anything about the Canon they had, in other words the Septuagint? Not Josephus, Origen, etc, etc. On the Bible Alone, where do Jesus and the Apostles complain about the Scriptures they had?

And, Does your Bible have ALL the books Paul was referring to in 2 Tim 3:16? What is Paul referring to when He says all Scripture is breathed by God? Since Jesus and the Apostles quote from the Septuagint about 85% of the time approx. (300/350 quotes).

If Sola Scriptura was… well… Scriptural. How come it didn’t include a list of books?

However, Scriptures does say that there is a Church. The revealed mystery hidden for ages and generations (1 Col 24-26), the pillar and buttress of Truth (1 Tim 3:15), and the highest authority to resolve matters among the faithful (Matt 18:15-17).

Thanks.

 

[tqualey]

Hi, Mrjinx,

I would really appreciate you dropping the cut 'n paste approach to these posts and engage in dialogue as is intended by CAF.

For example, what specific point do you wish to make with all of this information you have provided to us?

God bless

Continuation:

Even the problematic quotation of Ps 118:22-23 may receive some clarification from the targum. Klyne Snodgrass has argued plausibly that its presence is due to a play on words between “the stone” (h’bn) and “the son” (hbn), which probably explains the read-ing in Targiini Ps 118:22: "The son which the builders rejected. . . ."3’ This kind of word play is old and is witnessed in the New Testament (cf. Matt 3:9 par.: “from these stones God is able to raise up children [which in Aramaic originally could have been “sons”] to Abraham”; cf. Luke 19:40) and in Josephus (B.J. 5.6.3 §272). The quotation was assimi-lated to the better known Greek version, since it was used by Christians for apologetic and christological purposes (cf. Acts 4:11; 1 Pet 2:4, 7), and possibly because second generation Christians were unaware of the original Aramaic word play.

Perhaps most important of all is Jesus’ proclamation of the kingdom of God: “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God has drawn near; repent, and believe in the good news” (Mark 1:15). Jesus’ “good news” (etiangelion) harks back to the “good news” (bgr) of Isaiah, but not in the Hebrew: “O Zion, you that bring good news … say, Behold, your God"' (40:9); or "who proclaims good news of good ... who says to Zion, Your God reigns”’ (52:7); rather, in the Aramaic: “prophets who proclaim good news to Zion … say, The kingdom of your God is revealed"' (Tg. Isa. 40:9); or "who proclaims good news ... who says to ... Zion, The kingdom of your God is revealed”’ (Tg. Isa. 52:7).

bible.ca/b-canon-jesus-favored-old-testament-textual-manuscript.htm