Protestants using 2 Corinthians 5:21 (Imputed Righteousness)

[Tommy999]

As a Protestant convert to Catholicism, I am embarrassed and frankly surprised (okay, not really surprised. unfortunately) by the attitudes and words being directed towards a Protestant Christian.

If I’d met some of the personalities on here when I began inquiring seriously into the Catholic Church, I would’ve remained a Protestant. As an ex-Protestant with your Catholic interests at heart, I strongly encourage you to reconsider your behavior.​

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Thanks for voicing so eloquently what I was thinking, 1newcatholic.

First of all, I want to congratulate you on your faith journey. Since I believe Catholics are Christians in every sense of the word, I am happy for you regardless of the Christian faith tradition to which you belong. The main thing is to be in a church where the gospel of Christ is preached and you are growing closer to God through Christ. I greet you as another fellow Christian brother.

I’ve come across many nice, friendly, and charitable Catholics on CAF who have explained and clarified Catholic beliefs for me. I appreciate them a lot and regard them as friends because I believe they genuinely care about me and have good hearts and are not here to judge me or to collect spiritual scalps. They just answer questions from Catholic perspective in charity and good will, which is wonderful and much appreciated.

On the other hand, I’ve encountered some Catholics on CAF (just like some fellow Protestants I know in real life) who are only here to argue with non-Catholics and participate in what I call “Spiritual Crossfire” like that political TV show on CNN.

I’ve also run into Catholics who make condescending comments regarding Protestants such as being a protestant is like eating spam compared to a Catholic feast or how being a Protestant is like living in a tent on the lawn of a mansion while being a Catholic is like living *inside *the mansion. I’ve actually read comments like that on CAF, believe it or not.

I don’t consider protestants to be second-class Christians – never have and never will. God loves us all equally and works in our lives every bit as much as other Christians.

Regarding the OP’s subject, I don’t know which view is correct regarding imputed righteousness but I’ve pasted a link to one protestant scholar’s analysis on it. I’m not saying it is necessarily right or wrong but it is a perspective that supports imputed righteousness.

gotquestions.org/imputed-righteousness.html

 

[shawnbm]

I think some of the posts above may be the result of having thin skin. The OP was not being accusatory or chastising of Protestants. He appeared to be asking why there is not an apologia from a Catholic perspective to the “imputed righteousness” issue that is often brought up with certain evangelical Protestants I have known over the years. Some of the responses were in line with answering that question, which is an important question in terms of what it means to be a Christian, whether it is a one-time event that can’t be undone, whether one is to walk the Christian way in fear and trembling in the hopes of eternal salvation, the inner realities brought up, etc.

I can see I was once an apologist for the Episcopal tradition from whence I came and often smugly and condescendingly engaged Catholics I would meet. I am guilty of that, but was even more harsh with evangelical Protestants and Calvinists then. Following my conversion, I find myself quite aware of how we are brothers in Christ with those Protestants around us and I do not go out of the way to criticize them for their beliefs (most of which are culturally indoctrinated or are of familial inheritance). I rejoice in the essentials and help to educate them on all the misinformation on Catholicism that is out there. I pray for unity and try to do all of this in charity. This is what Our LORD clearly calls us to do.

 

[guanophore]

I’ve also run into Catholics who make condescending comments regarding Protestants such as being a protestant is like eating spam compared to a Catholic feast or how being a Protestant is like living in a tent on the lawn of a mansion while being a Catholic is like living *inside *the mansion. I’ve actually read comments like that on CAF, believe it or not.

It is very sad and painful to see these kinds of comments. I left the CC and sojourned among my Protestant siblings for about 20 years, and they taught me to read my bible, which no one in the CC had ever done. I learned how to pray conversationally, rather than using only rote prayers, and I learned how to sing, pray, and worship aloud with others, which I did not before. In my case, the spam was in my Catholic formation (or lack of it). I still miss some very good sermons, and the rich praise and worship sometimes.

I think that people who say things like this never have experienced the Holy Spirit working in the ecclesial communities of our non-Catholic siblings.

 

[Tommy999]

It is very sad and painful to see these kinds of comments. I left the CC and sojourned among my Protestant siblings for about 20 years, and they taught me to read my bible, which no one in the CC had ever done. I learned how to pray conversationally, rather than using only rote prayers, and I learned how to sing, pray, and worship aloud with others, which I did not before. In my case, the spam was in my Catholic formation (or lack of it). I still miss some very good sermons, and the rich praise and worship sometimes.

I think that people who say things like this never have experienced the Holy Spirit working in the ecclesial communities of our non-Catholic siblings.

Hi guanophore,
There are a lot of things I admire and respect about Catholicsm and Catholics, too. That’s one of the reasons I came to CAF to fellowship and learn from my Catholic brothers and sisters in Christ because I want to keep growing in faith and have an even deeper walk with Christ and I felt that Catholicism has a lot going for it. I consider Catholics like a wise uncle, for the most part.

 

[Tommy999]

The following is a popular praise song currently in many evangelical churches. It mentions “Oh that rugged cross my salvation, where your loved poured out over me…”

I wonder if that is in reference to imputed righteousness or something else?

youtube.com/watch?v=s7ZJ5D5q54g

 

[Lou_Anderson]

What an issue, don’t we have anything more important to wrangle over? Use all this energy in prayer for our brothers and sisters, catholic and otherwise. May God bless you.

 

[1newcatholic]

Thanks for voicing so eloquently what I was thinking, 1newcatholic.

I’ve come across many nice, friendly, and charitable Catholics on CAF who have explained and clarified Catholic beliefs for me. I appreciate them a lot and regard them as friends because I believe they genuinely care about me and have good hearts and are not here to judge me or to collect spiritual scalps. They just answer questions from Catholic perspective in charity and good will, which is wonderful and much appreciated.
…
I’ve also run into Catholics who make condescending comments regarding Protestants such as being a protestant is like eating spam compared to a Catholic feast or how being a Protestant is like living in a tent on the lawn of a mansion while being a Catholic is like living *inside *the mansion. I’ve actually read comments like that on CAF, believe it or not.

I don’t consider protestants to be second-class Christians – never have and never will. God loves us all equally and works in our lives every bit as much as other Christians.

Protestant v Catholic behavior is rarely pretty on anonymous internet forums. But positive Catholic witness at an online forum was the first important interaction I had with Catholicism as a young Protestant–Catholics were nice to me, and it opened me up to further conversations about Catholicism.

 

[guanophore]

What an issue, don’t we have anything more important to wrangle over? Use all this energy in prayer for our brothers and sisters, catholic and otherwise. May God bless you.

The seriousness of the heresy known commonly as “imputed righteousness” has such far reaching implications that it contaminates the Apostolic faith in the nature of God, the nature of man, the nature of sin, the nature of salvation, and many other things. It is not a minor issue.

But I agree, we need to pray for our brother’s and sisters.

 

[Catholic_Dude]

The seriousness of the heresy known commonly as “imputed righteousness” has such far reaching implications that it contaminates the Apostolic faith in the nature of God, the nature of man, the nature of sin, the nature of salvation, and many other things. It is not a minor issue.

But I agree, we need to pray for our brother’s and sisters.

Correct, there is a TON OF STUFF wrapped up in the historical Protestant understanding of Justification by Faith Alone, which affects ALL aspects of Christian theology. It’s not minor at all.

 

[Tommy999]

The following link explains the view of ‘Imputed Righteousness’ from both the traditional Protestant and Catholic viewpoints. I thought it did so in a fair and unbiased manner, but then again I am not expert on the subject myself. However, both perspectives on the subject were explained in a little more detail. I hope it helps.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imputed_righteousness

 

[jacobaer]

2 Corinthians 5:21

“For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.”

From the Catechism:

“For our sake God made him to be sin”

602 Consequently, St. Peter can formulate the apostolic faith in the divine plan of salvation in this way: “You were ransomed from the futile ways inherited from your fathers. . . with the precious blood of Christ, like that of a lamb without blemish or spot. He was destined before the foundation of the world but was made manifest at the end of the times for your sake.” Man’s sins, following on original sin, are punishable by death. By sending his own Son in the form of a slave, in the form of a fallen humanity, on account of sin, God “made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.”

603 Jesus did not experience reprobation as if he himself had sinned. But in the redeeming love that always united him to the Father, he assumed us in the state of our waywardness of sin, to the point that he could say in our name from the cross: “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” Having thus established him in solidarity with us sinners, God “did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all”, so that we might be “reconciled to God by the death of his Son”.

END OF QUOTE

“…he assumed us in the state of our waywardness of sin…”

What does this phrase mean?

I think it means that Christ “assumed” our sins on the Cross, He took them upon Himself, and then was able to say, in our name, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?”

What say you?

 

[Nelka]

I understand what you’re saying, but if you step back and see the bigger picture you will see that you’re actually guilty of the very thing you’re accusing Catholics of being guilty of. Let me explain.

By choosing to be Protestant, what you’re saying is that Catholics are wrong on some important issues. This means you’re making a judgment against Catholics, effectively saying they are not as Christian as you are. This is the very ‘judgmental’ attitude that Catholics are (incorrectly) accused of having towards Protestants.

What Catholics are simply saying is that Christianity has specific teachings that you must accept to be Christian. It’s just like any other group/school/job/club you join in real life: there are rules you must follow to be a member, otherwise you’re not a member. If a Protestant is not following the official rules, they’re outside the Church.

The problem is, the Protestant is basically saying they don’t have to follow any rules or accept any specific teachings, but at that point the Protestant has made themselves the rule-makers and have effectively said Catholics are outside the Church for making rules.

 

[michaelhager]

Forgive our brethren for their somewhat vehement stance in defense of their faith.
I’m sure it is a reaction to the extremely anti Catholic rhetoric that we tend to see on a daily basis.

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As a Protestant to Catholic convert, my reaction to Protestants is one of sadness that they do not understand the full meaning of Catholicism and do not benefit from ALL of the precious gifts our Lord gave us through His Church.

In general, I have found that the Catholic Church is far more tolerant of non Catholic denominations than many of them are of Catholics.

I pray that you will not judge us too harshly based on the zeal of these faithful.

God bless… my prayers will be for you all.