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joclucsylv
Guest
Pretty much lol! I have seen it happen in my hometown. Seriously. Disagreements cause more fly by night churches.
The Church has interpreted scripture for us since the beginning.
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The Church has interpreted scripture for us since the beginning.
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onemangang
Guest
Did it become less true later in Luther’s life?
He knew, and asserted truth.
Truth doesn’t change on the whim of a mans thoughts.
Truth doesn’t change with the times.
Truth is eternally true!
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faithalone1
Guest
Well each person has free will and can believe as they wish, I can’t subscribe to the “my church is the true church” mindset.
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joclucsylv
Guest
Well your answer just proved that you believe in works.
Wouldn’t you consider staying away from sin works??
You do works everyday and you can’t agknowledge it. Open your eyes and you will see all the good works you do.
We don’t become saved. Salvation is a thing that is CONSTANTLY worked on. You agreed that we can lose our salvation. Well ok then. It is imperative that we renew and nurture our faith in Jesus Christ every day with ongoing conversion. Remember Matthew 24:13 says, “But the one who perseveres to the end will be saved.”
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faithalone1
Guest
Well the Reformation was started in 1518 by Luther. He died in 1546. so thats 28 years. Luther rejected everything he’d been taught, all of the dogma, tradition, basically his whole life. So it took him a long time to get over the CC. its understandable to be confused when you radical alter the course of your life. I cannot accept the idea of a supreme pontif/bishop presiding over this faith. its wildly unbiblical in my view. we all have 1 high priest and its not Pope Benedict 16.
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onemangang
Guest
If one is not Catholic or Orthodox, they can’t assert that their “church” is the One True Church, it would be foolish to try to do so!
It is either one, or the other!
Now either the Catholic Church is in schism with the One True Church Christ founded (Orthodox communion)
Or the Orthodox Church is in Schism with the One True Church Christ founded (Catholic, big C)
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faithalone1
Guest
so we earn our salvation. i dont believe anything a human being can “do” can save them. virtually every other religion says this and its makes religion a system to work in. I try to do good BECAUSE i’m saved, not because I’m trying to get saved.Well your answer just proved that you believe in works.
Wouldn’t you consider staying away from sin works??
You do works everyday and you can’t agknowledge it. Open your eyes and you will see all the good works you do.
We don’t become saved. Salvation is a thing that is CONSTANTLY worked on. You agreed that we can lose our salvation. Well ok then.
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joclucsylv
Guest
Do you think it was the intention of Jesus to have so many denominations?? He said that the Church is the pillar and foundation of truth. In the first 400 years of Christianity there was no bible. The church was the teaching authority.
He built one church upon Peter. The Catholic church can trace it’s apostolic succession ALL THE WAY to Peter.
Tell me how do you interpret Matthew 16:18 where Jesus tells Peter that he is the rock on which he will build his church. He tells Peter he will give him the keys to the Kingdom and the power to bind and loose.
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onemangang
Guest
I think you have asserted correctely when you added IN MY VIEW.
Luther would go on to change his position. The quote I left of Luther was one he made before, in his rashness, he separated from the One True Church.
This is what John Calvin would go on to say about Luther’s change of Heart
John Calvin on St. Peter
"We must firmly believe there is a high-priest in the militant church, established by divine right whom all Christians must obey, and who has authority to impart absolution." I prove this position by the word addressed to Peter “Thou art Peter, and upon this rock,…etc:” If now a Lutheran should say, that Peter was here named as one of the faithful; that the rock was the foundation-stone of the church of Christ; that Peter was a bad foundation-stone because he denied Christ, and that, accourding to Paul, no one must lay another foundation but Christ-- This position must no wise be allowed. Then since a different exposition is favorable to Rome, you will know the rule from it’s proper application, that that which is favorable must be extended, Quod favores ampliari.** The Lutherans however, once for all, know that Christ gave the Roman primacy to Peter**.
Calvin and the Sorbonne Page 478 chapter 9
John Calvin
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faithalone1
Guest
Well “One True Churchism” can be a complicated subject. I just believe the true church is made up of true believers who obey the word of god the best as possible. Fact is 75% or more of “chirstians” dont even attend church regularly nor participate in worship with god in their daily lives. so we have people who are Christian in name only. Are they saved because there in your “One True Church” while a devout god fearing baptist etc. isn’t? “True churchism” is not healthy. just my view.
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joclucsylv
Guest
But you said one can lose salvation. You are a sinner, no??
You my friend are working on your salvation. You are not saved. It can be lost (you agreed) Sin makes us lose our salvation and no one is immune to sin.
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faithalone1
Guest
So why didn’t Calvin submit to the papacy?
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joclucsylv
Guest
faithalone 1
The bible refutes faith alone.
Tell me how you interpret James 2:24 : "Ye see then how that BY WORKS a man is justified, and not by faith only.
The bible refutes faith alone.
Tell me how you interpret James 2:24 : "Ye see then how that BY WORKS a man is justified, and not by faith only.
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faithalone1
Guest
so after one believes in Christ as lord and savior(the most important belief anybody can have) they then have to get to work? We do good because we’re saved. salvation isn’t like navigating the IRS.
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joclucsylv
Guest
faithalone 1
Explain Matthew 7 21-23
"Not everyone that saith unto me, Lord, Lord shall enter into the kingdon of heaven; but he that DOETH THE WILL of my Father which is in heaven.
Explain Matthew 7 21-23
"Not everyone that saith unto me, Lord, Lord shall enter into the kingdon of heaven; but he that DOETH THE WILL of my Father which is in heaven.
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faithalone1
Guest
We can cut and paste all night.
Ephesians 2:8-10
New International Version (NIV)
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
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faithalone1
Guest
isn’t THIS Gods will? God “desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.” 1 Timothy 2:4
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faithalone1
Guest
One thing to know here is that these passages were adressed to different people for various reasons. The gopsels are different because of the audience they were addressed too. Greeks, jews, romans. same thing with the rest of the NT. I believe salvation is gift of grace from God and we recieve it.
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joclucsylv
Guest
Well then let’s go to the original Greek if you don’t want to copy and paste all night. I need my parish priest here though lol. He can read Greek. Here is where I need a fellow Catholic more intellegent than I to pipe in.
The Catholic Church goes back to the original language the bible was written in.
I also suggest you read what the Church fathers wrote and in there I believe you will find the Catholic church.
Read about what they wrote on the Eucharist, the body and blood of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Remember, there is more than the bible. There is history. Are you curious at all as to how the early Christians worshipped and thought??
2 Thessalonians 2:15 St. Paul says, “Therefore brothers stand frim and hold fast to the traditions that you were taught, either by an oral statement or by a letter of ours.” The Catholic Church holds to Sacred Tradition which the scripture says to hold on to.
You are in my prayers faithalone1. You are here debating for a reason. Your soul is searching for the truth. If it wasn’t you wouldn’t be on a Catholic forum trying to persuade us you are right. The Catholic Church holds the fullness of truth. I pray you find it. Goodnight faithalone 1.
Scott Hahn was anti Catholic Protestant preacher/scholar. He came home to the Catholic chruch because he questioned. He has many books. He is maybe someone you want to look into reading.
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joclucsylv
Guest
The gospels were adressed to US!!!
What you are telling me is that the gospels were written for a different audience so we can’t apply them to our lives??
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