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Glennonite
Guest
What and why are there differences in the Catholic and Protestant versions of the Ten Commandments?
Glennonite
Glennonite
- Status
F
followingtheway
Guest
The Catholic Ten Commandments blend “Thou shalt not have any gods before me” with “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image” (referring to images of other gods that are worshiped) into one commandment (the First one).
In the Protestant religion, “Thou shalt not have any gods before me” and “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image” are two separate ones (the first and second).
The Catholic ten commandments also separates “Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife” (the ninth) from "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s “possessions” (the tenth).
In Protestantism, “Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife” and "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s “possessions” are blended into one commandment (the tenth).
But Lutherans are the only Protestants that have the same order of commandments as Catholics.
In the Protestant religion, “Thou shalt not have any gods before me” and “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image” are two separate ones (the first and second).
The Catholic ten commandments also separates “Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife” (the ninth) from "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s “possessions” (the tenth).
In Protestantism, “Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife” and "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s “possessions” are blended into one commandment (the tenth).
But Lutherans are the only Protestants that have the same order of commandments as Catholics.
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valentino
Guest
It is a basis on which morals can be founded.Each commandment in itself says very little.Catholics know there are many mortal sins which can come under the head of each commandment.That.s why Holy Mother Church has expounded on each which leads us to a better understanding of God’s will.Only the CC can decide definifly what is mortal and what is not.Take using the Lord’s name is vain.The Church may decide whether a 5yr old is committing mortal sin if he copies a parent.Without the Church one might say he used God.s name in vain and therefore he committed mortal sin.each protestant denomination decides for itself what is mortal and not mortal.Therefore the ten commandment can haveee different meanings .One church believes its sinful to dance.Or to taste alcohol.One cannot decide by themselves what is moral or amoral.There has to be a definitive authority.Thank God and Jesus for Holy Mother Church and our Holy Father and Magisterium.
J
Jim_Dandy
Guest
The original Ten Commandments were not numbered; they were separated (paragraphed). Numbering started when the printing press was invented.
Protestants changed the first and second commandments in their Bibles in order to zing the Catholics about “graven images.”
Jewish
1.I am the Lord thy God, who brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery.
2.Thou shalt have no other gods before Me. Thou shalt not make unto thee a graven image, nor any manner of likeness, of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; Thou shalt not bow down unto them, nor serve them; for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate Me; And showing mercy unto the thousandth generation of them that love Me and keep My commandments
.
3.Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that takes His name in vain.
4.Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work. But the seventh day is the Sabbath in honor of the Lord thy God; on it thou shalt not do any work, neither thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates; For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it.
5.Honor thy father and thy mother; in order that thy days may be prolonged upon the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee.
6.Thou shalt not kill.
7.Thou shalt not commit adultery.
8.Thou shalt not steal.
9.Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
10.Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s house; thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ***, nor any thing that is thy neighbor’s.
Catholic (short version)
1.I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt not have strange gods before me. (same as Jewish)
2.Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain. (same as Jewish)
3.Remember thou keep the Sabbath Day.
4.Honor thy father and thy mother.
5.Thou shalt not kill.
6.Thou shalt not commit adultery.
7.Thou shalt not steal.
8.Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
9.Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife.
10.Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods.
Protestant
1.Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
2.Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And showing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
3.Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain: for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that takes his name in vain.
4.Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it.
5.Honor thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the Lord thy God gives thee.
6.Thou shalt not kill.
7.Thou shalt not commit adultery.
8.Thou shalt not steal.
9.Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
10.Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ***, nor any thing that is thy neighbor’s.
Jim Dandy
Protestants changed the first and second commandments in their Bibles in order to zing the Catholics about “graven images.”
Jewish
1.I am the Lord thy God, who brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery.
2.Thou shalt have no other gods before Me. Thou shalt not make unto thee a graven image, nor any manner of likeness, of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; Thou shalt not bow down unto them, nor serve them; for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate Me; And showing mercy unto the thousandth generation of them that love Me and keep My commandments
.
3.Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that takes His name in vain.
4.Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work. But the seventh day is the Sabbath in honor of the Lord thy God; on it thou shalt not do any work, neither thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates; For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it.
5.Honor thy father and thy mother; in order that thy days may be prolonged upon the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee.
6.Thou shalt not kill.
7.Thou shalt not commit adultery.
8.Thou shalt not steal.
9.Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
10.Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s house; thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ***, nor any thing that is thy neighbor’s.
Catholic (short version)
1.I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt not have strange gods before me. (same as Jewish)
2.Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain. (same as Jewish)
3.Remember thou keep the Sabbath Day.
4.Honor thy father and thy mother.
5.Thou shalt not kill.
6.Thou shalt not commit adultery.
7.Thou shalt not steal.
8.Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
9.Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife.
10.Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods.
Protestant
1.Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
2.Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And showing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
3.Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain: for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that takes his name in vain.
4.Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it.
5.Honor thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the Lord thy God gives thee.
6.Thou shalt not kill.
7.Thou shalt not commit adultery.
8.Thou shalt not steal.
9.Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
10.Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ***, nor any thing that is thy neighbor’s.
Jim Dandy
B
beeliner
Guest
I’m not sure it had much to do with ‘zinging’ the Catholics or anyone else, but rather with interpretation.
Some ultra-conservative sects such as the Amish do not condone photography, in the fear that even photographs might be considered 'graven images" (rotoGRAVure?).
But from the context it seems obvious that the prosciption is against IDOLS, such as the infamous golden calf.
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Glennonite
Guest
Thanks “Industrial Strength”. I guess it’s all about the numbering; all three versions seem to say the same thing.
Glennonite
J
Jim_Dandy
Guest
What reason do you suppose Protestants had for changing the understanding of the ten commandments from the Jewish and Catholic interpretations that had endured until the 16th century? They Protest-ed everything Catholic, every way they could. Their war against “graven images” continues to this day. *Second Commandment: *Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven images! The bronze serpent Moses was commanded by God to make (Numbers 21:8-9, John 3:14-15, as well as other God-ordered “graven images”) is ignored.
I learned “Catholics make and worship idols” with my ABCs.
Jim Dandy
Former Protestant
J
Jim_Dandy
Guest
It’s about the numbering, which reinforces the Protestant interpretation. That’s why the numbering was changed.
Jim Dandy
Edit to add: Here’s a website that documents the differences:
davidmacd.com/catholic/10_commandments.htm
C
Crumpy
Guest
The more neutral reason for the difference in numbering was given by Fr. Mitch Pacwa. I seem to recall that he says that the numbering is strictly a case of catechetical convenience. there is no doctrinal significance to the numbering.
The Jewish listing in a previous post is based on the fact that God is mentioned in the first five commandments – so, these have to do with our service to God. (Honoring one’s parents is a very high duty, like one is serving God himself.)
Then, the remaining five have to do with our relations with other people.
That ‘jives’ with all the covenantal commands to love God with our whole heart, soul, and strength, and to love our neighbor as ourself.
As a Catholic, I prefer the Jewish numbering.
Strictly, there are about 13 commandments there, if you get literal about it. I like the simple reading of the commandments without numbers as actually occurs in scripture.
The Jews take great notice that there two versions of the commendments, one in Exodus and the other in Deuteronomy. In the one, it says to “observe” the Sabbath and in the other it says to “remember” the Sabbath. This represents quite a quandry, first, for the two versions to begin with, then, second, what to make of the difference in wording.
There is no central authority in Judaism, like the magisterium in the Catholic Church. so, the differences in versions is celebrated, rather than anything else. Two versions give them more to think about, observing and remembering the Sabbath. It’s a win-win situation to them.
The Hebrew word “mitvos” and “mitzvah” (if I have that right so far) are one the singular and the other the plural for commandment. The idiomatic meaning of the word is “blessing.” They consider they are blessed by performing a commandment. As the case may be, they even pray before the performance of a commandment.
Also, the depiction of the tablets with curved tops is merely an artistic embellishment that came along a couple hundred years ago, they were previously depicted on rectangular stones. The curved top tablets have even been picked up by the Jews, but it is not significant in a doctrinal or historical fashion, that I am aware of. It simply becomes a logo for the ten commandments, if I may use the term.
The Jewish listing in a previous post is based on the fact that God is mentioned in the first five commandments – so, these have to do with our service to God. (Honoring one’s parents is a very high duty, like one is serving God himself.)
Then, the remaining five have to do with our relations with other people.
That ‘jives’ with all the covenantal commands to love God with our whole heart, soul, and strength, and to love our neighbor as ourself.
As a Catholic, I prefer the Jewish numbering.
Strictly, there are about 13 commandments there, if you get literal about it. I like the simple reading of the commandments without numbers as actually occurs in scripture.
The Jews take great notice that there two versions of the commendments, one in Exodus and the other in Deuteronomy. In the one, it says to “observe” the Sabbath and in the other it says to “remember” the Sabbath. This represents quite a quandry, first, for the two versions to begin with, then, second, what to make of the difference in wording.
There is no central authority in Judaism, like the magisterium in the Catholic Church. so, the differences in versions is celebrated, rather than anything else. Two versions give them more to think about, observing and remembering the Sabbath. It’s a win-win situation to them.
The Hebrew word “mitvos” and “mitzvah” (if I have that right so far) are one the singular and the other the plural for commandment. The idiomatic meaning of the word is “blessing.” They consider they are blessed by performing a commandment. As the case may be, they even pray before the performance of a commandment.
Also, the depiction of the tablets with curved tops is merely an artistic embellishment that came along a couple hundred years ago, they were previously depicted on rectangular stones. The curved top tablets have even been picked up by the Jews, but it is not significant in a doctrinal or historical fashion, that I am aware of. It simply becomes a logo for the ten commandments, if I may use the term.
H
havana1
Guest
You might also keep in mind that some Protestants don’t believe they need to follow the Ten Commandments, that they’re “optional” and don’t have any bearing on their salvation. I asked about it on another thread to very little interest (apparently not a hot-enough topic in apologetics to merit any more attention), but keep in mind you may encounter an inevitable **"What Difference Does It Make How They’re Numbered? I’m Already Saved Without Your Legalism!" ** (I’m not saying that, but you may hear that from Protestants.)
G
Glennonite
Guest
Here’s what I remember from a Mass when I was a kid: The very purpose of the graven image of the serpent was to show the people, to remind the people the reason why they were being bitten by snakes. They were disobedient and sinful. This image was raised up upon a pole; when they saw it, they were reminded of their need to turn back to God.
This is the very reason we, as Catholics raise up the Corpus Christi (rather than a simple cross) upon a pole (cross). When we gaze upon it, we are reminded of our sinfullness and the reason to turn back to God. The graven serpent is a precurser to the Crucifix.
Graven image…Ha! Our world is full of statues of lions and soldiers and angels and… Why should we be worried about the one which reminds us of the price that was payed for our redemption?
Glennonite
I
Ignatius
Guest
It is not accurate to divide it between that Catholic and Protestant numbering of the decalogue. Some of the Protestants use the same numbering as The Catholic Church. The Anglicans, Lutherans and a few other Protestant denominations use that same numbering as The Catholic Church. So it would be more accurate to say the difference is between the Catholics and some Protestants.
Q
Qoeleth
Guest
Hey, I’m Catholic and I don’t take photos to avoid breaking the 2nd commandment. Neither do strict Muslims or Jews. Better to be on the safe side.
I think some icons are OK, as long as they are not intended a pictorial images.
Scripture is pretty clear.
G
Glennonite
Guest
Doesn’t ‘graven’ mean carved (in stone)? i.e. statues? I think photos, digital photos, TV pictures, these things:
, and drawings (unless you scratch them into a rockface) are all OK. Actually, I think even graven images are really OK as long as you’re not worshiping them…like your neighboring pagan-clans do.Glennonite
B
beeliner
Guest
LOL! If you’re Catholic, that would involve the FIRST commandment.
Not the reason that you suggest, nor am I certain that Jewish scripture numbers the commandmemts one by one, but I will ask my wife’s rabbi and report back to you.
Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill!
P
patrick457
Guest
Nuh-uh. The ‘Protestant’ (sic) division of the Commandments - more properly called the Philonic Division - actually has quite an ancient pedigree: in fact, it is found in the writings of Philo and Josephus, who both employ this reckoning long before Protestantism even existed.
Now the most excellent five were of this character, they related to the monarchial principle on which the world is governed; to images and statues, and in short to all erections of any kind made by hand; to the duty of not taking the name of God in vain; to that of keeping the holy seventh day in a manner worthy of its holiness; to paying honour to parents both separately to each, and commonly to both. So that of the one table the beginning is the God and Father and Creator of the universe; and the end are one’s parents, who imitate his nature, and so generate the particular individuals. And the other table of five contains all the prohibitions against adulteries, and murder, and theft, and false witness, and covetousness.
- Philo, De Decalogo 12.51
The first saying teaches us that God is one and that it is necessary to worship him alone. The second bids us to make an image of no living being or to worship it, the third to swear by God on nothing insignificant, the fourth to observe the seventh days by ceasing from all work, the fifth to honor parents, the sixth to desist from murder (φόνου), the seventh not to commit adultery, the eighth not to engage in theft, the ninth not to bear false witness, and the tenth to desire (ἐπιθυμίαν) nothing belonging to another.
- Josephus, Antiquities of the Jews, 3.89-92 (5.5)
- Yes, ladies and gents: this is the way the Ten Words are divided in the East!
P
patrick457
Guest
The modern-day Jewish reckoning is the so-called Talmudic Division used by Jews today, and one that appears - or at least inferred - in the Babylonian Talmud (Tractate Makkot 24a). Since some readers may not be familiar with it, here is how the commandments are divided.
1.) I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery.
2.) You shall have no other gods before me.
3.) You shall not make wrongful use of the name of the Lord your God.
4.) Remember the Sabbath day and keep it holy.
5.) Honor your father and your mother.
6.) You shall not murder.
7.) You shall not commit adultery.
8.) You shall not steal.
9.) You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
10.) You shall not covet.
The Targum Pseudo-Jonathan (usually dated to around the 7th century, or perhaps even much later into the medieval period) says this in its version of Exodus 20:
The first word, as it came forth from the mouth of the Holy One, whose Name be blessed, was like storms, and lightnings, and flames of fire, with a burning light on His right hand and on His left. It winged its way through the air of the heavens, and was made manifest unto the camp of Israel, and returned, and was engraved on the tablets of the covenant that were given by the hand of Mosheh, and were turned in them from side to side: and then called He, and said, “Sons of Israel, my people, I am the Lord your God, who brought you out free from the land of Mizraim, from the house of the bondage of slaves.”
The second word which came forth from the mouth of the Holy One, whose Name be blessed, was like storms, and lightnings, and flames of fire. A burning light was on His right hand and on His left and was borne through the air of the heavens, returned, and was made manifest unto the camp of Israel; it returned, and was engraved on the tablets of the covenant, and was turned in them from side to side. Then called He, and said, "*House of Israel, my people, you shall have no other God besides me. You shall not make to yourselves image or figure, or any likeness of what is in the heavens above, or on the earth beneath, or in the waters under the earth. You shall not bow down to them, or worship before them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God and an avenger, punishing with vengeance, recording the guilt of wicked fathers upon rebellious children unto the third and unto the fourth generation of them who hate me; but keeping mercy and goodness for thousands of generations of the righteous who love me, and who keep my commandments and my laws.
My people of the house of Israel, let no one of you swear by the name of the Word of the Lord your God in vain; for in the day of the great judgment the Lord will not hold guiltless any one who swears by His name in vain…*"
There is a Jewish legend about how God only was just done saying two commandments when the people, terrified of the Divine voice and the various phenomena, asked Moses speak instead. Rashi in his Commentary on Exodus 19:19 refers to it:
When Moses would speak and make the Decalogue heard to Israel - for they heard from the mouth of God only “I am…” and “You shall not have” (Makkot 24a) - the Holy One, blessed be He, would assist him [Moses] by giving him strength so that his voice would be strong and audible.
Not surprisingly, writers such as Maimonides (in his Sefer ha-Mitzvot) used this division. Ibn Ezra, in his commentary on Deuteronomy, notes that while “all the scholars of antiquity believed that the First Commandment is ‘I am’”, thinks it odd that God would give two commandments straight and only then pause, which led him to propose that ‘I am the LORD’ is the preamble “[introducing] the Commander”, while the first commandment is “You shall no other gods”. “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house” would be the ninth commandment, while not coveting your neighbor’s wife is the tenth.
1.) I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery.
2.) You shall have no other gods before me.
3.) You shall not make wrongful use of the name of the Lord your God.
4.) Remember the Sabbath day and keep it holy.
5.) Honor your father and your mother.
6.) You shall not murder.
7.) You shall not commit adultery.
8.) You shall not steal.
9.) You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
10.) You shall not covet.
The Targum Pseudo-Jonathan (usually dated to around the 7th century, or perhaps even much later into the medieval period) says this in its version of Exodus 20:
The first word, as it came forth from the mouth of the Holy One, whose Name be blessed, was like storms, and lightnings, and flames of fire, with a burning light on His right hand and on His left. It winged its way through the air of the heavens, and was made manifest unto the camp of Israel, and returned, and was engraved on the tablets of the covenant that were given by the hand of Mosheh, and were turned in them from side to side: and then called He, and said, “Sons of Israel, my people, I am the Lord your God, who brought you out free from the land of Mizraim, from the house of the bondage of slaves.”
The second word which came forth from the mouth of the Holy One, whose Name be blessed, was like storms, and lightnings, and flames of fire. A burning light was on His right hand and on His left and was borne through the air of the heavens, returned, and was made manifest unto the camp of Israel; it returned, and was engraved on the tablets of the covenant, and was turned in them from side to side. Then called He, and said, "*House of Israel, my people, you shall have no other God besides me. You shall not make to yourselves image or figure, or any likeness of what is in the heavens above, or on the earth beneath, or in the waters under the earth. You shall not bow down to them, or worship before them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God and an avenger, punishing with vengeance, recording the guilt of wicked fathers upon rebellious children unto the third and unto the fourth generation of them who hate me; but keeping mercy and goodness for thousands of generations of the righteous who love me, and who keep my commandments and my laws.
My people of the house of Israel, let no one of you swear by the name of the Word of the Lord your God in vain; for in the day of the great judgment the Lord will not hold guiltless any one who swears by His name in vain…*"
There is a Jewish legend about how God only was just done saying two commandments when the people, terrified of the Divine voice and the various phenomena, asked Moses speak instead. Rashi in his Commentary on Exodus 19:19 refers to it:
When Moses would speak and make the Decalogue heard to Israel - for they heard from the mouth of God only “I am…” and “You shall not have” (Makkot 24a) - the Holy One, blessed be He, would assist him [Moses] by giving him strength so that his voice would be strong and audible.
Not surprisingly, writers such as Maimonides (in his Sefer ha-Mitzvot) used this division. Ibn Ezra, in his commentary on Deuteronomy, notes that while “all the scholars of antiquity believed that the First Commandment is ‘I am’”, thinks it odd that God would give two commandments straight and only then pause, which led him to propose that ‘I am the LORD’ is the preamble “[introducing] the Commander”, while the first commandment is “You shall no other gods”. “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house” would be the ninth commandment, while not coveting your neighbor’s wife is the tenth.
P
patrick457
Guest
In his anti-Christian polemic Against the Galileans, Julian the Apostate - as quoted by St. Cyril of Jerusalem - shows that he is also familiar with this reckoning or something similar to it, which may show that this also has quite a bit of an early origin (Julian reigned from 360 to 363):
That is a surprising law of Moses, I mean the famous decalogue! “Thou shalt not steal.” “Thou shalt not kill.” “Thou shalt not bear false witness.” But let me write out word for word every one of the commandments which he says were written by God himself.
“I am the Lord thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt.” Then follows the second: “Thou shalt have no other gods but me.” “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image.” And then he adds the reason: " For I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third generation." “Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.” “Remember the sabbath day.” “Honour thy father and thy mother.” " Thou shalt not commit adultery." “Thou shalt not kill.” “Thou shalt not steal.” “Thou shalt not bear false witness.” “Thou shalt not covet anything that is thy neighbour’s.”
Now except for the command “Thou shalt not worship other gods,” and “Remember the sabbath day,” what nation is there, I ask in the name of the gods, which does not think that it ought to keep the other commandments? So much so that penalties have been ordained against those who transgress them, sometimes more severe, and sometimes similar to those enacted by Moses, though they are sometimes more humane.
Note how Julian also distinguishes “Thou shalt have no other gods but me” from “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image”!
That is a surprising law of Moses, I mean the famous decalogue! “Thou shalt not steal.” “Thou shalt not kill.” “Thou shalt not bear false witness.” But let me write out word for word every one of the commandments which he says were written by God himself.
“I am the Lord thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt.” Then follows the second: “Thou shalt have no other gods but me.” “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image.” And then he adds the reason: " For I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third generation." “Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.” “Remember the sabbath day.” “Honour thy father and thy mother.” " Thou shalt not commit adultery." “Thou shalt not kill.” “Thou shalt not steal.” “Thou shalt not bear false witness.” “Thou shalt not covet anything that is thy neighbour’s.”
Now except for the command “Thou shalt not worship other gods,” and “Remember the sabbath day,” what nation is there, I ask in the name of the gods, which does not think that it ought to keep the other commandments? So much so that penalties have been ordained against those who transgress them, sometimes more severe, and sometimes similar to those enacted by Moses, though they are sometimes more humane.
Note how Julian also distinguishes “Thou shalt have no other gods but me” from “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image”!
P
patrick457
Guest
To be more accurate, it is a difference between the Catholic Church and Lutherans (Augustinian Division) and most non-Lutheran Protestants and the Eastern Orthodox Church (Philonic Division) and Jews (Talmudic Division).
P
PJM
Guest
Good question:thumbsup:
**Exo. 20: **
And God spoke all these words, saying, "I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. "You shall have no other gods before me.”
"You shall not make for yourself a graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; “Remember to keep holy the Sabbath day”
"You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless who takes his name in vain. “
4. "Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long in the land which the LORD your God gives you.
5. "You shall not kill. “
6. "You shall not commit adultery”.
7. "You shall not steal”.
"You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.”
9. “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; or property”
10.“you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, or his manservant, or his maidservant, or his ox, or his ***, or anything that is your neighbors.”
And From Duet. 5: 6-21
[6] "
I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. [7] "You shall have no other gods before me.[8] "
You shall not make for yourself a graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; [9] you shall not bow down to them or serve them; for I the LORD your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, [10] but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments. [11] "You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain: for the LORD will not hold him guiltless who takes his name in vain.[12] "
Observe the sabbath day, to keep it holy, as the LORD your God commanded you. [13] Six days you shall labor, and do all your work; [14] but the seventh day is a sabbath to the LORD your God; in it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, or your manservant, or your maidservant, or your ox, or your ***, or any of your cattle, or the sojourner who is within your gates, that your manservant and your maidservant may rest as well as you. [15] You shall remember that you were a servant in the land of Egypt, and the LORD your God brought you out thence with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm; therefore the LORD your God commanded you to keep the sabbath day. [16] "Honor your father and your mother, as the LORD your God commanded you; that your days may be prolonged, and that it may go well with you, in the land which the LORD your God gives you.[17] "
You shall not kill. [18] "Neither shall you commit adultery.[19] "
Neither shall you steal. [20] "Neither shall you bear false witness against your neighbor.[21] "`Neither shall you covet your neighbor’s wife; and you shall not desire your neighbor’s house, his field, or his manservant, or his maidservant, his ox, or his ***, or anything that is your neighbor’s.
God Bless,
Pat
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