Prove it!

[MrS]

Quickest way… by far, it is death. At that point our eyes will be opened by the Lord, to see the Lord, to know the Lord.

Until then pray. This all happens in God’s time, not ours.

MrS

 

[DavidMark]

Reading these posts has given me insight into understanding Catholic thinking. What reason should Christ possibly have to come again if everything is understood so well by the Church?

 

[Dokimas]

What is the quickest, easiest way to prove to a Baptist that the Catholic church is the true church Jesus Christ founded, and is still the true church?

If you want my honest opinion, there isn’t anything you can say because it’s not exactly the truth.

 

[allischalmers]

Couldn’t prove it to me, no-way no-how, not ever. Read the Bible too much, read too many books, studied history too long.

 

[geometer]

(GOD) Who hath saved us and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given to us in Christ Jesus before the world began 2 Timothy 1 : 9

It reads a little better like this.

 

[Vimy_Ridge]

What is the quickest, easiest way to prove to a Baptist that the Catholic church is the true church Jesus Christ founded, and is still the true church?

TORTURE !!! just kidding,

You could tell him it is the oldest Church so it has a better chance of being somehow connected to the original Church.

 

[benidict]

With caution. Baptists know the Bible a lot better than Catholics do and they’ve interpreted it in their own way. I dated a Baptist for a while and he could quote the Bible like no other person I’ve ever met. So…unless you really know what you are doing,** be very careful. You might even want to have a priest present. Baptists believe that “once saved, always saved” and “sola scriptura”.**

Blessings,
Shannin

hi shannin. dont like disagreeing with you. yes it is good to be cautious about going toe to toe with a baptist. but as a former baptist who was imersed(pardon the pun, unintentional) in sola scriptura, there are many like us who know our bibles just as well as they do. also know many cradle Catholics who are very knowledgeable of the scriptures. just because a person was raised Catholic doesnt mean they are not going to know their bibles. but your caution is warrented, good to have some ground rules set up, and be grounded in church history as well. just because they can quote passages left and right does not mean they grasp the intent or meaning behind the passage. which is often the case. and yes i can trade bible verses with them all day long, but it wont do any good. all that happens is a circular discussion that gets nowhere. Love in Christ

 

[PJM]

=DavidMark;5860554]Reading these posts has given me insight into understanding Catholic thinking. What reason should Christ possibly have to come again if everything is understood so well by the Church?

I’m not sure that I fully understand the question?

The Second Comming of Christ: Here is some Biblical insight.

End Times

2 Thes. 2: “9 The coming of the lawless one by the activity of Satan will be with all power and with pretended signs and wonders, 10 and with all wicked deception for those who are to perish, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11Therefore God sends upon them a strong delusion, to make them believe what is false, 12** so that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness**. “

1 Thess. 4: 15-17 15 For this we declare to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, shall not precede those who have fallen asleep. For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the archangel’s call, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first; then we who are alive, who are left, shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air; and so we shall always be with the Lord.

Rev, 20: 11 “ Then I saw a great white throne and him who sat upon it; from his presence earth and sky fled away, and no place was found for them. And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Also another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, by what they had done. And the sea gave up the dead in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead in them, and all were judged by what they had done.

Mt. 24: 29-31 29 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken; then will appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory; and he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other”

Mt. 25: 31 "When the Son of man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne. Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate them one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, and he will place the sheep at his right hand, but the goats at the left. Then the King will say to those at his right hand, ‘Come, O blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world; for I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me… And when did we see thee sick or in prison and visit thee?’ And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brethren, you did it to me.’

There are two Judgements: The First at the instant of our death, where for Catholics and Christians who actually by our personal choices and deeds, judge ourselves, Chrsit affirms our judgement to heaven or hell.

For those who through NO FAULT OF THERE OWN do not know Christ, because they were not given the opportunity to do so [ability to know God and ignored is the same as saying NO to God] they will be judged on the the “body of there works and deeds” by Jesus.

At the end of THIS WORLD, God will reign supreme, Satan is defeated for all time, and all the dead adn living will be called forth to the Final Judgement, where everyone will know where everyone else is. We shall be reunited with out now perfected bodies and for all eternity paraise and honor God or Spend Eternity in despair, pain and missery.

Many Protestants hold that tere will be an [inbetween judgement] but this position in antibiblical. 1 Thess 4: 15-17.

Hope this clarifes the matter for you, if not let us know how we can be of further help.

Love and prayers,

Pat

 

[benidict]

Couldn’t prove it to me, no-way no-how, not ever. Read the Bible too much, read too many books, studied history too long.

which history did you study? clement? ignatious? Augustine? the letter to the corinthians would be a good one for you to read if you havent. also the city of God by augustine.interestingly enough, a good friend of mine was a baptist minister, grounded in the word. after a long time of study of both the scriptures and the church fathers he converted to the anglican church. the reason he didnt become Catholic was because he felt a need to stay close to his british heritage. i myself was a baptist. after years of study of both scripture and the church fathers, as well as some very intense spiritual experiences, i myself converted, one passage i would point you to would be malichi 1:11. i have a friend who was a seminarian in the missouri lutheren synod, when i asked him about this verse he like me saw the same thing. the only possibility for this passage is it is a prophecy about the Church Christ would establish. only One Church fits the criteria in this passage. that is The Holy Catholic Church. please dont give up your studying my friend. always more to learn. God bless you and yours

 

[Dokimas]

hi shannin. dont like disagreeing with you. yes it is good to be cautious about going toe to toe with a baptist. but as a former baptist who was imersed(pardon the pun, unintentional) in sola scriptura, there are many like us who know our bibles just as well as they do. also know many cradle Catholics who are very knowledgeable of the scriptures. just because a person was raised Catholic doesnt mean they are not going to know their bibles. but your caution is warrented, good to have some ground rules set up, and be grounded in church history as well. just because they can quote passages left and right does not mean they grasp the intent or meaning behind the passage. which is often the case. and yes i can trade bible verses with them all day long, but it wont do any good. all that happens is a circular discussion that gets nowhere. Love in Christ

The problem isn’t with ‘sola scriptura’ but with those misrepresenting the Scriptures that hold to ‘sola scriptura’. It’s the same with the idea that there is one universal Christian church known as the Body of Christ. The concept is correct but it’s those who think their church and its teaching is the only true church that is (are) the problem.

 

[benidict]

Reading these posts has given me insight into understanding Catholic thinking. What reason should Christ possibly have to come again if everything is understood so well by the Church?

to fulfill his promise that he would return to us. to usher in his kingdom forever. to judge mankind and bring justice. etc etc etc.

 

[benidict]

The problem isn’t with ‘sola scriptura’ but with those misrepresenting the Scriptures that hold to ‘sola scriptura’. It’s the same with the idea that there is one universal Christian church known as the Body of Christ. The concept is correct but it’s those who think their church and its teaching is the only true church that is (are) the problem.

hello again dokimas. yes sola scriptura is a problem. that has lead us to the mess we are in today. ill be generous here 20000 different denominations. none of which agree which is the correct interpretation. 1 Church stands firm. and its not the baptist church.

 

[Dokimas]

hello again dokimas. yes sola scriptura is a problem. that has lead us to the mess we are in today. ill be generous here 20000 different denominations. none of which agree which is the correct interpretation. 1 Church stands firm. and its not the baptist church.

Once again all I can say is thank you for your opinion.

 

[geometer]

The concept is correct but it’s those who think their church and its teaching is the only true church that is (are) the problem.

The catholic church is one that thinks it is the only true church, so its just another one of those. Your complaint is more valid than you think.

 

[benidict]

Once again all I can say is thank you for your opinion.

and i thank you for yours. do you know the history of the origination of the baptist church. many baptist do not. i would be intersted in your views. im going somewhere with this.

 

[benidict]

The catholic church is one that thinks it is the only true church, so its just another one of those. Your complaint is more valid than you think.

actually your partially correct. we dont think we are the only true Church… we know it.

 

[Dokimas]

The catholic church is one that thinks it is the only true church, so its just another one of those. Your complaint is more valid than you think.

I didn’t think I was complaining just observing.

 

[Dokimas]

and i thank you for yours. do you know the history of the origination of the baptist church. many baptist do not. i would be intersted in your views. im going somewhere with this.

I’m not Baptist, so I remember very little what learned in Bible School 25+ yrs ago.

 

[Dokimas]

actually your partially correct. we dont think we are the only true Church… we know it.

Paul may have an interesting response, Benidict.

1Co 8:1,2 Now concerning things offered to idols: We know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffs up, but love edifies. And if anyone thinks that he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know.

 

[benidict]

Paul may have an interesting response, Benidict.

1Co 8:1,2 Now concerning things offered to idols: We know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffs up, but love edifies. And if anyone thinks that he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know.

didnt mean to come across that way. just a historical fact. and i have found out i have been wrong on alot of things as a protestant. and yes i do humbly submit myself to leadership that have the correct interpretation of the scriptures. The One True Church.