Proverbs, a polygamists advice on Adultery

[AndyF]

The word brings on disdain in these times, but in Solomon’s time this was a moral option. I have no argument with this. So what if he did have 50 wives, so be it.?

The problem arises when we try to determine what gives him credentials to give advice on keeping one's chastity within marriage. What qualifies him as the epitomy of self restraint in the libido department. Unknown to everyone, would he have been the shining inspiration of how to behave during the day, credited only to fatigue brought on by a night of bed hopping.? So I am intrigued on what method he used to juggle this many wives without disqualifying himself from giving advice on adultery.( 5,1-20)

We can p(name removed by moderator)oint the problem starting after wife number one.  We watch this man to see how he tip toed the moral maize to foresee his end of marrying number two, without being labeled an adulterer, (perish the thought). To think he would need to do it all without savoring her *lips dripping with honey(3), *without falling into the trap of her* two edged sword(4). *I suppose the* wife of his youth(18) w*ould have something to say at the very first twinkle in his eye for number 2,  if of course she had only known. And why shouldn't she know. In all virtousness, honesty being his specialty, our man would have told her in a matter of fact way that he's on the lookout for number 2.

No. There was at one time a roadmap long gone and authored by Solomon that mapped the course to legitimate moral adultery that is now lost to antiquity.

There is one final quirk that needs mentioning. Just which “son” of the hundreds of children he sired is he giving advice to.? Only to offspring from the first wife would the advice be legitimate. One imagines what the answer if son #54 were the subject of this tutoring, and what he may say in reaction…

“But Father, if you hadn’t lusted after my mother #31, I wouldn’t be here for you to give advice to in regards to adultery.”?

No doubt this quite truthful snap back to reality would have brought on the back of his hand. We hope he was also “wise” as books of wisdom go to keep mum about what went on in the family closet.

But what does it mean to us today? It all makes sense today and it locks us quite contentedly into our one wife/husband systems. No escape clauses, or if you prefer roadmaps, for the modern man, not that we would want one of course, …Ahem.

So the polygamist Mormon of today can climb the podium give advice to his flock on the temptation of lust, or the millionaire will give advice on the slavery of money, and a sexually satiated and very married king can extole his sexual wisdom, but none have apparently heard the last wisest saying…

“Physician heal thyself.”

AndyF

 

[MH84]

No one else has answered you so I’ll try:

1 No one knows for sure if King Solomon was the actual author of the book of Proverbs. He may have only been the inspiration.

2 He could have contributed this advice before he went off the rails

3 All scripture in the Bible is inspired by God no matter who the author is.

1 Kings 3
7 Now, O LORD my God, You have made Your servant king instead of my father David, but I am a little child; I do not know how to go out or come in. 8 And Your servant is in the midst of Your people whom You have chosen, a great people, too numerous to be numbered or counted. 9 Therefore give to Your servant an understanding heart to judge Your people, that I may discern between good and evil. For who is able to judge this great people of Yours?”
10 The speech pleased the Lord, that Solomon had asked this thing. 11 Then God said to him: “Because you have asked this thing, and have not asked long life for yourself, nor have asked riches for yourself, nor have asked the life of your enemies, but have asked for yourself understanding to discern justice, 12 behold, I have done according to your words; see, I have given you a wise and understanding heart, so that there has not been anyone like you before you, nor shall any like you arise after you. 13 And I have also given you what you have not asked: both riches and honor, so that there shall not be anyone like you among the kings all your days. 14 So if you walk in My ways, to keep My statutes and My commandments, as your father David walked, then I will lengthen your days.”
www.biblegateway.com

You see initially God was pleased with Solomon and granted wisdom to him that had never been seen before. However, later Solomon turned his back away from God. As I said it is unknown when Proverbs was written.

 

[AndyF]

MH84:

Thanks for the post.

1/ NAB: “Parts II and V are explicitly ascribed to Solomon”

2/ True.

3/ NAB: 1 Kings 11,“The glorious rise of Solomon, his piety and wisdom, administrative skill and wealth, the extension of his kingdom, his prestige among neighbouring rulers, his reign of peace, above all his friendships with God-these are now eclipsed by his sins of intermarriage with great numbers of pagan wives and the consequent forbidden worship of their Gods (Ex 34,11-16,Dt 7,1-5)”

Sexual problems seem to be one of his weaknesses. Regardless,as a judge who judges and is wise(?), it would seem he fails to see this as a conflict of interest when he is asked for, or offers advice in sexual matters.

AndyF

 

[Nita]

Solomon chose to disregard God’s command not to “multiply wives for himself”.

Deut 17:14 "When you come to the land which the LORD your God gives you, and you possess it and dwell in it, and then say, I will set a king over me, like all the nations that are round about me’; 17:15 you may indeed set as king over you him whom the LORD your God will choose. One from among your brethren you shall set as king over you; …17:17 And he shall not multiply wives for himself, lest his heart turn away; nor shall he greatly multiply for himself silver and gold.

Yet, despite his personal sin of disobeying God’s command, I don’t think Solomon says/teaches in Scripture that it is okay and not contrary to God’s will to have more than one wife at a time. If I’m wrong on this, I’d appreciate your pointing out the verse to me.

It is amazing how God works throughout human history to transmit His truths to us through designated leaders (Old Covenant and New) even tho they may at some point/s choose to be flagrantly sinful in their personal lives!!! Ironically, it is the very sinfulness of some of the leaders that makes it obvious that God is powerfully acting in history to uphold His promise that the gates of hell will not prevail in His Church - that error will not be taught.

Nita

 

[AndyF]

Solomon chose to disregard God’s command not to “multiply wives for himself”.

Deut 17:14 "When you come to the land which the LORD your God gives you, and you possess it and dwell in it, and then say, I will set a king over me, like all the nations that are round about me’; …

… don’t think Solomon says/teaches in Scripture that it is okay and not contrary to God’s will to have more than one wife at a time. If I’m wrong on this, I’d appreciate your pointing out the verse to me.

I think my opening post makes it clear that I take no issue with a person having multiple spouses. In fact I take no issue with a person attempting to deal with his particular weakness. I do take issue if he paints himself as a prime example of perfection in that area.

In my last paragraph I outlined some analogies pertinent to present day situations to make my point. I think though it is reasonable for such a person regardless of who he or she is, to reflect on the privledge and in all humility refrain from making his position a prime example for everyone to emulate. He can obtain no credit for it.You will recall that God allowed polygamy, but did not give it full sanction because it was bestowed to please the desire of a stubborn people.

Solomon’s cross was sex, therefore I feel he should have withheld advice in this department. This doesn’t come from me, it is a social precept held by societies today. Actually it would have been more charitable for him to reference the advice of a saint more deserving as teacher in this area. Much advice is presented in the books of Wisdom that warns us of taking such a stance.

It is amazing how God works throughout human history to transmit His truths to us through designated leaders (Old Covenant and New) even tho they may at some point/s choose to be flagrantly sinful in their personal lives!!!

Amen.

Ironically, it is the very sinfulness of some of the leaders that makes it obvious that God is powerfully acting in history to uphold His promise that the gates of hell will not prevail in His Church - that error will not be taught.

Yes, then one would think editing should have been done. We are actually seeing the looking aside of a society who saw this man as incapable of doing wrong, a hero for their time, a charismatic figure we are familiar in characters of today, so what’s new.? The O/T fails to factor in this probability.

The Church explicitly states that while one is in a state of mortal sin, any good that a person achieves is not credited to him until he repents and is absolved. Therefore while he was in the state of sexual prison, and not dismissed his illegitimately acquired wives(occasions), he could not obtain credit for his contribution he was giving in Proverbs on sexual matters, never mind in it’s entirety.

Cross referencing of facts wasn’t a scribe’s specialty back then either. I imagine due to the effect of collective rapture and over confidence of a people that they are untouchable. That too is nothing new. The precepts of Sirach and Wisdom atest to Solomon not being wise.

AndyF

 

[Pete_1]

Didn’t the Lord judge solomon for what he did? I always thought that proverbs was written before Solomons many wives:

Proverbs 30

18 "There are three things that are too amazing for me,
four that I do not understand:
19 the way of an eagle in the sky,
the way of a snake on a rock,
the way of a ship on the high seas,
** and the way of a man with a maiden. **
20 "This is the way of an adulteress:
She eats and wipes her mouth
and says, ‘I’ve done nothing wrong.’

Although these are the sayings of Agur so… i don’t really have a point. But it is in proverbs.

 

[Daniel_Marsh]

A wise man learns form his mistakes, since adultery and plural wives would be mistakes. Then he may have had his eyes open by his mistakes to wisdom of the right way.

So, yes a person who makes mistakes and learns from them can tell others the right thing to do.

Like my father who had 17 wives always said, if you are going to play around make sure she has the first name of one of your wives.

I saw firsthand the insanity of many wives, and as such I am sticking with one wife for life.

And, a child born to any of his wives would still be his child.

 

[AndyF]

Dan:

Plural wives wasn’t forbidden back then. Adultery was.

We already see today marriage being used in an attempt to legitimize adultery. This sugar coating is taken to a science by some Muslims in the middle east. Young girls are “married” for a few hours then divorced.

Mistakes are made, but I think a sincere lesson would include the admittance that a person was wrong, and a person is now(then for them) making restitution to correct the problem. I think I would have liked to have read in Proverbs that he had dismissed all his illegitimate wives and removed himself from the occasions.

I sense no burden of conscience in Solomon’s words. In fact I read a confidence of a king that can do no wrong in this department.

As I write, there are dioceses today that will not accept lay people to certain Church functions if they are within the grasp of mortal sin and refuse to obtain absolution and commit themselves to attempted change in their lives.

At least one scribe may have come to the same conclusion a couple of hundred years before Christ. see: Wis 6. Neither does the Church pick up on the implication by him;

NAB “It’s author(of Wisdom) who’s name is not known to us, was a member of the Jewish community at Alexandria, in Egypt. … At times he speaks in the person of Solomon, placing his teachings on the lips of the wise king of Hebrew tradition in order to emphasize their value.”

I think he isn’t “placing the teaching”, he is really criticizing him.

AndyF