Purgatory: a place of torment or not?

[pocohombre]

Without criticizing views of Gods judgement, which are indeed a mystery…I might just point out that it is not “I” who says there is a Purgatory, but the Church.

And I see you are referencing “Newman’s Dream”…I haven’t even the slightest clue what it is still I better check it out!

Take care bro,
Michael

Check the nun’s version also done a few centuries before ,similar to newmans

 

[steve_b]

We are in a race.The race ends when we die. I think the admonishments in scripture are for this race, here and now, not for when it is finished. **Why would I need “correction” when it is over ? **

Here’s the reason.

Our body is mortal. It has a beginning, and an end. Our soul otoh is immortal. It has a beginning and no end. The soul has memory intellect and will…and that means because the soul is immortal, the soul never loses those properties. Those properties don’t sleep they don’t die. They go on forever!! Otherwise how would we appreciate heaven? The converse is also true re: purgatory or hell. Death merely releases us from the body. It doesn’t release us from memory intellect and will. It doesn’t release us from all we’ve done in that body. Our actions that we have full memories of, and our intellect fully processes those wrongs, because we willfully did them, are present to us and have consequences because our sins don’t just effect us alone. Therefore, that is our soul at death. Is it ready for heaven just because our body dies? If death wiped out everything we did, there would be no purgatory or hell, only heaven. And we know through Jesus that isn’t the case.

Since nothing uncleen will enter heaven, and most people at death aren’t perfect, in fact most are far from perfect, and I’m talking about the soul that is saved, what needs to happen between death of the body and a soul entering heaven? And what describes the process? That’s the purpose of 1 Corinthians 3:11-15 which will happen on “the day”… i.e. the day of one’s death, where the particular judgement by Jesus takes place of each soul. This process is done to us by Jesus. IOW we fully experience it but it is done to us. Our memory intellect and will are fully functional and being reordered to perfection during the process, no matter how long it takes. Otherwise heaven wouldn’t be heaven. It would just be a continuation of earth only with a bunch of disembodied souls. That’s not heaven.

Since Paul writes under the inspiration of the HS John 14:25-26 and the HS gets His teaching from Jesus John 16:12-15, then it is Jesus, the one who judges ALL souls ever born who tells us, purification will take place after death of the body but before heaven…for only those souls that are saved. It’s not a process for the unsaved as the passage indicates.
.
If one dies in mortal sin, forget purgatory. One won’t go to purgatory, they go immediately to hell as so many scripture passages warn and teach.
P:

Analysis, review, let’s see how we did,see the replay, yes, but it is over, and on with the critique,judgement,loss (big ouch) and reward. What is outside of time ? That is with the Lord ,but on this side of life, it is still a 24 hour day. Actually this time irrelevancy makes me think purgatory need not be place (it is called a “state”)

Even though in this subject, we are talking about existence outside time and space, we still use time / space language for purposes of communicating concepts. That’s all that’s meant.
P:

Will not our life be reviewed before the Lord, on that Day ,as Paul states ?

Yes. Jesus is the judge. Every soul ever born will be judged by Him. And before entrance into heaven the soul that is saved, if not already pure, will be purified.

Whatever purgatory can produce, why can not this "judgement’ produce ?

Don’t discount the fact, purification of the soul before entrance into heaven IS part of the judgement.

“on the Day” in 1 Corinthians 3:11-15 certainly refers to judgement of the soul at the end of this life. While there is no mention of time this process takes, as Peter taught, a day to our Lord is like 1000 years to us, and 1000 years to us is like a day to Our Lord. An analogy about time outside of time, to be sure, but it’s still instructive for this conversation.

For example

Some souls who are saved, might be in purgatory (being purified) till the end of time. Why would that be? Here again, this is an analogy. Maybe a real bad hombre in this life, would have gone straight to hell at death, but instead received last rites on his deathbed. Jesus saves him in the sacrament, however, the damage he did in this life had huge ripple effects on those he victimized. And in order for this hombre to be fully cleansed (his memory intellect and will) he needs to suffer the consequences of his actions in this life till the last of those ripple effects run their course, for purposes of his own purification. iow Jesus judges he can’t enter heaven before all that comes to pass…for his own instruction and purification. For all we know, the end of the world might be tomorrow, or a billion years from now. Either way, the guy escaped going to hell for eternity, but in his case, in this example, he won’t escape suffering till the end of the world comes.

Purgatory, takes NOTHING away from Calvary. Without Calvary, no soul would even have the opportunity of heaven. Heaven and Purgatory is the application of the grace from Calvary, and hell is the application of Divine justice.

 

[LionHeart777]

“Originally, it had no relation whatsoever to the prayers, and still less to the dead. In the course of time the power of redeeming the dead from the sufferings of Gehenna came to b[e ascribed, by some, to the recitation of the Ḳaddish”. (see Ḳaddish

)" . .As I have stated, it is more proper to say kaddish is by some Jews something to do like your purgatory, by some,and at a much later date The article seems to say Catholics do not base it on Judaism but sects of Judaism base it, on Catholicism…I would not lump all the Jews together, as I would not like an “outsider”(Buddhist) to say Christians,as in all, believe in purgatory. Finally,notice the kaddish prayer says nothing of the dead.

The articles I referenced from the Jewish Encyclopedia were “Purgatory” (my last post I posted a dead link to it ) found here, and “Kaddish”, found here. I don’t recall seeing anything in either article saying that “…Catholics do not base it on Judaism but sects of Judaism base it, on Catholicism.” Perhaps if you get the chance you will point that out to me. The quote you gave above about the the original usage of the Kaddish not being related to prayers for the dead (in the “Kaddish” article) doesn’t give a time frame of when it was used for prayers and later prayers for the dead, so I don’t see how you came to the conclusion that prayers for the dead were taken from Catholicism. Maybe you aren’t saying this though. However, if you take a step back and remember that prayers and offerings were made for the dead in the passage I cited from 2nd Maccabees (2nd century B.C. if I’m not mistaken), and from Josephus (relating Jewish custom ca. B.C. 60), you should see that prayers and sacrifices offered by the living for the dead, and the belief that they were efficacious in loosing the deceased from their sins was rooted in Jewish belief before the New Testament period.

That is what some say. Actually I thought the basis for any grace and merit, even to get out of purgatory are only possible because of Calvary. What I am saying is our robes are washed white by the Blood of the lamb, as per Revelations(CH 4 ?)

Well I disagree that all sins, past, present and future, are forgiven when one is regenerated, as this belief is contrary to the Bible. Keep in mind that it is possible for those who “have washed their robes, and have made them white in the blood of the Lamb” (Rev. 7:14) to defile their garments some time between that washing and death (Rev. 3:4).

Big questions. Certainly the final death of our flesh is a big gift, and may be the only thing keeping us from being truly like Him. Certainly when our works are revealed and tried may be the when final likeness occurs. Now I am not sure if our personal trial is at the judgement seat of Christ, at His coming( 1 Cor4:5)or immediately when we die. St.Paul says the dead in Christ will rise first, then we which are alive will meet Him in the air .Don’t see any purification needed to meet him in the air. Maybe the efficacy of the cross is greater than we know, and we are like Elijah and Enoch and can go directly into His presence . Let me ask you, do you feel you, as a Christian, are worthy to enter the Holy of Holies? Can you boldly go before the throne ? Just how does the Father see us in light of Christ in us? Anyways ,back to post mortem purification.I see it as those possible scenarios I just gave you ,a bit all over the place except with Catholic purgatory.Not even close.Same seed though.

A few things I will say: We Catholics believe in both the particular judgement (mentioned in Hebrews) and the general judgement at the end of time. We reject the idea of what is referred to as “the rapture”. We also reject the concept of “snow covered dunghills” as we believe that God actually makes us righteous and that we freely cooperate with His grace in this process.

While I believe I can “go, therefore, with confidence to the throne of grace: that we may obtain mercy, and find grace in seasonable aid” (Hebrews 4:16)
(that is not to say that the Sacraments are not needed; God is not bound by the Sacraments either), this doesn’t mean that most people aren’t going to be in need of a post mortem purification. Keep in mind that sin affects both body and soul. To quote Origen, " Would you enter into heaven with your wood and hay and stubble and thus defile the kingdom of God" ? (cf. 1 Cor. 3:15)

Ch 4 goes on to say "we"are judged,but not for salvation ,which is secured.
I think works can obviously be off the mark-sin, wood hay and stubble, and won’t cut the mustard thankfully.So yes there is the seed,but more in terms of judgement,before Him, before His light.

I disagree that salvation is secured, if you mean to say that a saved person cannot forfeit their own salvation. I did want to point out that it is the person with their works that go through the fire in 1 Corinthians ch. 3:15, and not just the works. And also, “works” can include sins (“works of iniquity”).

 

[MJCamp]

Here’s the reason.

Our body is mortal. It has a beginning, and an end. Our soul otoh is immortal. It has a beginning and no end. The soul has memory intellect and will…and that means because the soul is immortal, the soul never loses those properties. Those properties don’t sleep they don’t die. They go on forever!! Otherwise how would we appreciate heaven? The converse is also true re: purgatory or hell. Death merely releases us from the body. It doesn’t release us from memory intellect and will. It doesn’t release us from all we’ve done in that body. Our actions that we have full memories of, and our intellect fully processes those wrongs, because we willfully did them, are present to us and have consequences because our sins don’t just effect us alone. Therefore, that is our soul at death. Is it ready for heaven just because our body dies? If death wiped out everything we did, there would be no purgatory or hell, only heaven. And we know through Jesus that isn’t the case.

For example

Some souls who are saved, might be in purgatory (being purified) till the end of time. Why would that be? Here again, this is an analogy. Maybe a real bad hombre in this life, would have gone straight to hell at death, but instead received last rites on his deathbed. Jesus saves him in the sacrament, however, the damage he did in this life had huge ripple effects on those he victimized. And in order for this hombre to be fully cleansed (his memory intellect and will) he needs to suffer the consequences of his actions in this life till the last of those ripple effects run their course, for purposes of his own purification. iow Jesus judges he can’t enter heaven before all that comes to pass…for his own instruction and purification. For all we know, the end of the world might be tomorrow, or a billion years from now. Either way, the guy escaped going to hell for eternity, but in his case, in this example, he won’t escape suffering till the end of the world comes.

Purgatory, takes NOTHING away from Calvary. Without Calvary, no soul would even have the opportunity of heaven. Heaven and Purgatory is the application of the grace from Calvary, and hell is the application of Divine justice.

Yes, Yes, Yes…Even the most wretched may be saved but that does not mean there is no recourse. We are judged on our whole lives and what reparations were done

 

[josigirl]

,Reading all of these replies was quite informative. It was wonderful to see peoples perception on purgatory and the passages quoted from the bible. There are many people I noticed who don’t want to acknowledge purgatory or the Graces from God.

God is the only one who can open the eyes of their heart. God loves each and everyone of his creations. He created each soul in his lmage. My Lord Jesus was not a messenger, but His son in the flesh and My God in the spirit. He died for our sins, for love of us…a sacrifical lamb. He wants us in heaven but we cannot get there because of our sins, our souls are stained. By His Graces, we have confession, communion and prayer and fasting and many other gifts to help each other get there.

Still we do not all accept these gifts. Even if we pray, we must trully love Him. We must desire and choose Him. When we die, not all of us are in a state of Grace, therefore, not all can go to heaven. The Lord loves us, and if we believe in His love and mercy for us, then believing purgatory exists it not so hard.

It is referred to through out the bible, but it was not given the name until later. The devil really wants us to not believe it exists because he loves seeing souls in torment. He blinds you so you don’t pray for the souls there. But they pray and praise God every second. There suffering is because they know God exists without a doubt but they cannot feel him in the lower levels of purgartory. He created our souls to live for eternity with Him. To love Him, glorify Him, Worship Him.

He gave us choices so we can choose to love Him or not. Hell is not a place He wants anyone if us, but if we don’t pray, adore Him, Love Him from now, in this life, Our souls won’t chose Him in the next. Its our choice.

The people who don’t believe in purgatory, we catholics must pray for them so God can give them the Grace of faith. We have a responsibilty to pray for them because we are all one family in Christ until Christ says otherwise.

I don’t have a great theological knowledge that some people have been blessed with but I love My God and all his creations because he asks this of us… God bless

 

[BarryI]

,Reading all of these replies was quite informative. It was wonderful to see peoples perception on purgatory and the passages quoted from the bible. There are many people I noticed who don’t want to acknowledge purgatory or the Graces from God.

God is the only one who can open the eyes of their heart. God loves each and everyone of his creations. He created each soul in his lmage. My Lord Jesus was not a messenger, but His son in the flesh and My God in the spirit. He died for our sins, for love of us…a sacrifical lamb. He wants us in heaven but we cannot get there because of our sins, our souls are stained. By His Graces, we have confession, communion and prayer and fasting and many other gifts to help each other get there.

Still we do not all accept these gifts. Even if we pray, we must trully love Him. We must desire and choose Him. When we die, not all of us are in a state of Grace, therefore, not all can go to heaven. The Lord loves us, and if we believe in His love and mercy for us, then believing purgatory exists it not so hard.

It is referred to through out the bible, but it was not given the name until later. The devil really wants us to not believe it exists because he loves seeing souls in torment. He blinds you so you don’t pray for the souls there. But they pray and praise God every second. There suffering is because they know God exists without a doubt but they cannot feel him in the lower levels of purgartory. He created our souls to live for eternity with Him. To love Him, glorify Him, Worship Him.

He gave us choices so we can choose to love Him or not. Hell is not a place He wants anyone if us, but if we don’t pray, adore Him, Love Him from now, in this life, Our souls won’t chose Him in the next. Its our choice.

The people who don’t believe in purgatory, we catholics must pray for them so God can give them the Grace of faith. We have a responsibilty to pray for them because we are all one family in Christ until Christ says otherwise.

I don’t have a great theological knowledge that some people have been blessed with but I love My God and all his creations because he asks this of us… God bless

Are you sure Satan wants people to know it does not exist? How about this, by believing it exists, then one is more inclined to go on sinning. Relentlessly and without second thought. They become accustomed to believing its ok to keep sinning going to confession and repeating the cycle because there’s no fear . The Church says so. You’ll go to purgatory st best. This now let’s people never think of the consequences. But if it doesn’t exist then Satan would not want anyone to know. He would want to give them false hope so they keep on sinning and rebelling against God. That is the problem with thinking Satan wants people to think it doesn’t exist. Quite the contrary as he is the great deciever

 

[BarryI]

Yes, Yes, Yes…Even the most wretched may be saved but that does not mean there is no recourse. We are judged on our whole lives and what reparations were done

I’m curious to how death does not release us from memory or intellect . Can you elaborate on this? I do believe it was said " the dead are conscious of nothing at all". OT in Ecclisiastes, I believe.

 

[pablope]

As for the passage of the thief in the cross, did Jesus say"verily I say unto thee, today thou shalt be with me in paradise". Or " Verily I say unto thee today,thou shalt be with me in paradise" indicating he would be, but at a later date on judgement day.

We are judged at the moment of death. The thief went to Abraham’s bosom.

The icons here show what the church believes where he went to:forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=725074

 

[BarryI]

We are judged at the moment of death. The thief went to Abraham’s bosom.

The icons here show what the church believes where he went to:forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=725074

Can you show me the passage in the bible thàt says we are judged at the moment of death. If that is so, then why is there judgement day, and why then did Jesus say "the hour is coming when eveyone in the tombs will hear His voice and come out.And those who have done good things will be granted eternal life, but those whose works were wicked will be condemned to eternal damnation. "

 

[Church_Militant]

Can you show me the passage in the bible thàt says we are judged at the moment of death. If that is so, then why is there judgement day, and why then did Jesus say "the hour is coming when eveyone in the tombs will hear His voice and come out.And those who have done good things will be granted eternal life, but those whose works were wicked will be condemned to eternal damnation. "

Luke 23:43] And he said to him, “Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise.”

If judgement wasn’t immediate, then how could that be?

 

[BarryI]

Luke 23:43] And he said to him, “Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise.”

If judgement wasn’t immediate, then how could that be?

Because then Jesus would have contradicted Himself in all of the parables and teachings . Are you sure that the comma was put in the right spot? Based on all of Jesus’ teachings, then the comma would have been put after “today”, and not before it. "Truly I Tell you this today, you will be with me in paradise " indicating He was saying " as sure as I am hanging here on this cross and talking to you today, then yes you will be with me in paradise in the resurrection . If you view it as such, then everything Jesus said lines up with this. If it is interpreted the other way, then everything is contradictory.

 

[MJCamp]

Can you show me the passage in the bible thàt says we are judged at the moment of death. If that is so, then why is there judgement day, and why then did Jesus say "the hour is coming when eveyone in the tombs will hear His voice and come out.And those who have done good things will be granted eternal life, but those whose works were wicked will be condemned to eternal damnation. "

2 Cor 5: 6-8So we are always courageous, although we know that while we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord, for we walk by faith, not by sight. Yet we are courageous, and we would rather leave the body and go home to the Lord.1 Thess 5:10(Jesus) died for us, so that whether we are awake or asleep we may live together with him.Phil 1:21-23For to me life is Christ, and death is gain. If I go on living in the flesh, that means fruitful labor for me. And I do not know which I shall choose. I am caught between the two. I long to depart this life and be with Christ, (for) that is far better.

 

[MJCamp]

The author of the Letter to the Hebrews says, “it is appointed to die once and after that comes the judgment” (9:27). (The Catholic Church does not believe in Reincarnation. As the above quote from Hebrews states:we die once and after that comes our judgment).Catholic theology speaks about aParticularandGeneralJudgment. TheParticular Judgmentoccurs immediately after death. No text in the scripture speaks explicitly about this judgment, though the Parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man in Luke 16:19-31 implies such a judgment. We shouldn’t imagine theParticular Judgmentas God pulling out his book of life to see if our good deeds outweigh our evil deeds. Rather, ourParticularJudgment will more likely be God accepting what we opted for in this life. If on earth our “fundamental option” (I.e., our basic orientation in life) was for God, then we will go to heaven, even if we have a “stopover” in Purgatory. If on earth we knowingly and deliberately rejected God, ourParticularJudgment will be God accepting our chosen option. In John 3:19, we read, "On these grounds judgment is pronounced: that though the light has come into the world, people have shown they prefer darkness to the light…"In these words, Jesus is telling us that we judge ourselves by our response to his coming and offer of salvation.TheGeneralorLast Judgmentrefers to God coming to complete his Lordship over all of creation and to finally establish his heavenly community. (See 1 Corinthians 15:20-28) Matthew 25:31-46 gives us an account of the Last Judgment where we read that the saved will be those who “fed the hungry, clothed the naked,” etc. In other words, the saved will be those who showed compassion for the poor and needy. (For more on this, see*The Catechism of the Catholic Church #*1021-22.

 

[Carlan]

And how do you know this? Can you direct me to the verse or verses and the writer so that I may review it and see if what you are saying is true. I thank you for your response and will await your reply with the Bible verse and author.

Barryl,The temporal punishment attached to sin is part of the purification God requires of us before we can look upon his face in heaven,our heart must be perfectly pure. And if when we die our purification of temporal punishment still remains our purification continues in a state what we Catholics call Purgatory,now , you do not have to call it that if you do not want to,but you are going to have to experience along with the rest of us if by your death you have not reached that perfection which the Father requires of all of us.
Peace, Carlan

 

[rcwitness]

If someone struggles with Purgatory due to a fear of slandering Gods grace, that is understood. This should be our focus in reassuring brothers that it is not outside of honoring Gods total grace.

But that is precicely the thing that we do when we sin as new children of God…sin against His gracious life in us! That is a burning contradiction that we committ. If brothers and sisters can’t see how that demands a participation in the agony of what we are (not just what we did) then they just are both not understanding the ugliness of sin nor the heights of purity of the almighty, in which our sin touches.

So, we must deny ourselves all the more. So our sin does not define us. That the grace of Christ defines us.

If Peter, in this life, wept so bitterly because he, through faith, realized what he had done…how would he have felt if he would have died before being able to stand up after his shamefull denial? Not able to repent through the conviction of his conscience and witness to all the way in which he cowardly smothered all the blessings Jesus performed for him! Not able to tell the world,“Yes! I was a fool!” He would have not been able to forgive himself without chastisement from His righteous Lord!

That’s how I see temporal punishment

 

[josigirl]

Are you sure Satan wants people to know it does not exist? How about this, by believing it exists, then one is more inclined to go on sinning. Relentlessly and without second thought. They become accustomed to believing its ok to keep sinning going to confession and repeating the cycle because there’s no fear . The Church says so. You’ll go to purgatory st best. This now let’s people never think of the consequences. But if it doesn’t exist then Satan would not want anyone to know. He would want to give them false hope so they keep on sinning and rebelling against God. That is the problem with thinking Satan wants people to think it doesn’t exist. Quite the contrary as he is the great deciever

By saying that believing in purgatory give you the warrant to sin and keep sinning and go to confession and repeat it because God will cleanse you there means :

1. Not loving God with all your heart, your mind and your soul,
2. Taking God for granted and testing him,
3. Not understanding the sacrament of confession and what it means to have a contrite heart,
4. Not having Faith that Jesus Christ washes our sins with His Presious Blood in confession,
   But only God can see into our hearts to know if we are trully sorry for our sins,we must always pray for a contrite heart, true remorse for our sins. They are what keeps us attached to world and not to God.
5. Ingoring the fact that it is One church, the Bride of Christ and purgatory is part of his bride. And they need prayers as they suffer so much.

If satan hides purgatory from the hearts of man, it divides the church, rather than uniting it as One Holy Church. He divides to try and conquer, but the Lord rebuilds His Church for He loves it so. It was Christ who founded the Catholic Church and other churches brokeaway. End of story… we are meant to faithful stay with it for better or worse. And pray for it too.

Pray pray pray to the Lord, knowledge without heart is not seeing God, heart without faith is not living Is Holy will. His is completely Love and Mercy. However, He is not to be taken for granted, debated upon and tested. Believe in His Love for you, consent to do His Holy Will, and He will restore the sight of you heart.

God Bless you in your search and journey to Him.

 

[pablope]

Can you show me the passage in the bible thàt says we are judged at the moment of death. If that is so, then why is there judgement day, and why then did Jesus say "the hour is coming when eveyone in the tombs will hear His voice and come out.And those who have done good things will be granted eternal life, but those whose works were wicked will be condemned to eternal damnation. "

There is the specific judgement…after death…and the general judgement at the 2nd coming…where the consequences of our actions will be revealed.

What Catholics Believe About The End of the World://www.americancatholic.org/Newsletters/CU/ac0993.asp

catholic.com/quickquestions/what-happens-to-our-bodies-immediately-after-we-die

 

[BarryI]

By saying that believing in purgatory give you the warrant to sin and keep sinning and go to confession and repeat it because God will cleanse you there means :

1. Not loving God with all your heart, your mind and your soul,
2. Taking God for granted and testing him,
3. Not understanding the sacrament of confession and what it means to have a contrite heart,
4. Not having Faith that Jesus Christ washes our sins with His Presious Blood in confession,
   But only God can see into our hearts to know if we are trully sorry for our sins,we must always pray for a contrite heart, true remorse for our sins. They are what keeps us attached to world and not to God.
5. Ingoring the fact that it is One church, the Bride of Christ and purgatory is part of his bride. And they need prayers as they suffer so much.

If satan hides purgatory from the hearts of man, it divides the church, rather than uniting it as One Holy Church. He divides to try and conquer, but the Lord rebuilds His Church for He loves it so. It was Christ who founded the Catholic Church and other churches brokeaway. End of story… we are meant to faithful stay with it for better or worse. And pray for it too.

Pray pray pray to the Lord, knowledge without heart is not seeing God, heart without faith is not living Is Holy will. His is completely Love and Mercy. However, He is not to be taken for granted, debated upon and tested. Believe in His Love for you, consent to do His Holy Will, and He will restore the sight of you heart.

God Bless you in your search and journey to Him.

Can I ask you a question here? Do you not think it is possible for Satan to mislead the Church through false human doctrine? Therefore misleading an entire organization, except for the true believers who believe what was written in the bible writings over human doctrines?

 

[rcwitness]

Can I ask you a question here? Do you not think it is possible for Satan to mislead the Church through false human doctrine? Therefore misleading an entire organization, except for the true believers who believe what was written in the bible writings over human doctrines?

You realize you are asking a Catholic if Jesus actually meant the gates of hell will prevail against His Church, right?

 

[MJCamp]

Can I ask you a question here? Do you not think it is possible for Satan to mislead the Church through false human doctrine? Therefore misleading an entire organization, except for the true believers who believe what was written in the bible writings over human doctrines?

I believe it may be the other way around…The Church was established before the Bible. The Bible was compiled by the Church, and supports the Church’s teaching. The Bible coupled with Sacred Tradition both make up the Church.
Tim3:15
15"But if I should be delayed, you should know how to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of truth."
Jesus entrusted the Church to save souls