Purgatory and Matt. 12:32

[jamil_joseph02]

Matthew 12: 31-32 “Therefore, I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. And whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.”

I just wanted to verify whether my understanding of the Catholic interpretation of this passage is correct. Some Catholic answers articles often associate this passage with purgatory:

“Christ refers to the sinner who “will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come” (Matt. 12:32), suggesting that one can be freed after death of the consequences of one’s sins.”

“The concept of an after-death purification from sin and the consequences of sin is also stated in the New Testament in passages such as 1 Corinthians 3:11–15 and Matthew 5:25–26, 12:31–32.”

“This declaration of our Lord implies at least some sins can be forgiven in the next life—a declaration to a people who already believed it. If Jesus wanted to condemn this commonly held teaching, he was not doing a very good job of it, according to Matthew’s Gospel.”

okay, so does that mean if I blaspheme against the Holy Spirit, then I asked for forgiveness/repented about it, I will still not be forgiven? That forgiveness for this sin will only be available after my death?

 

[Nate13]

Matthew 12: 31-32 “Therefore, I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. And whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.”

I just wanted to verify whether my understanding of the Catholic interpretation of this passage is correct. Some Catholic answers articles often associate this passage with purgatory:

“Christ refers to the sinner who “will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come” (Matt. 12:32), suggesting that one can be freed after death of the consequences of one’s sins.”

“The concept of an after-death purification from sin and the consequences of sin is also stated in the New Testament in passages such as 1 Corinthians 3:11–15 and Matthew 5:25–26, 12:31–32.”

“This declaration of our Lord implies at least some sins can be forgiven in the next life—a declaration to a people who already believed it. If Jesus wanted to condemn this commonly held teaching, he was not doing a very good job of it, according to Matthew’s Gospel.”

okay, so does that mean if I blaspheme against the Holy Spirit, then I asked for forgiveness/repented about it, I will still not be forgiven? That forgiveness for this sin will only be available after my death?

I believe this passage comes right after the Pharisees claimed his works were done using power given to him by the devil and not God. I believe the sin he was referring to was related to this statement by the Pharisee’s. I don’t want to get all legalistic about it, but I believe this blasphemy against the Spirit involves attributing the good works of God as if they were works of the devil.

 

[cemiller]

Matthew 12: 31-32 “Therefore, I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. And whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.”

I just wanted to verify whether my understanding of the Catholic interpretation of this passage is correct. Some Catholic answers articles often associate this passage with purgatory:

“Christ refers to the sinner who “will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come” (Matt. 12:32), suggesting that one can be freed after death of the consequences of one’s sins.”

“The concept of an after-death purification from sin and the consequences of sin is also stated in the New Testament in passages such as 1 Corinthians 3:11–15 and Matthew 5:25–26, 12:31–32.”

“This declaration of our Lord implies at least some sins can be forgiven in the next life—a declaration to a people who already believed it. If Jesus wanted to condemn this commonly held teaching, he was not doing a very good job of it, according to Matthew’s Gospel.”

okay, so does that mean if I blaspheme against the Holy Spirit, then I asked for forgiveness/repented about it, I will still not be forgiven? That forgiveness for this sin will only be available after my death?

I do believe that the Catholic teaching on the unforvigable sin is rejecting forgivness in dispair. Like saying that there is no way that God can forgive me of this one, therefore effectively shutting out God’s mercy…

 

[Dorothy]

I do believe that the Catholic teaching on the unforvigable sin is rejecting forgivness in dispair. Like saying that there is no way that God can forgive me of this one, therefore effectively shutting out God’s mercy…

Correct!

 

[Nelka]

okay, so does that mean if I blaspheme against the Holy Spirit, then I asked for forgiveness/repented about it, I will still not be forgiven?

He will always forgive you if you ask Him for forgiveness!

 

[Bohm_Bawerk]

okay, so does that mean if I blaspheme against the Holy Spirit, then I asked for forgiveness/repented about it, I will still not be forgiven? That forgiveness for this sin will only be available after my death?

You have it entirely wrong. Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is when you deliberately reject God’s forgiveness. In essence, you’ve “shut the door” on him. That is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. It is not swearing at the Holy Spirit, it is not insulting the Holy Spirit. The way to understand blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is through this maxim: “If you don’t ask for forgiveness, you won’t be forgiven”. It’s synthentically true in the same way triangles have three sides.

There are many possible ways in which one can not ask for forgiveness from God. One of them is through despair - this is when you are so fearful of your sin that you do not ask God to forgive it because you believe it is unforgivable. That is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. Another form is impenitence, which is essentially not asking for forgiveness. Another form is presumption - this is when you go to Confession but do not confess your sins contritely and fool yourself into thinking you’ve been forgiven.

 

[TimothyH]

Matthew 12: 31-32 “Therefore, I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. And whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.”

I just wanted to verify whether my understanding of the Catholic interpretation of this passage is correct. Some Catholic answers articles often associate this passage with purgatory:

“Christ refers to the sinner who “will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come” (Matt. 12:32), suggesting that one can be freed after death of the consequences of one’s sins.”

“The concept of an after-death purification from sin and the consequences of sin is also stated in the New Testament in passages such as 1 Corinthians 3:11–15 and Matthew 5:25–26, 12:31–32.”

“This declaration of our Lord implies at least some sins can be forgiven in the next life—a declaration to a people who already believed it. If Jesus wanted to condemn this commonly held teaching, he was not doing a very good job of it, according to Matthew’s Gospel.”

okay, so does that mean if I blaspheme against the Holy Spirit, then I asked for forgiveness/repented about it, I will still not be forgiven? That forgiveness for this sin will only be available after my death?

Forgiveness in the age to come is viewed as purgatory, yes.

-Tim-

 

[Nita]

You have it entirely wrong. Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is when you deliberately reject God’s forgiveness. In essence, you’ve “shut the door” on him. That is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. It is not swearing at the Holy Spirit, it is not insulting the Holy Spirit. The way to understand blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is through this maxim: “If you don’t ask for forgiveness, you won’t be forgiven”. It’s synthentically true in the same way triangles have three sides.

There are many possible ways in which one can not ask for forgiveness from God. One of them is through despair - this is when you are so fearful of your sin that you do not ask God to forgive it because you believe it is unforgivable. That is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. Another form is impenitence, which is essentially not asking for forgiveness. Another form is presumption - this is when you go to Confession but do not confess your sins contritely and fool yourself into thinking you’ve been forgiven.

And there is another way.
It is the Holy Spirit who convicts/convinces us of our sins (cf. John 16:8) - brings them to mind - awakens our conscience to the sinfulness of our wrong actions. We can accept His promptings and admit our sin; or, we can ignore and/or reject those promptings, using our own thinking to convince ourselves that it really isn’t sinful and therefore we have no need to repent and confess. Like the Pharisees and scribes, we consider ourselves righteous (not sinners) and not in need of seeking forgiveness. And as you “boldly” noted in your post: “If you don’t ask for forgiveness, you won’t be forgiven.”

 

[po18guy]

2 Maccabees 12:38-45 is also used in support of purgatory.

 

[TimothyH]

The Biblical Basis for Catholic Belief in Purgatory

Also posted it as a PDF at timhollingworth.webs.com/docs/catholic/04-the.biblical.basis.for.catholic.belief-purgatory.pdf

-Tim-

 

[jamil_joseph02]

okay, blasphemy against the Spirit - rejecting God’s forgiveness in despair. I got that

so what Catholics mean in this verse is that, if you blaspheme the Spirit, you will not be forgiven in the age to come (since you didn’t ask forgiveness in the first place), which implies that there is forgiveness in the age to come if your sins is not blasphemy against the Spirit

 

[Huiou_Theou]

okay, blasphemy against the Spirit - rejecting God’s forgiveness in despair. I got that

so what Catholics mean in this verse is that, if you blaspheme the Spirit, you will not be forgiven in the age to come (since you didn’t ask forgiveness in the first place), which implies that there is forgiveness in the age to come if your sins is not blasphemy against the Spirit

The Greek is written in the continuous tense; the closest we have is the “present” tense in English. The idea being described is that if one persists in the present and emphasizing continual sinning against the Holy Spirit (as the Pharisees did but only for a moment in the example preceding the verse) they can not be forgiven the sin for the simple reason that they are STILL committing it.

If one sins continuously against the Holy Spirit, they can not be forgiven in this world or the one to come because they are guilty of an Eternal Sin. (eg: one with no boundaries)

The idea of forgiveness in the age to come, is a little problematic; for there are philosophical/theological issues regarding “time” or “sequence” in the world to come, which often is considered equivalent to “Eternal” and thus ill defined in many Catholic books I have read on the subject, esp. St. Thomas, and modern ones like Theology and Sanity.

Even if one sins against the Holy Spirit, but repents of it in this life; Jesus’ saying would not apply to them. It is those who sin against the Holy Spirit and take this sin “to their death” which become fixed permanently in this sin. A good example would be Annanias and Saophi-ra (?wise fighter woman/pun?) from whom the Holy Spirit withdrew are accused of by Peter as “sinning against the Holy Spirit”.
Their actual act was to lie to Peter, who could hold sins bound or freed, about their love of money and false pretenses in giving (a Pharisee issue with tithing as well)

Acts 5:1 But a certain man named Ananias, with Saphira his wife, sold a piece of land,
Acts 5:2 And by fraud kept back part of the price of the land, his wife being privy thereunto: and bringing a certain part of it, laid it at the feet of the apostles.
Acts 5:3 But Peter said: Ananias, why hath Satan tempted thy heart, that thou shouldst lie to the Holy Ghost and by fraud keep part of the price of the land?
Acts 5:4 Whilst it remained, did it not remain to thee? And after it was sold, was it not in thy power? Why hast thou conceived this thing in thy heart? Thou hast not lied to men, but to God.
Acts 5:5 And Ananias, hearing these words, fell down and gave up the ghost. And there came great fear upon all that heard it.

It is noteworthy, that burying the dead is a mercy – and the scripture says:

Acts 5:6 And the young men rising up, removed him, and carrying him out, buried him.

The number three, is associated with the casting out of demons, and the passion death and resurrection of our Lord Jesus Chirst; It is in this vein that the following statement is made:

Acts 5:7 And it was about the space of three hours after, when his wife, not knowing what had happened, came in.

A married couple sanctifies each other; and they share their flesh if truly married with God joining them together. It is quite strongly emphasized here that St. Peter, who can hold one’s sin bound or loosed chose to judge this woman for her sin after an interrogation to prove she was a source of the sin itself, and not her husband who might otherwise be sanctified by her.

Acts 5:8 And Peter said to her: Tell me, woman, whether you sold the land for so much? And she said: Yea, for so much.
Acts 5:9 And Peter said unto her: Why have you agreed together to tempt the spirit of the Lord? Behold the feet of them who have buried thy husband are at the door: and they shall carry thee out,

But she too is buried and not left out as a corpse to feed the birds of the air and the dogs in the street. In this way, I think, we are given a sign of hope that they may yet be saved in the moment(s) of their death; for they were told their sin by Peter which gave them a chance to at least repent of it WHILE they were dying.

At no time could they have been said to have returned the defrauded money; nor to have repented – but still the corporal act of mercy of burying them was carried out; so that we may hope that they paid for their sin by their death – and if they repented, they might be cleansed of their sin in the grave by the departing of filfthy flesh – and the burning of purgatory before the resurrection.

The reasoning of purgatory being shown by the passage of the Sin against the Holy Spirit is not very clear to me; although the pope teaching that it shows us this hope is not incompatible with the passage and finds support in the only example I can think of at the moment concerning a demonstrated sin against the Holy Spirit being written of in scripture. There might be better examples, but I can’t think of any at the moment.

 

[Nelka]

Pope John Paul II: “‘Blasphemy’ does not properly consist in offending against the Holy Spirit in words; it consists rather in the refusal to accept the salvation which God offers to man through the Holy Spirit.”

I assume that anybody who commits this sin would have no intention in asking for forgiveness and therefore would not receive it.

 

[Huiou_Theou]

Pope John Paul II: “‘Blasphemy’ does not properly consist in offending against the Holy Spirit in words; it consists rather in the refusal to accept the salvation which God offers to man through the Holy Spirit.”

I assume that anybody who commits this sin would have no intention in asking for forgiveness and therefore would not receive it.