Purgatory? Real or Man Made

[Zooey]

We should take into consideration the teaching of JPII –

QUOTE

The term [Purgatory] does not indicate a place, but a condition of existence. Those who, after death, exist in a state of purification, are already in the love of Christ who removes from them the remnants of imperfection (cf. Ecumenical Council of Florence, Decretum pro Graecis: DS 1304; Ecumenical Council of Trent, Decretum de iustificatione: DS 1580; Decretum de purgatorio: DS 1820).

END QUOTE

ewtn.com/library/PAPALDOC/JP2HEAVN.HTM

Jim Dandy

 

[Michael19682]

Purgatory is Man Made, just like how the bible is man made.

Part 2 of why hell is not real, hell violates the law of conservation of energy, in physics energy is never created nor destroyed, so if a hell did exist, that energy of the being would have to leave our universe to a different plane, which is a big no no in physics (Energy’s conservation has been proven, I have used and conducted experiment’s which prove it’s a law.) Some people will argue with me saying, a hell could exist, since there is a possibility of other dimensions and Anti universes. Yes those dimensions and universes could exist, but there is not way for energy to be transferred from one to another. Again it violates the conservation of energy’s law.

Are the laws of physics man made? I understand that they are undergoing revision, even radical revision and that the underlying reality they purport to describe and predict is not as it seems; in fact, these immutable laws are relative, are they not? To the contrary, the bible, which also has a human element involved in its creation, points to a reality which it in no wise misrepresents, a dynamic mystery of transcendence and immanence. I believe its experiential directives are far more open to flexibility and revision than the laws of physics. For example, you claim that hell is a cruel hoax used to intimidate people and cause them discomfort for disbelieving the doctrines of the church. I ask, is it any more cruel than telling someone that if they accelerate their vehicle to 200 km/hour and drive it into a stone wall that they will smash their head and cease to exist at all. Isn’t annihilation to non-being far worse a prediction than a state of being where we atone for wrongs committed? After all, why should I automatically be doomed if I drive into a wall? If it is your laws which create my death in such a circumstance, then it is no wonder people are afraid of dying. One can argue that the laws which you espouse condition the mind to ignorance, and thus inflict more harm than any belief in Hell. This is the reason that the same laws of the atomic nucleus, that heat homes throughout the globe also created a bomb to destroy hundreds of thousands.

I’ve read a brief history of time and am indebted to the greats in physics as are we all, each time we use a cell phone or turn on the tv. I don’t think, no, I know that they mean harm. Just something to think about softwareghost.

 

[Michael19682]

mean *no harm The greats meant no harm

 

[rinnie]

Purgatory is Man Made, just like how the bible is man made. I’m sick of religions like Catholicism fearing people into their religion, sickens me. I myself follow the laws of physics and the laws of biology and nature.

Reasons why Purgatory is not real.

1. Sins are not real,

Sins are man made, lets face it, the universe does not care if we have sex before marriage, or don’t believe in god, all the universe cares about is that the laws of physics and nature are obeyed.

This is why I do not believe sins are real, int he universe every single creature has the instinct of social darwinism (Survival of the fittest) please note Social Darwinism is not a theory, HUMAN EVOLUTION is a theory, Social Darwinism has been proven. The law of Social Darwinism states the only the strongest organisms will survive to have a lot of sex and pass on there genes to the next generation. All the acts which are considered SINS, in the Christan religion are actually just regular instincts of nature.

1. Hell isn’t real.

There are many reasons why a hell can’t be real. It goes against the Christan belief of an all LOVING god, how can an all loving god damn someone to eternal suffering? Yes you may say well the disobeyed god, so god will damn you to suffering just because you disobeyed him, gee very loving.

A lot of people would say, well it’s because Jesus had to suffer. Lets think of this logically, why would a god TORTURE his only son to death, because some man took an apple? That makes no logic sense, that is barbaric and evil! If I tell my little sister, “hey don’t eat my ice cream cone in the fridge” and she eats it, does that make logic sense for me to have my son tortured to death?

Part 2 of why hell is not real, hell violates the law of conservation of energy, in physics energy is never created nor destroyed, so if a hell did exist, that energy of the being would have to leave our universe to a different plane, which is a big no no in physics (Energy’s conservation has been proven, I have used and conducted experiment’s which prove it’s a law.) Some people will argue with me saying, a hell could exist, since there is a possibility of other dimensions and Anti universes. Yes those dimensions and universes could exist, but there is not way for energy to be transferred from one to another. Again it violates the conservation of energy’s law.

Lets start with you first statement. Okay sins are not REAL, they are man made? How can they be Man Made if they are not Real?

So if all sins are just instincts of nature why can we choose to sin or not sin?

Tell me this do you feel you have a soul? Something inside of you that makes you feel? Or are you saying you do not have a inner soul? Are you saying you cannot hide things deep inside of yourself that you can choose to reveal or not reveal to people.

If you agree that you do have a soul, hows your energy theory fit into that?

 

[rinnie]

Another unbelievable comment on the theory on sins are not real.

Okay I go out and I kill my neighbor. That puts me in a state of Mortal Sin. But its not real, because sins are not real. SO then I created no sin, and did not kill my neighbor, but the problem is my Neighbor is indeed DEAD!

How do we take something that is real, and deny that it is real then? According to the LAW OF GOD murder is indeed a sin. So now it seems to me the Law of God is correct. Because when you kill someone and commit a sin, its pretty real. So what we deny sin and murder and death also?

 

[eegardner]

Sins are man made, lets face it, the universe does not care if we have sex before marriage, or don’t believe in god, all the universe cares about is that the laws of physics and nature are obeyed.

It is not the universe that will judge us in the final days. So, if the universe even had the ability to care it would not matter what the universe thought. Only what the Creator of the universe thinks matters.

 

[SteveVH]

Purgatory is Man Made, just like how the bible is man made. I’m sick of religions like Catholicism fearing people into their religion, sickens me. I myself follow the laws of physics and the laws of biology and nature.

I have yet to meet a person who has joined the Catholic Church that did so out of fear. As to following the laws of physics, biology and nature, I don’t think you have much choice. But we are more than just lumps of meat walking around a planet; the fact that we are having this discussion is evidence of that.

Reasons why Purgatory is not real.

1. Sins are not real,

Sins are man made, lets face it, the universe does not care if we have sex before marriage, or don’t believe in god, all the universe cares about is that the laws of physics and nature are obeyed.

Please demonstrate the thought process of the universe? Are you saying that you believe the “universe” has feelings? This is nonsensical.

This is why I do not believe sins are real, int he universe every single creature has the instinct of social darwinism (Survival of the fittest) please note Social Darwinism is not a theory, HUMAN EVOLUTION is a theory, Social Darwinism has been proven. The law of Social Darwinism states the only the strongest organisms will survive to have a lot of sex and pass on there genes to the next generation. All the acts which are considered SINS, in the Christan religion are actually just regular instincts of nature.

Please explain why a person would lay down his life for another, especially one stronger than those for whom his life is laid down. Survival of the fittest assumes that each being is clawing and scratching to stay alive and that, naturally, the fittest will prevail. It does not answer the phenomena of sacrificial love which happens to be a reality.

1. Hell isn’t real.

There are many reasons why a hell can’t be real. It goes against the Christan belief of an all LOVING god, how can an all loving god damn someone to eternal suffering? Yes you may say well the disobeyed god, so god will damn you to suffering just because you disobeyed him, gee very loving.

Are you arguing that hell cannot exist because it violates a belief (Christian) which you do not share? Love cannot exist unless one can make a choice to love through ones own free will. A robot cannot be programmed to love. Love is not a function of nature or physics. God allows us to make that choice; to either love him or not. If we choose a life apart from God, he allows that decision and it will have eternal consequences. Hell is simply life without God, a life that has been chosen, not imposed by a vengeful God. God does not damn anyone; we damn ourselves. God has done everything in order to save us from this state of being, to the point of giving his very life. Those that reject this love have chosen their eternal state of being, God has not imposed it upon them in order to punish them. Indeed, his desire is that all be saved.

A lot of people would say, well it’s because Jesus had to suffer. Lets think of this logically, why would a god TORTURE his only son to death, because some man took an apple? That makes no logic sense, that is barbaric and evil! If I tell my little sister, “hey don’t eat my ice cream cone in the fridge” and she eats it, does that make logic sense for me to have my son tortured to death?

God did not torture his Son, people did. What is harder for a person to do; give their own life; or give their child’s life? I don’t know of a parent who would not give their own life for the life of their child. To give your child’s life for the sake of another is a love beyond human imagination. Your simplistic approach to these questions sheds much light on the depth of your understanding. I don’t know of any Chistian who believes that God tortured his Son because someone stole an apple. You should try to gain at least some understanding of the actual Christian belief before you criticize it.

Part 2 of why hell is not real, hell violates the law of conservation of energy, in physics energy is never created nor destroyed, so if a hell did exist, that energy of the being would have to leave our universe to a different plane, which is a big no no in physics (Energy’s conservation has been proven, I have used and conducted experiment’s which prove it’s a law.) Some people will argue with me saying, a hell could exist, since there is a possibility of other dimensions and Anti universes. Yes those dimensions and universes could exist, but there is not way for energy to be transferred from one to another. Again it violates the conservation of energy’s law.

God is not subject to the law of physics, neither are our souls. We are speaking of an entirey different reality, one beyond space and time and creation. You have placed false limitations on God in an attempt to prove your point. Sorry.

 

[Nicea325]

Purgatory is Man Made, just like how the bible is man made. I’m sick of religions like Catholicism fearing people into their religion, sickens me. I myself follow the laws of physics and the laws of biology and nature.

Reasons why Purgatory is not real.

1. Sins are not real,

Sins are man made, lets face it, the universe does not care if we have sex before marriage, or don’t believe in god, all the universe cares about is that the laws of physics and nature are obeyed.

This is why I do not believe sins are real, int he universe every single creature has the instinct of social darwinism (Survival of the fittest) please note Social Darwinism is not a theory, HUMAN EVOLUTION is a theory, Social Darwinism has been proven. The law of Social Darwinism states the only the strongest organisms will survive to have a lot of sex and pass on there genes to the next generation. All the acts which are considered SINS, in the Christan religion are actually just regular instincts of nature.

1. Hell isn’t real.

There are many reasons why a hell can’t be real. It goes against the Christan belief of an all LOVING god, how can an all loving god damn someone to eternal suffering? Yes you may say well the disobeyed god, so god will damn you to suffering just because you disobeyed him, gee very loving.

A lot of people would say, well it’s because Jesus had to suffer. Lets think of this logically, why would a god TORTURE his only son to death, because some man took an apple? That makes no logic sense, that is barbaric and evil! If I tell my little sister, “hey don’t eat my ice cream cone in the fridge” and she eats it, does that make logic sense for me to have my son tortured to death?

Part 2 of why hell is not real, hell violates the law of conservation of energy, in physics energy is never created nor destroyed, so if a hell did exist, that energy of the being would have to leave our universe to a different plane, which is a big no no in physics (Energy’s conservation has been proven, I have used and conducted experiment’s which prove it’s a law.) Some people will argue with me saying, a hell could exist, since there is a possibility of other dimensions and Anti universes. Yes those dimensions and universes could exist, but there is not way for energy to be transferred from one to another. Again it violates the conservation of energy’s law.

Okay…good for you. You want to adhere to science,your choice,but your opinions about religion are old and boring news. So go and preach your anti-religion sermons to those who care,because frankly no one here cares.

 

[byeveryword]

Real. Leaning toward a region within Sheol, or Hades that is a place of purgation, or purification.