Purification by the WORD of GOD!

[Ani_Ibi]

bloodsanctified:

Blessings (not a question!)

I see that you are a very new poster to Catholic Answers. Some very new posters hang out a while, get to know the format of the board, get to know the regular posters, get to know the ‘culture’ as it were of the board.

Some, however, blaze on in, convinced that we Catholics are bound for Hell and start ‘instructing’ us right off the mark.

http://bestsmileys.com/religous/3.gif

Oh this is a very unwise strategy. You will find that many regular posters here are extremely well versed in Scripture and Tradition.

There is a Library on the main page of Catholic Answers – not the message board. Most of your questions will be answered there. Those that are not you can ask on the ask an expert forum.

Oh by the way, you might want to take a really close look at the Forum Rules.

 

[Courtneyjo]

Ani Ibi:

I see that you are a very new poster to Catholic Answers. Some very new posters hang out a while, get to know the format of the board, get to know the regular posters, get to know the ‘culture’ as it were of the board.

Some, however, blaze on in, convinced that we Catholics are bound for Hell and start ‘instructing’ us right off the mark.

http://bestsmileys.com/religous/3.gif

Oh this is a very unwise strategy. You will find that many regular posters here are extremely well versed in Scripture and Tradition.

There is a Library on the main page of Catholic Answers – not the message board. Most of your questions will be answered there. Those that are not you can ask on the ask an expert forum.

Oh by the way, you might want to take a really close look at the Forum Rules.

Great points! And after you do all that, if you want to discuss Scripture, please consider posting on the Sacred Scripture forum as well.

 

[pnewton]

bloodsanctified:

Ps I only go by the WORD,…

Where in the Bible does it say we should do this? Since you “only go by the WORD”, is this technique mandated by the WORD?

 

[Robert_in_SD]

Hello “BS”:

Welcome to the forum. Let me start by acknowledging that faith is absolutely necessary for a person’s justification and it is not by our works outside of grace that we are justified or sanctified, but by faith through grace, working in love in cooperation with God.

As Catholics, we depart from your interpretation of the scriptures because they clearly do not teach that faith alone (or sola fide) is all that is necessary for salvation. That is an invention of the protestant reformation.

The NT is not consistent with sola fide. Hence, Catholics must object to the idea that only faith is required for salvation. Such a belief is not a biblically supportable concept, and Martin Luther knew this when he changed the wording in his translation to insert the word “alone” into the Gospel, knowing full well that it did not exist in the original greek text.

None of your passages support the proposition that it is “faith alone” that saves. Rather, the whole of scripture suggest that faith - but not faith alone - is necessary for salvation…

Not every one who says to me, `Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. (Mt 7:21)

[17] … If you would enter [eternal] life, keep the commandments." (Mt 19:16-17)

[21] He who has my commandments and keeps them, he it is who loves me; and he who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and manifest myself to him." (Jn 14:21)

[3] Do you suppose, O man, that when you judge those who do such things and yet do them yourself, you will escape the judgment of God?
[4] Or do you presume upon the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience? Do you not know that God’s kindness is meant to lead you to repentance?
[5] But by your hard and impenitent heart you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath when God’s righteous judgment will be revealed.
[6] For he will render to every man according to his works:
[7] to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life;
[8] but for those who are factious and do not obey the truth, but obey wickedness, there will be wrath and fury. (Rom 2:2-8.)

[6] For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision is of any avail, but faith working through love. (Gal 5:4-6.)

[8] For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God –
[9] not because of works, lest any man should boast.
[10] For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them. (Eph 2:8-10.)

[12] Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
[13] for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. (Phil 2:12-13.)

[14] What does it profit, my brethren, if a man says he has faith but has not works? Can his faith save him?
[15] If a brother or sister is ill-clad and in lack of daily food,
[16] and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and filled,” without giving them the things needed for the body, what does it profit?
[17] So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.
[18] But some one will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I by my works will show you my faith.
[19] You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe – and shudder.
[20] Do you want to be shown, you shallow man, that faith apart from works is barren?
[21] Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he offered his son Isaac upon the altar?
[22] You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by works,
[23] and the scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned to him as righteousness”; and he was called the friend of God.
[24] You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone. (Jam 2:14-24.)

 

[montanaman]

bloodsanctified:

montanaman:

Oh, that’s cute. Someone told him Catholics didn’t know any scripture and they’d leave Rome in droves if only someone could throw random verses at them.
QUOTE]

blessing to you also,

WOW?
Did you just make up that lie by yourself or did you have proof of that aweful statemant?
And why would anyone, say such a lie without the proof to show, to back it up?
Never said such a thing and never will.

Bless you!

I apologize. I didn’t realize your sarcasm detector and sense of humor were surgically removed at the tent revival. I’m always making that faux pax.

 

[Robert_in_SD]

bloodsanctified:

First of ALL when anyone wants to STUDY the LAW they do what is ‘called” a Subject matter Study…

BS;

I did a text search for the term “subject matter study” and found nothing in my bible? Where does the bible teach that we have to perform a “subject matter study” and how does one decide to exclude certain passages from that study? Your suggestion seems awful un-biblical to me.

 

[Courtneyjo]

bloodsanctified:

Blessings Courtneyjo,
Never forget any WORDs from the WORD of GOD because I do NOT rely on my own underatanding Prov. 3: 6 And those with the MIND of Christ within them, can’t forget any WORD of GOD, but they who rely on “their own understanding” can’t understand how any one else could be so reliant or dependent on the WORD of GOD, for their sanctification as to Live by the WHOLE WORD!
AND live by the WORD and for the WORD and nothing but the WORD = no reliance on the “self” for anything!

Ps You could have cut and pasted John 6, instead of just refering to it as “others” might not have a “bible” to see what you are refering to. Unless it doesn’t have this certain Topic contained therein! (not a question!)

I would ask you to prove that purification and justification are the same thing, but I don’t quibble with trolls.

 

[Ani_Ibi]

pnewton:

Where in the Bible does it say we should do this? Since you “only go by the WORD”, is this technique mandated by the WORD?

The Word of God – or logos – is not the Bible, it is Jesus.

 

[LovedOne]

bloodsanctified - what is the “pillar and foundation of truth?”

 

[pnewton]

Ani Ibi:

The Word of God – or logos – is not the Bible, it is Jesus.

I am aware of that. I just don’t think (surely not) that the writer is claiming he is hearing the voice of Jesus in his head. He quotes scripture only and hasn’t mentioned any voices, feelings, personal revelation, etc.

 

[Trelow]

where’d he go?

 

[montanaman]

Trelow:

where’d he go?

He is undoubtedly consulting with a respected mentor or pastor right now, trying to come to terms with the unexpected fruitlessness of his efforts. Either he’s learning from the experience and modifying his approach, or he’s right now suffering a crisis of faith with the knowledge that flinging random verses at Catholics doesn’t have the intended result. And how could that BE?

 

[montanaman]

Whoa. I just checked out his bio. If it’s true, the guy is nearly 60. I thought, judging by the grammar, all the exclamation points and the bold font that we were dealing with a very zealous first-year Bible college student.

Now I’m even more aggrvated that someone who should know better is so unbelievably condescending.

 

[LovedOne]

montanaman:

Whoa. I just checked out his bio. If it’s true, the guy is nearly 60. I thought, judging by the grammar, all the exclamation points and the bold font that we were dealing with a very zealous first-year Bible college student.

Now I’m even more aggrvated that someone who should know better is so unbelievably condescending.

A fundementalist no doubt.
More concerned about being “right” (which he of course is not and may have just discovered this and is now suffering a crisis of faith… happens to em’ all the time) than being humble, charitable and loving. All fruits of the spirit…hmmm?

 

[LSK]

Thank you so much, my brother in Christ, for posting what you did!

You may not know this, but my Church, the Catholic Church, is the institution that gathered the Holy Scripture together in the Book so that all Christians could read it. We are more than aware of what is in the Holy Scriptures and thank you again for posting the holy words as you did.

Catholics Christians are not Children of the Book, however, we are Children of the Word, the Word Incarnate. For as it is written in the Holy Scripture, not everything Jesus did or said was written down (John 21:25). This is why we hold fast to Sacred Tradition, as instructed by St. Paul (1 Cor 11:2 and 2 Thess 2:15).

Remember, my brother in Christ, St. Peter cautions us that St Paul was so learned that his letters could be difficult to grasp and interpret (2 Pet 3:15-16) which is why as faithful members of the Body of Christ and the Holy Mother Church we rely upon not just our own interpretation - oh, no! We could so easily fall into the heresies that plagued the early Church and plague the Church today! No, my brother, we rely upon the learned, faithful men of the magisterium guided by the Holy Spirit to teach us and lovingly guide us so that we may remain true to the Teachings and Traditions of the Church founded by Christ HIMSELF.

You post here because you are hungry for the TRUTH…cast aside your ego and the demons that plague you and join us at the banquet table!

 

[Ani_Ibi]

pnewton:

I am aware of that. I just don’t think (surely not) that the writer is claiming he is hearing the voice of Jesus in his head. He quotes scripture only and hasn’t mentioned any voices, feelings, personal revelation, etc.

The crux of the matter is personal relationship – love – as manifested by the Real Presence of Jesus.

 

[montanaman]

LSK:

Thank you so much, my brother in Christ, for posting what you did!

You may not know this, but my Church, the Catholic Church, is the institution that gathered the Holy Scripture together in the Book so that all Christians could read it. We are more than aware of what is in the Holy Scriptures and thank you again for posting the holy words as you did.

Catholics Christians are not Children of the Book, however, we are Children of the Word, the Word Incarnate. For as it is written in the Holy Scripture, not everything Jesus did or said was written down (John 21:25). This is why we hold fast to Sacred Tradition, as instructed by St. Paul (1 Cor 11:2 and 2 Thess 2:15).

Remember, my brother in Christ, St. Peter cautions us that St Paul was so learned that his letters could be difficult to grasp and interpret (2 Pet 3:15-16) which is why as faithful members of the Body of Christ and the Holy Mother Church we rely upon not just our own interpretation - oh, no! We could so easily fall into the heresies that plagued the early Church and plague the Church today! No, my brother, we rely upon the learned, faithful men of the magisterium guided by the Holy Spirit to teach us and lovingly guide us so that we may remain true to the Teachings and Traditions of the Church founded by Christ HIMSELF.

You post here because you are hungry for the TRUTH…cast aside your ego and the demons that plague you and join us at the banquet table!

That, my friends, is how you put the message board smackdown on hyperventilating fundamentalists who try to “out-sincere” you.

Brilliant. Simply brilliant.

 

[Ani_Ibi]

montanaman:

That, my friends, is how you put the message board smackdown on hyperventilating fundamentalists who try to “out-sincere” you.

http://bestsmileys.com/magic/7.gif :yup:

 

[bloodsanctified]

Ani Ibi:

I see that you are a very new poster to Catholic Answers. Some very new posters hang out a while, get to know the format of the board, get to know the regular posters, get to know the ‘culture’ as it were of the board.

Some, however, blaze on in, convinced that we Catholics are bound for Hell and start ‘instructing’ us right off the mark.

http://bestsmileys.com/religous/3.gif

Oh this is a very unwise strategy. You will find that many regular posters here are extremely well versed in Scripture and Tradition.

There is a Library on the main page of Catholic Answers – not the message board. Most of your questions will be answered there. Those that are not you can ask on the ask an expert forum.

Oh by the way, you might want to take a really close look at the Forum Rules.

Well blessing to you ,

Did the WORDS that is not correct to assume that I never placed and such words as “Catholics are bound for Hell.” Do youy mind coping and pasting that quote for all to see where that came from? Thanks?

Hower the assumption that I would . . .quote . . ." however, blaze on in AND quote "start ‘instructing’ us right off the mark is also somewhat incorrect…as you should know that GOD HIMSELF said (without forum rules) in 2Ti 3:16 "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness."

1. "All scripture is given by inspiration of God!"
2. "is profitable for doctrine"
3. "for reproof
4. "for correction!"
5. "for instruction in righteousness."

I look at the WORD of GOD and HE RULES and what HE says I DO and I follow the WORD of GOD rather than men asI do believe that the “forum” rules follow the WORD of GOD! RIGHT! That was not a question…

Thanks NOW back toi the TOP{IC …when were you “sanctified” to the WORD of GOD?
The reason I “asked” is I did not see any WORD of GOD refered to as a basis for any of your statements …just asking as Purification is the topic of this tread!

Blessings

 

[bloodsanctified]

Dearest Robert in SD,

Just by looking by the SPIRIT of GOD, you love the WORD enough to copy and past MUCH WORD into your post. Praise the WORD of GOD. and I do love to see other searching OUT the truth IN the WORD of GOD!
BUT
“We” do not Do anything but "by faith." Than after the faith for doing. . . than we “do” something.
After we glean the faith in the WORD of GOD and BY the WORD of GOD we “do something,” like "works worthy of repentance" (Luke 3:8 )

We do everything “by faith” in the WORD of GOD, FIRST and “by faith” the “works” than follow! We just “go and do,” by faith and NOT in “ourselves” lest we may “boast or glory” in our faith instead of HIS FAITH to do HIS WILL and NOT “ours.”

We just go and DO what HE said to GO and DO, and ONLY one of the things that GOD said to “GO and DO” Faith in and BY the WORD of GOD than the “doings.” It is not a “thing” we work up but an a-tribute (attribute) of the SPIRIT of the WORD of GOD by HIS FAITH.

WORKS were NOT listed in the FRUITS of the SPIRIT! NOR wer works found in the following
1Co 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

1. FAITH came before “hope.”
2. FAITH came before “charity” than the Mention of which is greater of the three which is mentioned AFTER Faith is “charity.”
   “Works” mentioned after “Faith” as “charity!”
   NEXT
   Do try to follow the following in 2Co 4:13 We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak."
   Why the “works” of the “Spoken WORD?” Belief ot faith and than the SPEAKING of the WORD or the works of the WORD!

Faith comes in via the FAITH of the WORD of GOD and than the “works” follow the faith in the WORD of GOD and never before do any godly “works” happen, but thru faith in and by the WORD of GOD.

The TOPIC of this thread is “Purification” and that purification is done “by faith” and the Proof of the faith of Purification by the belief of the TRUTH, or the FRUITS of the Spirit of HOLINESS is living a HOLY Life, HIS HOLY Life, with the ‘works’ following the faith of the “purification.”
AGAIN We having the same Spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak."

Do you see any reference of the Purification of the Fruits of the Spirit as mentioned as “works” in the following Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith!"
“Fruits first” by faith, and than the works, not before!
Works FOLLOW faith, always have and always will!
HIS Faith first and than the “works.”
Proof: in 1Co 6:11 but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God

1. And such were some of you. Were is a Past tense situation which equals NO MORE!
2. "ARE Washed" Present perfect possessive tense First!
3. "ARE Sanctified" Present perfect possessive tense came second and than came…
4. "Justified" and only in that is the only godly ORDER and there is no other order with GOD … washed … sanctified … than justified . . .LAST than come the “works.”

“Were”… is a Past Tense verb…washed . . .purified. . . than justified and GOD (the one I serve) said Rom 6:22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

1. WORDS are But now being made free from sin!"
   NOT “free IN sin” Nor did GOD just say “free TO sin” but HE said
   "now being made free from sin!" With the exact time statement inspired by GOD (not the still fallen) stated NOW
2. After the “NOW… Free From sin,” comes the WORDs become servants to God. NOT before the 'free from sin" does the godly statement of "servants to GOD" as those who are not yet “free From sin” are NOT worthy to be "servants of GOD." because Heb 2:11 For both He that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren" Only the sanctified are one with the ONE who Sanctified them, not before…
   3."ye have your fruit unto holiness" comes AFTER the WORDs Free From Sin" and NOT before.
   4 And also AFTER ALL the rest of the things listed BY GOD and not sinning man…comes the WORDs and the end everlasting life. Not BEFORE!

Only they who are still “working out their OWN salvation with fear and trembling” get things ALL mixed up, and OUT of GODLY Order, and than they try to “deceive the elect if it were possible”