Purpose for Infant Baptisms

[CHRISTINE77]

Then you were never Catholic, and do not understand the faith. There is no such Cannon, no such entry in the Catechism and I challenge you sir to find it.

We Catholics do typically baptise infants because it makes sense to do so. Christ was quite clear, no one born only of flesh will win the kingdom. We can hope God has some mechinism to save unbaptised babies, but we can’t know. This is why be baptise infants. We must be baptised as an infant? Where in the heck did you get that from?

Actually I wasn’t baptized until I was around 2. There’s no law that says you must be baptized as an infant. It’s the custom, and it is a beautiful ceremony to see the little infants get blessed, and as I said before, it keeps them safe from Satan’s power.

 

[thecourt]

Christine77 there is no waiting. The truth is taught to the child when they are at a age to understand — no infant baptism prior since we don’t perform this unnecessary ordinance.

Agency, or freedom to choose for oneself, is understand.

What is Catholicism’s understanding of agency? Or I would guess, if someone does not join Catholicism, they are going to hell? The arrogance of the so called true church is never ending.

 

[crazzeto]

Christine77 there is no waiting. The truth is taught to the child when they are at a age to understand — no infant baptism prior since we don’t perform this unnecessary ordinance.

Agency, or freedom to choose for oneself, is understand.

What is Catholicism’s understanding of agency? Or I would guess, if someone does not join Catholicism, they are going to hell? The arrogance of the so called true church is never ending.

Provide your proof that there is an ordenance that infants must be baptised, or stop posting in error. In fact, I won’t wait for you:

1229
From the time of the apostles, becoming a Christian has been accomplished by a journey and initiation in several stages. This journey can be covered rapidly or slowly, but certain essential elements will always have to be present: proclamation of the Word, acceptance of the Gospel entailing conversion, profession of faith, Baptism itself, the outpouring of the Holy Spirit, and admission to Eucharistic communion.

Where in here is the ordenance for infant baptism

1230
This initiation has varied greatly through the centuries according to circumstances. In the first centuries of the Church, Christian initiation saw considerable development. A long period of catechumenate included a series of preparatory rites, which were liturgical landmarks along the path of catechumenal preparation and culminated in the celebration of the sacraments of Christian initiation.

1231
Where infant Baptism has become the form in which this sacrament is **usually **celebrated, it has become a single act encapsulating the preparatory stages of Christian initiation in a very abridged way. By its very nature infant Baptism requires a post-baptismal catechumenate. Not only is there a need for instruction after Baptism, but also for the necessary flowering of baptismal grace in personal growth. The catechism has its proper place here.

Did you note that word usually? Does that sound like an ordenance to baptise infants to you? No, that’s not what it is, that’s an admission in the Catechism that more often than not parents opt for this.

1233
Today in all the rites, Latin and Eastern, the Christian initiation of adults begins with their entry into the catechumenate and reaches its culmination in a single celebration of the three sacraments of initiation: Baptism, Confirmation, and the Eucharist.37 In the Eastern rites the Christian initiation of infants also begins with Baptism followed immediately by Confirmation and the Eucharist, while in the Roman rite it is followed by years of catechesis before being completed later by Confirmation and the Eucharist, the summit of their Christian initiation.38

Whoopsy, the Catechism right here is discussing the baptism of adult catechumin.

 

[crazzeto]

Why baptise infants?

1213
Holy Baptism is the basis of the whole Christian life, the gateway to life in the Spirit (vitae spiritualis ianua),4 and the door which gives access to the other sacraments. Through Baptism we are freed from sin and reborn as sons of God; we become members of Christ, are incorporated into the Church and made sharers in her mission: "Baptism is the sacrament of regeneration through water and in the word."5

1215
This sacrament is also called “the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit,” for it signifies and actually brings about the birth of water and the Spirit without which no one "can enter the kingdom of God."7

1250
Born with a fallen human nature and tainted by original sin, children also have need of the new birth in Baptism to be freed from the power of darkness and brought into the realm of the freedom of the children of God, to which all men are called.50 The sheer gratuitousness of the grace of salvation is particularly manifest in infant Baptism. The Church and the parents would deny a child the priceless grace of becoming a child of God were they not to confer Baptism shortly after birth.51

 

[thecourt]

crazzeto I never have supported the unnecessary ordinance of infant baptism.

 

[crazzeto]

crazzeto I never have supported the unnecessary ordinance of infant baptism.

thecourt:

You have never proved that such an ordenance exists. More over I have proved you wrong, decisively. Please stop posting your error. Thanks.

 

[thecourt]

crazzeto what error are you talking about?

 

[crazzeto]

Christine77 claims that infant will be forced to become a member of my church. Yet we have no unnecessary ordinance known as infant baptism and when older as a child, can make a choice if they wish to be taught the gospel and be baptized in the church.

Catholics do not do this since infants MUST BE BAPTIZED without question.

Again, spreading your errors about my faith, thank you very much. I definitively proved your position wrong. More over I grounded why the baptism of infants is such a good idea.

 

[Randy_Carson]

Randy Carson is good example of the lack of respect for a infant’s agency, or freedom to choose to be baptized or not because infant baptism is unnecessary.

Do you understand agency, or freedom to choose for oneself, versus in your view, denial of that and it must happen because you said so?

Third Request

When was the Jewish infant allowed to say, “Tell the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob that I do not want this”?

When are the dead for whom Mormons are baptized allowed to say, “I do not want this”?

I have asked these questions repeatedly; when will you answer them?

 

[Randy_Carson]

Christine77 there is no waiting. The truth is taught to the child when they are at a age to understand — no infant baptism prior since we don’t perform this unnecessary ordinance.

You keep saying that - “unnecessary ordinance”. What does the Bible actually say?

The Necessity of Water Baptism Proved from Scripture

The New Testament writers indicate that baptism is necessary for salvation in the following verses of scripture.

Mark 16:16
He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.

Acts 2:37-39
37When the people heard this, they were cut to the heart and said to Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?” 38Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39The promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off—for all whom the Lord our God will call.”

Acts 22:16
And now why do you wait? Rise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on his name.’

Titus 3:4-7
4But when the kindness and love of God our Savior appeared, 5he saved us, not because of righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy. He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit, 6whom he poured out on us generously through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7so that, having been justified by his grace, we might become heirs having the hope of eternal life.

1 Peter 3:20-21
when God’s patience waited in the days of Noah, during the building of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were saved through water. Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a clear conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

"Baptism…now saves you…"

---

Unnecessary?

 

[Randy_Carson]

Or I would guess, if someone does not join Catholicism, they are going to hell?

Where is that found in Catholic teaching? Or is this just your own opinion?

The arrogance of the so called true church is never ending.

The ignorance of the so-called “restored church” is never helpful.

 

[thecourt]

Randy Carson do not play the fact if those who do not join Catholicism are going to hell. That is part of your doctrine.

 

[crazzeto]

Randy Carson do not play the fact if those who do not join Catholicism are going to hell. That is part of your doctrine.

The doctrine is that all those who are saved, are saved through the Catholic Church. There for all salvation is through the Catholic Church, which is the body of Christ. Not that all Protestants need to get to RCIA ASAP because if they don’t they’re going to hell.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

The doctrine is that all those who are saved, are saved through the Catholic Church. There for all salvation is through the Catholic Church, which is the body of Christ. Not that all Protestants need to get to RCIA ASAP because if they don’t they’re going to hell.

In the end, God is the Judge of who will be saved.

 

[crazzeto]

In the end, God is the Judge of who will be saved.

Yep, what I post doesn’t contradict this. It clarifies the Church Teaching is that the Body of Christ is the Catholic Church. Everyone who is saved, is saved due to either a direct or indirect link to the CC.

 

[juliamajor]

Randy Carson do not play the fact if those who do not join Catholicism are going to hell. That is part of your doctrine.

Your hatred has overcome and overwhelmed any semblance of logic, clear thinking , truth and finally charity. I would not want to meet the Lord with that much hatred in my heart for finally that’s how we are judged.Not by what we seem to be, or seem to proclaim but those secrets of heart which only God knows-if love is not primary in us we are in deep trouble.
Pax Christi

 

[Akini]

Let us be simple and blunt. Personally, I do not agree or don’t want un-baptized infants to go to some other places apart from Heaven. Unfortunately, that doesn’t change one bit about the Truth that infant baptism is necessary as a ticket to Heaven. The final destiny of un-baptized infants lies squarely with God’s mercy. Let’s leave at that.

In the meantime, I urge every parent to bring your child for Baptism shortly after birth. You will do eternal goodness to your child if you do that.

Akini

 

[Akini]

At least Catholics have every chance of going to Heaven. There is a very slim chance for those who are outside the One Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.

Akini

 

[crowcounty]

at least some catholics are humble, "at least sounds like an infant baptism, but as a catholic i must point out that according to our doctrine if a person is baptised properly even if donE by NON BELIEVER IS VALID…so whoever you may be eather you like it or not if you are baptised in the name of the trinity for the remission of sins you are part of the universal church and that means weather you admit it or agree or whatever if you are really baptised you are catholic

 

[Randy_Carson]

at least some catholics are humble, "at least sounds like an infant baptism, but as a catholic i must point out that according to our doctrine if a person is baptised properly even if donE by NON BELIEVER IS VALID…so whoever you may be eather you like it or not if you are baptised in the name of the trinity for the remission of sins you are part of the universal church and that means weather you admit it or agree or whatever if you are really baptised you are catholic

This is correct. Unfortunately, Mormon baptisms have been determined to be invalid by the Catholic Church.