Purpose of the Perpetual Virginity of Mary

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I’m not disagreeing with you on that, I’m asking whether Joseph has to be a perpetual virgin to fulfill God’s plan.
 
MagdalenaRita said:
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C.Longinus:
The same question could be asked for a non-virginal Joseph. What is your point,
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Many of the comments in this thread indicate that it would have been too difficult or too impossible for him to be married and not have relations with Mary or she isn’t submissive if she wasn’t having relations with him and the like, so…

So my point is, why couldn’t St., Joseph choose to remain virginal? Why are people finding it so hard to understand that Mary and Joseph didn’t have sexual relations?

If we can have faith she conceived without relations, why can’t we have faith that Mary and Joseph chose to continue to not have relations?
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That’s right, St.Joseph and St. Mary didn’t mate like animals do, they were on a different spiritual level than ordinary people.
 
nfinke said:
From what I understand, the Greek word used that is translated here as “until” does not imply anything about what happens after that limit is reached, unlike the word does in English.
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Well that’s convenient. Just like Jesus’ brothers and sisters are just cousins because the Jews supposedly called their cousins brothers and sisters. All very convenient explanations given to the many parts of the scripture that support the claim Mary was not a perpetual virgin.

But how many parts of scripture actually support the claim that Mary was a perpetual virgin?
I would expect something like that to be clearly stated in the bible. I don’t believe it is
 
How is the structure of the greek language convenient? Youre responding like I created the language. 😄
 
De_Maria said:
It sure sounds like you have a problem with it.
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I thought I made the point clear.

I have no problem accepting it if the Church says its true. but, if the church had not decided to come out and make that teaching infallible dogma (which it did not do for centuries), then it would be entirely reasonable for a faithful person to be on either side of the issue. The fact that they did come out and make it dogma means they saw it as such a critical issue that everyone needed to be on the same side. Logic says there has to be a reason why they would need to go out of their way for that, for a doctrine that I dont think is critically important to the body of the faith, especially compared to others like the trinity or the true presence etc.

There are many things (quadrillions of things in fact) that are true that the Church doesnt feel the need to announce from the infallible mouth of the Pope, a method theyve only used a handful of times in their 2000+ year history. Thats all Im saying.
 
nfinke said:
I thought I made the point clear.
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That was your initial claim. But your continued objections indicate that you do have a problem with it which you deny.
I have no problem accepting it if the Church says its true. but,
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The Church says its true. That should be the end of it, then.
if the church had not decided to come out and make that teaching infallible dogma (which it did not do for centuries), then it would be entirely reasonable for a faithful person to be on either side of the issue.
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Many people were on the other side of the issue. What does that have to do with you?
The fact that they did come out and make it dogma means they saw it as such a critical issue that everyone needed to be on the same side.
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What it means is that the Church realized that it needed to be clarified so that those individuals on the wrong side of the issue would know, in no uncertain terms, that they were on the wrong side of the issue. And furthermore, that if they continued on the wrong side of the issue, they would incur the wrath of God.
Logic says there has to be a reason why they would need to go out of their way for that,
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To save souls.
for a doctrine that I dont think is critically important to the body of the faith,
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If you keep making yourself the judge of what is and isn’t important to the body of the faith, you will have problems remaining a Catholic.
especially compared to others like the trinity or the true presence etc.
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I guess you need to start your own religion, then. The religion of the critical doctrines that you deem necessary for salvation. I hope you clear those with God, first.
There are many things (quadrillions of things in fact) that are true that the Church doesnt feel the need to announce from the infallible mouth of the Pope, a method theyve only used a handful of times in their 2000+ year history. Thats all Im saying.
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And all I’m saying is that God put the Church in charge. Not you or I.
 
De_Maria said:
your continued objections indicate that you do have a problem with it which you deny.
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I’ve said many times I accept the teaching and have no objections to it. Nor did I ever suggest the church was in error, or that they should somehow take back the teaching. I never claimed I knew better. But if you really think you have some secret insight into my heart of hearts, I guess you’re free to believe what you want.

God gave me the gift of reason in addition to faith. Seeing as, for the umpteenth time, I do not contest the teaching, it’s not sinful to wonder why the church does things.

It also shouldn’t be controversial to say some doctrines are clearly more critical to the faith than others. If a person who says they’re Catholic said to you “I don’t think Mary was always a virgin, and also I think Jesus was just a normal mortal man”, it would be obvious which of those issues should be addressed first.
 
nfinke said:
The fact that they did come out and make it dogma means they saw it as such a critical issue that everyone needed to be on the same side.
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I think just because it is a truth and we need to accept all that God has revealed as being true and this was what God wanted us to know and believe about the Blessed Mother.

Perhaps also because devotion to the Blessed Mother is extremely important.

I also think one more thing. It fulfills the OT and shows that Jesus is God and how everything needs to be free from the impurity of sin to be in His presence.
 
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