Question about all those initials

[Lucy_1]

I’m a candidate for conversion, so take it easy on me

I don’t understand the references on the forum to different kinds of mass. As near as I can tell the OF is also known as the NO and is a more modern mass? While the EF also known as the Tridentine (sp?) is more old fashioned, in Latin?

What are the differences between these two types of Mass?

Also, is the revised liturgy that’s coming out in November going to be in Latin? I’m wondering if as I new convert I should learn Latin.

 

[Little_One0307]

OF is the same as NO. It’s not about it being a more modern Mass, it the the Mass that came about after Vatican II.

EF is not the Old fashioned Mass, it was the form of Mass that was celebrated before Vatican II.

Some differences, I am sure some more knowledgeable people can further delineate the differences.

OF - Vernacular; EF - Latin
OF and EF differ greately in their rubrics and the words of the Mass as well
OF - does allow more for modern songs and things of this nature
EF - has more traditional music done at it

Latin is not necessary to learn as a convert. They make missals that have the Latin in them as well beside the English that make it easy to follow along. I would however recommend if you do go to EF which is also known as TM Tridentine Mass, to learn how to pronounce the Latin. The pronunciation of Ecclesiastical Latin is different from that of Classical Latin.

The Mass revisions coming out in November are a bit more faithful to the Latin.

God bless.

 

[Cat]

NO = novus ordo, or “new order”, abbreviated NO.

This was the name of the Mass that came out as a result of the work done at Vatican II. It’s the Mass that most people in the U.S. are familiar with, done in the language of the people (mainly English and Spanish in the U.S., although in this part of the country, we see a lot of Polish Masses).

EF = extraordinary form
OF = ordinary form

These are the names that the Pope uses for the two forms of the Mass. For this reason, many of us prefer to use these two names rather than novus ordo or NO. There are some Catholics who take offense to the term NO, becaues it looks like the English word, “No,” which has a very negative connotation. But a lot of Catholics don’t take offense, either, since the term is correct. The Mass is the “new order.”

The EF is the Latin Mass, or “traditional Latin Mass,” or “TLM.” This is the old form of the Mass that was done for many centuries. Pope Benedict XVI released a motu proprio a few years back that makes it very clear that it is OK for parishes to hold EF Masses without getting permission from the bishop (although practically, priests DO continue to seek approval from their bishop, because it makes for a more friendly relationship).

Before the motu, there were a lot of dioceses where the TLM was essentially “forbidden.” Pope Benedict made it very clear that the Latin Mass, or EF, was here to stay.

The OF is the same as the novus ordo, or “new Mass” or “verncular Mass.” The Pope has labelled this the “ordinary form” because it is the form that most people will be experiencing. Pope Benedict XVI has made it clear that this Mass form is also here to stay, not a passing fad.

The EF and the OF are the same rite (the Roman or Latin rite), but two different forms. They are both equally efficacious, and both equally reverent when done with liturgical correctness, free of abuses. It is totally a question of personal preference.

I hope this helps.

My husband and I are converts from evangelical Protestantism. Both of us prefer the OF, as to us, coming out of the evangelical Protestant tradition, understanding and comprehension are extremely important. We respect the EF, and those who prefer it.

We are blessed that there is a TLM parish in our city, where Latin Masses are held daily and several times on Sunday. The parish has about 400 people in regular attendance, while the OF parishes have 1000s in attendance. So in our city, the TLM has not attracted many Catholics. However, in other cities, I’ve heard on CAF that the TLM has become very popular, especially among younger people.

 

[TuAutem]

You’ve got the terms straight for the two versions of the Mass. As for the differences between them, well, they’re quite significant, and I’m not ambitious enough to try to summarise them in a forum post. I’d recommend attending both to see–and maybe even an Eastern Catholic liturgy if you get the chance.

One key difference is that the OF allows for a lot more variation in how it’s celebrated, which is why many dislike it: there are examples of extremely sloppy, irreverent celebration ‘horror stories’ that are what send many people to the EF in the first place. However, it is important to note that the OF *can *be celebrated with great reverence, and beautiful liturgy. So do not get the impression that all OF masses are alike. (My parish does the OF in Latin with traditional music, and it’s quite beautiful.)

Both forms of the Mass are officially in Latin, however the OF is most often celebrated in the vernacular. The new English translation that is coming out this year is much more faithful to the Latin, but the Latin text of the Mass is not changing.

I’d always recommend learning Latin, for its own sake, but it’s certainly not required: In the OF, the English responses are more commonly used (if you’re new to it, I would recommend memorising the prayers and responses out of the new missal only, since the current one is on its way out). In the EF, most of the interaction takes place between the priest and server, the people pray along but don’t really have many ‘lines’ to say.

It probably is a good idea to learn to pronounce Latin, though, with the Roman pronunciation that we use in church (not the one classical Latin textbooks today use, unfortunately).

 

[Phemie]

The OF (Ordinary Form) is the Mass you’ll find in most parishes.

Generally it’s in the vernacular, that is, in English or whatever language the community speaks, according to the Missal of 1970 approved by Paul IV. The ‘official language’ of the Mass is Latin and the OF may be celebrated totally in that language but, unless you live in a city with many parishes and go searching, you probably won’t experience one. I know that I’ve never, in 41 years, stumbled into a church where they celebrated the Mass totally in Latin, although some might use some Latin responses (or Greek for the Kyrie) and it would be good if you learned the basic one’s (the Sanctus, the Agnus Dei, etc.)

The EF (Extraordinary Form, extraordinary in this case means ‘not the usual’ not ‘super duper special’) is the Mass celebrated totally in Latin according to the 1962 Missal approved by Pope John XXIII.

In this one the priest and the community face ‘liturgical east’ and the priest must say some prayers in a very low voice. It’s the Mass that I experienced until I was a teenager. Although not identical to the original Tridentine Mass, it is still often referred to as the Tridentine or Traditional Latin Mass. Some parishes are set up to celebrate only this Mass but, depending on where you live, you may not find one within a reasonable distance. I would have to travel 1500 km before I came to a city where the EF is celebrated. Many priests my age have never celebrated in this form and have no desire to start now, while other younger priests are very interested in offering this form and are striving to learn to do so.

 

[starsmurf]

I am also a convert, and I was also confused by all those terms at first. If you want to hear the Mass celebrated in Latin, either as the OF or EF, try a monastery. A couple I’ve stayed at had the OF Mass in both Latin and English. I can’t say that knowing Latin has been much help to me, so much is different to the Classical Latin. I do recommend learning the Sanctus (the one that starts “Holy, Holy, Holy” in English and the Agnus Dei (the one that starts “Lamb of God…” in English) as these are sometimes sung in Latin at an English Mass.

I’ve attended a couple of Tridentine Masses and I can say that they were beautiful but that they did not give me the same feeling that an OF Mass does. I do wonder if some of the joy people find in the Tridentine Mass is simple familiarity. I have found most of the OF Masses I’ve attended to be very well celebrated and reverant. The changes that are about to come in will be interesting, though I think the congregation are going to be stumbling over their parts for a while (rather like the poor priest who about three months after the election of the current Holy Father said “…your servant Pope John P… …Benedict…”)

Some people enjoy the OF, the EF, neither is better than the other. They are both the Sacrifice of the Mass, and that is what is important.

 

[Lucy_1]

Thank you for all your responses. I was looking at the masses in my diocese, and there is one that lists “Sung High Mass” would this be the EF?

 

[Phemie]

Thank you for all your responses. I was looking at the masses in my diocese, and there is one that lists “Sung High Mass” would this be the EF?

I would expect it to be.

 

[Lucy_1]

(if you’re new to it, I would recommend memorising the prayers and responses out of the new missal only, since the current one is on its way out).

Is the new missal available? I thought it wasn’t coming out until November. I already have the current one memorized, but my kids don’t so I’d be interested in learning it ASAP

 

[Phemie]

Is the new missal available? I thought it wasn’t coming out until November. I already have the current one memorized, but my kids don’t so I’d be interested in learning it ASAP

It goes into effect on the last Sunday in November/First Sunday of Advent, but the text is already public. You’ll find it HERE.

 

[Lucy_1]

Thank you!

 

[PJM]

=SherylPatton;8223132]I’m a candidate for conversion, so take it easy on me

I don’t understand the references on the forum to different kinds of mass. As near as I can tell the OF is also known as the NO and is a more modern mass? While the EF also known as the Tridentine (sp?) is more old fashioned, in Latin?

What are the differences between these two types of Mass?

Also, is the revised liturgy that’s coming out in November going to be in Latin? I’m wondering if as I new convert I should learn Latin.

First of all WELCOME HOME:thumbsup:

At present there are the Novus Ordo [New Mass] which has it’s origin in the Post Vatiican II period. Tecnically there are two ways of celebrating this Mass [based on Historical of two form of the “Extrodinary Form” the Lain Mass.

The two versions possible in BOTH the Ordinary Form [ususal…Novus Ordo], and the Latin Mass are the “Low Mass” and the High Mass.

Again the norm is the “Low Mass” which is the now our “common Mass.” High Mass in the Novus Ordo might be seen at MAJOR FEAST DAYS. Easter, Christimas; The Auunication and the like. Insense is usually a sign of a “High Mass” and there may be additional flowers and altar servers.

High Mass in the “Extrodinary Form” takes on even more sense of the “solemn” and a more festive [if I can use that word?] display. High Masses are more common in the latin form [Extrodinary form] and often are used for Major Saints Feast too.

BOTH forms retain all of the essential acts, Words, and actions, so the differences are spiritually the same. Grace flow from both equally if Said and Participated in FULLY.

OF = “Ordinary Form” which IN LATIN is the NO [Novus Ordo]. Ya did good figuring this out for yourself.

Hope this clears this up for you. If just ask more questions.

God Bless you,
Pat