Question about Annulments from the Non-Catholic

[RG633]

Hello Everyone!

I hope everyone is doing well. After doing a considerable amount of reading and my attempting to understand the Catholic Religion (I mean no disrespect by this but I am trying to learn). I wanted to ask a few questions. I am sure these have been asked multiple times but I am hoping I can get some solid answers as far as guidance and learning. Please forgive if this has been asked before and I just missed it.

Being that I am not Catholic I have a very limited knowledge base of where to go for answers. My fiance a lovely woman whom I have known since high school are looking to get married (down the road) and one of the discussions that has come up is how this would work in the sense I have been previously married.

My fiance loves me to death and has basically said I will do anything to marry you even if it means outside of the Church. While I am not Catholic I am baptized as Methodist however, have only been in a Protestant church and Baptist churches (Due to family being Military and that is what they have on the post). I disagree with her choice and I don’t feel I am doing the right thing by asking her to make such choice. One in my thoughts shouldn’t be forced to make such a decision.

So as I am sure you know where I am leading to I googled (something I am good at) and have done a lot of reading on if I would even be allowed to potentially marry my fiance. I have also done a lot of looking in regards to understand things. One of the things I have come across was annulment. Which leads to my few questions.

I was married for 3 years. I was civilly divorced 2 weeks shy of my 4 years of marriage. The marriage for a lot of reasons went “wrong” through I am sure my fault but some of it was not. In the first year and a half or the second year my ex was talking to me about her liking other women since she was 12 years old. She had commented how she was attracted to a girl and would love to watch her undress. During this same conversation I was told how she had also had things for her first room mate from college (a female) and among other things told me some adult related items to that effect. After discussing this all with me she said she was Bi-Sexual Curious and wanted to have time with another woman.

To make the long story short I didn’t know what to do. She went off and started going to Bi-Sexual websites and eventually started asking to do swinging things. After all this happened shortly afterwards she basically left. She moved out of the house filed for divorce and moved in with a girl she and I had known for a while because her and my ex were having sexual experiences. Over and over and even involved other guys.

Now that the history is done I have been divorced for over a year and a half. The girl as I said am engaged to is my world. So there is no way I will let her betray her faith in such a manner. I want to do the right thing. She is not a very big into going to church and when she does I go with her. She nor I know what to do or if even I can marry her.

My questions:

1. What are the chances of annulment in such situations?
2. Does it complicate an annulment process because I am not catholic nor was my ex?
3. One of the things from my research has been that I have to get statements from people who know about the relationship. My challenge to this is we didn’t have many friends outside of the circle she was in (swinging lifestyle) and those folks don’t talk about their private lives even if I could give them contact info (which I don’t have any). The only people who knew about us where co-workers and family. Outside of the working place we didn’t have friends because it was the two of us. How hard will this complicate things even further?
4. What is the proper steps for me to take at this point? I moved from the city I was married and lived in to another city. Does that complicate it more?

Thank you for your time. I am again sorry if these questions were asked before and I didn’t find them. I greatly appreciate everything I can be given. I am truly trying to learn a lot. Even listened to the Catholic radio station when I had Sirius always got a kick out of the Catholic Guy show.

 

[fermat]

Welcome.

First, let me commend you on trying to keep your fiancée on the right path, even if she doesn’t see that she needs to be.

Assuming that both you and your ex are baptized, the church presumes that your marriage was sacramental and valid. If you were to want to marry in the Catholic church, you would need to go to your dioceses and present your case to the marriage tribunal. They would ask for interviews and the like to decide if your marriage suffered from some kind of defect that made it, in fact, non-sacramental or non-valid.

One note here. The tribunal will try to decide if you were ever really married to start with. They can’t undo a valid marriage. The church teaches that once your are validly married in the eyes of God, man cannot break that. If they church decides that your marriage probably wasn’t valid, you will be free to marry really for the first time.

Long story short, go talk to your fiancées priest and ask to get the annulment process started. He’ll get you started.

I’ll pray for your situation.

 

[Apryl]

Hello Everyone!

And Hello right back at you

Your first post?!? Welcome to these forums. Thank you for taking an interest, and asking questions about things where you are confused or unsure

While I don’t know a lot about annulments and when it has to do with Non-Catholics, I would like to offer some things that may give you a bit of insight - based on my ideals of what Protestants see in the Catholic process of having a marriage declared null (this is what an annulment does)

Marriage, for Catholics, is a SACRAMENT. This is why Catholics can’t have a Catholic wedding outside of the church (except in some really odd, rare circumstances… none of which I have ever heard of taking place). This is a vow not only of Man to Woman, but also from each of them to God. They are expected to do so willingly and prepared to take on the challenges of marriages.

Some people, after they are married, sometimes for many years, they determine that their marriage was not started with these things in place: they were too immature, they determine their partner lied and falsified what they were getting, or some other such thing.

This is the reason why they want to interview your friends and relatives. Did you KNOW that your partner was a drug addict and you just ignored it? Did you KNOW that your partner had children outside of the marriage, and you still married? Were you aware that your partner was just SAYING that they would be faithful to you… so you had no reason to be surprised when that partner was unfaithful?

I think that you will agree that Jesus talks about divorce several times in scripture. There is NEVER an out for marriages. If you don’t want to be married to this person, you can’t marry someone else just because they are not taking you dancing twice a month. But… if you were never married…

I hope this helps you to understand this process and what is going on.

I’m sorry that I didn’t help to answer the questions you posted. I realize I went my own way, but I hope that this is helpful, and helps someone else to answer the questions you posted.

 

[JRKH]

What a beautiful and Godly person you are. I firmly believe that Chrsit is with you in this and will guide you through the necessary processes.

As to your Questions:

1. What are the chances of annulment in such situations?
Can’t say for sure. Your first wife’s sexual disfunction would be abig factor along with the fact that she left you. These would both be indicators that whe was in capable of entering into a valid sacramental marriage. Purely as a guess - I’d say the chances were pretty good.

2. Does it complicate an annulment process because I am not catholic nor was my ex?
Not particularly, though what your “non-catholic” view of marriage was at the time might be a factor.

3. One of the things from my research has been that I have to get statements from people who know about the relationship. My challenge to this is we didn’t have many friends outside of the circle she was in (swinging lifestyle) and those folks don’t talk about their private lives even if I could give them contact info (which I don’t have any). The only people who knew about us where co-workers and family. Outside of the working place we didn’t have friends because it was the two of us. How hard will this complicate things even further?
I wouldn’t be too concerned about this. I received an annulment after being married 19 years, divorced and remarried for an additional 15 years. The only witnesses I could come up with were my mom and my Aunt and Uncle.
The Tribunals are use to this sort of thing. The Deacon who was helping me said that they only get beck questionaires from about 4% of the ex spouses. Best advise here is to just provide them with any contact information you have available and let the chips fall…

*4. What is the proper steps for me to take at this point? I moved from the city I was married and lived in to another city. Does that complicate it more? *
As advised earlier, go and talk to her parish priest. Tell him what you’ve told us and he will most likely refer you to someone in the parish who is well versed in these matters and can properly guide you.

The most important thing in all of this is to pray hard, act speak and answer the questions truthfully and then to Trust in God. Then, be patient and willing to accept whatever decision as God’s will for you.

Peace
James

 

[JohnDamian]

Sorry for the slow reply; you might want to speak to a priest about particulars or specifics but these are the answers to your questions:

1. You can certainly get an annulment under canon 1101§2 (No intention for long-term relationship; no intention for Children) and under canon 1098; deception about the state of the individual (not heterosexual) before marraige.

Evidently your wife was not fully able or willing to have a long term relationship soley with you; nor was she honest when she married you as she only later admitted her sexual attractions.

1. It doesn’t complicate the matter at all. However you must still get an annulment as your marraige still poses an obstacle which must be removed before celebrating a Catholic marraige. Feel free to speak to your partners Priest; he will instruct you on your local (diocese) procedure.
2. This will not pose a particular problem at all; if you have divorce papers (civil) with testemonies then these should be fine.
3. The fact you have moved doesn’t matter particularily.

Now; the first and only specific step is contacting your partners Priest (you can do this alone OR with your partner); he will happily explain the process and give you any assistance you require on the matter.

Don’t worry; from what you have told me your first marraige was **invalid **as it had diriment impediment under both Canon’s (rules) 1101 and 1098.

 

[RG633]

Thank you to everyone that answered. I am extremely thankful.

My fiance is very very important to me and means the world to me. I truly believe in Christ and his teachings. I wouldn’t ask anyone to sacrifice their religion to be with me. It is not fair and I think even though I am not a Catholic we believe in Christ and he would be more then disappointed in me.

There is a challenge here I didn’t see before in regards to the baptized part. I never got the certificate and I have verified that the Church I did this didn’t keep a record or if they did it was lost. (Mine was done at a Military Church so things like this happen). I guess I will have to handle that challenge as well.

I will get in touch with her Priest and see get the ball starting. This has proven to be a learning process for me. One that I feel is important step to love and understanding my Fiance. I have not found a place to ever truly ask questions. I found lots of reading material (such as the US Bishops website).

One quick question though. Should I have future questions in regards to another topic should I start another thread or should I keep it all in one post?

Thank you again everyone. I am going to pray about this and do what I have done before and let the Lord lead me.

 

[JohnDamian]

My fiance is very very important to me and means the world to me. I truly believe in Christ and his teachings. I wouldn’t ask anyone to sacrifice their religion to be with me. It is not fair and I think even though I am not a Catholic we believe in Christ and he would be more then disappointed in me.

It is great that you are tolerant and understanding of your fiances faith; the only obstacle I can see is that as Catholics; we are *strongly *encouraged to bring our children up in the faith - whilst inter-faith marraiges themselves are not a problem; what faith to raise the children in is a major issue (particularily if you both hold strong beliefs) and I would gently encourage you to discuss this issue so you can either identify or eliminate any future problems before they occur.

There is a challenge here I didn’t see before in regards to the baptized part. I never got the certificate and I have verified that the Church I did this didn’t keep a record or if they did it was lost. (Mine was done at a Military Church so things like this happen). I guess I will have to handle that challenge as well.

Now; I believe Methodists are baptised in a trinitarian formulae (please, correct me if I am wrong) and as such their Baptisms are valid. If you are a practicing Methodist it is safe to take that you have been baptised and no certificate is likely to be needed (it is only usually needed for Catholics as they are quite organised about certificates) - by all means speak to the Priest about this; but don’t worry it won’t be a problem. Baptism leaves an indellible mark on the character of the individual; we don’t need a certificate to prove that!! - although it is handy for all that beurocracy…

I will get in touch with her Priest and see get the ball starting. This has proven to be a learning process for me. One that I feel is important step to love and understanding my Fiance. I have not found a place to ever truly ask questions. I found lots of reading material (such as the US Bishops website).

One thing I might reccomend; if you don’t have a Catechism of the Catholic Church; it is basically an encyclopedia or “rulebook” which explains all matters such as baptism, original sin etc. etc. in full detail with referances to Sacred Scripture and so forth - it is a great resource for those who want to understand more about the Church. (and, if your fiance hasn’t got one; it would make a great present).

One quick question though. Should I have future questions in regards to another topic should I start another thread or should I keep it all in one post?

If your questions are on a seperate topic (or some time has elapsed) it would be best to start a new thread; there is a list of the different forums to be found here:

forums.catholic-questions.org/index.php

If there is any specific question you have that you don’t feel can be answered by lay-Catholics or non-experts like myself, feel free to make use of the “ask an apologist” section; where the experts will be happy to help you. - Also; feel free to message myself if you have any questions.

Thank you again everyone. I am going to pray about this and do what I have done before and let the Lord lead me.

Let us together praise the Lord,
from whom we have rain from the heavens,
and abundance from the earth,
Blessed be God now and for ever.

 

[RG633]

It is great that you are tolerant and understanding of your fiances faith; the only obstacle I can see is that as Catholics; we are *strongly *encouraged to bring our children up in the faith - whilst inter-faith marraiges themselves are not a problem; what faith to raise the children in is a major issue (particularily if you both hold strong beliefs) and I would gently encourage you to discuss this issue so you can either identify or eliminate any future problems before they occur.

We have actually discussed this in detail. Part of the role that I believe in is that I myself need to be knowledgeable on both faiths. Being that I know I have failed at one relationship does weigh heavy on me to make this one work. Our agreement is that our children will be raised in the Catholic faith and if acceptable (something I really need myself to learn if it is okay) to be exposed to different religions as well. But in keeping with her faith and respecting her I have no problems with our children being brought up in the Catholic Church and learn the Catholic ways.

Now; I believe Methodists are baptised in a trinitarian formulae (please, correct me if I am wrong) and as such their Baptisms are valid. If you are a practicing Methodist it is safe to take that you have been baptised and no certificate is likely to be needed (it is only usually needed for Catholics as they are quite organised about certificates) - by all means speak to the Priest about this; but don’t worry it won’t be a problem. Baptism leaves an indellible mark on the character of the individual; we don’t need a certificate to prove that!! - although it is handy for all that beurocracy…

I believe this to be correct. I am not 100% sure the proper term. However, a quick Google search shows this to be correct. The original certificate (I was 13 when I was first baptized) was unsigned and then the name was wrong and then I think was never done. Shortly after that the Chaplin retired and left the Army.

One thing I might reccomend; if you don’t have a Catechism of the Catholic Church; it is basically an encyclopedia or “rulebook” which explains all matters such as baptism, original sin etc. etc. in full detail with referances to Sacred Scripture and so forth - it is a great resource for those who want to understand more about the Church. (and, if your fiance hasn’t got one; it would make a great present).

Again to show my newness to all of this. I have heard a lot of this mentioned like I said in my original post listening to the Catholic radio station on Sirius. Quite honestly I loved listening to the radio show and learning as much as I could about the Catholic faith and each show I listened too (being a college student and hanging out in my car in between classes) I got to hear a lot of the different shows. I was always amazed at how the Catholic Church is truly very ritual about things. This is something I am curious do I get from the Church or can I go to like Family Christian bookstore and get one there for both the Fiance and myself?

I truly have a challenge with the Catholic Service I got to with my Fiance. She is naively Hispanic and as such she speaks Spanish. So we go to the Spanish service for her and her sister. I am however, not fluent in Spanish (the Fiance is trying to hard to change this lol) so I don’t truly understand what is going on or the readings. Though the missalette is printed in both languages as they do both services so I read from the English side. I do everything but the communion part as I know that is not allowed.

If your questions are on a seperate topic (or some time has elapsed) it would be best to start a new thread; there is a list of the different forums to be found here:

forums.catholic-questions.org/index.php

If there is any specific question you have that you don’t feel can be answered by lay-Catholics or non-experts like myself, feel free to make use of the “ask an apologist” section; where the experts will be happy to help you. - Also; feel free to message myself if you have any questions.

Let us together praise the Lord,
from whom we have rain from the heavens,
and abundance from the earth,
Blessed be God now and for ever.

PRAISE BE TO GOD!

Thank you very much for your time. I think the lay-Catholics could tell me if it is a question best posted in the apologist section. I don’t want to waste their time. I do truly appreciate your time and knowledge. It is wonderful that such people are here to volunteer their time to answer questions. Thank you again.

 

[JohnDamian]

We have actually discussed this in detail. Part of the role that I believe in is that I myself need to be knowledgeable on both faiths. Being that I know I have failed at one relationship does weigh heavy on me to make this one work. Our agreement is that our children will be raised in the Catholic faith and if acceptable (something I really need myself to learn if it is okay) to be exposed to different religions as well. But in keeping with her faith and respecting her I have no problems with our children being brought up in the Catholic Church and learn the Catholic ways.

It is wonderful that you are open to allowing your Children to be raised in the Catholic faith; it is also excellent that you feel they should be exposed to other religions or religious traditions aswell - it is very important for people to understand the context of their religion not only with other religions; but also how it ties into the world as a whole.

I believe this to be correct. I am not 100% sure the proper term.

The term basically means that you were baptised “in the name of the Father; the Son and the Holy Spirit”. It is unfortunate that the Chaplain has since retired; although the Methodists have dioceses (I think they are reffered to as districts) which will have some central records; although if the name was listed incorrectly this might not be worth pursuing; but beurocracy is not a major issue.

Again to show my newness to all of this. I have heard a lot of this mentioned like I said in my original post listening to the Catholic radio station on Sirius. Quite honestly I loved listening to the radio show and learning as much as I could about the Catholic faith and each show I listened too (being a college student and hanging out in my car in between classes) I got to hear a lot of the different shows. I was always amazed at how the Catholic Church is truly very ritual about things. This is something I am curious do I get from the Church or can I go to like Family Christian bookstore and get one there for both the Fiance and myself?

I honestly do not know what the bookstore chains are over the pond; but any major book retailer will have a copy of the book; they are also available online. The current edition is called “Catechism of the Catholic Church - Second Edition”.

Here is an online version of the Catechism from the Vatican website;

vatican.va/archive/catechism/ccc_toc.htm

If your wife’s native (or preffered) language is Spanish then I am certain that a Spanish version of the Catechism is available (although if your first language is English perhaps you might get an english one for yourself; and a Spanish one for her?) - I am certain that the Priest who leads the mass will be able to provide the name of a retailer who could supply the Spanish version - or you could ask a local bookstore.

I truly have a challenge with the Catholic Service I got to with my Fiance. She is naively Hispanic and as such she speaks Spanish. So we go to the Spanish service for her and her sister. I am however, not fluent in Spanish (the Fiance is trying to hard to change this lol) so I don’t truly understand what is going on or the readings. Though the missalette is printed in both languages as they do both services so I read from the English side. I do everything but the communion part as I know that is not allowed.

You are certainly putting in the effort – I have trouble speaking to people with a different accent let alone a different language altogether! I am sure she appreciates your efforts; and learning a new Language is a definative sign of commitment; perhaps however she might accompany you to an English version of the mass; either on a fortnightly basis; or perhaps during the week - sometimes it can be hard enough for a new-comer to understand what is going on in English; let alone Spanish!

Thank you very much for your time. I think the lay-Catholics could tell me if it is a question best posted in the apologist section. I don’t want to waste their time. I do truly appreciate your time and knowledge. It is wonderful that such people are here to volunteer their time to answer questions. Thank you again.

No problem whatsoever. I am blessed with the opportunity to help people.

 

[Viki63]

She is not a very big into going to church and when she does I go with her. .

Dear brother,
your fiance is fortunate that you are a conscientious Christian. I married a hispanic Catholic, originally in a protestant church, then I converted to Catholicism and find it to be the best decision of my life.
You might consider attending RCIA together, this is the initiation for the Catholic church but some people just take the classes to learn about it, you’re not required to join. I suspect that your fiance would also benefit by the instruction. If she only goes to church sometimes, perhaps she’s not aware that skipping mass for no good reason is a serious sin. Good reasons would be inability to get there, or illness, or needing to care for a sick person or a small child.

We have had challenges due to the language and cultural differences. I think the most important thing is to be respectful of each other under all circumstances. I have learned to tell my husband when I’m angry without being rude or disrespectful, and vice versa. Some of the cultural differences I find hard to deal with, such as the hispanic separation of the sexes at parties, but I just deal with it now.
God bless.

 

[lizaanne]

Just a reminder to everyone giving advice on here - it is absolutely NOT advisable to tell anyone that a Declaration of Nullity is a sure thing. No one here knows all the facts of this situation, and no one knows what the Tribunal will find. To give someone possibly false hope is dangerous and ill advised.

IN THE MEAN TIME ---- that marriage IS considered valid, and he should be conducting himself as a married man, and not be dating, getting engaged, or setting wedding dates. Married men don’t do this.

The 6th Commandment is not exclusive to Catholics. It applies to everyone.

~Liza

 

[JRKH]

Just a reminder to everyone giving advice on here - it is absolutely NOT advisable to tell anyone that a Declaration of Nullity is a sure thing. No one here knows all the facts of this situation, and no one knows what the Tribunal will find. To give someone possibly false hope is dangerous and ill advised.

IN THE MEAN TIME ---- that marriage IS considered valid, and he should be conducting himself as a married man, and not be dating, getting engaged, or setting wedding dates. Married men don’t do this.

The 6th Commandment is not exclusive to Catholics. It applies to everyone.

~Liza

This is really very good advise, but not always practical in every situation. This is one example. This person has already dated, become engaged etc BEFORE recognizing the need for an annulment. I am another example. I had left the church for many years, then divorced and was civilly remarried for many years before returning to the Church and seeking an annulment.

As to giving assurance that an annulment will be granted, I agree - no one should do this, however it is fine to give encouragement, based upon the information given, so that the person feels comfortable proceding to the next step.

Peace
James

 

[joandarc2008]

As far as the baptismal record goes - I don’t know how to go about taking care of it but if your parents were there or if you had friends there (yes, I am military too so I am sure you still have some floating around on facebook) they could write a statement stating that they were there and it was done in the Trinitarian Formula. These things happen. That is why we have Canon Law that has ways to deal with almost every possible situation.

As far as the anullment goes - it is not advisable for anyone to tell anyone that they will or will not get one. I would strongly suggest studying the Holy Family as a model with your fiancee. It will help you get through this. It has helped me the last two weeks while I have found horrendous things. God bless you on your quest - start now - it will take you a year or so.

 

[snowbee]

Good job for not wanting her to give up her faith for you! Unless of course you simply meant simply having the marriage ceremony out of the church.

The bigger issue I think you should think about is… does she love you so much she would give up God and her faith for you, turning you in effect into her new “God”.
I’ve seen people do it, happens all the time.
The problem with this is that they lose their compass, that drive together to grow closer to God by each other, what winds up happening is they wind up finding out that their partner is all too human.
Since you are embarking on this path make sure it is Christ-Centered!
Consider going to mass with her for starts, then you won’t be “making her choose.”

 

[RG633]

I agree with the comments made about it being a “for sure thing” I don’t think anyone really went so far to say yes its a done deal but did say yes you do qualify in my opinion under these rules. I know that this is something the Tribunal will have to decide and thus make their decision based on the facts are around this. I am sure everyone here agrees that there is always 3 sides to a story. One side, the other side, and the truth. I just don’t know Canon Law well enough to even know if this is something they would “consider” which is where my questions were aimed at. If it is not something then I have a whole challenge ahead of me.

The Church I attend is the same one I got baptized in and the church is mostly retired people and so majority of the people know me where present my parents were not due to them living in a different city. Thanks for the advice I will get the letters written would this need to be something that i should get a notary to sign off as well? Or is that not needed?

I know she doesn’t want to turn her back on God and nor make me her “God” it is more of a I love you so much that I want to be with you and while you made the mistake of getting married to a person who treated you badly and did some bad things. She and I have been going to mass a few times then she left the city for school reasons and came back. Due to various reasons I have been not able to go with her/take her. But after talking last night we are going to start going on Saturday to the English Mass. Since she is bilingual it will be easy I think for her to pick up the English based Mass.

As for the comments about holding myself to be a married man. With all due respect my religion does see that I have been “divorced”. While I see that this may pose a problem for my fiance in the sense to her religious standards I have not yet met those requirements. This was something I did not think of when we started dating nor the implications but we refused to date until the civil divorce was completed.

Truly I am thankful for the continued advice. By no means am I trying to offend or disrespect anyone. I truly want to be respectful of her, and her religion. The only way I know to do that is to start reading and attempting to understand and get guidance from those that know more then I. It’s like i say I listen to my car mechanic about my car but I refuse to let him tell me how to fix a computer as I am trained in computer repair and he is not. Same applies here.

 

[joandarc2008]

I agree with the comments made about it being a “for sure thing” I don’t think anyone really went so far to say yes its a done deal but did say yes you do qualify in my opinion under these rules. I know that this is something the Tribunal will have to decide and thus make their decision based on the facts are around this. I am sure everyone here agrees that there is always 3 sides to a story. One side, the other side, and the truth. I just don’t know Canon Law well enough to even know if this is something they would “consider” which is where my questions were aimed at. If it is not something then I have a whole challenge ahead of me.

The Church I attend is the same one I got baptized in and the church is mostly retired people and so majority of the people know me where present my parents were not due to them living in a different city. Thanks for the advice I will get the letters written would this need to be something that i should get a notary to sign off as well? Or is that not needed?

I know she doesn’t want to turn her back on God and nor make me her “God” it is more of a I love you so much that I want to be with you and while you made the mistake of getting married to a person who treated you badly and did some bad things. She and I have been going to mass a few times then she left the city for school reasons and came back. Due to various reasons I have been not able to go with her/take her. But after talking last night we are going to start going on Saturday to the English Mass. Since she is bilingual it will be easy I think for her to pick up the English based Mass.

As for the comments about holding myself to be a married man. With all due respect my religion does see that I have been “divorced”. While I see that this may pose a problem for my fiance in the sense to her religious standards I have not yet met those requirements. This was something I did not think of when we started dating nor the implications but we refused to date until the civil divorce was completed.

Truly I am thankful for the continued advice. By no means am I trying to offend or disrespect anyone. I truly want to be respectful of her, and her religion. The only way I know to do that is to start reading and attempting to understand and get guidance from those that know more then I. It’s like i say I listen to my car mechanic about my car but I refuse to let him tell me how to fix a computer as I am trained in computer repair and he is not. Same applies here.

OP - you are so sweet for asking all of these questions and it really is a can of worms but the answer is that until that anullment comes through as far as the Catholic Church is concerned you are married in the eyes of God. It does not mean however that you are in a state of mortal sin (the sin is venial) if you two were not under the intent to contravene God’s law if you both did not understand the process and what it meant. I am telling you this to be charitable not to give you a big loophole because now you do.

This is very complicated and why for Catholics going through the process it is required that they not start dating until the anullment is granted.

 

[JRKH]

OP - you are so sweet for asking all of these questions and it really is a can of worms but the answer is that until that anullment comes through as far as the Catholic Church is concerned you are married in the eyes of God. It does not mean however that you are in a state of mortal sin (the sin is venial) if you two were not under the intent to contravene God’s law if you both did not understand the process and what it meant. I am telling you this to be charitable not to give you a big loophole because now you do.

This is very complicated and why for Catholics going through the process it is required that they not start dating until the anullment is granted.

Agree with this. We should not get hung up on the “dating” issue. It is pretty apparent that they got to this point innocently and now the OP, RG633, is seeking the best way to proceed.
Just take things one step at a time and be guided by the priests advice.

Peace
james

 

[lizaanne]

Agree with this. We should not get hung up on the “dating” issue. It is pretty apparent that they got to this point innocently and now the OP, RG633, is seeking the best way to proceed.
Just take things one step at a time and be guided by the priests advice.

Peace
james

And if his marriage is found to be valid? What then? He has been putting the soul of his girlfriend in grave danger, and his own as well. Better to cool things down until this is resolved - the outcome is not guaranteed to result in a Declaration of Nullity. If it does, well then he can proceed with this girl, if it does not then she will not be able to date or marry him.

~Liza

 

[JRKH]

And if his marriage is found to be valid? What then? He has been putting the soul of his girlfriend in grave danger, and his own as well.

WHOA - Slow down here. First of all he has not been putting his girlfriends soul in grave danger, It she is, it is by her decisions alone. No other person can put your soul in grave danger only you can do that.
If the previous marriage were found valid, then they could not be validly married in The Church (or anywhere else) - but that is not the question at rpesent.

Better to cool things down until this is resolved - the outcome is not guaranteed to result in a Declaration of Nullity. If it does, well then he can proceed with this girl, if it does not then she will not be able to date or marry him.

~Liza

Sounds to me like he has already “cooled things down” at least to the point where he is seeking to get his marrital status clarified before proceeding.
The thing to be sensative about here is the fact that these two people were acting innocently when they fell in love. Now that they are discovering certain issues that could be impediments, that are acting promptly and properly to resolve the issues. So I think it best we confine ourselves to this in our answers and not try to load him/them up with other issies. Let’s leave that to their priest to deal with.

Peace
James

 

[lizaanne]

WHOA - Slow down here. First of all he has not been putting his girlfriends soul in grave danger, It she is, it is by her decisions alone. No other person can put your soul in grave danger only you can do that.
If the previous marriage were found valid, then they could not be validly married in The Church (or anywhere else) - but that is not the question at rpesent.

Fair point - correction noted.

Sounds to me like he has already “cooled things down” at least to the point where he is seeking to get his marrital status clarified before proceeding.
The thing to be sensative about here is the fact that these two people were acting innocently when they fell in love. Now that they are discovering certain issues that could be impediments, that are acting promptly and properly to resolve the issues. So I think it best we confine ourselves to this in our answers and not try to load him/them up with other issies. Let’s leave that to their priest to deal with.

Peace
James

I agree with this - so then telling them to “not worry” about the dating thing is not helping them in any way. They need to seek the counsel of a good and holy priest to help them with this, and not someone who will turn a blind eye to the possibility of a valid marriage in the mix and advise them to just keep on as they have been.

~Liza