Question about cohabitation

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Monkey1976

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I realize I’m opening myself up for criticism by posting about this, but it’s been a quandary to me for some time now. My fiancee and I are both Catholic. She was raised in the Church. I was born Catholic, fell away when I was 13, and returned to make my confirmation through RCIA in 2005. When I stood before our pastor to accept the Gifts of the Holy Spirit, she stood with me as my sponsor. Both of us are in the choir at our parish. Without her, I may never have come home.

Now for the catch. We live together, and have since mid-2003. We are committed to marry in the Church as soon as we can (we are working on getting an annulment for her first marriage). I am the only wage-earner in the household, and she has gone back to school (at my prompting) to get her degree. We are both in our thirties. My paycheck is not enough to cover the expenses of us living apart. Both of us have been diagnosed with bipolar disorder, and we act as watchers for each other to ensure that neither of us slips into a manic or depressed state. Recently, we were apart for a single week, and both of us came dangerously close to the edge. Our house is not large enough to make separate beds a reasonable alternative, either. We both know in our hears that what we are doing is a VERY near occasion of sin, and we do occasionally falter. Oddly, though, not nearly as much as we did before living together.

My question - is it possible, in this state, for either of us to make a good confession? Was my confirmation valid? When we talk to our pastor about starting preparations for marriage, is he likely to refuse us?

HELP!

(PS - I’m currently at work, so please don’t be offended if I’m unable to respond in a timely fashion.)
 
Monkey1976 said:
**
Now for the catch. We live together, and have since mid-2003. We are committed to marry in the Church as soon as we can (we are working on getting an annulment for her first marriage). I am the only wage-earner in the household, and she has gone back to school (at my prompting) to get her degree. We are both in our thirties. My paycheck is not enough to cover the expenses of us living apart. Both of us have been diagnosed with bipolar disorder, and we act as watchers for each other to ensure that neither of us slips into a manic or depressed state. Recently, we were apart for a single week, and both of us came dangerously close to the edge. Our house is not large enough to make separate beds a reasonable alternative, either. We both know in our hears that what we are doing is a VERY near occasion of sin, and we do occasionally falter. Oddly, though, not nearly as much as we did before living together.**

My question - is it possible, in this state, for either of us to make a good confession? Was my confirmation valid? When we talk to our pastor about starting preparations for marriage, is he likely to refuse us?

HELP!

(PS - I’m currently at work, so please don’t be offended if I’m unable to respond in a timely fashion.)
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My first suggestion would be to take the paragraph above that is in bold to God. Offer that up to Him in prayer, preferably in Eucharistic Adoration, but if you have some quiet time that will do. I think that while reading that to Him you will find the answers to your questions.

A good confession is always possible if you are open to God’s love and mercy and if you repent of your sins, which means you are saying :I turn away from that sin, I am finished with it, I will never do it again." I do not see a reason why the confirmation is not valid. I cannot speak for your pastor as all of them are different, but yes there is a chance he could refuse you.

You must live as brother and sister now. Not to engage in premarital sex and not to sleep in the same bed (bedroom) as to avoid the near occasion of sin. You say that you cannot afford another bed…no worries just get practice doing what most men do when they get in trouble…sleep on the couch. 👍
 
The most worrisome possibility to me is the chance that our pastor might refuse to let us marry in the church. We are both committed to each other, and I’ve been taking comfort in Saint Paul’s advice on this point:
1Cor7:9:
But if they do not contain themselves, let them marry. For it is better to marry than to be burnt.
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How can we reconcile this with the possibility of the pastor refusing marriage to us?
 
Monkey1976 said:
The most worrisome possibility to me is the chance that our pastor might refuse to let us marry in the church. We are both committed to each other, and I’ve been taking comfort in Saint Paul’s advice on this point:

How can we reconcile this with the possibility of the pastor refusing marriage to us?
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Has the mentioned that he would refuse to marry a cohabiting couple?
 
Monkey1976 said:
The most worrisome possibility to me is the chance that our pastor might refuse to let us marry in the church. We are both committed to each other, and I’ve been taking comfort in Saint Paul’s advice on this point:

How can we reconcile this with the possibility of the pastor refusing marriage to us?
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It is all going to depend upon him. Some priests will refuse to marry a couple that is living together, however there are just as many that will marry couples that are living together. You need to be up front and honest with him. Again, you need to live as brother and sister until you are married. Easy? Maybe not. Worth it? Definitely.

Do you have any sort of a relationship with your pastor? What is his stance on situations like this? Has he given homilies about it? You cannot simply “tell” him that you are going to live as bro an sis, you have to actually do it. Then again, he will not be the one watching you, God will!

Again, you know what is right, you just need to put it into action.
 
mercygate said:
Has the mentioned that he would refuse to marry a cohabiting couple?
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No, but I’m afraid to bring in up in case he would. He knows who I am, he knows who I am engaged to, and so I’m afraid that if I ask him, “In theory, if a cohabiting couple who were fully committed to each other, and cannot live seperately for economic reasons, were to ask for marriage in the Church, what would you think?” he’ll know EXACTLY who I’m talking about. We want to be married in the Church, and I don’t know what we would do if we are refused.
 
Monkey1976 said:
No, but I’m afraid to bring in up in case he would. He knows who I am, he knows who I am engaged to, and so I’m afraid that if I ask him, “In theory, if a cohabiting couple who were fully committed to each other, and cannot live seperately for economic reasons, were to ask for marriage in the Church, what would you think?” he’ll know EXACTLY who I’m talking about. We want to be married in the Church, and I don’t know what we would do if we are refused.
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You think you’re the first couple with this problem? You think he doesn’t know you BOTH have the same phone number.

Be up front with him about your attempt to live in continence; maybe he has some pastoral options. When do you plan to marry? Why not this weekend?
 
mercygate said:
You think you’re the first couple with this problem? You think he doesn’t know you BOTH have the same phone number.

Be up front with him about your attempt to live in continence; maybe he has some pastoral options. When do you plan to marry? Why not this weekend?
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At the moment, he’s also helping her with an annulment from what we call her “practice wedding” (as far as I can tell, it’s open-and-shut for nullification, and we’re hoping that the tribunal agrees). Once that is complete, we plan to start our preparations ASAP.
 
Monkey1976 said:
At the moment, he’s also helping her with an annulment from what we call her “practice wedding” (as far as I can tell, it’s open-and-shut for nullification, and we’re hoping that the tribunal agrees). Once that is complete, we plan to start our preparations ASAP.
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BE HONEST with him. Explain your attempt at continence. Honest: can’t somebody sleep on the sofa? I’m old, and with a comforter underneath me, I can sleep perfectly well on the floor.

If I were a hard-*****, I would say that one of you has to move out. But if that is not feasible, then you have to do your best. Why CAN’T one of you move out? The bipolar thing?
 
mercygate said:
BE HONEST with him. Explain your attempt at continence. Honest: can’t somebody sleep on the sofa? I’m old, and with a comforter underneath me, I can sleep perfectly well on the floor.

If I were a hard-*****, I would say that one of you has to move out. But if that is not feasible, then you have to do your best. Why CAN’T one of you move out? The bipolar thing?
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The combination of the bipolar disorder (a week apart nearly sent us both to the asylum - no exaggeration), plus the fact that we simply cannot afford to keep two households. I’m the sole wage-earner until she finishes her degree. I’d like to call our pastor right now and find out what he recommends, but she’s extremely afraid of the potential consequences of me doing so, and I don’t want to go behind her back.
 
Monkey1976 said:
The combination of the bipolar disorder (a week apart nearly sent us both to the asylum - no exaggeration), plus the fact that we simply cannot afford to keep two households. I’m the sole wage-earner until she finishes her degree. I’d like to call our pastor right now and find out what he recommends, but she’s extremely afraid of the potential consequences of me doing so, and I don’t want to go behind her back.
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Deceit is not a good foundation for marriage.

It seems you two have some serious work to do before you marry. The thought that a week apart “nearly sent you both to the asylum” kind of sends up a BIG red flag. Nobody is perfect entering into a marriage, but in my understanding (limited to be sure), well managed bipolar syndrome puts people on a pretty good footing – not where you would be ready for hospitalization because of a routine separation . . . ???

What’s up here?
 
We were both having a very stressful week in addition to being apart. Normally, we can let each other know when the other’s “pendulum” is swinging too far one way or another. Without that, we both started spiraling and not having someone there who can tell when something’s starting to go wrong let it go far past where we would have normally calmed each other down. It’s a very frightening experience to know you’re losing your mind, and the only person who knows exactly what you’re going through is over 300 miles away. It was a kind of “perfect storm” situation that badly frightened us both. If it hadn’t been for the additional stress that week from other issues, we would probably have had no problems other than missing each other.
 
Monkey1976 said:
We were both having a very stressful week in addition to being apart. Normally, we can let each other know when the other’s “pendulum” is swinging too far one way or another. Without that, we both started spiraling and not having someone there who can tell when something’s starting to go wrong let it go far past where we would have normally calmed each other down. It’s a very frightening experience to know you’re losing your mind, and the only person who knows exactly what you’re going through is over 300 miles away. It was a kind of “perfect storm” situation that badly frightened us both. If it hadn’t been for the additional stress that week from other issues, we would probably have had no problems other than missing each other.
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I have close family who are bi-polar. I want to stress how important it is that you are both on approriate medications and that you have medical care–a Dr that you see regularly. You also should expand your circle of support. You shouldn’t try to live in a little world of just the 2 of you.

As the others have said, I also think you should speak to your Pastor. Make an appt and lay the whole issue in front of him. You should also consider what steps you would take if her annulment doesn’t come through (!) or if it is delayed in any way.

I will be praying for you both.
 
Can either of you move back in with your parents?

Even if you are living as brother and sister, keep in mind that cohabitating is a bad example for your friends and family members. I realize you weren’t conscious of this when you first moved in together.

I helped teach RCIA for a few years, and we had many cohabitating couples preparing for marriage. Our priest gave the advice 1) to move into separate residences if at all possible and 2) if it wasn’t possible to move apart, to live as brother and sister until the wedding.

I think most priests understand that we live in a society that sees no problems with non-married couples cohabitating, and that many Catholics (who don’t know better) are just “going with the flow.” Actually cohabitating is a big problem, and it sounds like you are becoming aware of this. I doubt that your priest will deny you the sacrament of marriage because you are cohabitating with your fiancee. Still, talk to your priest about your situation.

One priest I know allowed cohabitating couples to marry in the Church, but he refused to have a Mass at their weddings. I suppose ultimately, it’s up to the individual priest.
 
Living together without having a sexual relationship is possible. If you are strong, because it can be difficult.
Kathy
 
Originally Posted by **Monkey1976 **
Both of us have been diagnosed with bipolar disorder, and we act as watchers for each other to ensure that neither of us slips into a manic or depressed state. Recently, we were apart for a single week, and both of us came dangerously close to the edge.
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Monkey1976 said:
The combination of the bipolar disorder (a week apart nearly sent us both to the asylum - no exaggeration), plus the fact that we …
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Besides the impropriety of living together before marriage and the near occassion for sin that your cohabitation presents, the fact that maintaining your mental stability is a mutually contingent factor should be a flag enough that you folks first need to seperate and slow down before seriously considering marriage. Entering the lifelong commitment of sacramental marriage requires the consent of two independently stable and mature individuals, of which appears to be lacking on both parts. Get chaste, get stable, develop a healthy interdependence then consider what God is calling you to as a couple.
 
We have been considering marriage since 2003. Under normal circumstances, we are both independently stable. When a large amount of stress is added on top of that, and the other is 300 miles away for an extended period of time, we started to crack. Each of us knowing what was happening to the other, and not being able to be there to help, is what caused the spiral. It was our strength in each other when we talked on the phone that kept us from cracking.

I had intended to illustrate the fact that we give each other strength and stability as any committed couple does when I wrote about our week apart. Apparently, I failed to do so.

For those who think that this experience shows are are not ready for marriage - I would ask you to consider how you would have responded if we were already married and I described that week in the exact same way.

As far as one of us moving back in with our parents, mine are halfway across the country. Hers are across the street from us. However, she is covered under my insurance as a “domestic partner” through the company I work for. If one of us moves out, the coverage for her ceases unless we lie about her address.

I realize that having one of us move out would normally be the best solution to the situation, but financially, it’s simply not possible.

I appreciate the concern for us shown by the replies in this thread, and I thank all of you for your prayers on our behalf.
 
Monkey1976 said:
We have been considering marriage since 2003. Under normal circumstances, we are both independently stable. When a large amount of stress is added on top of that, and the other is 300 miles away for an extended period of time, we started to crack. Each of us knowing what was happening to the other, and not being able to be there to help, is what caused the spiral. It was our strength in each other when we talked on the phone that kept us from cracking.

I had intended to illustrate the fact that we give each other strength and stability as any committed couple does when I wrote about our week apart. Apparently, I failed to do so.

For those who think that this experience shows are are not ready for marriage - I would ask you to consider how you would have responded if we were already married and I described that week in the exact same way.

As far as one of us moving back in with our parents, mine are halfway across the country. Hers are across the street from us. However, she is covered under my insurance as a “domestic partner” through the company I work for. If one of us moves out, the coverage for her ceases unless we lie about her address.

I realize that having one of us move out would normally be the best solution to the situation, but financially, it’s simply not possible.

I appreciate the concern for us shown by the replies in this thread, and I thank all of you for your prayers on our behalf.
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Duh. Don’t answer this: if you are financially independent and have been together for 4 years, why in the world are you not married? As I said: don’t answer. It’s none of our business. But I sure hope it is NOT because you are saving for the reception.
 
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