Question about dying in mortal sin?

[Chuck1]

Hi I was wondering , if one has the last rites and made a confession etc and been anointed free of sin and in the state of grace , so say this is done a few hours before you die and commit mortal sin in that time after the last rites so you are now out of the state of grace ? Do you go to purgatory ? But you won’t go to hell becuase you didn’t reject god whilst on earth so do you go to purgatory or hevean ?

Thanks chuck

 

[1ke]

Hi I was wondering , if one has the last rites and made a confession etc and been anointed free of sin and in the state of grace , so say this is done a few hours before you die and commit mortal sin in that time after the last rites so you are now out of the state of grace ? Do you go to purgatory ? But you won’t go to hell becuase you didn’t reject god whilst on earth so do you go to purgatory or hevean ?

Thanks chuck

What do you believe a mortal sin to be? Sounds lilke maybe you have it confused with venial sin.

A mortal sin is a grave sin, and when you commit a mortal sin you cut yourself off from God completely. If you die in a state of mortal sin you go to Hell, not purgatory or heaven.

 

[R_C]

Hi I was wondering , if one has the last rites and made a confession etc and been anointed free of sin and in the state of grace , so say this is done a few hours before you die and commit mortal sin in that time after the last rites so you are now out of the state of grace ? Do you go to purgatory ? But you won’t go to hell becuase you didn’t reject god whilst on earth so do you go to purgatory or hevean ?

Thanks chuck

I won’t quote any official document, just my opinion.

Trust in the mercy of Jesus. If someone commit a mortal sin after the Last Rites (which I think it’s not likely to occur, given that you receive a unique strength for that special moment) but he repents and dies loving God…can you imagine him in hell? He’d be the only one over there loving God.

 

[Zenkai]

Here’s a what-if scenario: Someone commits a mortal sin and then confesses his sin to God. He then plans to go to Confession the following Sunday, but he gets murdered before he could make it to Confession.

What would happen to him?

 

[Nigel7]

Here’s a what-if scenario: Someone commits a mortal sin and then confesses his sin to God. He then plans to go to Confession the following Sunday, but he gets murdered before he could make it to Confession.

What would happen to him?

He should be truly sorry for his sin and say an act of perfect contrition right away with the intent of going to confession as soon as possible (in other words NOT next week or whenever they happen to get around to it).

My priest says, for example, that if you are on your way to confession and are killed along the way in a traffic accident that your “intent” counts in your favor. Intent is a big deal regarding this stuff in matters of life and death, so I’ve been told by at least two priests.

 

[thistle]

He should be truly sorry for his sin and say an act of perfect contrition right away with the intent of going to confession as soon as possible (in other words NOT next week or whenever they happen to get around to it).

My priest says, for example, that if you are on your way to confession and are killed along the way in a traffic accident that your “intent” counts in your favor. Intent is a big deal regarding this stuff in matters of life and death, so I’ve been told by at least two priests.

However that is only opinion and not a teaching.

If you are in a state of mortal sin and make an act of perfect contrition and die on the way to Confession you would be saved.
If you are in a state of mortal sin and make an act of imperfect contrition and die on the way to Confession you are not saved.
Being on the way to Confession does not change an act of imperfect contrition into an act of perfect contrition. The Church teaching is clear that an act of imperfect contrition does NOT forgive mortal sins.

 

[Zenkai]

However that is only opinion and not a teaching.

If you are in a state of mortal sin and make an act of perfect contrition and die on the way to Confession you would be saved.
If you are in a state of mortal sin and make an act of imperfect contrition and die on the way to Confession you are not saved.
Being on the way to Confession does not change an act of imperfect contrition into an act of perfect contrition. The Church teaching is clear that an act of imperfect contrition does NOT forgive mortal sins.

How can one know the difference?

 

[thistle]

How can one know the difference?

An act of perfect contrition is motivated primarily by sorrow for having offended God.
An act of imperfect contrition is motivated primarily by fear of going to Hell.

 

[Jerry-Jet]

Dying unrepentant in a state of mortal sin = Hell!

“Pray for us now and in the hour of our death”.

 

[Nita]

However that is only opinion and not a teaching.

…

If you are in a state of mortal sin and make an act of imperfect contrition and die on the way to Confession you are not saved.
Being on the way to Confession does not change an act of imperfect contrition into an act of perfect contrition. The Church teaching is clear that an act of imperfect contrition does NOT forgive mortal sins.

The teaching of the Church on imperfect contrition (attrition) does not address possible extreme, out of the ordinary situations. (At least I was unable to find an official decree concerning someone dying when they were so resolved to go to Confession that they were actually on their way there. If you know of one, could you provide a link or give the document title?)

Unless there is an official Church teaching that specifies imperfect contrition is insufficient even under those circumstances, I would trust the priest’s “opinion” or judgement. It seems to be more in line with the Church teaching regarding Baptism of desire granted to catechumens who die before actually being baptized - that is, God looking at the desire that is in one’s heart when one is physically prevented from actually receiving the sacrament.

It’s important to keep in mind that imperfect contrition is sufficient to have mortal sin forgiven in Confession. The question revolves around whether God can grant that grace of forgiveness outside of the ordinary means of Confession - especially under extraordinary conditions.

 

[thistle]

The teaching of the Church on imperfect contrition (attrition) does not address possible extreme, out of the ordinary situations. (At least I was unable to find an official decree concerning someone dying when they were so resolved to go to Confession that they were actually on their way there. If you know of one, could you provide a link or give the document title?)

Unless there is an official Church teaching that specifies imperfect contrition is insufficient even under those circumstances, I would trust the priest’s “opinion” or judgement. It seems to be more in line with the Church teaching regarding Baptism of desire granted to catechumens who die before actually being baptized - that is, God looking at the desire that is in one’s heart when one is physically prevented from actually receiving the sacrament.

It’s important to keep in mind that imperfect contrition is sufficient to have mortal sin forgiven in Confession. The question revolves around whether God can grant that grace of forgiveness outside of the ordinary means of Confession - especially under extraordinary conditions.

The Church teaching is clear that imperfect contrition does NOT forgive mortal sins. It does not say mortal sins are not forgiven unless you die on the way to Confession. There are no exceptions. With imperfect contrition mortal sins can only be forgiven in Confession with a priest.
Only an act of perfect contrition would save you if you die on the way to Confession.

Under your thought process making an act of perfect contrition and an act of imperfect contrition would have the same result if a person dies before getting to Confession. That makes no sense which is why the Church teaches there is a different outcome.

 

[Nita]

The Church teaching is clear that imperfect contrition does NOT forgive mortal sins. It does not say mortal sins are not forgiven unless you die on the way to Confession. There are no exceptions. With imperfect contrition mortal sins can only be forgiven in Confession with a priest.
Only an act of perfect contrition would save you if you die on the way to Confession.

Under your thought process making an act of perfect contrition and an act of imperfect contrition would have the same result if a person dies before getting to Confession. That makes no sense which is why the Church teaches there is a different outcome.

Perfect contrition effects forgiveness of mortal sin as soon as that contrition is made by the sinner. The sin is forgiven and sanctifying grace is restored to his soul before he goes to Confession. This would not be the case with imperfect contrition.1452 When it arises from a love by which God is loved above all else, contrition is called “perfect” (contrition of charity). Such contrition remits venial sins; it also obtains forgiveness of mortal sins if it includes the firm resolution to have recourse to sacramental confession as soon as possible.

**1453 The contrition called “imperfect” (or “attrition”) is also a gift of God, a prompting of the Holy Spirit. It is born of the consideration of sin’s ugliness or the fear of eternal damnation and the other penalties threatening the sinner (contrition of fear). Such a stirring of conscience can initiate an interior process which, under the prompting of grace, will be brought to completion by sacramental absolution. By itself **however, imperfect contrition cannot obtain the forgiveness of grave sins, but it disposes one to obtain forgiveness in the sacrament of Penance
vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P4D.HTMThe words “By itself” are critical. In other words, just making an act of imperfect contrition will not automatically restore one to the state of sanctifying grace (as an act of perfect contrition does). Forgiveness can be obtained in Confession — but note the teaching does not say that is the ONLY possible way that God can/will be merciful and grant forgiveness. You are reading “only” into the teaching. (The person in the example had received that grace of wanting to obtain forgiveness in the sacrament of Penance. Who are we to declare how God will judge him – especially since he accepted that grace and was acting upon it?)

1861 Mortal sin is a radical possibility of human freedom, as is love itself. It results in the loss of charity and the privation of sanctifying grace, that is, of the state of grace. If it is not redeemed by repentance and God’s forgiveness, it causes exclusion from Christ’s kingdom and the eternal death of hell, for our freedom has the power to make choices for ever, with no turning back. However, although we can judge that an act is in itself a grave offense, we must entrust judgment of persons to the justice and mercy of God.
vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P6C.HTM

 

[Zenkai]

Here’s a nice prayer I found for an act of perfect contrition:
“O dear God, I am heartily sorry for having offended Thee, and I detest all my sins, known and unknown, because I dread the loss of Heaven and dread the pains of Hell, and also because Thou art my Creator, my Savior, and my Sanctifier, but most of all because my sins have offended Thee, my God, Who art all good in Thyself and deserving of all my love. I firmly resolve, with the help of Thy grace to confess my sins, to do penance and to amend my life. Amen.”

 

[pablope]

Here’s a nice prayer I found for an act of perfect contrition:

 “O dear God, I am heartily sorry for having offended Thee, and I detest all my sins, known and unknown, because I dread the loss of Heaven and dread the pains of Hell, and also because Thou art my Creator, my Savior, and my Sanctifier, but most of all because my sins have offended Thee, my God, Who art all good in Thyself and deserving of all my love.  I firmly resolve, with the help of Thy grace to confess my sins, to do penance and to amend my life. Amen.”

Hi, Zen…you should memorize this prayer now …for when you do decide to join the CC, and go to your first confession…the priest will ask you to recite this……before leaving the confessional. It is part of the ritual of Confession.

 

[thistle]

Perfect contrition effects forgiveness of mortal sin as soon as that contrition is made by the sinner. The sin is forgiven and sanctifying grace is restored to his soul before he goes to Confession. This would not be the case with imperfect contrition.1452 When it arises from a love by which God is loved above all else, contrition is called “perfect” (contrition of charity). Such contrition remits venial sins; it also obtains forgiveness of mortal sins if it includes the firm resolution to have recourse to sacramental confession as soon as possible.

**1453 The contrition called “imperfect” (or “attrition”) is also a gift of God, a prompting of the Holy Spirit. It is born of the consideration of sin’s ugliness or the fear of eternal damnation and the other penalties threatening the sinner (contrition of fear). Such a stirring of conscience can initiate an interior process which, under the prompting of grace, will be brought to completion by sacramental absolution. By itself **however, imperfect contrition cannot obtain the forgiveness of grave sins, but it disposes one to obtain forgiveness in the sacrament of Penance
vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P4D.HTMThe words “By itself” are critical. In other words, just making an act of imperfect contrition will not automatically restore one to the state of sanctifying grace (as an act of perfect contrition does). Forgiveness can be obtained in Confession — but note the teaching does not say that is the ONLY possible way that God can/will be merciful and grant forgiveness. You are reading “only” into the teaching. (The person in the example had received that grace of wanting to obtain forgiveness in the sacrament of Penance. Who are we to declare how God will judge him – especially since he accepted that grace and was acting upon it?)

1861 Mortal sin is a radical possibility of human freedom, as is love itself. It results in the loss of charity and the privation of sanctifying grace, that is, of the state of grace. If it is not redeemed by repentance and God’s forgiveness, it causes exclusion from Christ’s kingdom and the eternal death of hell, for our freedom has the power to make choices for ever, with no turning back. However, although we can judge that an act is in itself a grave offense, we must entrust judgment of persons to the justice and mercy of God.
vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P6C.HTM

You are trying to find a loophole or get out of jail free card.

The action of being on the way to Confession does not turn imperfect contrition into perfect contrition. Imperfect contrition does not forgive mortal sins outside Confession.

 

[Gamera]

Bishop Fulton Sheen told a story on his radio show about a woman who was preparing to be baptized into the Catholic Church who asked him, ‘What if I should die before I’m scheduled to be baptized?’ Sheen told her not to worry because she was doing exactly what she was supposed to be doing, namely, taking the required course in preparation of being baptized as soon as permitted. Sure enough, the woman did die. Sheen was confident that she was saved. God binds us to the sacraments, but He Himself is not limited by them – He can choose to save whoever He wishes even without them.

 

[Deo_Gratias42]

What do you believe a mortal sin to be? Sounds lilke maybe you have it confused with venial sin.

A mortal sin is a grave sin, and when you commit a mortal sin you cut yourself off from God completely. If you die in a state of mortal sin you go to Hell, not purgatory or heaven.

This is true, and it is very possible for someone to commit a mortal sin after they’ve already received Last Rites. If one reads about Last Rites in the traditional form, one will find instructions to remove anything and anyone that could cause spiritual harm to the person, and that everyone in the room should be praying. Further, it instructs either the priest or another family member to continue whispering things into the person’s ear (hearing is the last sense to go) such as encouraging them to “say” an Act of Contrition, or to “say” certain ejaculatory prayers, etc so that the person is in his best possible spiritual mindset as he passes from this life to the next.

 

[Deo_Gratias42]

How can one know the difference?

You can’t that’s why we have Confession.

 

[steve_b]

Hi I was wondering , if one has the last rites and made a confession etc and been anointed free of sin and in the state of grace , so say this is done a few hours before you die and commit mortal sin in that time after the last rites so you are now out of the state of grace ? Do you go to purgatory ? But you won’t go to hell becuase you didn’t reject god whilst on earth so do you go to purgatory or hevean ?

Thanks chuck

Just thinking out loud, it seems completely unrealistic that one would receive the last rites then go out and commit mortal siin. But if it happened, then one needs to immediately go to sacramental confession again.

**1035 **The teaching of the Church affirms the existence of hell and its eternity. Immediately after death the souls of those who die in a state of mortal sin descend into hell, where they suffer the punishments of hell, “eternal fire.” The chief punishment of hell is eternal separation from God, in whom alone man can possess the life and happiness for which he was created and for which he longs.

Any sin that keeps us out of heaven, if we die in them, is by definition mortal sin.

Such as

• Ephesians 5: 3-5 fornication, covetousness……5 Be sure of this, that no fornicator or impure man, or one who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
• Galatians 5: 19 - 21 sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21and envy; drunkenness, orgies, will not inherit heaven
• 1 Corinthians 6: 9 - 10 no sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor male prostitutes, nor homosexual offenders, 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor slanderers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.

 

[Nita]

The action of being on the way to Confession does not turn imperfect contrition into perfect contrition. …

I never claimed it did.

We are allowed to judge whether actions are or are not considered serious/grave offenses according to Church teaching. But when you say a person** is **going to hell, you are judging him – the person – the state/guilt of his immortal soul. You have gone beyond judging the gravity of his actions and judged the guilt of his soul, judged where he will spend eternity. I don’t know whether he’ll go to heaven or hell; and neither do you. That judgement belongs to God alone.
(The Church doesn’t even judge whether Judas Iscariot is in hell. CCC #597)

In the example of the person killed on the way to Confession, his repentence doesn’t include perfect contrition, but it is repentence nonetheless.
Luke17:3-4 Take heed to yourselves; if your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him; and if he sins against you seven times in the day, and turns to you seven times, and says, I repent,’ you must forgive him.Do you think God expects us to be more forgiving than He is?