Question about Islamic law/rules

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Darrel

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I see a major difference in the way American Islamic people function compared to the way Islamic people in the Middle East function. Do American Islamic people feel that women should be covered from head to toe in public? If not why? I would also ask what Islamic people in the US feel that God thinks about women not being covered from head to toe here? It almost seems like two totally different religions. What practices take place when an Islamic woman commits adultery in the United States? Is it right in the eyes of God?

-D
 
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Darrel:
I see a major difference in the way American Islamic people function compared to the way Islamic people in the Middle East function. Do American Islamic people feel that women should be covered from head to toe in public? If not why? I would also ask what Islamic people in the US feel that God thinks about women not being covered from head to toe here? It almost seems like two totally different religions. What practices take place when an Islamic women commits adultery in the United States? Is it right in the eyes of God?

-D
The area I live in has a large Muslim population and some of the woman cover from head to toe, others just cover their head and others do neither.
 
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Karin:
The area I live in has a large Muslim population and some of the woman cover from head to toe, others just cover their head and others do neither.
I see the same thing here. It almost seems as divided as the prots with a million flavors. I have to wonder if true Islam does better better in democracy. BTW this thread is not to bash Islam. I just want some straight forward answers because it’s kind of confusing when you have everything from public stonings to peace and love.

-D
 
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Darrel:
BTW this thread is not to bash Islam. I just want some straight forward answers because it’s kind of confusing when you have everything from public stonings to peace and love.
Never thought you were bashing or looking to…but as in previous posts regarding Islam I am sure that it will 😦
 
I see a major difference in the way American Islamic people function compared to the way Islamic people in the Middle East function
out of curiosity, which Middle east country have you visited?
Do American Islamic people feel that women should be covered from head to toe in public? If not why? I would also ask what Islamic people in the US feel that God thinks about women not being covered from head to toe here?
Islam is Islam. Women have to dress modestly, which includes covering the entire body plus the hair. Whether the woman lives in spain or ameria or saudia arabia…its irrelevant.

We are here on this earth to worship our Creator. Everything that we do on this earth, from work to play, has to serve that one purpose. Allah created us and knows us better than our own selves. He has also, from His mercy, given us rules/regulations on how to live our lives…this includes what we eat to how we dress, etc.

Some Muslim women do not cover, both in middle east countries and in America. I was one of them until 2 years ago when I decided that priority number 1 is pleasing my Creator…and pleasing people shouldnt come on that list. I personally try not to judge anyone…just because a woman does not cover doesnt mean she is a bad woman or whatever.
It almost seems like two totally different religions
Islamic rules/regulations are taken from two sources: Quran and Hadith. Much else that you see in “muslim” countries is nothing more than culture and is not backed up by either of the two sources

I, myself, had to fight some stupid comments when i went to Egypt covered for the first time. I recieved comments like “you are soooo youngg, wait until *after * you get married” and stupid things like that which basically stem from people who have been sucked into this world and have lost sight of their purpose in life.
What practices take place when an Islamic woman commits adultery in the United States? Is it right in the eyes of God?
Adultery is a sin and the punishment is the same for the man and the woman. A court of law has to prove the woman or man guilty (which is really hard to do since you have to have 4 EYE witnesses of the actual act). Since the USA is not based on Islamic law and individual muslims are not allowed to take the law into their own hands, then they pretty much go “unpunished”…at least in this world.
 
out of curiosity, which Middle east country have you visited?
It realy has never been on my list of vacation spots. I base my questions from what I have read and seen on television. Not that I need to visit a country to ask a question about Islam.
Some Muslim women do not cover, both in middle east countries and in America. I was one of them until 2 years ago when I decided that priority number 1 is pleasing my Creator…and pleasing people shouldnt come on that list. I personally try not to judge anyone…just because a woman does not cover doesnt mean she is a bad woman or whatever.
Seems from what you are saying it is optional everplace for the most part. That clears it up, thank you.
Adultery is a sin and the punishment is the same for the man and the woman. A court of law has to prove the woman or man guilty (which is really hard to do since you have to have 4 EYE witnesses of the actual act). Since the USA is not based on Islamic law and individual muslims are not allowed to take the law into their own hands, then they pretty much go “unpunished”…at least in this world.
If a man or a women in the United States or another country is caught cheating by four people do you personaly feel they should die? If so by what method?

-D
 
It realy has never been on my list of vacation spots. I base my questions from what I have read and seen on television. Not that I need to visit a country to ask a question about Islam.
ahh the media. If someone in another country only watched the news to make a decision about America…then they would think it is a place where you cant go outside without being murdered/raped/robbed, etc. Normally because only the bad news is reported…same thing for the middle east countries.
Seems from what you are saying it is optional everplace for the most part. That clears it up, thank you.
Hijab (the word that is used to refer to the modest dress of a muslim woman, which includes covering her entire body plus hair) is NOT optional. It is fard, which is an arabic word that is used to define things that are obligatory.

When i did not wear Hijab, i knew that i was not following God’s orders and that I was not fullfiling an Islamic obligation.
If a man or a women in the United States or another country is caught cheating by four people do you personaly feel they should die? If so by what method?
Personally, i feel they deserve to have all their punishment in the afterlife…b/c it’ll be a much harsher punishment than any on earth. There is no excuse for adultery…and when it happens again and again, society becomes very similiar to the one we are living in now…where it is acceptable to go around sleeping with people, where a man’s virginity before marriage is seen as something that he should be embarrassed about,etc.

If a man and a woman is caught cheating by 4 eye witnesses that means that they really have no regard for God’s laws and are a disease to the entire society (having sex where 4 people can actually see them)…what punishment? The punishment that God ordained, which is death by stoning
 
ahh the media. If someone in another country only watched the news to make a decision about America…then they would think it is a place where you cant go outside without being murdered/raped/robbed, etc. Normally because only the bad news is reported…same thing for the Middle East countries.
I agree that media is mostly junk. I would rather ask you since you are in this for real. Most of what I see on the news is filtered out and I just want to know whats happening in the world.
Hijab (the word that is used to refer to the modest dress of a muslim woman, which includes covering her entire body plus hair) is NOT optional. It is fard, which is an arabic word that is used to define things that are obligatory.

When i did not wear Hijab, i knew that i was not following God’s orders and that I was not fullfiling an Islamic obligation.

Is this considered a huge sin in Islam?
Personally, i feel they deserve to have all their punishment in the afterlife…b/c it’ll be a much harsher punishment than any on earth. There is no excuse for adultery…and when it happens again and again, society becomes very similiar to the one we are living in now…where it is acceptable to go around sleeping with people, where a man’s virginity before marriage is seen as something that he should be embarrassed about,etc.
Yes but adultery keeps on happening even in places like Iran. It would seem that the threat of death is not enough to stop sin. If you feel that these sinning people deserve an eternity of punishment for there sins I must admit that this sounds devoid of mercy for the sinner. Honestly it sounds like hate. Please correct me if I’m wrong. Do you hate the sin or the sinner?
If a man and a woman is caught cheating by 4 eye witnesses that means that they really have no regard for God’s laws and are a disease to the entire society (having sex where 4 people can actually see them)…what punishment? The punishment that God ordained, which is death by

People are a disease to society when they sin? Let me ask you this. The prophet Jesus in Islam forgave a woman who committed adultery. He said let he among who is without sin cast the first stone. Do you feel that his teachings made him a false prophet? Please also explain how mercy and forgiveness factor into Islam. Once a person is dead they can not change. Why not let them live in a prison for life when they commit adultery so that there is as least a chance for them to repent? Does God expect mercy in Islam?
 
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Darrel:
Is this considered a huge sin in Islam?
Yep.
Yes but adultery keeps on happening even in places like Iran. It would seem that the threat of death is not enough to stop sin. If you feel that these sinning people deserve an eternity of punishment for there sins I must admit that this sounds devoid of mercy for the sinner. Honestly it sounds like hate. Please correct me if I’m wrong. Do you hate the sin or the sinner?
Ok, two things:
  1. No deterrence is 100% effective. That does not mean we should have zero deterrence.
  2. Hell is not permanent in Islam for anyone who had even the faintest speck of belief in God in their heart at some point in their life.
The prophet Jesus in Islam forgave a woman who committed adultery. He said let he among who is without sin cast the first stone. Do you feel that his teachings made him a false prophet? Please also explain how mercy and forgiveness factor into Islam. Once a person is dead they can not change. Why not let them live in a prison for life when they commit adultery so that there is as least a chance for them to repent? Does God expect mercy in Islam?
Where did Jesus (PBUH) forgive the woman who committed adultery? In the forgery that is John 7:53-8:11?
 
Yes but adultery keeps on happening even in places like Iran. It would seem that the threat of death is not enough to stop sin. If you feel that these sinning people deserve an eternity of punishment for there sins I must admit that this sounds devoid of mercy for the sinner. Honestly it sounds like hate. Please correct me if I’m wrong. Do you hate the sin or the sinner?
I’ll have to agree with the idea that people are people, and adultery is committed everywhere. But in places where people understand that they will DIE if they commit it…they are 1. think a million times before doing it 2. go to extreme measures to keep it secret. Either way, it doesnt become something that is considered normal for mainstream society.

Example…in America, losing your virginity before marriage is something normal, nothing to be ashamed of. In Egypt, it is something to be ashamed of and something you dont want anyone to know. When you hear about everyone doing something that you thought was wrong, then it somehow doesnt become wrong anymore…and that is when society goes down the drain.
color=black]People are a disease to society when they sin? Let me ask you this. The prophet Jesus in Islam forgave a woman who committed adultery. He said let he among who is without sin cast the first stone. Do you feel that his teachings made him a false prophet? Please also explain how mercy and forgiveness factor into Islam. Once a person is dead they can not change. Why not let them live in a prison for life when they commit adultery so that there is as least a chance for them to repent? Does God expect mercy in Islam?
There are certain sins that severely damage society…adultery is one of them (for so many reasons that you are probably aware of). For me, it is an intolerable sin…and one that can be easily avoided. That is MY opinion

According to my brother Shenango’s post, it seems that that story never really happened. Allah knows best. by the way, Jesus Christ peace be upon him, is among the best of messengers…for any muslim to call him a false prophet would take that person out of the fold of Islam. But we dont believe that everything recorded in the Bible actually came from him.

About Mercy. Here is a story from the Prophet Mohamed (pbuh) time

HADITH SAHIH MUSLIM Book 017, Number 4207: :

Imran b. Husain reported that a woman from Juhaina came to Allah’s Apostle (may peace be upon him) and she had become pregnant because of adultery. She said: Allah’s Apostle, I have done something for which (prescribed punishment) must be imposed upon me, so impose that. Allah’s Apostle (may peace be upon him) called her master and said: Treat her well, and when she delivers bring her to me. He did accordingly. Then Allah’s Apostle (may peace be upon him) pronounced judgment about her and her clothes were tied around her and then he commanded and she was stoned to death. He then prayed over her (dead body). Thereupon Umar said to him: Allah’s Apostle, you offer prayer for her, whereas she had committed adultery! Thereupon he said: She has made such a repentance that if it were to be divided among seventy men of Medina, it would be enough. Have you found any repentance better than this that she sacrificed her life for Allah, the Majestic?
 
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Shenango:
Where did Jesus (PBUH) forgive the woman who committed adultery? In the forgery that is John 7:53-8:11?
Can you please explain what evidence you have that the Bible is a forgery? I find this comment counter productive to civil conversation. I could just as easly say that the prophet muhammed is a false prophet making the above quote null and void.
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Faith101:
There are certain sins that severely damage society…adultery is one of them (for so many reasons that you are probably aware of). For me, it is an intolerable sin…and one that can be easily avoided. That is MY opinion

According to my brother Shenango’s post, it seems that that story never really happened. Allah knows best. by the way, Jesus Christ peace be upon him, is among the best of messengers…for any muslim to call him a false prophet would take that person out of the fold of Islam. But we dont believe that everything recorded in the Bible actually came from him.
I thought we were people of the book? The thing I dont understand, is why it is that Islamic people think that Christians are living out a lie based on forgery. It seems like the truth is that Islam would like to remove Christianity from the face of the Earth but just fails to come right out and say it. Are we Christians simply all living a lie? What does the Koran offer for advice in dealing with such people?
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Faith101:
I thought we were people of the book? The thing I dont understand, is why it is that Islamic people think that Christians are living out a lie based on forgery. It seems like the truth is that Islam would like to remove Christianity from the face of the Earth but just fails to come right out and say it. Are we Christians simply all living a lie? What does the Koran offer for advice in dealing with such people?

About Mercy. Here is a story from the Prophet Mohamed (pbuh) time

HADITH SAHIH MUSLIM Book 017, Number 4207: :

Imran b. Husain reported that a woman from Juhaina came to Allah’s Apostle (may peace be upon him) and she had become pregnant because of adultery. She said: Allah’s Apostle, I have done something for which (prescribed punishment) must be imposed upon me, so impose that. Allah’s Apostle (may peace be upon him) called her master and said: Treat her well, and when she delivers bring her to me. He did accordingly. Then Allah’s Apostle (may peace be upon him) pronounced judgment about her and her clothes were tied around her and then he commanded and she was stoned to death. He then prayed over her (dead body). Thereupon Umar said to him: Allah’s Apostle, you offer prayer for her, whereas she had committed adultery! Thereupon he said: She has made such a repentance that if it were to be divided among seventy men of Medina, it would be enough. Have you found any repentance better than this that she sacrificed her life for Allah, the Majestic?
I must admit that Mohamed did the right thing in letting her have the baby. There is just one problem after that. He committed murder. The right merciful answer is ‘go and sin no more’ not ‘stone her to death’. The only places on Earth where these sort of Islamic murders for adultery are taking place are in third world countries that lack the very essence of true civilization and justice for all people.

For all of it’s faults the US won’t kill you for making a mistake like cheating. And since God is love he is willing to forgive us. When you hear the words from Christians “God is love” do you agree? Or is God something else in Islam?

Another thing I would like to point out is the fact that this scenario of the women turning herself in to be killed is not a matter of repentance. The woman lived out a nightmare scenario.

She makes an error and gets pregnant out of adultery. She then gives birth to the child and gets to see the wonderful creation of God in her childs eyes. She is then wrapped in her clothes and forced to endure a horrific death. The child gets to grow up without it’s mother in a broken situation. There is nothing Holy or of God about any of that. The entire scenario stinks of brutality and hatred. I suppose little people should be encouraged to watch when these things take place as well? After all why hide the will of God from children.

-D
 
Can you please explain what evidence you have that the Bible is a forgery? I find this comment counter productive to civil conversation. I could just as easly say that the prophet muhammed is a false prophet making the above quote null and void.
Did you read the link that Shenango provided? It is **not ** the Muslims who are saying it was an addition…reread the link.
I thought we were people of the book? The thing I dont understand, is why it is that Islamic people think that Christians are living out a lie based on forgery. It seems like the truth is that Islam would like to remove Christianity from the face of the Earth but just fails to come right out and say it. Are we Christians simply all living a lie? What does the Koran offer for advice in dealing with such people?
Yes, Christians are believing in a lie that has been told to them. Allah advises the believers to call Christians back to the truth and out of the misguidance that has reached them. Our duty as Muslims is to call to the truth…as you will see from the verses below.

The Quran says:

So if they dispute with thee, say: “I have submitted My whole self to Allah and so have those who follow me.” And say to the People of the Book and to those who are unlearned: “Do ye (also) submit yourselves?” If they do, they are in right guidance, but if they turn back, Thy duty is to convey the Message; and in Allah.s sight are (all) His servants (Quran 3:20)

Say: “O People of the Book! come to common terms as between us and you: That we worship none but Allah. that we associate no partners with him; that we erect not, from among ourselves, Lords and patrons other than Allah.” **If then they turn back, say ye: "Bear witness that we (at least) are Muslims ** (bowing to Allah.s Will).(Quran 3:64)
I must admit that Mohamed did the right thing in letting her have the baby. There is just one problem after that. He committed murder. The right merciful answer is ‘go and sin no more’ not ‘stone her to death’. The only places on Earth where these sort of Islamic murders for adultery are taking place are in third world countries that lack the very essence of true civilization and justice for all people.
The lady in the story understood her mistake and sought her punishment. The prophet peace be upon him turned her down several times, telling her to go away…and she would continously come back…for 3 years this happened.

There are some people on this earth who when they do something wrong, they dont run from the consequences. She was one of them…and that is probably why her repentence is enough to cover the sins of 70 men.
color=black]For all of it’s faults the US won’t kill you for making a mistake like cheating. And since God is love he is willing to forgive us. When you hear the words from Christians “God is love” do you agree? Or is God something else in Islam?
One of Allah’s 99 names is “the Loving” But that doesnt mean we dont have punishments for people on earth or that there is no such place as Hell.

Why dont we just not punish anyone? Why do the murderes have to go to jail for their “mistake”? why dont we just have a place where if you make a mistake, you are just forgiven, and you go home…hmm.

Like I said, the punishment is an act of mercy…it removes the sin…that is why the lady in the story chased the prophet peace be upon him down for 3 years.
She makes an error and gets pregnant out of adultery. She then gives birth to the child and gets to see the wonderful creation of God in her childs eyes. She is then wrapped in her clothes and forced to endure a horrific death. The child gets to grow up without it’s mother in a broken situation. There is nothing Holy or of God about any of that. The entire scenario stinks of brutality and hatred. I suppose little people should be encouraged to watch when these things take place as well? After all why hide the will of God from children.
This is your conjecture. Have you seen what is inside her heart? From the story, we know it was to repent from her sin…or else that prophet (pbuh) would not have prayed for her and he would not have said what he said about her repentance.

There were many hypocrites in the prophet’s (pbuh) time. For example, ther was a man who died in battle…and everyone was praising him saying “he gave his life up for the sake of God in defense of his religion and people” and the prophet (pbuh) told them that that man is in hell (i think it was either b/c he committed suicide or b/c he was fighting to show off and not for the sake of God).
 
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Faith101:
Yes, Christians are believing in a lie that has been told to them. Allah advises the believers to call Christians back to the truth and out of the misguidance that has reached them. Our duty as Muslims is to call to the truth…
Truth, what truth???Are you sure that it’s not Muslims that believe in a lie? After all, your whole religion is based on the “private revelations” of one man who claimed that his only miracle was the Qur’an and even though you say he performed many miracles, he did not acknowledge any other.

If that’s enough “proof” for you, I can only say that it doesn’t take much to convince you, does it?

Instead of attacking our faith and saying that it’s corrupted and all the rest, why don’t you supply us with concrete proof that your religion is for real!
 
Brother Darrel

How are you ? I hope you are fine Godwillingly and all yr family and loved ones.

Let me tell you really somthing that is very simple.

When it comes to polictics and laws and religious right and left and stuff like that …

Islam is like any other faith .

If you look at The US you will see that in Just one country you can very much differenjtiate between Alabama and california when it comes to Faith .

Same with Islam all over the world . Sudan is different from Egytpt , from Lebanon , from Sweden from america.

Islam status is very hard to asess for muslims let alone non muslims lol.

I am a muslim myself and have been muslim all my life and i still yet to experience how islam is like in other countries.

You have thr right to be confused. Muslims themselves differ very much .

Its One and a half billion stretched all over the Globe

Quarter of Planet earth population.

I know you arent bashing islam at all and i am glad for your question.

You see… even among muslims christians , jews , any body you will always have the right and left and center etc…

The most important thing to know is that its not the most accurate thing to Judge Islam By actions of Muslims.

Here in Egypt many women doesnt wear Headscarf. Egypt has 60 million Muslims . many muslims in the west are more orthodox than many in the Muslim countries. Really really you cant judge at all.

I would talk about this subject for ever . many opinions differ about nearly everything .

Again , the one thing i am very sure about is that you have all sorts of Islam all over the earth . You really cant generalise . But if you wish to know Islam . Read teh Quran and the Life of the prophet .

May Peace and love and prosperity and happiness be upon you and your family and loved ones forever .

Sincerely
Meedo
 
Truth, what truth???Are you sure that it’s not Muslims that believe in a lie? After all, your whole religion is based on the “private revelations” of one man who claimed that his only miracle was the Qur’an and even though you say he performed many miracles, he did not acknowledge any other.
Booklover, you keep making these accusations and not following them up with any proof…so i’ll just ignore them

what do you mean that the prophet peace be upon him did not acknowledge his miracles?
If that’s enough “proof” for you, I can only say that it doesn’t take much to convince you, does it?
Instead of attacking our faith and saying that it’s corrupted and all the rest, why don’t you supply us with concrete proof that your religion is for real!
Booklover.

What kind of proof would you like? According to my understanding of history, there was once a man who raised the dead to life by the will of God…and people still denied him. So i’ve come to know that for some people…no proof is enough. I pray that you are not among them.
 
Like I said, the punishment is an act of mercy…it removes the sin…that is why the lady in the story chased the prophet peace be upon him down for 3 years.
This pretty well sums it up for me in the above quote. This is the most basic and fundamental type of bad and evil doctrine I can think of. To say that murder “removes sin” is a total abomination.

When a person is killed it is very simple … the entire person is removed. That includes all of the good and bad in that person. If this so called prophet said no for three years he must not have been very sure that this women should die. If he was so close to God he should have recieved an answer on this sooner and acted on it. Can you explain to me the reason for the cresent moon in Islam? I have heard that the prophet named God after the ‘moon god’ back in Mecca. Any truth to this?

-D
 
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meedo:
Brother Darrel

How are you ? I hope you are fine Godwillingly and all yr family and loved ones.

Let me tell you really somthing that is very simple.

When it comes to polictics and laws and religious right and left and stuff like that …

Islam is like any other faith .

If you look at The US you will see that in Just one country you can very much differenjtiate between Alabama and california when it comes to Faith .

Same with Islam all over the world . Sudan is different from Egytpt , from Lebanon , from Sweden from america.

Islam status is very hard to asess for muslims let alone non muslims lol.

I am a muslim myself and have been muslim all my life and i still yet to experience how islam is like in other countries.

You have thr right to be confused. Muslims themselves differ very much .

Its One and a half billion stretched all over the Globe

Quarter of Planet earth population.

I know you arent bashing islam at all and i am glad for your question.

You see… even among muslims christians , jews , any body you will always have the right and left and center etc…

The most important thing to know is that its not the most accurate thing to Judge Islam By actions of Muslims.

Here in Egypt many women doesnt wear Headscarf. Egypt has 60 million Muslims . many muslims in the west are more orthodox than many in the Muslim countries. Really really you cant judge at all.

I would talk about this subject for ever . many opinions differ about nearly everything .

Again , the one thing i am very sure about is that you have all sorts of Islam all over the earth . You really cant generalise . But if you wish to know Islam . Read teh Quran and the Life of the prophet .

May Peace and love and prosperity and happiness be upon you and your family and loved ones forever .

Sincerely
Meedo
Thank you for the kind words Meedo. May the peace, grace and eternal love of the Father and The Son and Holy Spirit be upon you and all of your family and friends in this life and the world to come.

My question for you is with regards to killing people who commit adultery as well. Do you feel that all people in Islam agree that they should all die? Or is it starting to become sort of an outdated barbaric practice in civilized Islamic circles?

-D
 
That includes all of the good and bad in that person. If this so called prophet said no for three years he must not have been very sure that this women should die.
In Islam, in order for someone to be convicted for adultery, than 4 eye witnesses have to testify OR the person themselves admit it. The confession of this woman was the reason for her punishment. The prophet peace be upon him gave her apple oppurtunity to retract her comment, she insisted.
Can you explain to me the reason for the cresent moon in Islam? I have heard that the prophet named God after the ‘moon god’ back in Mecca. Any truth to this?
No.
 
peace Darrel

i just read the quote on the bottom of your responses
Justice is trampled underfoot by weakness, cowardice and fear of the diktat of the ruling mindset. Evil draws its power from indecision and concern for what other people think.
pretty interesting.
 
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Faith101:
peace Darrel

i just read the quote on the bottom of your responses

pretty interesting.
Thanks,

It’s a quote from the Pope before he was Pope. He was heading up the office of the Inquisition in Vatican. My kind of guy.

-D
 
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