Question about men and sex

[1ke]

Blame men because if men were acting like men and loving the women in their lives as Christ loves the Church, His Bride, then women would not be looking emancipate themselves from their traditional roles to get their need for affirmation, security, empowerment in a false feminism.

\

Well, of course. Our intellect and will have been darkened by Original Sin.

The fundamental blame resides with men, and the response of women to the lack of real men [relationships and modeling] in their lives is .

I’m a woman and I disagree.

 

[setter]

Looking over this thread, it seems almost everyone is trying to put the blame on the other group. ‘It’s women!’ ‘It’s men!’ ‘No, it’s women!’ ad nauseam.

It’s people, okay? People in general like to have sex, enjoy admiring or even lusting after other people – it isn’t restricted to ‘just women’ or ‘just men’.

Wrong. Adam failed Eve, then tried to blame Eve, when Adam should have been defending Eve against the seductive wiles of the serpent. This is God’s revealed reality and the reason for all the symptom ills that we see in the male-female relationship. Only when men begin behaving like real men, will women be able to respond like real women and not be vulnerable to looking for love in all the wrong places and ways.

 

[setter]

I’m a woman and I disagree.

Then fundamentally you disagree with God’s order of creation, which includes the ordering of the relationship between the sexes.

 

[FredWentworth]

I’m not sure it is a matter of putting the blame on men or women.

I’ve transgressed the church’s teachings on sex in relationships. I’m still torn on whether the church is right, as if sex is only for marriage, what happens when men and women marry later in life, as many now do? Is it really healthy for a man to be a 30 or 35 year old virgin?

I’m not saying he should be a sex addict but I can’t really get too upset about a single man’s interest in sex with his girlfriend/fiancee, or vice-versa. It is natural, if not always wise. It is something that the Old Testament seemed to understand why it happens.

FW

 

[setter]

I’ve transgressed the church’s teachings on sex in relationships. I’m still torn on whether the church is right, as if sex is only for marriage, what happens when men and women marry later in life, as many now do? Is it really healthy for a man to be a 30 or 35 year old virgin?

:bigyikes: …are you torn because it is the moral and healthy thing to do, and because the task of self-mastery in service of chastity is just too hard, too inconvenient, and too self-sacrificing a cross to carry?

I’m not saying he should be a sex addict but I can’t really get too upset about a single man’s interest in sex with his girlfriend/fiancee, or vice-versa. It is natural, if not always wise. It is something that the Old Testament seemed to understand why it happens.

FW

Are we projecting one’s own sin unto others here? Jesus had some very severe things to say to those who would confirm and leads others astray in sin.

Btw – since when does “natural” = morally right?

 

[mchale]

I always find it amazing when someone focuses on one sin (usually sex) and ask why a particular group is so prone to it. The answer is simple and ultimately the same for every sin. We are in a fallen state and subject to terrible temptations as a result. Whether those temptations are to lie, to steal, to hurt people or to have sex, it is really irrelevant. Sin is sin.

Now, just a couple of thoughts on the specifics of the sin. The problem is our whole culture. I agree that a woman should not need to cover up completely. That being said, there is a difference between a woman where shorts or a skirt or a sleevless blouse and the blatently sexualized clothing that lots of younger women are wearing these days. Also, quick question on figure skaters; if the skimpyness of the womens’ costumes was purely functional, then how come men’s costumes are not nearly as skimpy?

In any case, there are many women in our society who seem to dress to encourage sexual attention and there are many men who just as eagerly look for it. Ultimately, I think alot of these people really want love and companionship but might be afraid to admit. I know for my own part, my random sexual urges actually decreased when I am in a good relationship and then they skyrocketed after the relationship was over. Its not that I didn’t want sex with my then girlfriend, but at the time I thought we were heading to… well getting engaged and married and wanted to wait until it was right. When she broke up with me, the urges returned… and I recognize now, what I really want is the sharing and closeness of a relationship. The desire for sex is simply the way those unfulfilled desires express themselves (again, by our fallen nature, good and wholesome urges can be redirected into unwholesome ones).

Oh well, those are my thoughts on it.

–
Bill

 

[Beaver]

Adam and Eve walked away from the true authority in their life, the Real Presence in the garden. Satan said, “That they would be like God”, that is that they could be that authority, but which one becomes the authority, once it is no longer the Real Presence.

 

[1ke]

Then fundamentally you disagree with God’s order of creation, which includes the ordering of the relationship between the sexes.

What?

Where the heck did you get that?

I do not disagree with God’s order of Creation.

 

[gam197]

originally posted by FredWentworth
can’t believe women do not have similar sexual feelings.

I once asked a 18 years old why she wanted an abortion. She felt it was necessary. When I pursued it as to why she got involved. Her statement was “I have my needs.” Isn’t that what the vaginal monologues are about, bringing the girls into it. Girls in the past had more self-control.

I do believe the drive for men is stronger because of generations of acting on it.

As a young girl, I never looked at a man’s butt. Never noticed they had bodies. I looked at their face and what they said until I heard from the media about it and it planted an idea in my mind.

 

[litllulu]

Adam and Eve walked away from the true authority in their life, the Real Presence in the garden. Satan said, “That they would be like God”, that is that they could be that authority, but which one becomes the authority, once it is no longer the Real Presence.

What a funny name for this post! ahha

And ps, the men have willling participants right?

 

[b_justb]

Why are most men so sexually immoral? Why are they so desperate for sex that they feel the need to hurt and exploit women and so desperate for it despite all of the consequences of fornication (that also indirectly hurt other people) that make it obviously way more trouble than it’s worth? All for what? A tingly feeling in their private parts? I mean, I get sexually aroused too that doesn’t mean I’m going to act on it. Just like I get angry and feel the urge to punch somebody, that doesn’t mean I’m going to do it. How is fornication any different? Why is a tingly feeling in their private parts so important to men that they feel the need to cause all those negative consequences and on top of it they’ll get it anyway if they just wait? Why don’t they simply demonstrate self-control? It’s not that hard. I know the men in my family aren’t like that but I keep hearing that most men are- hopefully that’s just hype, but anyway, I wanna know the answers to those questions so I won’t feel so afraid, judgmental and stressed because if most men are so immoral then why should I even like, trust or respect them?

For an issue you say you hope is just hype you seem to be fairly distressed over it.

In sexual sin outside of masterbation it always takes 2 …

 

[Mirdath]

Wrong. Adam failed Eve, then tried to blame Eve, when Adam should have been defending Eve against the seductive wiles of the serpent. This is God’s revealed reality and the reason for all the symptom ills that we see in the male-female relationship. Only when men begin behaving like real men, will women be able to respond like real women and not be vulnerable to looking for love in all the wrong places and ways.

Looking at Genesis, they were both complicit; Adam knew what the fruit was before he ate it. The story of the fruit of knowledge is highly metaphoric anyway – same kind of thing happened in Greek myth with Prometheus giving the people fire. A fall from earthly paradise cannot really be blamed on one specific person; it is the fault of all people. Were Eve to bear the whole of the reproach, you’d have no doctrine of original sin. Yet you hold that both men and women suffer from this fallen state – Eve was not the only sinner.

 

[catholicmessage]

The blame falls on anyone who sins, whether they be man or woman.

Is it a sin to lust after a woman (or man)? - yes

Is it a sin to dress immodestly? - yes (for men and women)

Is it a sin to encourage someone to lust or dress immodestly? - yes

Is it a sin to deliberately harm someone’s self-esteem? - yes

Is it a sin to spread filthy magazines, movies and TV shows? - yes

Lets stop passing the blame. It is up to all of us to build up the dignity of the human person and promote the beauty of chaste love.

 

[cavyqueen]

Wait…I’m confused. I thought this was a Christian forum. Sex before marriage is a sin, and we have to accept that. It’s part of our religion. God intended sex for marriage, as a pleasurable experience between man and wife. So if you choose to ignore that clear part of the Bible, please don’t answer my question. But it’s also just plain wrong for obvious practical reasons and there’s a reason why so many religions and cultures of the world condemn it as well. It’s no coincidence.

Of course men are going to be turned on. That’s totally ok. My question is why do men feel that just because they get turned on by looking at a woman and think she’s hot that they actually have to sleep with her? I get turned on by men and fantasize about them too but that doesn’t mean that I’m ACTUALLY going to sleep with them. I get highly aroused yet it’s not that difficult for me to control it, so why can’t you?

So in short, my question is why do men think being turned on rationializes actually fornicating? Why can’t they just fantasize and keep it to themselves?

And I agree that feminism is wrong. I am NOT one of these women. I will never give it up to a man out of wedlock. However, the reason why many women do this is because men PRESSURE them to. So stop pressuring them. Also, why do men go along with it? No one’s forcing them to have sex with the woman. If a woman offers sex the man is capable of saying “no”.

I just want to find a husband that’s both moral and masculine. Not perfect, not even religious, but one that’s actually faithful to me and doesn’t carry an STD. I haven’t even began looking yet because I’m afraid that I’ll be disappointed. I’ve never actually been to a bar, I’m only basing this on what I’ve heard.

So anyway, I’ll repeat my question seeing as no one has really explained it yet:

*Of course men are going to be turned on. That’s totally ok. My question is why do men feel that just because they get turned on by looking at a woman and think she’s hot that they actually have to sleep with her? I get turned on by men and fantasize about them too but that doesn’t mean that I’m ACTUALLY going to sleep with them.

So in short, my question is why do men think being turned on rationializes actually fornicating? Why can’t they just fantasize and keep it to themselves? I get highly aroused yet it’s not that difficult for me to control it, so why can’t you?*

 

[LovedForever]

Why are most men so sexually immoral? Why are they so desperate for sex that they feel the need to hurt and exploit women and so desperate for it despite all of the consequences of fornication (that also indirectly hurt other people) that make it obviously way more trouble than it’s worth? All for what? A tingly feeling in their private parts? I mean, I get sexually aroused too that doesn’t mean I’m going to act on it. Just like I get angry and feel the urge to punch somebody, that doesn’t mean I’m going to do it. How is fornication any different? Why is a tingly feeling in their private parts so important to men that they feel the need to cause all those negative consequences and on top of it they’ll get it anyway if they just wait? Why don’t they simply demonstrate self-control? It’s not that hard. I know the men in my family aren’t like that but I keep hearing that most men are- hopefully that’s just hype, but anyway, I wanna know the answers to those questions so I won’t feel so afraid, judgmental and stressed because if most men are so immoral then why should I even like, trust or respect them?

I think the heart of your question is not why men are so sexually immoral (keep in mind - for every MAN fornicating or committing adultery there is a WOMAN doing the same!); but rather, why do men seem to be so much more focused on sex than women?

Biology. It’s just simply the way God designed us.
Men, being designed to be very visually stimulated, are naturally (especially in this day) going to be more easily “turned on” than women.
Women are designed to be more turned on through attention and emotions. The physical turn-on (arousal) follows.

It’s important to understand basic biology here and not (as the feminists would like you to) lump men and women into the same category when it comes to sexual needs and desires.

Ultimately, BOTH men and women are seeking true intimacy when using the vehicle of sex and their bodies. They are seeking that unconditional love and affection and acceptance that can ONLY truly be achieved within the marriage bond.

When it is outside of marriage - that intimacy, while “looking” the same (sexual act) is a counterfiet. It is never a true and authentic love of completely, without reservation - giving of oneself.

So men are no more “immoral” when it comes to sex than women.
Men ARE however - wired differently and more easily “aroused.”
Thus - they, more than women must take greater care to practice self-control.
And this is why traditionally, it was the GIRL who was expected to “say no.” Because… it is EASIER for her to do so. Just biologically speaking.

Men are like microwaves - push a button and they are quickly ready to go!
Women are like slow cookers - it takes time and patience etc. and then they too are ready to go!

It’s just the way God designed us.

 

[setter]

What?

Where the heck did you get that?

I do not disagree with God’s order of Creation.

You are blaming the woman, just what Adam tried to do to cover up his complicity in Eve’s sin. My point being, that if Adam had not failed his role as protector, Eve would less likely to have been seduced by temptation.

 

[cavyqueen]

I think the heart of your question is not why men are so sexually immoral (keep in mind - for every MAN fornicating or committing adultery there is a WOMAN doing the same!); but rather, why do men seem to be so much more focused on sex than women?

Biology. It’s just simply the way God designed us.
Men, being designed to be very visually stimulated, are naturally (especially in this day) going to be more easily “turned on” than women.
Women are designed to be more turned on through attention and emotions. The physical turn-on (arousal) follows.

It’s important to understand basic biology here and not (as the feminists would like you to) lump men and women into the same category when it comes to sexual needs and desires.

Ultimately, BOTH men and women are seeking true intimacy when using the vehicle of sex and their bodies. They are seeking that unconditional love and affection and acceptance that can ONLY truly be achieved within the marriage bond.

When it is outside of marriage - that intimacy, while “looking” the same (sexual act) is a counterfiet. It is never a true and authentic love of completely, without reservation - giving of oneself.

So men are no more “immoral” when it comes to sex than women.
Men ARE however - wired differently and more easily “aroused.”
Thus - they, more than women must take greater care to practice self-control.
And this is why traditionally, it was the GIRL who was expected to “say no.” Because… it is EASIER for her to do so. Just biologically speaking.

Men are like microwaves - push a button and they are quickly ready to go!
Women are like slow cookers - it takes time and patience etc. and then they too are ready to go!

It’s just the way God designed us.

You make a good point but this question still isn’t answered:
Of course men are going to be turned on. That’s totally ok. My question is why do men feel that just because they get turned on by looking at a woman and think she’s hot that they actually have to sleep with her? Why can’t they just fantasize about it and keep it to themselves and get release in a more harmless way. Sorry but I think it’s necessary that men have to touch themselves for release because often times they get aroused without trying and they have to wash it away. So that alternative is a lot more harmless than actually sleeping with a woman so why don’t they just do that until they’re married?

Sorry but I need an answer to this.

 

[Mirdath]

You make a good point but this question still isn’t answered:
[Of course men are going to be turned on. That’s totally ok. My question is why do men feel that just because they get turned on by looking at a woman and think she’s hot that they actually have to sleep with her? Why can’t they just fantasize about it and keep it to themselves and get release in a more harmless way.

Wait, you think some men don’t do exactly that? And that no woman behaves as you think men do ‘by default’?

Sorry, you’re wrong.
[/quote]

 

[LovedForever]

You make a good point but this question still isn’t answered:
[Of course men are going to be turned on. That’s totally ok. My question is why do men feel that just because they get turned on by looking at a woman and think she’s hot that they actually have to sleep with her? Why can’t they just fantasize about it and keep it to themselves and get release in a more harmless way. Sorry but I think it’s necessary that men have to touch themselves for release because often times they get aroused without trying and they have to wash it away. So that alternative is a lot more harmless than actually sleeping with a woman so why don’t they just do that until they’re married?

Sorry but I need an answer to this.

You are suggesting “self-abuse”, which is a sin, as a remedy to a man’s arousal?
No. Here is a fact: A man will not “explode” if he does not get release from his arousal.
He doesn’t NEED to “wash it away” through sin.

You would do well to read Christopher West’s “Good News About Sex & Marriage” and the other Theology of the Body resources.
You will come to understand that anything (including masturbation) outside of the proper use of our bodies - is sinful.
Most importantly - you will fully understand WHY.

So don’t fall for the lie that a man is “in pain” or “will explode” if he does not get release. He may be uncomfortable for a time - but it will pass.
And, if he practices self-control he will become more disciplined in avoiding temptations that may cause him to become aroused.

Have we forgotten about Grace?
[/quote]

 

[cavyqueen]

You are suggesting “self-abuse”, which is a sin, as a remedy to a man’s arousal?
No. Here is a fact: A man will not “explode” if he does not get release from his arousal.
He doesn’t NEED to “wash it away” through sin.

You would do well to read Christopher West’s “Good News About Sex & Marriage” and the other Theology of the Body resources.
You will come to understand that anything (including masturbation) outside of the proper use of our bodies - is sinful.
Most importantly - you will fully understand WHY.

So don’t fall for the lie that a man is “in pain” or “will explode” if he does not get release. He may be uncomfortable for a time - but it will pass.
And, if he practices self-control he will become more disciplined in avoiding temptations that may cause him to become aroused.

Have we forgotten about Grace?

Well ok, sorry. I don’t know what it’s actually like to be a guy so I just assumed that they had to. I guess what I’m say is, if they were to solve it through sin, than couldn’t they at least pick the lesser of the two evils seeing as masturbation has virtually no consequences compared to actual sex.