Question about Metamucil and Holy Communion

[ConstantineTG]

It may not be your intention Constantine, but I get the same impressions that Father does from your posts in this thread.

I can say the same exact thing to 100 people and get 50 different opinions on what I said. I know what I said and I know what I intended to say.

I do not disagree at all with what you are saying, and I don’t think anyone else here does either.
BUT, a very simple question was asked, and the answer is NO, it does not break the Eucharistic fast to take medication. PERIOD.

Maybe, you should start a new thread about fasting, both from the Eastern & Western perspective. I know that I would find it very interesting.

If you want you can start. I’d be glad to contribute whatever I can. At this point I don’t know what to say in a thread as a first post.

 

[TrueLight]

I can say the same exact thing to 100 people and get 50 different opinions on what I said. I know what I said and I know what I intended to say.

If you want you can start. I’d be glad to contribute whatever I can. At this point I don’t know what to say in a thread as a first post.

“Legalism leads to scrupulosity”.

 

[ConstantineTG]

“Legalism leads to scrupulosity”.

Its hard to write about something that I’ve already read from someone. Its almost plagiarism. But that is a good topic by itself. Its really sad that people know more about the GIRM than the symbolism of every action in Mass. They know what the priest must do but not know why the priest does it. We go to confession and then afterwards go to CAF and ask, “was my confession valid?” Rather than ask how can we reform ourselves so that we will sin less in the future.

 

[Julia_Mae]

Why would anyone need to take a laxative less than one hour before receiving Communion. That could easily wait until after. There is not a crucial timing to take something like that unlike many other medications. In my view that breaks the fast.

Well, thistle, some folks, especially older one, have certain medications that make other things necessary. And one of the things that makes this routine work is to do the same things at the same time every single day.

Now, let’s say you usually go to 10AM Sunday Mass and you have scheduled things so this is not an issue. But then, one week, say for a Holy Day of Obligation, you might be going to Mass on a weekday at 6pm.

You see how that might be at odds with a schedule if we are going to decide that a medicinal product recommended by our doctors has to be approved by the general assembly of the Catholic Answers Forum and risk disturbing a routine that can be, the obvious jokes notwithstanding, serious to maintaining our health.

If anyone is so scrupulous that they worry about Metamucil, on Mass days take the sugar-free kind. That should be penitential enough for anyone.

 

[centurionguard]

Well, thistle, some folks, especially older one, have certain medications that make other things necessary. And one of the things that makes this routine work is to do the same things at the same time every single day.

Now, let’s say you usually go to 10AM Sunday Mass and you have scheduled things so this is not an issue. But then, one week, say for a Holy Day of Obligation, you might be going to Mass on a weekday at 6pm.

You see how that might be at odds with a schedule if we are going to decide that a medicinal product recommended by our doctors has to be approved by the general assembly of the Catholic Answers Forum and risk disturbing a routine that can be, the obvious jokes notwithstanding, serious to maintaining our health.

If anyone is so scrupulous that they worry about Metamucil, on Mass days take the sugar-free kind. That should be penitential enough for anyone.

Metamucil is a Dietary Fiber supplement used for irregularity for health needs.

Its not like its actually a food item. I certainly don’t see how it breaks the hour long Eucharistic Fast.

If a person is at Mass a half hour before Holy Communion and breaks out into a coughing spell and takes a cough drop to help break the cough does he/she break their Eucharistic Fast? No they do not…

 

[benedictus2]

Does ingesting Metamucil less than an hour before receiving Holy Communion break the one-hour fast?

May I ask why this is even an issue? Why does it have to be taken before Communion?

It is only fibre and I don’t think there is any medical requirement for this to be taken at precise times so why not just wait till after communion if you are in doubt?

For one thing, if you take it before and it starts having an immediate effect on you then you will be most uncomfortable during Mass.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

You see how that might be at odds with a schedule if we are going to decide that a medicinal product recommended by our doctors has to be approved by the general assembly of the Catholic Answers Forum…

LOL!

 

[FrDavid96]

May I ask why this is even an issue? Why does it have to be taken before Communion?

It is only fibre and I don’t think there is any medical requirement for this to be taken at precise times so why not just wait till after communion if you are in doubt?

For one thing, if you take it before and it starts having an immediate effect on you then you will be most uncomfortable during Mass.

The reason is actually quite simple.

Your questions
“why does it have to be taken…?”
“why not just wait…?”

Are NOT questions that the Church asks. These are not criteria that the Church establishes for keeping the Communion fast. What the Church does in fact say is that medicine is excluded from the fast.

The Church says that medicine does not break the fast. Therefore, medicine simply does not break the fast, no matter what the motivation or the necessity, or the ability to wait, or anything else.

Let me give a parallel example:

If someone were to ask a question “can I go to Communion if I have not abstained from making a cell phone call for 1 hour before?” What would be the answer? Of course it would be that there is no such thing as a mandatory fast from cell phones before Communion. The same thing applies to medicine.

There is no such thing in the current laws of the Church as a* fast from medicine* before receiving Communion. It does not exist. Therefore, no one has any right to impose such a fast on anyone else.

 

[TrueLight]

The reason is actually quite simple.

Your questions
“why does it have to be taken…?”
“why not just wait…?”

Are NOT questions that the Church asks. These are not criteria that the Church establishes for keeping the Communion fast. What the Church does in fact say is that medicine is excluded from the fast.

The Church says that medicine does not break the fast. Therefore, medicine simply does not break the fast, no matter what the motivation or the necessity, or the ability to wait, or anything else.

Let me give a parallel example:

If someone were to ask a question “can I go to Communion if I have not abstained from making a cell phone call for 1 hour before?” What would be the answer? Of course it would be that there is no such thing as a mandatory fast from cell phones before Communion. The same thing applies to medicine.

There is no such thing in the current laws of the Church as a* fast from medicine* before receiving Communion. It does not exist. Therefore, no one has any right to impose such a fast on anyone else.

I see your point, Father and I see Constantine’s point as well.

The Church doesn’t do things at random. There is a reason and it’s well thought out – or should be.

We are to fast from all foods and drinks at least one hour before communion.

However, since it wouldn’t make sense to physically harm oneself because of a communion fast, there is an exemption for medicine.

The Church does not have to say if you do not need to take your medicine less than an hour before the fast, that you shouldn’t.

That is common sense.

If you need to take it because of the way in which the medicine works by itself or in conjunction with other medicines, than yes you should take it.

Some things are inferred.

Here is scenario that illustrates how things can be inferred.

Imagine I tell my daughter before mass to be dressed by 8 AM. At 8AM I check in on her and she has her dress and shoes on, but her hair looks like a bird’s nest.

Me: Didn’t I tell you to be dressed by 8AM?
Daughter: I am dressed.
Me: But your hair is a mess.
Daughter: You didn’t tell me my hair had to be combed by 8AM.

In the same way, how could there be nothing wrong with wolfing down the last piece of your McDonald’s bacon, egg and cheese sandwhich at 8:59 AM for a 10 AM mass?

The Church does not spell out everything.

Even though I’m new, surely Catholicism is much more than just a bunch of Canon law.

 

[asd72]

I see your point, Father and I see Constantine’s point as well.

The Church doesn’t do things at random. There is a reason and it’s well thought out – or should be.

We are to fast from all foods and drinks at least one hour before communion.

However, since it wouldn’t make sense to physically harm oneself because of a communion fast, there is an exemption for medicine.

The Church does not have to say if you do not need to take your medicine less than an hour before the fast, that you shouldn’t

MEDICINE AND WATER DO NOT BREAK THE FAST, SO IT IS NEITHER HERE OR THERE WHETHER YOU TAKE THEM BEFORE OR DURING THE FASTING HOUR.

YOU SEEM BELIEVE THAT MEDICINE DOES BREAK THE FAST OR YOU WOULD NOT THINK IT BETTER TO AVOID THEM DURING THE FAST.

That is common sense.

If you need to take it because of the way in which the medicine works by itself or in conjunction with other medicines, than yes you should take it.

Some things are inferred.

Here is scenario that illustrates how things can be inferred.

Imagine I tell my daughter before mass to be dressed by 8 AM. At 8AM I check in on her and she has her dress and shoes on, but her hair looks like a bird’s nest.

Me: Didn’t I tell you to be dressed by 8AM?
Daughter: I am dressed.
Me: But your hair is a mess.
Daughter: You didn’t tell me my hair had to be combed by 8AM.

In the same way, how could there be nothing wrong with wolfing down the last piece of your McDonald’s bacon, egg and cheese sandwhich at 8:59 AM for a 10 AM mass?

THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING OUTSIDE THE FASTING PERIOD.

The Church does not spell out everything.

Even though I’m new, surely Catholicism is much more than just a bunch of Canon law.

 

[FrDavid96]

I see your point, Father and I see Constantine’s point as well.

The Church doesn’t do things at random. There is a reason and it’s well thought out – or should be.

We are to fast from all foods and drinks at least one hour before communion.

However, since it wouldn’t make sense to physically harm oneself because of a communion fast, there is an exemption for medicine.

The Church does not have to say if you do not need to take your medicine less than an hour before the fast, that you shouldn’t.

That is common sense.

If you need to take it because of the way in which the medicine works by itself or in conjunction with other medicines, than yes you should take it.

Some things are inferred.

Here is scenario that illustrates how things can be inferred.

Imagine I tell my daughter before mass to be dressed by 8 AM. At 8AM I check in on her and she has her dress and shoes on, but her hair looks like a bird’s nest.

Me: Didn’t I tell you to be dressed by 8AM?
Daughter: I am dressed.
Me: But your hair is a mess.
Daughter: You didn’t tell me my hair had to be combed by 8AM.

In the same way, how could there be nothing wrong with wolfing down the last piece of your McDonald’s bacon, egg and cheese sandwhich at 8:59 AM for a 10 AM mass?

The Church does not spell out everything.

Even though I’m new, surely Catholicism is much more than just a bunch of Canon law.

You’re missing the whole point.

The Communion fast is a discipline of the Church. As such, the Church tells us what does or does-not constitute the fast.

Since the Church tells us that the fast does not apply to medicine then that means exactly that: the fast does not apply to medicine.

You say that “the Church does not spell out everything” Fair enough. And very true.
However, what you’re not seeing here is that when it comes to medicine the Church does indeed “spell it out” by telling us quite clearly and without any ambiguity that there is no such thing as a Communion fast from medicine.

Such a thing does not even exist.

There is a problem with what you posted above:

"We are to fast from all foods and drinks at least one hour before communion. "
That’s simply not true.

What the Church does say is that we are to fast, but with the express exception of water and medicine. One cannot take only part of the definition of the Communion fast without giving the entire definition.

The Church does not have to say if you do not need to take your medicine less than an hour before the fast, that you shouldn’t.

That is common sense.

No, this is not at all “common sense” because it is adding a requirement to the law which is not only not-put-there by the Church, but it runs completely contrary to the Church’s law that says there is no fast from medicine.

Given that the Church says that medicine is not part of the Communion fast, no one else can try to impose other obligations or other interpretations that contradict the Church’s law.

The problem with telling people that they “must” or “should” or whatever other word, refrain from taking medicine as part of the Communion fast is that this information completely contradicts the Church’s law.

Do you not see this?

 

[TrueLight]

You’re missing the whole point.

The Communion fast is a discipline of the Church. As such, the Church tells us what does or does-not constitute the fast.

Since the Church tells us that the fast does not apply to medicine then that means exactly that: the fast does not apply to medicine.

You say that “the Church does not spell out everything” Fair enough. And very true.
However, what you’re not seeing here is that when it comes to medicine the Church does indeed “spell it out” by telling us quite clearly and without any ambiguity that there is no such thing as a Communion fast from medicine.

Such a thing does not even exist.

There is a problem with what you posted above:

"We are to fast from all foods and drinks at least one hour before communion. "
That’s simply not true.

What the Church does say is that we are to fast, but with the express exception of water and medicine. One cannot take only part of the definition of the Communion fast without giving the entire definition.

No, this is not at all “common sense” because it is adding a requirement to the law which is not only not-put-there by the Church, but it runs completely contrary to the Church’s law that says there is no fast from medicine.

Given that the Church says that medicine is not part of the Communion fast, no one else can try to impose other obligations or other interpretations that contradict the Church’s law.

The problem with telling people that they “must” or “should” or whatever other word, refrain from taking medicine as part of the Communion fast is that this information completely contradicts the Church’s law.

Do you not see this?

Fair enough regarding the Metamucil.

I’d love to read your opinion on fasting in general on this new thread.

 

[pinctor]

As a user of metamucil I can state that its taste and consistency are so foul that it can hardly be defined as food that may be abstained from.

I would not ingest it an hour before communion in case its intended effect suddenly grabbed me at some point in the Mass

 

[Phemie]

As a user of metamucil I can state that its taste and consistency are so foul that it can hardly be defined as food that may be abstained from.

I would not ingest it an hour before communion in case its intended effect suddenly grabbed me at some point in the Mass

I eat Metamucil wafers. They are so tasty I usually save them for dessert.

 

[Catholic90]

In the same way, how could there be nothing wrong with wolfing down the last piece of your McDonald’s bacon, egg and cheese sandwhich at 8:59 AM for a 10 AM mass?

.

Actually, you could be eating at 8:59 before a 10 am mass that starts at 10 am, because the fast is 1 hour before communion, not before the start of mass. No wolfing required - you could leisurely chew it, since communion usually is about 30 minutes after the start of mass.

 

[TrueLight]

Actually, you could be eating at 8:59 before a 10 am mass that starts at 10 am, because the fast is 1 hour before communion, not before the start of mass. No wolfing required - you could leisurely chew it, since communion usually is about 30 minutes after the start of mass.

What I meant was 1 hour before you actually receive communion, which means you would be estimating when you actually receive communion.

 

[tjwdsssc2015]

This is also a good post.

I believe the question refers to the spirit of the law versus the letter of the law.

Laws are not just created at random.

This reminds me of a little game I see kids playing.

A parent will say, do not touch the stove. Invariably some kid will put their little finger as close as they can while not touching. They haven’t disobeyed, but they’re going as far as they can.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the reason that medicine is allowed is so that no one’s health will be adversely affected for the cause of Christ? God wouldn’t want that.

So if I need the Metamucil so as not to be be sick during or shortly after mass, of course I can and should take it. If I can take it at any time, then why would I take it …just because I can? So isn’t the intention important as well as the letter of the law?

JMJ

Thanks for your reply, TrueLight!

To be frank, to my knowledge there is no particular reason given by the Church as to why medicine and water are permitted within the period of fasting. Thus, any statement we make on it is our understanding, using the hermeneutic of continuity as our guide, as to why the Church teaches as She does.

I don’t think there is anything incorrect in your reason for the “allowance” of medicine, but at the same time, I wouldn’t reduce it to only that reason. The Church has not given reasons, so there may be others than just that one. For if we reduce it to just that, what would stop us from reducing it only to life-saving medicines? That is, if grandpa needs to take a certain pill in order to keep his ticker going, he can take it; but if I need to take my ADDerall to keep my noggin running up to speed, I shouldn’t.

Essentially, this is what it seems ConstantineTG is doing: reducing the law to a specific among a more relative necessity. In other words, there are no specific reasons, but ConstantineTG wants to say that there is a need of necessity, based on his own understanding of what is necessary. What would stop another from coming along and saying “I declare that by ‘medicine’ the Church means those drugs regulated by the FDA”; and another could say, “I declare that acceptable drugs are those which absolutely cannot be delayed until after Mass.” This is the underlying fallacy in ConstantineTG’s “two questions” he posed FrDavid96. He turns the real question around, asking if it a sin to wait to take the medication. The direct answer: no, it’s not a sin…but that means absolutely nothing to the question at hand, for neither is it a sin to take the medication before Mass. Simply, it is not a sin to take the medication, regardless of when the medication is taken.

You are correct, TrueLight, that intention is in fact important: hence why we cannot reduce the law to specific necessity. When does one determine necessity? As I already said, this only leads to further definition, resulting in life-or-death situation alone. And clearly, that does not fit the spirit of the law.

Intentionality is important, though. Like I mentioned in a previous post, if one is taking the Metamucil so as to break the fast (with the intention of breaking the fast; that is, taking the Metamucil for the intention of feeling full), then indeed the fast is broken. However, the fast is broken not by the taking of Metamucil as such; rather, the fast is broken because the individual intended to break the fast.

One may question: if I have only one piece of candy corn, and I eat it not intending to break the fast, do I break the fast? Yes: solid food is not permitted to be consumed within the period of fasting. Thus, the fast has been broken, intentional or not.

One may further question–and I’ll leave this one open for response because it’s more interesting (let’s see if we can’t get this thread even longer, eh? haha): if grandpa needs to take his ticker medication or he’ll kick the bucket, and all he has available to him is vodka, is he breaking the fast to take his medication (because he needs to use the vodka to wash down the pill). Vodka could be replaced with any non-water beverage.

Let us remember the canon:

Canon 919 §1 of the Code of Canon Law (CIC):

“Whoever is to receive the blessed Eucharist is to abstain for at least one hour before holy communion from all food and drink, with the sole exception of water and medicine.”

The annotation says:

“Water and liquid or solid medicine may be taken by all at any time.”

NB: the annotation is not law, but commentary; it holds no juridical authority.

God love you!

 

[ConstantineTG]

What I meant was 1 hour before you actually receive communion, which means you would be estimating when you actually receive communion.

Still wondering why people are more concerned with technicalities like that (when does the one hour start) rather than why we fast in the first place. If we know and appreciate why we fast, people will go 6 hours or more without food without having canons hanged over their heads.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

If we know and appreciate why we fast, people will go 6 hours or more without food without having canons hanged over their heads.

This is the problem of exceeding what the Church actually says. Now we’ve moved from “true fasting” from everything unnecessary for an hour before communion to “true fasting” meaning we should go 6 hours. OK, what about 7, 8, 9, 10?

 

[ConstantineTG]

This is the problem of exceeding what the Church actually says. Now we’ve moved from “true fasting” from everything unnecessary for an hour before communion to “true fasting” meaning we should go 6 hours. OK, what about 7, 8, 9, 10?

Sure, some saints have went for long periods of time. Father, my point is not the amount of time, 1, 6, 12, 5000 hours, it doesn’t matter. If we know why we fast, it would be easier to fast more because of our love for Christ.