Question about online downloads/viewing

  • Thread starter Thread starter kantus12
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
K

kantus12

Guest
Hey all,

I have come back to the Catholic faith in a big way in recent years, in no small part thanks to this website and its members. However, over the years I have also spent much time on the Internet, and am as such concerned as to whether or not certain acts constitute immoral behaviour, since I may end up running across the desire to do these things on a fairly frequent basis. I know that piracy is wrong, as it is a form of theft, but I am having trouble asserting surely whether or not some of these things constitute theft. So, to put my mind at ease (at least as regards what I should be doing), how does Catholic teaching apply to the following:
  1. The watching of video review/comedy video review shows, such as The Nostalgia Critic? I would assume that, as parody and review are perfectly legal, and that watching one of his videos does not constitute watching all or even a large part of the movie in question, and that a man’s reaction to a movie is not itself a movie, that it is not theft. Am I mistaken in this?
  2. The viewing of materials online (for free) which would be impossible to acquire at all in one’s home country, such as certain manga. I do not feel quite at home with doing this, but I have heard some assert that, as no physical copy of the work has been taken, TOGETHER with the fact that the maker never intended to and did not provide you with the opportunity to purchase his work legally, that therefore a sale has not been stolen from him.
  3. The viewing of Youtube videos which depict gameplay of a certain game, where the game is a game between two or more players (that is, all of the actual content of the video is provided by the players themselves), provided that the players in question are uploading said video entirely free of charge and of their own volition? I have heard the argument that this is essentially analogous to viewing a team-based sport such as football, on the grounds that a particular person’s game is not identical to the game itself, in the same way that a football match is not the sport of football.
  4. “Let’s Play” videos, and such things as the Yogscast. I have heard the argument that in cases such as these, you are really seeking the interaction of the players and members of the team who are playing the game (which are theirs and theirs alone), and thus that it may not signify theft to watch such videos.
While I say all of this, I should point out that I am normally a fairly anxious person, and that I feel that I may be likely to fall into Scrupulosity. I want to find a way of living that is consistent with Catholic teaching, without falling into the bleak, depressing landscape of the stereotypical Catholic (ie, one who frets and worries endlessly that such-and-such small action may damn them to Hell and thus becomes the most frighteningly uptight sort of person imaginable).

Thank you dearly for all of your help. I want to see if I can get any clarification on this, because while a man can make changes to his sinful lifestyle, he simply cannot live with the mere suspicion that his lifestyle is sinful.

Thank you again,
kantus
 
I’m 99% sure that number 1 is OK. It’s for puropses of critique and parody, which falls under fair use. (I hope it’s OK, because I watch things on Channel Awesome regularly. 😊)

I’m not sure on the second one. I do know that it’s against international copyright law, so I avoid it. But it’s more of an “err on the side of caution” thing for me, as I don’t understand what I would be taking. I have to admit that I do still illegally download old, outdated games for systems that are no longer sold. I bought these systems once, but they are broken now. Again, I don’t understand what I’m taking by playing them. 😦

I’m not sure what you’re asking on the third. Sounds like watching people play a tabletop RPG or something. Whatever it is, it sounds fine to me.

I think Let’s Plays are OK. It never occurred to me that they wouldn’t be, although they do use plenty of copyrighted material. But at the same time, it’s not like it’s a substitute for playing the game yourself, and some could be considered commentary on the game.

I have come to the conclusion that 90% of modern fandom is illegal, so I’m not really sure what to do about all of this. I love fandom, but I also want to obey the law.

Strictly speaking, I’m not even sure if my avatar is legal. I do know that it’s fan art and that the artist said anyone could take it for any purpose, but since togepi is a copyrighted character… 🤷

EDIT: In other words, for me, the question is not whether it’s theft. None of the above, with the possible exception of number 2, appear to be theft. But we are supposed to obey just laws, and except for number 1 and maybe number 3, I believe that these things are illegal. It’s also true that few people take such laws seriously. I’m not sure whether we need to obey them or not, since to me it seems that nobody really cares whether you watch a Let’s Play or not, especially if you’ve already bought the game.
 
kantus12 said:
Hey all,

I have come back to the Catholic faith in a big way in recent years, in no small part thanks to this website and its members. However, over the years I have also spent much time on the Internet, and am as such concerned as to whether or not certain acts constitute immoral behaviour, since I may end up running across the desire to do these things on a fairly frequent basis. I know that piracy is wrong, as it is a form of theft, but I am having trouble asserting surely whether or not some of these things constitute theft. So, to put my mind at ease (at least as regards what I should be doing), how does Catholic teaching apply to the following:
  1. The watching of video review/comedy video review shows, such as The Nostalgia Critic? I would assume that, as parody and review are perfectly legal, and that watching one of his videos does not constitute watching all or even a large part of the movie in question, and that a man’s reaction to a movie is not itself a movie, that it is not theft. Am I mistaken in this?
  2. The viewing of materials online (for free) which would be impossible to acquire at all in one’s home country, such as certain manga. I do not feel quite at home with doing this, but I have heard some assert that, as no physical copy of the work has been taken, TOGETHER with the fact that the maker never intended to and did not provide you with the opportunity to purchase his work legally, that therefore a sale has not been stolen from him.
  3. The viewing of Youtube videos which depict gameplay of a certain game, where the game is a game between two or more players (that is, all of the actual content of the video is provided by the players themselves), provided that the players in question are uploading said video entirely free of charge and of their own volition? I have heard the argument that this is essentially analogous to viewing a team-based sport such as football, on the grounds that a particular person’s game is not identical to the game itself, in the same way that a football match is not the sport of football.
  4. “Let’s Play” videos, and such things as the Yogscast. I have heard the argument that in cases such as these, you are really seeking the interaction of the players and members of the team who are playing the game (which are theirs and theirs alone), and thus that it may not signify theft to watch such videos.
While I say all of this, I should point out that I am normally a fairly anxious person, and that I feel that I may be likely to fall into Scrupulosity. I want to find a way of living that is consistent with Catholic teaching, without falling into the bleak, depressing landscape of the stereotypical Catholic (ie, one who frets and worries endlessly that such-and-such small action may damn them to Hell and thus becomes the most frighteningly uptight sort of person imaginable).

Thank you dearly for all of your help. I want to see if I can get any clarification on this, because while a man can make changes to his sinful lifestyle, he simply cannot live with the mere suspicion that his lifestyle is sinful.

Thank you again,
kantus
Click to expand...
Where did you get get your information about “the bleak, depressing landscape of the stereotypical Catholic”? The average Catholic has the Truth and the truth shall set you free.

Say you live in Australia and my company, which does publish books, is not allowed to sell certain books to you. That is our right. Copyright means the right to copy, and that right includes distributing our books as we see fit.

Just because a book can be turned into digital bits and downloaded, does that mean nothing? It means you can read a book that legally, should not be available in your country.

If I create a business called NetFlix and for $10.00, I will stream a movie to your computer, or you can get it for free from a file-sharing site, it’s still the same movie. One was obtained legally, and another COPY was obtained illegally.

So downloading is copying and illegal downloads are illegal.

Peace,
Ed
 
Thank you for your responses, all

I just want to add some more detail to what I originally said - I have a brother, who has come with me into the Catholic faith. He went with me into the Confessional for the first time in years, but i fear that this issue might be his breaking-point. I don’t think he feels as if he could live without scanned-in, freely-uploaded manga. I think he thinks that he doesn’t want to be “screwed over” by the fact that he doesn’t have a lot of money, or that the series he wants to read aren’t sold in our country. I don’t think he will accept the idea that he doesn’t have the right to read or view these series, or that their creators have a right not sell to him. I dearly love my brother and I don’t want him to fall into sin because of his lifestyle, but I also fear that I am simply pushing him too hard. I do not want to commit an act of cruelty by forcing him down a path that makes him miserable. What on Earth should I do? Perhaps no Earthly power can help him…

I know that his Salvation is ultimately not my responsibility (or at least not solely my responsibility), but I feel as if my doing nothing is an act of gross negligence. I will pray for him, and look toward God for support. Perhaps that is the best I can do.
 
No one is perfect :rolleyes:
As long as you strive to better yourself I dont see the big problem. Other than the potential risk of getting caugth by authorities :bluelite: :bigyikes:
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top