question about Opus Dei

[Faithdancer]

Sorry, I took for granted that you’re an Opus Dei member, but for your answer it seems that you’re not. So I’ll need to explain more.
As I mentioned in my post, Opus Dei members can not choose their confessor, it is assigned to them. Also, spiritual counseling in Opus Dei is not provided by their priests. They only hear your confession. The Spiritual counseling is provided by a lay person assigned to you (which also you can not choose).
Numeraries and Supernumeraries have exactly the same “norms” which also includes weekly confession.

I don’t know how it is in your area, Mark, but the priests in our area do provide spiritual counseling, and that is emphasized at the beginning of every EOR. Of course, one has to arrive a bit early to take advantage of that, and the line tends to fill up as the evening progresses, which reduces the time the priest has available for each individual.

And no, I’m not a member yet, but I ask questions of members, which is how I’ve informed myself. I am currently attending EOR’s and dialoguing with members. I’ve been told that if I become a member I would be a single celibate supernumerary. I thought all supernumeraries were married, and single members not living in community would be considered associates, but apparently that’s not the case.

 

[Faithdancer]

No, that’s not correct as you, yourself, have no way of knowing what OD Centers are close to your location. This is just the closest one they are willing to assign you to.

Why is this so secret? Why isn’t there a list of Opus Dei Centers?

This is ludicrous. Knowledge of the location of every Opus Dei center and every EOR in my area is open to anyone. In fact the locations are published on the Internet and I am not “assigned” to anything. Where do you get your information?

 

[JillianRose]

This is ludicrous. Knowledge of the location of every Opus Dei center and every EOR in my area is open to anyone. In fact the locations are published on the Internet and I am not “assigned” to anything. Where do you get your information?

Probably ODAN…

 

[Mark12]

I don’t know how it is in your area, Mark, but the priests in our area do provide spiritual counseling, and that is emphasized at the beginning of every EOR. Of course, one has to arrive a bit early to take advantage of that, and the line tends to fill up as the evening progresses, which reduces the time the priest has available for each individual.

And no, I’m not a member yet, but I ask questions of members, which is how I’ve informed myself. I am currently attending EOR’s and dialoguing with members. I’ve been told that if I become a member I would be a single celibate supernumerary. I thought all supernumeraries were married, and single members not living in community would be considered associates, but apparently that’s not the case.

Faithdance, thanks for your question.
Once again, all what we are talking in this post does not apply to you as you’re not an Opus Dei member.
Yes, Opus Dei’s priests provide spiritual counseling to non-members (how to say it… it’s one of their ways to get new members).
But once you become a member, your spiritual counselor will be a lay person assigned to you.
If you don’t want to do the commitment (because in Opus Dei they’re no vows) of being celibate for life (like a numerary or an associate), you can perfectly join as a supernumeary. It’s not required to be married to be a supernumerary.

 

[Julia_Mae]

I am supernumerary and I’ve never been told who to confess to, or what I can discuss with a priest from Opus Dei. I have a weekly chat with a Numerary. I confess weekly, but just once a month to a priest of the Work.

How do you pick which priest?

 

[Julia_Mae]

This is ludicrous. Knowledge of the location of every Opus Dei center and every EOR in my area is open to anyone. In fact the locations are published on the Internet and I am not “assigned” to anything. Where do you get your information?

Well that’s great! Could you post the link to the list, please?

 

[JillianRose]

shellbourne.org/ - This is the Valpo, Indiana one

opusdei.org/

 

[Julia_Mae]

shellbourne.org/ - This is the Valpo, Indiana one

opusdei.org/

If this is meant to respond to what I asked faithdancer, it doesn’t, although it’s nice you took the time.

He said this:

Knowledge of the location of every Opus Dei center and every EOR in my area is open to anyone. In fact the locations are published on the Internet and I am not “assigned” to anything. Where do you get your information?

I don’t know what his area is, or where this list of every Center is, but I’d love to see it.

A general link to the Opus Dei site isn’t useful as there is no list of every OD center there.

BTW, I “get my information” from the Code of Opus Dei, for the most part. Every person, whether actual member (clergy) or associated person (laity) is assigned to a Center by Opus Dei. This is for their internal purposes, kind of like the bank where you opened your account is your bank, but you can go into any bank of the same name all over the country. But they have your records someplace, that’ll be your home bank. Opus Dei doesn’t necessarily inform you of anything. If you were in serious formation as a Numerary or something that would be different. Then you have an assigned confessor and spiritual director and so forth at a Center for that purpose.

 

[JillianRose]

If this is meant to respond to what I asked faithdancer, it doesn’t, although it’s nice you took the time.

He said this:

I don’t know what his area is, or where this list of every Center is, but I’d love to see it.

A general link to the Opus Dei site isn’t useful as there is no list of every OD center there.

BTW, I “get my information” from the Code of Opus Dei, for the most part. Every person, whether actual member (clergy) or associated person (laity) is assigned to a Center by Opus Dei. This is for their internal purposes, kind of like the bank where you opened your account is your bank, but you can go into any bank of the same name all over the country. But they have your records someplace, that’ll be your home bank. Opus Dei doesn’t necessarily inform you of anything. If you were in serious formation as a Numerary or something that would be different. Then you have an assigned confessor and spiritual director and so forth at a Center for that purpose.

I don’t know about every center. At mine, the Priest only comes onces a month. I asked a supernumerary if I could also go to confession with my home parish she said “absolutely”. You do not have to only use the Opus dei priest. (I am about to become a coordinator)

I did not know anyone in Opus Dei. I was looking into other Vocations for laity and I contacted them. They actually asked me two questions 1. If I was a man or a women
2. Where do I live.

They gave me the closet centers, they NEVER told me which one I have to go to. I obviously chose the one closest to my house. Everyone I have talked to there, has a church they belong to and go to their parish Priest for confession.

They informed me of everything. No one acted crazy or CIA cooperative on me.

Maybe at some centers, their are people who use Opus Dei as a power trip.
I could see why this day and age why Opus Dei would want to be low key. I think Opus Dei wants to feel you out to see where you stand. Making a Vocation is serious. Why is it being treated as joining a bank? Its not. God Calls you, not the other way around. This is not 4 H.

They are conservative and encourage women who’s vocation is in the home. They talk about equal submission. They talk about showing love to God thru your EVERYDAY life. It is low key , because they are not concerned about your socio-economic status. They wont even take a stipend from me because they said I should wait to see if I want to join.

Please forgive me, but why are you so bent on arguing. Why not try it? If you are so against it, why are you so interested? Its ok if its not your calling. Somethings in life
need to be experienced. I find it weird that people have a problem with anything that the Catholic Church says is ok. The fight over traditions, vocations, etc. I am just waiting to hear on a forum here :“my priest can beat up your priest”. Isn’t that why the Catholic Church Rocks? We can still have the HOLY Eucharist and still find our place. There is a place for everyone in the Church.

I hope you are just trying to be informative and not trying to propagate a hidden agenda. It is hard to know because I don’t know you, you don’t know me, and things get lost in translation over email…

God Bless,

Jill:thumbsup:

 

[roveau]

Thanks everyone, I feel that I have a better understanding of Opus Dei now.

 

[lizaanne]

And here’s a guy like Michael Voris, Opus Dei Numerary, with one of the most visible apostolates around, openly proclaiming his organization is dedicated to saving souls. How is it necessary to hide the fact that he is Opus Dei?

Michael Voris is NOT an Opus Dei Numerary. You have no proof of this, because it is simply not true.

~Liza

 

[Julia_Mae]

Michael Voris is NOT an Opus Dei Numerary. You have no proof of this, because it is simply not true.

~Liza

Lizanne, welcome to the thread!

As to your assertion: I’m sorry, but you can’t know that. Unless he’s told you he is a Supernumerary, I suppose that’s possible. But I know this: that Oratory in your old digs was unknown to your Archbishop and your “Apostolate” is one of a dedicated Opus Dei Fidelity. So, I believe your remark is kind of misleading. OTOH, perhaps you, yourself, don’t know. That doesn’t make sense, tho.’ So, Lizanne, tell us about your experience with Opus Dei. And, how you liking your new location?

 

[Julia_Mae]

I don’t know about every center. At mine, the Priest only comes onces a month. I asked a supernumerary if I could also go to confession with my home parish she said “absolutely”. You do not have to only use the Opus dei priest. (I am about to become a coordinator)

You mean “cooperator?” I’m not sure what this is supposed to tell anyone since you aren’t a member of any sort. Do you think Mark is lying about being assigned a confessor and an SD when he became a Numerary? Do you think he quoted Escriva accurately about going to a confessor outside of Opus Dei k leading to sin?

All these nice testimonies of what the EOR is like are fine, but they don’t have anything to do with the experience of the actual incorporated lay Opus Dei adherent. One person says at the EOR they have no time to ask any questions. Faithdancer says the centers are listed online but can’t come up with a link. Everyone says there’s no secrecy but know one knows anything about how OD actually works. So, I’m back to the Constitutions and Statutes. These are their controlling rules.

Has the single Supernumerary you have a number for ever read them herself? Have you? A Cooperator isn’t one of the “faithful of Opus Dei” you know. You can be an atheist and be a Cooperator.

16S1Cooperators are able to offer collaboration by their effusive, unremitting prayers to God, their alms, and as far as possible, by their own work, in apostolate works and share in the spiritual benefits of Opus Dei.

** 16S2** There are also those who stray far from the Father’s house in different ways or who do not profess the true Catholic faith, who nevertheless offer assistance to Opus Dei by their own work or alms. These people, by right and merit, are able to be appointed Cooperators of Opus Dei. All the faithful of the Prelature, by prayer, sacrifice, and conversation, thus ought to work with these Cooperators in order that, by the intercession of the Blessed Virgin and by the divine mercy, the unfailing light of faith might be brought to them and that they might efficiently and gently come to Christian ways.

 

[Mark12]

If this is meant to respond to what I asked faithdancer, it doesn’t, although it’s nice you took the time.

He said this:

I don’t know what his area is, or where this list of every Center is, but I’d love to see it.

A general link to the Opus Dei site isn’t useful as there is no list of every OD center there.

BTW, I “get my information” from the Code of Opus Dei, for the most part. Every person, whether actual member (clergy) or associated person (laity) is assigned to a Center by Opus Dei. This is for their internal purposes, kind of like the bank where you opened your account is your bank, but you can go into any bank of the same name all over the country. But they have your records someplace, that’ll be your home bank. Opus Dei doesn’t necessarily inform you of anything. If you were in serious formation as a Numerary or something that would be different. Then you have an assigned confessor and spiritual director and so forth at a Center for that purpose.

Julia,
I understand your interest, but you’re digging in the sand.
Opus Dei officially does not provide nor disclose a full list of their centers, so I doubt that Faithdancer would be able to give you that list.
This is one of the things that John Allen mentioned in his book (the lack of public information)
Opus Dei “officially” only owns a couple of buildings (like their headquarters in Rome), the rest of the centers and residences are owned by “non profits” created for the purpose of owning the buildings and collect donations (and shield Opus Dei from any responsibility of whatever happens there… we could talk hours about the legal ramifications of this, but I do not have time).
Of course all those non-profits are all managed and controlled by Opus Dei members.
So Opus Dei “officially” does not recognize them as their own property or involvement.
If you check any of the websites or brochures of the Centers or Residences you’ll see that they only say something like “the spiritual and doctrinal activities offered at this Center are entrusted to Opus Dei”, that’s the only trace that you’ll find that Opus Dei is involved.

 

[JillianRose]

You mean “cooperator?” I’m not sure what this is supposed to tell anyone since you aren’t a member of any sort. Do you think Mark is lying about being assigned a confessor and an SD when he became a Numerary? Do you think he quoted Escriva accurately about going to a confessor outside of Opus Dei k leading to sin?

All these nice testimonies of what the EOR is like are fine, but they don’t have anything to do with the experience of the actual incorporated lay Opus Dei adherent. One person says at the EOR they have no time to ask any questions. Faithdancer says the centers are listed online but can’t come up with a link. Everyone says there’s no secrecy but know one knows anything about how OD actually works. So, I’m back to the Constitutions and Statutes. These are their controlling rules.

Has the single Supernumerary you have a number for ever read them herself? Have you? A Cooperator isn’t one of the “faithful of Opus Dei” you know. You can be an atheist and be a Cooperator.

Yes I do mean cooperator… MY android auto check!! hahahah…

Anyho, I am saying that it sounds like each center is different. I understand want you are saying. Whats YOUR problem. Its like your bagering Opus Dei? Like you trying to prove a point. You know we are all adults here and you keep going in circles. Its ok for adults to have diffferent feelings. People have their experiences to speak for. Whats the obsession?

 

[JillianRose]

Here is a link that answers FAQ? I don’t see what so hard about emailing them like they ask to tell you your nearest center?

opusdei.us/sec.php?s=494

 

[Julia_Mae]

Julia,
I understand your interest, but you’re digging in the sand.
Opus Dei officially does not provide nor disclose a full list of their centers, so I doubt that Faithdancer would be able to give you that list.

Yes, I believe this is exactly correct. But the poster said the list was publicly available and online, so, if things have changed and it is, I’d love to see that. So I thought I’d ask.

Opus Dei “officially” only owns a couple of buildings (like their headquarters in Rome), the rest of the centers and residences are owned by “non profits” created for the purpose of owning the buildings and collect donations (and shield Opus Dei from any responsibility of whatever happens there… we could talk hours about the legal ramifications of this, but I do not have time).
Of course all those non-profits are all managed and controlled by Opus Dei members.
So Opus Dei “officially” does not recognize them as their own property or involvement.

Oh yes, it’s all clearly spelled out in the Code of Opus Dei. But, the “faithful” of Opus Dei who own these apostolates, that is whatever businesses and so forth they operate, are required to report to their Center Director or Spiritual Director what they do and take the advice of Opus Dei in operating that business. They are also required to support every other Opus Dei apostolate. Interestingly, since the apostolates don’t announce themselves as being part of Opus Dei, no one knows what they are until the Center Director or someone informs the person what they need to do to give that support.

Also, as male and female Numeraries and Numerary Assistants, all make promises or personal vows of poverty, all their paychecks are signed over to the Centers and all funds are managed by Opus Dei which can send the money anywhere in the world for any purpose it desires.

BTW, OD is opening a huge residential Center in Indiana. So, not just New York City anymore.

If you check any of the websites or brochures of the Centers or Residences you’ll see that they only say something like “the spiritual and doctrinal activities offered at this Center are entrusted to Opus Dei”, that’s the only trace that you’ll find that Opus Dei is involved.

Yes, and some don’t even say that much. These retreat houses were something fairly new that really started getting cranked up after 2005 or so.

 

[Julia_Mae]

Yes I do mean cooperator… MY android auto check!! hahahah…

Anyho, I am saying that it sounds like each center is different.

Yes, I think this is true.

 

[lizaanne]

Lizanne, welcome to the thread!

As to your assertion: I’m sorry, but you can’t know that. Unless he’s told you he is a Supernumerary, I suppose that’s possible. But I know this: that Oratory in your old digs was unknown to your Archbishop and your “Apostolate” is one of a dedicated Opus Dei Fidelity. So, I believe your remark is kind of misleading. OTOH, perhaps you, yourself, don’t know. That doesn’t make sense, tho.’ So, Lizanne, tell us about your experience with Opus Dei. And, how you liking your new location?

I’m not sure what you mean - I have not relocated anywhere, I’m in the same place I’ve always been. And I have no connections to Opus Dei either.

As for Michael Voris - I do know. He’s not affiliated with Opus Dei. Period. You keep saying this, but saying it does not make it true.

You really should be consistent and use the same name - instead of being Curious Catholic somewhere else, and Julia Mae here. Doesn’t it get confusing?

~Liza

 

[Luigi_Daniele]

Also, as male and female Numeraries and Numerary Assistants, all make promises or personal vows of poverty, all their paychecks are signed over to the Centers and all funds are managed by Opus Dei which can send the money anywhere in the world for any purpose it desires.

This is not as sinister as you (maybe inadvertantly) make it sound. How is this any different than what is expected of any lay brother of any movement within the Church?