Question about RCIA for Children

[alanswife30]

My 12 year old twins are currently in our parish RCIA for Children. We were given a schedule of class dates and Rites. They had First Reconcilliation last month which I thought was weird since my sons have not been baptized yet. They are scheduled for First Communion on March 22nd which I don’t understand. I was told that they would receive the Sacraments of Initiation at Easter Vigil. Does anyone know if this is correct? I appreciate any help.

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

I don’t know who is leading the program for your children, but it sounds like you should talk with that person, the RCIA director, and/or your pastor. Do they all know that your sons haven’t been baptized? It sounds like they somehow missed that.

Baptism definitely comes before receiving other sacraments like Reconciliation. And obviously someone being baptized doesn’t need to go to confession first. They also can’t receive their First Communion before Baptism.

In the meantime, since they are seeking Baptism, they should go through the Rite of Election and other rites during Lent. I would follow up on this ASAP.

 

[alanswife30]

That’s what I thought. They will have the Rite of Election on March 8th. The Sr. that does directs the program knows that they have not been baptized, none of the children in my son’s class has been baptized. I will ask about this at their next class. Thanks!

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

My 12 year old twins are currently in our parish RCIA for Children. We were given a schedule of class dates and Rites. They had First Reconcilliation last month which I thought was weird since my sons have not been baptized yet. They are scheduled for First Communion on March 22nd which I don’t understand. I was told that they would receive the Sacraments of Initiation at Easter Vigil. Does anyone know if this is correct? I appreciate any help.

Obviously someone does not know what is going on or should be going on.

A child over the “age of reason” or “Catechetical age” and is not Baptized is considered an adult catechumen and attends RCIA (geared for their age). They enter the Catechumenate just like every other Inquirer with the Rite of Acceptance and go through a preparation/catechetical process with a Sponsor. When ready they participate in the Rite of Election which is coming up soon and are Initiated into the Catholic Church with the Sacraments of Baptism, Confirmation and HOly Communion AT THE EASTER VIGIL along with all the other Elect.

First red flag would have been the Sacrament of Reconciliation for an un-Baptized child??? DUH. You can’t validly receive ANY other Sacraments until you have been Baptized!

 

[Dawn_Treader]

Unfortunately, you are not alone in this experience. I had a similar situation in my parish recently, although it was not in RCIC but RCIA. I was baptized last year but before the Easter Vigil, after the class on the sacrament of confession we were told to all begin scheduling first confessions with the pastor for before Easter. I assumed at that point that they misspoke and only meant for candidates to do so (Candidates and catechumens were all in the same class together), so fortunately I never scheduled it, at least not before Easter. This year I am a sponsor and in the class last week I heard the same thing. First I told my catechumen that first confession only applied to those already baptized so she should not schedule one, then after class I approached the RCIA director (who is also a deacon) to clarify. To my shock he said they wanted even catechumens to do this.
This was especially surprising since in my experience this parish has always been pretty good about these things. I did tell the RCIA director that baptism is the “doorway to the sacraments” and he said that while theologically I may be correct, this is how things have been done at this parish.
Anyway, I sent an email to the Diocesan Worship office that night, but have yet to get a reply. Does anyone have any ideas on what else I should do?

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

Anyway, I sent an email to the Diocesan Worship office that night, but have yet to get a reply. Does anyone have any ideas on what else I should do?

My next step after talking with the teacher/RCIA director would have been the pastor. He should know what’s going on in the parish and have the opportunity to correct it. I don’t believe in “going over someone’s head” to try to resolve things.

 

[palmas85]

Unfortunately, this is a common situation in many RCIA programs nationwide.In my old parish the DRE and the director of RCIA wanted everyone to go as a group to one of the group reconciliation Masses prior to Baptism. In fact it was a scheduled part of the program.

My own personal take on the issue is this. In a progressive Parish, many people do not believe that original sin exists anymore and they no longer believe that Baptism removes it.

They see that entire concept as being somewhat archaic and even mystical. As true followers of the 19th century enlightenment movement that denied the veracity of miracles, they have extended that concept to baptism. They have developed the belief that baptism is merely an acceptance into the community. Baptism for them does not remove the stain of original sin, and certainly does not remove other sins that you are carrying around. In effect they have desacramentalized the sacraments. There is nothing mystical or miraculous in any of them as far as they are concerned. They are just rituals geared towards fostering a sense of community.

Further, since they believe that the community is all important, above even the worship of God, the sacraments in general and the Mass itself, they firmly believe that those in RCIA should and must do everything together to foster that goal of community,

Several of us fought this battle yearly for a long time. Since we did have the catechism on our side, we usually won. But it was always a struggle and at times, we lost.

Or more aptly everyone lost.

 

[Dawn_Treader]

My next step after talking with the teacher/RCIA director would have been the pastor. He should know what’s going on in the parish and have the opportunity to correct it. I don’t believe in “going over someone’s head” to try to resolve things.

Well, I realize now that I should have done this, and regret not having done so, but in my shock I didn’t even think of it. What can I do to repair this?

 

[Til2morrow]

Unfortunately there are many parishes run in this manner. However, it is not unusual for one to be Baptised, take First Communion and be Confirmed all on Easter Vigil–right or wrong it happens. Remember that Baptism confers an indelible character or mark on the soul of being annointed in the Holy Spirit (as do the sacraments of Confirmation and Holy Orders–all of which are sacraments that cannot be repeated) and one should also remember that Baptism is the “first and chief sacrament of forgiveness of sins because it unites us with Christ. . . . so that we may walk in newness of life.”(CCC977-978) Therefore, it is not only not necessary to participate in the Sacrament of Penance, as you have not officially been received into Christ prior to Baptism (the first Sacrament that one will participate in when the parish does this type of 3-fold Sacrament thing on Easter Vigil), but it is not a Sacrament one is entitled to participate in if not having been Baptised first. Your sins will be forgiven through Baptism enabling you to take First Communion and be Confirmed on Easter Vigil. I think the person in charge of the course needs to be clearer on the sacraments and I must say I am surprised at the Deacon not giving you a better explanation. Please, knowing that these three Sacraments will all take place during the Easter Vigil, go to your parish priest and let him know that you are aware of the nature of Baptism and tell him that you do not wish to have your child participate in a Sacrament for which he/she is yet to be entitled and tell him as well you are clear on the nature of Baptism and I would hope that this would settle the issue. I hope this is clear and helpful.
Good luck,
In the Love and Joy of Living in Christ,
Til2morrow

 

[maggiemay2u]

Unfortunately, this is a common situation in many RCIA programs nationwide.In my old parish the DRE and the director of RCIA wanted everyone to go as a group to one of the group reconciliation Masses prior to Baptism. In fact it was a scheduled part of the program.

My own personal take on the issue is this. In a progressive Parish, many people do not believe that original sin exists anymore and they no longer believe that Baptism removes it.

They see that entire concept as being somewhat archaic and even mystical. As true followers of the 19th century enlightenment movement that denied the veracity of miracles, they have extended that concept to baptism. They have developed the belief that baptism is merely an acceptance into the community. Baptism for them does not remove the stain of original sin, and certainly does not remove other sins that you are carrying around. In effect they have desacramentalized the sacraments. There is nothing mystical or miraculous in any of them as far as they are concerned. They are just rituals geared towards fostering a sense of community.

Further, since they believe that the community is all important, above even the worship of God, the sacraments in general and the Mass itself, they firmly believe that those in RCIA should and must do everything together to foster that goal of community,

Several of us fought this battle yearly for a long time. Since we did have the catechism on our side, we usually won. But it was always a struggle and at times, we lost.

Or more aptly everyone lost.

My sister had to go to the pastor to get the RCIA leaders to stop telling candidates the Eucharist was representative of Christ’s body and blood… the same pastor who eschewed the Stations of the Cross on Good Friday for his thoughts on various readings, music and dancing girls, then suggested we all “give a round of applause” to the musicians and dancers.

 

[Halos1n2Horns]

Whom ever told you that, is totally wrong, I am a rcic teacher we don’t give any sacrament until the vigil at Easter, confession tho is done right before Easter for there reconcillation sacrament.

Did they confess to the teacher these prayers.
beautitudes, apostles creed, 10 commandments, and The our father prayer, Please check with your teacher to make sure they know what they are suppose to be teaching them and that your children know these prayers, If they don’t then there not allowed to recieve there sacraments at Easter.

age of reason for rcic is 7 up to 17 usually we have a teacher for the 7-10 children and then a teenager teacher to .

If your pastor is letting them do what u said they were doing, then u need to contact the education department at your diocese.

If you need any more information Let me know

Halos

 

[Phemie]

Unfortunately there are many parishes run in this manner. However, it is not unusual for one to be Baptised, take First Communion and be Confirmed all on Easter Vigil–right or wrong it happens.

There’s nothing wrong with the above. Those who are baptized at the Easter Vigil or received into full Communion, are confirmed and receive Communion then too. Although the option is there to have children wait to be confirmed with their class, it’s perfectly acceptable for the to be confirmed at the Vigil.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Unfortunately, you are not alone in this experience. I had a similar situation in my parish recently, although it was not in RCIC but RCIA. I was baptized last year but before the Easter Vigil, after the class on the sacrament of confession we were told to all begin scheduling first confessions with the pastor for before Easter. I assumed at that point that they misspoke and only meant for candidates to do so (Candidates and catechumens were all in the same class together), so fortunately I never scheduled it, at least not before Easter. This year I am a sponsor and in the class last week I heard the same thing. First I told my catechumen that first confession only applied to those already baptized so she should not schedule one, then after class I approached the RCIA director (who is also a deacon) to clarify. To my shock he said they wanted even catechumens to do this.
This was especially surprising since in my experience this parish has always been pretty good about these things. I did tell the RCIA director that baptism is the “doorway to the sacraments” and he said that while theologically I may be correct, this is how things have been done at this parish.
Anyway, I sent an email to the Diocesan Worship office that night, but have yet to get a reply. Does anyone have any ideas on what else I should do?

Tell your Catechumen not to schedule a Confession and don’t bring it up again to the Deacon or the Director. If asked your Catechumen should just say that they plan to take care of it… No need to tell them that it will be taken care of 1 or 2 months after Easter!

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Whom ever told you that, is totally wrong, I am a rcic teacher we don’t give any sacrament until the vigil at Easter, confession tho is done right before Easter for there reconcillation sacrament.

Did they confess to the teacher these prayers.
beautitudes, apostles creed, 10 commandments, and The our father prayer, Please check with your teacher to make sure they know what they are suppose to be teaching them and that your children know these prayers, If they don’t then there not allowed to recieve there sacraments at Easter.

age of reason for rcic is 7 up to 17 usually we have a teacher for the 7-10 children and then a teenager teacher to .

If your pastor is letting them do what u said they were doing, then u need to contact the education department at your diocese.

If you need any more information Let me know

Halos

There actually is no such thing as RCIC!

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

There’s nothing wrong with the above. Those who are baptized at the Easter Vigil or received into full Communion, are confirmed and receive Communion then too. Although the option is there to have children wait to be confirmed with their class, it’s perfectly acceptable for the to be confirmed at the Vigil.

The option is for when there is a serious reason they cannot receive all the Sacraments at the time of Baptism as required in Canon Law.

 

[Joannm]

There actually is no such thing as RCIC!

THANK YOU. THANK YOU. That is really one of my pet peeves…it is RCIA adapted for children.

 

[Til2morrow]

to Phemie. what I was referring to when I said that many parishes unfortunetly are run in this manner, I was referring to the confusion caused by instructors who are not always well informed on the specific canonic requirements, but rather rely on parish tradition to guide them on the information they may pass on to parents casually. The other thing is that when I stated “right or wrong” I was not referring to anything wrong with taking the three sacrements of Baptism, First Communion and Confirmation at Easter Vigils–all together. I was referring to the fact that sometimes one can find parishes where children who take instruction for First Communion will be given the Sacrament on Easter Vigil rather than at the end of the course, which is then followed by the class for Confirmation the following liturgical year. I think it proper that we distinguish from converts or those not Baptised as infants or raised in the Catholic faith who participate in RCIA and children who follow the scheduled series of Catechism having been Baptised as infants into the faith and reaching the age of reason begin Catechism instruction in the order of First Communion followed by the course for Confirmation. Many dioceses are beginning catechism at various times throughout the liturgical year rather than just once a year as in the past. I may be of the old school but I enjoyed it when the liturgical calendar was followed more closely and First Communion always came at the same time every year–that is following a “scholastic” type year of instruction. First Communion was then done in the spring, as was the “graduating” Confirmation class. My home diocese now starts Confirmation groups when there is a certain number of young people to warrant a new group as sometimes the numbers are greater than the ability to accommodate all who wish to participate. On the other hand it is encouraging to have say that there is a need to actually start a new Confirmation group due to the numbers involved.
Til2morrow

 

[alanswife30]

Whom ever told you that, is totally wrong, I am a rcic teacher we don’t give any sacrament until the vigil at Easter, confession tho is done right before Easter for there reconcillation sacrament.

Did they confess to the teacher these prayers.
beautitudes, apostles creed, 10 commandments, and The our father prayer, Please check with your teacher to make sure they know what they are suppose to be teaching them and that your children know these prayers, If they don’t then there not allowed to recieve there sacraments at Easter.

age of reason for rcic is 7 up to 17 usually we have a teacher for the 7-10 children and then a teenager teacher to .

If your pastor is letting them do what u said they were doing, then u need to contact the education department at your diocese.

If you need any more information Let me know

Halos

I do know that my sons’ teacher has taught them the Our Father (which they already knew), the Glory Be and the Hail Mary. He is now working on some other prayers.

Maybe they had the kids go through confession so that they would know what it’s like. When I was received into the church last Easter Vigil, we had to go to Confession after practice that morning so that we would know what it was like. But, the whole First Communion thing has me dumb-struck. But, I will definately ask the teacher at the next class.

Thanks to everyone who replied.

 

[Til2morrow]

Actually one does not have a child or anyone else for that matter participate in a true Sacrament to practice. Sacraments are for a very specific purpose and practicing to know what they will face is not one of them. Most probably like I stated above the teacher has lumped all the children into one bunch without taking into consideration if they will be having the first Sacrament of Baptism (which releases the soul of any sins that may have been committed prior to the Sacrament together with forgiveness of Original Sin which is that mark on all our souls we carry from the time of The Fall from Grace of Adam/Eve). If a child is being Baptized at Easter Vigil that will be the first act of being Absolved of sin making the Sacrament of Confession not necessary in those cases. However, those children who were Baptized as infants and have been participating in preparation for First Communion must participate in the Sacrament of Reconciliation (Confession) it is absolutely necessary. I think the teacher, priest or whoever has put them all in the same basket. Talk to the teacher and the pastor–it is better not to go higher as this will certainly be taken as an offense and this is no way to start your fellowship inside the parish. Gods Blessings. Live in the peace that it will all be worked out and you and your family will experience a very joyous occasion.
In Christ,
Til2morrow

 

[Dawn_Treader]

Update:

I still have not received a response from the diocese. The pastor came to RCIA the other night to do a class on confession and the director asked him (I assume because of my questioning) to affirm that he wanted those not baptized to go to him for confession before Easter as well, which he did. So now I know that the pastor knows what is going on and is not correcting it, but the diocese does not seem to have done anything.