Question about SSPX/SSPV Groups

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miyuki

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This is an over-simplification, so forgive me.

If the SSPX broke away from the Roman Catholic Church because they thought the Church too liberal,

And the SSPV broke away from the SSPX because they thought that group too liberal,

Are there any groups that make the SSPV look liberal?
 
And don’t forget about Congregation of Mary Immaculate Queen, CMRI.

CMRI, SSPV and several others are sedevacantist. SSPX is not.
 
And some guy out in New Mexico who calls St Thomas Aquinas “a notorious heretic.”

:rolleyes:
 
Altho I have to quibble and say the SSPX did not leave the Church but received a disciplnary excommunication for consecrating bishops without Vatican approval.
 
St_Francis said:
Altho I have to quibble and say the SSPX did not leave the Church but received a disciplnary excommunication for consecrating bishops without Vatican approval.
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In fact, St Francis, Archbishop Lefebvre and his priests of the Society of St Pius X were suspended from ALL priestly faculties in 1976 - which is a GREAT deal more than "receiving a disciplinary excommunication!

While the disciplinary excommunication WAS lifted from the bishops - the suspensions from faculties remain in force.

See the second article at jloughnan.tripod.com/sspx-1.htm

In my opinion - the SSPX (and other like-minded ‘traditionalists’) suffer under precisely the same condition of all other protestant ecclesial groups - such as the Anglicans, United Churches, Methodists, etc. - the condition of being “Not in full communion with the Catholic Church” - an euphemism for “schismatic”!

I go further, saying that they are the modern-day “Fundamentalists” in the same manner as the post-Reformation Fundamentalist sects!

By the way - there are now 2,000 articles from back-issues of ANNALS AUSTRALASIA - a 123 year-old Australian Journal of Catholic culture at jloughnan.tripod.com/portal.htm - some of which may be of interest.

God bless,

F. John Loughnan
 
miyuki said:
This is an over-simplification, so forgive me.

If the SSPX broke away from the Roman Catholic Church because they thought the Church too liberal,

And the SSPV broke away from the SSPX because they thought that group too liberal,

Are there any groups that make the SSPV look liberal?
Click to expand...
Terms like “liberal” and “conservative” come from politics, misleading when applied to the Church. “Old Catholics” broke off when the papal infallibility was defined. Are they “conservative” because they claim to be reverting to an earlier Catholicism, (Catholics disagree with that) or are they “liberal”? Fundamentalists claim to be conservative, in that they reject all Roman “innovations”, whereas they might be radical in the sense of pushing the Reformation to the farthest.

A better way to describe Christians is how they stand in relation to the Magisterium. Groups on the far “left” and far “right” both reject the Magisterium. They look different but are united on the crucial variable. Maybe you reject the Magisterium because it’s part of the white male Eurocentric capitalist power structure, or maybe you reject it because Rome abandoned proper liturgical candles in 1539, it doesn’t matter. You don’t benefit from the fullness of the Catholic faith until you come home to the Church. The Media loves any “Catholic” group that opposes the Church
 
Sean_O_L said:
In fact, St Francis, Archbishop Lefebvre and his priests of the Society of St Pius X were suspended from ALL priestly faculties in 1976 - which is a GREAT deal more than "receiving a disciplinary excommunication!

While the disciplinary excommunication WAS lifted from the bishops - the suspensions from faculties remain in force.

See the second article at jloughnan.tripod.com/sspx-1.htm

In my opinion - the SSPX (and other like-minded ‘traditionalists’) suffer under precisely the same condition of all other protestant ecclesial groups - such as the Anglicans, United Churches, Methodists, etc. - the condition of being “Not in full communion with the Catholic Church” - an euphemism for “schismatic”!

I go further, saying that they are the modern-day “Fundamentalists” in the same manner as the post-Reformation Fundamentalist sects!

By the way - there are now 2,000 articles from back-issues of ANNALS AUSTRALASIA - a 123 year-old Australian Journal of Catholic culture at jloughnan.tripod.com/portal.htm - some of which may be of interest.

God bless,

F. John Loughnan
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I’m sorry, Father, you’re comparing the SSPX to Anglicans, United and Methodists??? :rotfl: I’m afraid you’ve been terribly misinformed along the way.

The SSPX have valid orders, a valid mass and the Real Presence, things the Protestants heretics to not have.
 
Dies_Irae said:
I’m sorry, Father, you’re comparing the SSPX to Anglicans, United and Methodists??? :rotfl: I’m afraid you’ve been terribly misinformed along the way.

The SSPX have valid orders, a valid mass and the Real Presence, things the Protestants heretics to not have.
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Greetings Dies Irae.

First of all, I am not a priest. I am a revert from the SSPX - having realized that "there is no GOOD reason for being in a state of schism! This is abundantly clear - if you were to view my web-site at jloughnan.tripod.com/index.htm

Secondly, there are many ecclesial groups (hundreds, in fact) which possess the word/s “Catholic” or “Roman Catholic” in their official names. There are many more (such as the SSPX) which do NOT have those words in their titles.

Thirdly, some of those organisations - which the Catholic Church describes officially as “Ecclesial groups” - but NOT as “Churches” possess valid orders; some do not! Some possess the Apostolic Succession - some do not.

As for the SSPX: their “orders” are valid - but illicit; which means illegal, and the Sacraments of Marriage and Confession are null and void (due to the suspension a divinis still being in place,) In a genuine emergence, an SSPX priest may administer the Last Rites.

If you look - you will find an abundance of original evidence at jloughnan.tripod.com/sspx-1.htm

See also Political Religion Lefebvre Style at jloughnan.tripod.com/lefebvstyle.htm

I might add that some Anglicans have had themselves re-ordained by schismatic groups which genuinely have Apostolic Succession (for example: Old Catholics)
Thus they possess the same “powers” as the SSPX. Nevertheless, these Anglicans (when they convert to Catholicism and wish to be catholic priests) have to be ordained in the Catholic rite: their “Anglican Orders” are considered null and void…

God bless,

John Loughnan
 
Dies_Irae said:
I’m sorry, Father, you’re comparing the SSPX to Anglicans, United and Methodists??? :rotfl: I’m afraid you’ve been terribly misinformed along the way.

The SSPX have valid orders, a valid mass and the Real Presence, things the Protestants heretics to not have.
Click to expand...
The crucial dividing line is “in communion with the Pope, or not?” It refers not to dialogue, but to obedience.
Protestant communities, and the SSPX, are not in communion with the Pope; nor are groups, even those labeled as “Catholic”, who lobby for the right to abortion or ordination of women. It’s not a question of being more or less “traditional”; you are either in the Church, guided by the Magisterium, united to the bishops; or else you are outside.
It doesn’t matter if your group falls off the cliff to the left side, or to the right side, you are now off the cliff.
 
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