Question about the authority of Eastern Catholic Patriarchs

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Hail_Linus

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I asked an Eastern Orthodox person whether their Patriarchs had any plenary authority of their Bishops.

I gave the following examples of how the Latin Rite Patriarch (the Pope) has certain plenary authorities over his subordinate Bishops in the Latin Rite. In other words authorities exclusive to his Patriarchy that would have no power or effect over Eastern Catholic Patriarchs.

I gave the following examples:


  1. *]As Patriarch, John Paul II permitted non-ordained people to clean the chalice after communion. Bishops in the Latin rite then had the prerogative to permit the non-ordained to clean the chalice after communion. Shortly after John Ratzinger became the Patriarch he prohibited any Bishop in the Latin Rite to permit non-ordained from cleaning the Chalice after communion.

    *]As Patriarch, John Paul II, instituted the Pastoral Provision which permitted Bishops to accept married Anglican Priests into the Catholic Priesthood.

    *]As Patriarch, John Paul II permitted girls to serve as alter servers.

    In all of these cases the Bishops of the Latin Rite had to accept the Latin Rite Patriarch’s decision. However, as Patriarch of the Latin Rite, none of these examples were authoritative over the Eastern Rites since it would be interfering with the authority of the Eastern Catholic Patriarchs.

    This person of the Eastern Orthodox Church informed me that the Eastern Orthodox Patriarchs have no plenary authority over their Bishops.

    I was wondering about the Eastern Catholic Patriarchs. Are they just figure heads like in the Eastern Orthodox or do they have authority like the Latin Rite Patriarch?
 
Our(Ukrainian church) synod can make similar decisions I think. Our patriarch is the head of our synod but he can not make decisions on his own .
 
Formosus said:
Our(Ukrainian church) synod can make similar decisions I think. Our patriarch is the head of our synod but he can not make decisions on his own .
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AFAIK, that’s the paradigm for all the East/Orient. I should add here that it occasionally happens that a Synod will grant ad hoc authority to the Patriarch to deal with a particular issue(s) on his own for a defined period of time. When convened, the Synod could, in theory, reverse those actions. I believe the same also applies to Major Episcopal Churches as well.
 
Hail_Linus said:
If I had a dime for every time I have made this mistake I would be rich.😃
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Don’t forget to give 10% to the UGCC 😃

I guess I really had nothing to contribute to this thread so I’m just messing around 😊

I think malphono gave a good description. Patriarchs aren’t just titular or honorary heads, but their powers are determined by the synod and can be taken away or overridden at any time. But for the most part they let him lead over the Church.
 
Well the way a Patriarch sit at the head of a Synod is the model by which the Papacy and Rome should handle affairs with other churches. The patriarch is the first among equals in his synod and leads with love and charity, just as Rome once did before papal supremacists took over the venerable see.
 
Formosus said:
Well the way a Patriarch sit at the head of a Synod is the model by which the Papacy and Rome should handle affairs with other churches. The patriarch is the first among equals in his synod and leads with love and charity, just as Rome once did before papal supremacists took over the venerable see.
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👍
 
I remember the situation with our sainted Confessor, Patriarch Josef.

Rome would go over his head to appoint new bishops (just to let him know for sure he wasn’t a patriarch, I suppose).

That episcopal candidate would, more often than not, travel to Rome to obtain the patriarch’s blessing to accept the appointment.

In one case I’m aware of, when the episcopal candidate did NOT get that blessing, there was quite a nasty demonstration by the laity against him. He came around in time. . .

We like to honour and cherish our Patriarch, to obey him and his Synod and otherwise appreciate him.

The Pope’s portrait is in our churches and we do commemorate him. But other than that, the pope simply does not figure in the daily business at the parish or synodal levels. He’s just “there.”

Had any pope affirmed our patriarchate, as we have been requesting for decades, the situation would be different.

Alex
 
Hail_Linus said:
…
I was wondering about the Eastern Catholic Patriarchs. Are they just figure heads like in the Eastern Orthodox or do they have authority like the Latin Rite Patriarch?
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“The Patriarchs with their Synods are the highest authority for all business of the Patriarchate” (Orientalium Ecclesiarum, n. 9).

The Churches of the East “have the power to govern themselves according to their own disciplines, since these are better suited to the character of their faithful and better adapted to foster the good of souls” (Unitatis redintegratio, n. 16; cf. Orientalium Ecclesiarum, n. 9)
  1. In re-establishing the rights and privileges of the Eastern Catholic Patriarchs as desired by the Council, the Decree Orientalium Ecclesiarum offers us valuable advice: “These rights and privileges are those which existed in the time of union between East and West, although they must be adapted somewhat to present-day conditions” (n. 9).
Blessed Pope John Paul II address to prelates - Codex Canonum Ecclesiarum Orientalium
ewtn.com/library/PAPALDOC/JP2ESTRN.HTM
 
Formosus said:
Well the way a Patriarch sit at the head of a Synod is the model by which the Papacy and Rome should handle affairs with other churches. The patriarch is the first among equals in his synod and leads with love and charity, just as Rome once did before papal supremacists took over the venerable see.
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I am not an expert on this issue but I do know that sadly the Latin Rite has overstepped its authority and interfered with the Eastern Rite’s authority in the past. Especially in the United States. That’s not really the point of this thread but I would welcome another thread on that issue. BTW that invitation is serious. Not that I am interested in debate but I would like to be informed.

As far as the Patriarch of the Latin Rite he really needs to be very strong. In these modern times, the Eastern Catholics are very lucky to have Bishops loyal to orthodoxy. In the Latin Rite we are not so lucky. We have many unorthodox Bishops and Priests that would love to make changes similar to the Anglicans so we do indeed need a strong Patriarch. In fact some times it seems he is not exercising enough authority.
 
Vico said:
“The Patriarchs with their Synods are the highest authority for all business of the Patriarchate” (Orientalium Ecclesiarum, n. 9).

The Churches of the East “have the power to govern themselves according to their own disciplines, since these are better suited to the character of their faithful and better adapted to foster the good of souls” (Unitatis redintegratio, n. 16; cf. Orientalium Ecclesiarum, n. 9)
  1. In re-establishing the rights and privileges of the Eastern Catholic Patriarchs as desired by the Council, the Decree Orientalium Ecclesiarum offers us valuable advice: “These rights and privileges are those which existed in the time of union between East and West, although they must be adapted somewhat to present-day conditions” (n. 9).
Blessed Pope John Paul II address to prelates - Codex Canonum Ecclesiarum Orientalium
ewtn.com/library/PAPALDOC/JP2ESTRN.HTM
Click to expand...
Thank you. This is the type of information I was looking for.
 
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