Question about the Institution of the Eucharist

[Titanjoe]

Hey Guys I need some help,

So a few nights ago i was contemplating the last supper and the institution of the blessed sacrament, and it hit me, the order of events is very odd. My question is since the eucharist brings us into full communion with God, and since humans could not come into full communion with God until the crucifixion, how is it that the Apostles were able to? Since we know that God is perfectly just it seems to me that he would not come into full communion with men because the ultimate sacrifice had not been made.

Not to mention that it contradicts the idea that the lamb must be slaughtered before its flesh is consumed (like the original passover).

Thanks for the Help

 

[Gamera]

Hey Guys I need some help,

So a few nights ago i was contemplating the last supper and the institution of the blessed sacrament, and it hit me, the order of events is very odd. My question is since the eucharist brings us into full communion with God, and since humans could not come into full communion with God until the crucifixion, how is it that the Apostles were able to? Since we know that God is perfectly just it seems to me that he would not come into full communion with men because the ultimate sacrifice had not been made.

Not to mention that it contradicts the idea that the lamb must be slaughtered before its flesh is consumed (like the original passover).

Thanks for the Help

Hi, Titanjoe, and welcome to the board!

“Full communion with God” seems a bit vague, and that’s probably where the confusion starts. Yes, we have access to grace only because of the crucifixion. And yes, God allowed people to enjoy His grace before He was crucified, anticipatorily.

 

[ryanoneil]

It’s a mystery I don’t have the answer to, but I have an observation. I always figured everything is possible with God. Jesus’ sacrifice on the cross was once for all, and applied to those who were long dead and those who wouldn’t be born for centuries. (after and before the fact, so to speak) Why should His unbloody sacrifice be restricted then?

Jesus word is the word of God so I figure if He said it, then it happened. It a miracle I hope to understand some day.

Peace,

Ryan

 

[JimG]

Christ’s sacrifice of Calvary transcends time and space. It was made present sacramentally at the last supper just as it is made sacramentally present to us 2000 years later. It’s all one event to Christ.

 

[Titanjoe]

I understand that the crucifixion transcends time as in all are encompassed by it, but to say that the world (as in reality) would operate as though the crucifixion had already taken place seems to contradict church teachings that Jesus descended into Hell (more appropriately the land of the dead) after his crucifixion to the souls awaiting the pascal sacrifice.

And though the world of the eternal is timeless, it seems as though it is at least in part dependent on earthly time.

 

[JimG]

You can think of time as a continuum, and Jesus at the crucifixion punctures the continuum and connects to other space-time events, reaching back to the last supper and forward to every Mass, to make His one sacrifice present eveywhere and always.

His descent to the dead is not quite the same, since they did not have the Eucharist, yet he preached their salvation and presented it to them–those who were long deceased, yet having salvation present to them, enabling their entrance into heaven.

 

[Randy_Carson]

I understand that the crucifixion transcends time as in all are encompassed by it, but to say that the world (as in reality) would operate as though the crucifixion had already taken place seems to contradict church teachings that Jesus descended into Hell (more appropriately the land of the dead) after his crucifixion to the souls awaiting the pascal sacrifice.

And though the world of the eternal is timeless, it seems as though it is at least in part dependent on earthly time.

I’m not sure the world operated as though the crucifixion had already taken place. There is no reason to believe that the Apostles celebrated Mass on their own in the 24 hours that lapsed between the Last Supper and the Crucifixion.

Therefore, the only person to have consecrated bread and wine prior to Calvary is Jesus Himself, and he can do what He wants!

Hope this helps. :tiphat: