Question About Theft & Making Amends

[Leegal]

The priest may release you from restitution. I feel certain that the priest will not see the restitution as costing $1,600.

 

[Leegal]

I understand he was not your regular confessor and didn’t give you penance or require restitution. I just didn’t understand if he forgave you and you were pardoned by God’s mercy, why your conscience is still so troubled? I would have thought any priest who has been given the power by Christ to forgive and retain sins, would have given penance if he had deemed it necessary for you. In any case, God blessings and His peace be with you.

It’s called moral conscience. Even when the Church, a priest, the Magisterium and any authority does not speak clearly on a subject, we are bound by moral conscience. It’s his conscience that’s bothering him. That the first priest was silent needs clarification – for him.

I think he has a well-formed moral conscience, but I think he needs guidance on restitution because his conscience may be leading him to believe his obligation is far greater than it is. These are, afterall, useless books now to the BOE.

 

[CMatt25]

It’s called moral conscience. Even when the Church, a priest, the Magisterium and any authority does not speak clearly on a subject, we are bound by moral conscience. It’s his conscience that’s bothering him. That the first priest was silent needs clarification – for him.

I think he has a well-formed moral conscience, but I think he needs guidance on restitution because his conscience may be leading him to believe his obligation is far greater than it is. These are, afterall, useless books now to the BOE.

Thanks Leegal. I understood the conscience part. But the “for him” helps me understand further. And I’m guessing then someone else on the otherhand could have walked away after being absolved by the first priest with a conscience more at peace.

 

[Deo_Gratias42]

The text books he would be returning would be outdated and no longer usable. He wants to replace them with equivalent value of present texts. He’s doing what his conscience dictates.

You can no longer send anything through the mails without a return address; it won’t be accepted nor delivered. After 9/11 and the Anthrax mailings of 2001 that has changed. He now is at a school 140 miles away from the two schools the books belonged to.

I think he’s thought this all out well beforehand and wants to do the right thing by his conscience.

I’m not talking about mailing stuff. I’m talking about returning the stuff in person. 140 miles isn’t that far to return stuff anyway.

Why not just do a donation to the school for the amount of the textbooks then? You don’t have to say what it’s for. This is what we get people do who were caught shoplifting, except the minimum amount starts at $100. Really, save up the money every month. Cut out something that is not a fixed cost,so you have the extra money and then just make a donation to the school. Really, it’s not worth having a panic attack over.

 

[rhiannonh]

If you are sincere as I believe you are, about returning the actual books then the cost of postage will not deter you unless that leads you into debt itself. But you could save up for the postage/travel fare. Apart of your punishment one could say, to save up and swallow the pride about cost of postage or travel fare to return them. Its worthless that the cost of postage is more than the books etc. For it will give you piece of mind. That is what you are seeking isn’t it? Perhaps too that having to put your name on the parcel will help you with the punishment of growing closer to God. Not that I like the term punishment as what we are given is meant to help us to grow/overcome. After all 140 mile away, then are hardly going to send the school bully around are they to sort you out are they. I think you can be strong enough to admitt who you are and this will help you achieve peace of mind.

Does the school have a website? If so you could browse on there and see if there are any funds you could contribute to if you really feel the cost of sending the books is too great.

But I think in retrospect, you are worried about this, I can see that, but somehow even anonymously returing the books might not give you the peace you are seeking for? Share it all at confession because hopefully your confessor does know who you are more than any of us and know the right course of action to help you put the matter behind you. Share what you have shared here in full.
God be with you

 

[runningdude]

Sin damages one’s soul, and the world. Confession heals the soul, and restitution and penance help heal the world.

Many of these suggestions about making restitution, simply put, are ridiculous.

Confession as offered today is absolutely anonymous. You are under no obligation to risk revealing what was confessed during the sacrament. In the grand scheme of thing, two textbooks and a pen are fairly worthless, especially when compared to one’s immortal soul that was saved during confession.

Keeping and benefiting from the textbooks is not right. Restitution would be donating the books to charity. The pen’s value is so trivial that merely throwing it in the trash, or conveniently losing it would count as restitution.

Donating to the school could be an option, but it is not necessary. If privacy is a concern, most school have a PTO or alumni association, through which a donation could be discretely made. The funds would be used to meet whatever the schools current needs are, without revealing the motive for the donation.

 

[johnofdamascus]

If you are sincere as I believe you are, about returning the actual books then the cost of postage will not deter you unless that leads you into debt itself. But you could save up for the postage/travel fare. Apart of your punishment one could say, to save up and swallow the pride about cost of postage or travel fare to return them. Its worthless that the cost of postage is more than the books etc. For it will give you piece of mind. That is what you are seeking isn’t it? Perhaps too that having to put your name on the parcel will help you with the punishment of growing closer to God. Not that I like the term punishment as what we are given is meant to help us to grow/overcome. After all 140 mile away, then are hardly going to send the school bully around are they to sort you out are they. I think you can be strong enough to admitt who you are and this will help you achieve peace of mind.

But I think in retrospect, you are worried about this, I can see that, but somehow even anonymously returing the books might not give you the peace you are seeking for? Share it all at confession because hopefully your confessor does know who you are more than any of us and know the right course of action to help you put the matter behind you. Share what you have shared here in full.
God be with you

It is not the cost of postage that worried me, it was my estimate of what the profit lost would be for the items stole. In Catholic moral theology when it comes to restitution three things are in order:* to make restitution of them, or to return the equivalent in kind or in money, if the goods have disappeared, as well as the profit or advantages their owner would have legitimately obtained from them.* (Catechism 2412)

Depending on what my confessor tells me to do I will do it, whether it be just simply returning the books, replacing it monetarily, or if he dispenses me from restitution completely.

As far as telling my name and “confessing” to the crime to those that I have taken from, the Catechism says: Every offense committed against justice and truth entails the duty of reparation, even if its author has been forgiven. When it is impossible publicly to make reparation for a wrong, it must be made secretly. If someone who has suffered harm cannot be directly compensated, he must be given moral satisfaction in the name of charity. (Catechism 2487).

So in a way, you are correct, but again, I will ask the advice of my confessor.

 

[AHapka]

I’m not talking about mailing stuff. I’m talking about returning the stuff in person. 140 miles isn’t that far to return stuff anyway.

Why not just do a donation to the school for the amount of the textbooks then? You don’t have to say what it’s for. This is what we get people do who were caught shoplifting, except the minimum amount starts at $100. Really, save up the money every month. Cut out something that is not a fixed cost,so you have the extra money and then just make a donation to the school. Really, it’s not worth having a panic attack over.

Ok, I agree with this.

When I confessed that a shop had once given me and my wife a free set of tires (which wasn’t noticed at payment, cause we had a ton of stuff done, didn’t catch it until late), my confessor stated that we should donate to a charity.

I understand your desire to strictly follow the Catechism, it is wise and good. However, the priest sits in Persona Christi. He alone is your judge in regard to the penance for those sins over us. Perhaps he was silent because the Spirit moved him so. We don’t know.

Before making any decisions, PLEASE speak with your confessor again. Do not make decisions purely based on an Internet forum.

Now in my personal opinion, an anonymous donation is really the way to go. Recycle the books and make the donation if you must.

 

[rhiannonh]

Sounds like you know your own answer now of what you want to happen :-}

It does not matter how much the monetary value ie, that the price of the travel or sending the books back by post is too much in worthness. You are concerned about doing the confession justice and following it through whole. If cost is not the issue-just the worthy of it, then to catch a bus/plane and take the books back in person and saying sorry to the school secretary etc will be the only relevant peace of mind. Going that extra mile for our sins. Its a bit extreme may be in my opinion but we all have our differences.

 

[fred_conty]

If the package needs a return address, just put the school address as a
return address. Or make up one.

You also do not have to go to confession to seek advice. Ask for
advice from the forum members right here on CAF. If it makes you
more comfortable ask for one of the priests to answer your question.

If you need money, ask St. Joseph, he’s good at that.

 

[rhiannonh]

Confession is about being sorry isn’t it? not about seeking advice. Though yes we do receive advice via confession too but the main purpose of confession is being truelly sorry for our sins. In which case you do not have to do anything and if you concerned about the books in your possession, then leave them at a charity shop. Do you have them in USA? The concern over your punishment shouldnt really figure because It not what your punishment would be that brings you to confession. What brings you to confession is that you know that it is a sin and that you are sorry. The punishment like I said before aims to help you spiritually grow. Your confessor may say nothing about returning books because that is what you are kind of expecting. The punishment should aim to help you spiritually grow, rather than just ease your mind. Which is important too but that is not the main aim of confession. Punishment is a wrong word through and through because its about growth. Confession is about being sorry for the sin.
I think you may be focusing to much on Catholic Law and trying to do the confessors job for him. Not ‘our’ role. If you know you have done wrong and are sorry then simply confess. What comes next will depend on how your confessor sees the way forward for you to spiritually grow to help you through sins.
Peace be with you