Question about when and why to have kids

[BlueEyedLady]

It’s naive to think that people never change their minds and their priorities. Many women, once they are married, feel a strong pull towards motherhood even if they might not have been super keen on the idea before marriage.

It’s called growth. It’s called change. As a couple, you figure out how to deal with it.

You can discuss all you want before you marry, that just doesn’t mean you won’t or can’t change your mind later. It happens. That is why, IMHO, it is important that you both have the same come from in life-- the same values, beliefs, and core aspects of faith. Because her “come from” is the Catholic faith, she is easily moving towards motherhood and being open to life. Because his “come from” is something else entirely he is not moving along in the same direction she is-- this will be true throughout their marriage as she grows and matures in the faith and he does not. It will be quite difficult for them.

Of course people grow and change, that’s a good thing. But to singlehandedly change an agreement that the marriage probably wouldn’t have happened without is wrong.

 

[pconwell]

And that is difficult when you have problems even putting food on the table for them, or when you cannot spend time with them or even have a healthful living environment for them. No one, including the OP, is advocating waiting until they the couple can afford a mansion and wait staff for the children. At the same time, it’s extremely uncharitable and irresponsible to assume that the OP is wrong or lying to us. Nor is it our place to challenge his statement, even if we feel we have good reason to do it. At least wait until the OP’s question has gotten answered.

And to the poster(s) saying that the poorest person in the US is still richer than people elsewhere, that’s a totally vacuous argument unless the cost of living is the same.

OP, your wife needs to be open to life at all times. I suggest that you discuss this matter with her and a priest.

I think that the question can be rewritten as follows, if it helps: is a couple obligated to get pregnant within a set amount of time?

Thanks for this. I was afraid everyone would be against me here because I’m not Catholic (well, more because I am an atheist, I mean).

 

[pconwell]

What does your wife say about this? Sit down and look at the numbers together. Does she understand how much your debt payment is and how much you would need to earn to allow her to stay home? Is she willing to sacrifice being a stay at home mom in order to have kids right away? Or does she expect you to go into more debt in order thats he can stay home with the kids?

I don’t see how you are preventing her from following her faith. There’s nothing sinful about taking medication that temporarily renders her infertile, and there’s no obligation to seek pregnancy if in discernment a couple has decided to postpone having children for the time being. On the other hand, marriage is for children. That’s one of the primary and fundamental purposes of marriage. Saying she’s “forcing” you to have children is like going to a water park and then complaining that your friends are forcing you to get wet.

My advice to you is to keep up respectful dialogue. Don’t belittle her desire to be a mother and all the meanwhile pay off the debt as fast as you can so you’ll have more options when it comes to starting a family. My advice to her (if she’s reading this or if you care to share it) would be to start saying rosaries for your conversion.

God bless.

Here’s my question. What happens when I sit down with her and show her we cannot afford to have a kid right now, and she still wants to have one? We have sat down and looked at the numbers and she said “it will work out”. She has a valid point - it’s not like we would literally starve to death, but we would probably have to move in with my parents.

She would quit her job to raise the child (which I support 100%), but we couldn’t afford to live where we do, which means we would have to move (as in move in with parents) and I would have to quit my job. Then, neither one of would have a job and we would be a burden on my parents. They live in middle of nowhere, so it’s not like I could get some high paying job on which I could support “my” family.

Next question. Just to make sure we are clear, she can either 1) take the birth control, or 2) get pregnant. It’s not like she has to take the birth control. If she needs to be open to life, and pregnancy is one of the things that will help her condition, is she not morally obligated to try to get pregnant?

We do have a (fairly) respectful dialog. I’m not going to lie and say that I always keep my cool, but - for the most part - we have a pretty good relationship, communication, etc.

… and yes, she is already praying for my conversion. I’m not sure if she is doing rosaries or not, but, well…

 

[pconwell]

Of course people grow and change, that’s a good thing. But to singlehandedly change an agreement that the marriage probably wouldn’t have happened without is wrong.

I understand people change, and I’m not upset about her changing. I just don’t like feeling as though I’m being forced into something that I know is a bad idea. It’s not that I think it’s a bad idea even, just bad timing. If I could have one year, maybe two, she could have whatever she wanted - but I feel like I’m between a rock and a hard place. I can either force her hand against her beliefs, or I can work on making a baby and do something that I feel is morally wrong (bringing a child into the world when we are not capable of caring for it responsibly).

 

[lifeisbeautiful]

Is the main impediment the fact that you cannot afford your home if your wife stops working?
Could you put your home on the market just to see if it would sell for what you need it to sell for (I know the market is bad), and look for a cheaper option you can afford on one salary? Could you afford your home if you cut down on other things (satellite/cable, cell plans, etc)?

I think it is great that you care so much about your wife’s faith that you have come here trying to understand where she is coming from. I disagree with the idea that she is using her faith to get what she wants, she can very well feel that the right thing for your marriage right now is to be open to kids. I understand it must be tough for you, though, because for many Catholics faith and trust in God is what has helped them be at peace with being open to children when people without faith and trust in God would have thought it was a bad time to do so (and I am not saying Catholics do not believe in being responsible, but there are different perceptions of what responsible can mean when it comes to being open to children). I don’t think she is wrong in what she is doing (I’ll join her in praying for your conversion ), but in a mixed marriage I know this kind of situation can be tough for everyone involved, since your moral compasses are guiding you in opposite directions (which is another reason why I believe there is only one Truth ). It is something you guys will just need to talk about and try to find a way to resolve. Maybe she can speak with a priest that can help her sort through this, or maybe both of you together can do so? I really don’t have a solution, but I do think it is a very good sign that you want to support her living her faith even if you don’t share it.

 

[Apagano]

Something to keep in mind is that there is no guarantee that you can get pregnant easily. What happens if you both decide, ‘ok, let’s wait one year. Then we’ll try.’ and it takes you two more years to conceive? With her being on the pill and having hormonal issues it could take a long time to conceive a child. There is never a guarantee. It takes the average couple 4 months of unprotected sex to conceive. Just something to think about.

 

[St_Francis]

I think that there is more than one issue here.

The first is the issue of your wife’s health. If it is simply a matter of pain at certain times, there may be dietary changes that she can make (drastically reduce salt intake and increase potassium–I had this problem and that worked for me after several years of either screaming pain or being zombified by painkillers), or there may be other options if her problem is a different one than what I had. But all that the pill is doing is masking the symptoms and possibly causing other problems. And there are moral issues about this which her priest may not have fully understood.

The next issue is that of y’all’s having a baby. Well, that’s a tough one. Is there any way that the two of you can compromise? For example, cut back on expenses so you can pay off the debt (some people would advocate living on your income while using hers to pay off the debt and saving), or she could move into an area of her work which she could continue to do at home or part-time, buying a slightly run-down house that the two of you can fix up… stuff like that. As someone pointed out, it may take a while before she becomes pregnant, and it will definitely be 9 months before the baby comes. I think you have valid concerns, but I also think that there is a lot of room for compromise if the two of you are imaginative.

 

[pconwell]

I think that there is more than one issue here.

The first is the issue of your wife’s health. If it is simply a matter of pain at certain times, there may be dietary changes that she can make (drastically reduce salt intake and increase potassium–I had this problem and that worked for me after several years of either screaming pain or being zombified by painkillers), or there may be other options if her problem is a different one than what I had. But all that the pill is doing is masking the symptoms and possibly causing other problems. And there are moral issues about this which her priest may not have fully understood.

The next issue is that of y’all’s having a baby. Well, that’s a tough one. Is there any way that the two of you can compromise? For example, cut back on expenses so you can pay off the debt (some people would advocate living on your income while using hers to pay off the debt and saving), or she could move into an area of her work which she could continue to do at home or part-time, buying a slightly run-down house that the two of you can fix up… stuff like that. As someone pointed out, it may take a while before she becomes pregnant, and it will definitely be 9 months before the baby comes. I think you have valid concerns, but I also think that there is a lot of room for compromise if the two of you are imaginative.

She has cysts. If she doesn’t take birth control, they will come back. It is painful, but it’s not just pain.

As far as salary stuff - that’s exactly what we do. We “live” of my salary, while her entire check goes into our debt.

As far as it may take a while, NO ONE can know how long it could take, she might get pregnant next week, if we tried, or possibly never with the scaring she had when her last cyst ruptured. It’s not prudent nor helpful advice to say “well, it might take a while”.

 

[CDB1718]

I wonder if your wife is now feeling guilt for using birth control. While she might have been taking it for a medical reason before, the issue of it causing infertility might not have been a concern. Now that she wants to have children, maybe she is keenly aware that the medicine she’s taking is what is preventing her from being able to. Maybe she does not feel like your marriage is currently open to life. Maybe she’s resentful and blames you.

A lot of marriages work through this issue. You being on different pages with religious beliefs is a complicating factor, but the real issue of when you’re ready to have children is something that isn’t unique to Catholics.

She’s telling you that she thinks you’re ready and she wants to start now. You’re telling her that you don’t think you’re ready and you want to wait. She probably feels like you’re unyielding and uncompromising, don’t understand, refuse to listen… You probably feel like she’s pulled the rug out from underneath you, is being impractical, doesn’t understand and refuses to listen… You’re talking past each other right now.

Because she’s been on birth control, it can take up to 6 months for her cycle to return to normal.
Because she has a hormone disorder, it can take longer than usual to return to normal and can take longer than usual to conceive.
Depending on her hormonal disorder, she might be infertile or have low fertility. “Trying” can take a year. After that point, deciding if you want to pursue medical treatments like clomid or ovary drilling to increase fertility can increase already strained emotional and financial stress.
It is possible that she might not get pregnant even with interventions. It is also possible that she will resent you and blame you for not trying sooner and for her staying on birth control longer than she wanted, as if her window of opportunity was shattered.
It’s possible that she could get pregnant even on birth control and with her disorder, or could right after going off of it.

Our advice to you if you were Catholic would be to pray together and put your focus on the joint goal of loving and serving the Lord. By doing that, you’d be able to have a shared vision and to support each other through the difficulties of living it out. It’s harder to give advice since you are an atheist. We can’t recommend that she follow your lead because you aren’t seeking to follow God. I’m not saying this to be mean, just to let you know the Catholic perspective.

What we’re left to deal with is a woman whose biological clock is ticking loudly in her ear, who might feel like she is contracepting and avoiding being open to life and therefore having tension in her spiritual life and her marital life, and a man who does not feel prepared enough to seek out parenthood. At 25 and 28, you aren’t “young” for parenthood, but your debt is going to especially weigh heavily on you as you’re going to be the primary (and only) breadwinner. There might be more pressing on her, like poor job prospects or a sense of fear or futility in getting a job when she wants to be home. This is a hard spot you two are in. There’s no right or wrong answer.

1. See if there is a different way to regulate her hormone disorder. A lot of docs tell you it’s BCPs or pregnancy when it isn’t. We know your wife wants pregnancy right now so she might not be happy with other choices, but you should be aware of the options. The Pope Paul VI institute might be able to help, depending on the problem. This will remove the spiritual tension at least.
2. Look into NFP. Offer it to her as a way to work with her and show your love and openness to life. A lot of the NFP curriculum will reinforce your concerns about responsible family planning and will reinforce her concerns over being open to life, so you’ll both hear it from a source other than your spouse, which makes it easier sometimes to return home and talk together. That will remove the medical tension.
3. List out your priorities. Don’t argue or minimize your wife’s priorities. Really hear what your wife is saying. Be honest about where you are. Kind, but clear. That will remove the problem about not feeling heard.
4. Make a budget. Make 5, for that matter. One for every possible scenario. See how they compare. Choose one together. That might take weeks of revisiting the discussion. Having a definite end date makes it easier to work through something you aren’t happy about. If she knows that you’ll support her fully in 1.5 years if she supports you fully now it will be a lot easier. No moving the hoop, so plan wisely. That will get you both on the same page and working toward the same goal.
5. Support her and be gentle with her in other areas. Recognize that she’s working hard to put you first and make sure you do the same for her. Affirm her desires. Tell her that she’s going to be an amazing mother. Let her know that you know what she’s going through and that you’re there with her. That will remove the issue of her feeling alone and like you don’t understand.
6. Don’t forget date night and connecting as a couple. You might be in this conversation for a long, long time depending on her fertility. You can’t control the fact that you will have different desires and be on a different page when it comes to that, so make sure you’re connected in other ways.