Question for [indult] TLMers

[ABostonCatholic]

There were also fasting days known as Rogation Days and Ember Days, where the faithful would fast and pray against natural disasters and for a plentiful harvest. These are just some differences I can name off the top of my head.

So perhaps we should have been looking to the post-v2 fathers as a scape goat after Katrina rather than Bush or Mike Brown seriously, though, why give up praying for these things?

 

[Freshman88]

The big difference is that the NO calendar has done away with Sundays after Epiphany and Pentecost. It’s all Ordinary time now. Also the NO is on a 3-yr cycle with its Propers so following it with a missal may prove to be frustrating.

I realize that the NO is on a three year cycle, but what is the TLM on? a one year cycle? is that advantageous? what’s the reason for a three year cycle?

Anywho, thanks for all the posts regarding this subtopic and thanks a lot to the above poster for the link.

 

[Swiss_Guard]

I go to the Tridentine Mass on Sundays, unless I’m reading at the Novus Ordo Mass. I will usually go to a Tridentine Mass at a different time.

My parish has the Tridentine Mass at 10:00 on Sundays, but there’s a Novus Ordo Mass at the same time. The Tridentine Mass is in the lower church.

I go to the Tridentine Mass during the week when I can. I’ve been fortunate this week to go to the Tridentine Mass on the feast of St. Joseph as well as last night and tonight. Shrine of Christ the King Sovereign Priest on the south side of Chicago had a High Mass for the feast of St. Benedict tonight. He is one of the patrons of the Institute of Christ the King Sovereign Priest. They also have the perpetual novena to St. Therese of Leseiux every Tuesday. Mass is at 6:30 followed by the novena and ending with benediction.

St. John Cantius has the Tridentine Mass every Wednesday evening at 7:30 which is preceeded by the novena to St. Monica at 7:00. They also have the Tridentine Mass on First Fridays at 7:30 in the evening. This Monday for the feast of the Annunciation they will have the Golden Mass at 5:00 in the morning. It’s a little too early for me, so I’ll go to the Shrine of Christ the King for Mass at 6:30 in the evening.

I go to the Novus Ordo Mass during the week when I can’t get to the Tridentine Mass. I almost always go at my parish. I will go to a church in Elgin to see a friend of mine who is a priest there. I knew him before he even thought of becoming a priest.

I am truly blessed to have so many Tridentine Masses near me. I pray for the universal indult to come out soon and that more Tridentine Masses will be made available to everyone.

 

[Swiss_Guard]

I realize that the NO is on a three year cycle, but what is the TLM on? a one year cycle? is that advantageous? what’s the reason for a three year cycle?

Anywho, thanks for all the posts regarding this subtopic and thanks a lot to the above poster for the link.

The Tridentine Mass is on a one year cycle. The readings for Sundays and holy days never change, as well as for the weekdays of Lent.

The Tridentine Mass doesn’t have daily readings like the Novus Ordo Mass. The Tridentine Mass will take the reading for the saint of the day in the proper if there is one or in the common readings. Votive Masses also have their own readings. When there is no feast being celebrated, which is known as a feria, the priest can take the Mass of the preceding Sunday or a Votive Mass. There are Votive Masses for each day of the week. Monday is for the Holy Trinity. Tuesday is for the Angels. Wednesday is for Sts. Peter and Paul or all the Apostles. Thursday is for the Holy Spirit or the Blessed Sacrament. Friday is for the Holy Cross, Passion of Our Lord Jesus Christ, or the Sacred Heart. Saturday is for Our Lady.

There are also various Votive Masses that can be offered on feria day. Some include in time of war, for the healing of schism, for the propogation of the faith, for peace, in time of pestilence, for the forgivesness of sins, for the sick, and for the grace of a holy and happy death.

The reason for the three year cycle is that it covers the entire bible. If you go to the Novus Ordo Mass every Sunday for three years straight you will hear the entire bible. I prefer the one year cycle because it gives us a familiarity with the readings. We can then go and read more on our own.

There was also a consistency with the readings that can’t be found now. For example, during holy week in the Tridentine Mass, the Passion according to St. Matthew is read on Palm Sunday, the Passion according to St. Mark is read on Tuesday, the Passion according to St. Luke is read on Wednesday, and the Passion according to St. John is read on Good Friday. Now the Passion according to St. Matthew, St. Mark, and St. Luke rotate on a three year basis. The Passion according to St. John is still read on Good Friday. Instead of hearing all four Passion accounts during holy week, we now only hear two of them.

You’re asking many good questions. I hope my answers have been a help to you.

 

[Psalm45_9]

So perhaps we should have been looking to the post-v2 fathers as a scape goat after Katrina rather than Bush or Mike Brown seriously, though, why give up praying for these things?

Ember and Rogation days were removed from the Universal Calendar, but they can and are still observed in individual dioceses. Those who were affected by Katrina might want to petition to their bishops to re-incorporate Rogation Days on their calendar.

 

[Freshman88]

The Tridentine Mass is on a one year cycle. The readings for Sundays and holy days never change, as well as for the weekdays of Lent.

The Tridentine Mass doesn’t have daily readings like the Novus Ordo Mass. The Tridentine Mass will take the reading for the saint of the day in the proper if there is one or in the common readings. Votive Masses also have their own readings. When there is no feast being celebrated, which is known as a feria, the priest can take the Mass of the preceding Sunday or a Votive Mass. There are Votive Masses for each day of the week. Monday is for the Holy Trinity. Tuesday is for the Angels. Wednesday is for Sts. Peter and Paul or all the Apostles. Thursday is for the Holy Spirit or the Blessed Sacrament. Friday is for the Holy Cross, Passion of Our Lord Jesus Christ, or the Sacred Heart. Saturday is for Our Lady.

There are also various Votive Masses that can be offered on feria day. Some include in time of war, for the healing of schism, for the propogation of the faith, for peace, in time of pestilence, for the forgivesness of sins, for the sick, and for the grace of a holy and happy death.

The reason for the three year cycle is that it covers the entire bible. If you go to the Novus Ordo Mass every Sunday for three years straight you will hear the entire bible. I prefer the one year cycle because it gives us a familiarity with the readings. We can then go and read more on our own.

There was also a consistency with the readings that can’t be found now. For example, during holy week in the Tridentine Mass, the Passion according to St. Matthew is read on Palm Sunday, the Passion according to St. Mark is read on Tuesday, the Passion according to St. Luke is read on Wednesday, and the Passion according to St. John is read on Good Friday. Now the Passion according to St. Matthew, St. Mark, and St. Luke rotate on a three year basis. The Passion according to St. John is still read on Good Friday. Instead of hearing all four Passion accounts during holy week, we now only hear two of them.

You’re asking many good questions. I hope my answers have been a help to you.

Oh I appreciate this so very much! Thank you brother!
I can’t get enough of Traditionalist Catholicism. Everything is starting to come together. I absolutely despise modernism and liberalism, and it appears as though I’ve found the cure. Every detail I find interesting. Again, thank you!

 

[Chatter163]

Ember and Rogation days were removed from the Universal Calendar, but they can and are still observed in individual dioceses. Those who were affected by Katrina might want to petition to their bishops to re-incorporate Rogation Days on their calendar.

I once wrote an article for a national newsletter that asked for evidence of any ember or rogation observances in North America, and no one ever responded. This makes me quite curious. Would you please identify dioceses that still observe these days, as well as the nature of the observances? Thanks.

 

[Psalm45_9]

I once wrote an article for a national newsletter that asked for evidence of any ember or rogation observances in North America, and no one ever responded. This makes me quite curious. Would you please identify dioceses that still observe these days, as well as the nature of the observances? Thanks.

I myself do not know any dioceses in this country that still observe these days. When I asked this question last year about these days, I was told that observance of them is optional. I am assuming portions of Europe that are say prone to flooding and volcanic erruptions probably still observe rogation days.

 

[Psalm45_9]

Oh I appreciate this so very much! Thank you brother!
I can’t get enough of Traditionalist Catholicism. Everything is starting to come together. I absolutely despise modernism and liberalism, and it appears as though I’ve found the cure. Every detail I find interesting. Again, thank you!

During the Paschal Triduum there was also the public prayer of Matins and Lauds known as the Tenebrea. It was really the funeral service for Jesus, before the 1950’s it was said on the nights preceeding the actual day the prayers were intended for. Prayers for Maundy Thursday were said on Spy Wednesday evening for example. There was a triangular candle holder that as each one of the Lamentations of Jeremiah was read, one would be extinguished. When there was one left, it was placed behind the altar and the church would be in complete darkness. Then everyone would bang their brievraries on the pew representing the earthquake that occured at Jesus death. After the 1950’s this service was returned to the morning of the actual days. Matins and Lauds have been revised yet again in the 70’s there are no readings from Lamentations now.

However, I have been told that the Tenebrae can still be said in the evening of the proceeding day, but it is a revised version. I have cannot find the rubrics for this revised Tenebrae on the internet.

 

[lak611]

During the Paschal Triduum there was also the public prayer of Matins and Lauds known as the Tenebrea. It was really the funeral service for Jesus, before the 1950’s it was said on the nights preceeding the actual day the prayers were intended for. Prayers for Maundy Thursday were said on Spy Wednesday evening for example. There was a triangular candle holder that as each one of the Lamentations of Jeremiah was read, one would be extinguished. When there was one left, it was placed behind the altar and the church would be in complete darkness. Then everyone would bang their brievraries on the pew representing the earthquake that occured at Jesus death. After the 1950’s this service was returned to the morning of the actual days. Matins and Lauds have been revised yet again in the 70’s there are no readings from Lamentations now.

However, I have been told that the Tenebrae can still be said in the evening of the proceeding day, but it is a revised version. I have cannot find the rubrics for this revised Tenebrae on the internet.

My NO parish is having Tenebrae on Wednesday in Holy Week. I’ll see if I can find out what the readings are if I attend the service.

 

[Psalm45_9]

My NO parish is having Tenebrae on Wednesday in Holy Week. I’ll see if I can find out what the readings are if I attend the service.

I pray the Divine Office (revised version). The revised versions of Matins and Lauds for these days are not any different in structure from Matain and Lauds any other days. So my confusion is if what is called the Tenebrea today is a revised version of the old Tenebrae or just praying the offices as they are found in the brievrary. I will be eagerly awaiting to hear about what you experienced.

 

[lak611]

I pray the Divine Office (revised version). The revised versions of Matins and Lauds for these days are not any different in structure from Matain and Lauds any other days. So my confusion is if what is called the Tenebrea today is a revised version of the old Tenebrae or just praying the offices as they are found in the brievrary. I will be eagerly awaiting to hear about what you experienced.

They usually have a little pamphlet in the pews with the readings. I’ll see if I can borrow one. If I can, I’ll list what readings were read.