Question from protestant

[INRI]

There is a principle, I think it comes from either the Dominicans or the Jesuits, that states that we should always assume the most charitable interpretation of another’s actions. It is seldom that a person acts out of pure mendacity, but usually has some good motive that maybe gets misinterpreted by others. The uncharitable attitudes that you have seen on this website (and I have been occasionally guilty), you will also see on Protestant websites that attack the Catholic Church. Just the nature of the beast when you’re talking apologetics, I guess.

Egg,
I am glad you have found Christ. You have a spirtual life that seems to mirror that of a priest! (if you don’t mind me saying so). I too went through a period of time when I rejected the Catholic Church of my upbringing and joined that fastest-growing of all denominations, the “non-denominational” church. I loved their sense of fellowship and the liveliness of their faith. However, there was a certain shallowness there, and the first time that I felt my faith challenged, I crumbled like a house of cards and became agnostic for probably a good 8 years. Having returned to the church, I have found such deep and lasting friendships that mirror some of the best I found in my Protestant days. And a spirituality that is as deep and as wide as the ocean (John of the Cross, Teresa of Avila)! As G.K. Chesterton once said, the church is ever so much larger when looked at from the inside!

The other posters are right when they say that Protestants and Catholics have a different conception of church. Protestants, and I realize I making a generalization, emphasize a very individual relationship with Christ. This individualistic approach is very appealing to us as Americans living in a democracy. One can then find the church that meets our expectation of what the church should be. The Catholic would say that that is backwards. The Catholic looks, not to find a church that conforms to what he thinks the church should be, but to see if he can conform himself to the idea of the church as CHRIST thinks it should be. Other posters have commented on the Eucharist as part of our relationship with Christ, I will not elaborate further. We also have a great conception, sadly a little atrophied these days, of the church as the body of Christ, and our fellow parishioners as members of a great extended family. I would say this sense is somewhat lost in the typical “suburbia parish” where the homilies are as soft and mushy as the seat cushions in the pews. But, remember the parable of the weeds and the wheat!!

I am glad that you have decided to talk to a priest. Just be aware that if he is unable to answer you questions it does not mean that there are no answers. There was a period of time in the 70’s and 80’s when seminary training was atrocious. This has improved a lot in the 90’s and 00’s, but the upshot is that you can’t just go to any random priest and expect him to give good answers. I might suggest you check out the “Ask an Apologist Forum”, you should get good and charitable answers there. Otherwise, the youngest priests (ask for the associate pastor) may be your best bet.

Finally, I would say that God is moving in your church. The Catholic conception of church as properly understood means that we believe that the grace of God is not confined to the visible boundaries of the Catholic Church. It also spills out in other churches to the extent that they remain faithful to the true faith as given by Christ.

 

[mercygate]

Egg4christ:

You all bring up excellent points. yeah, if i’m looking for the love of christ, it might be hard to find in these forums. But i think christians are called to be as loving as possible at all times. Granted, Mister Rogers may have difficulty fighting back the gates of hell, but Rambo is gonna have trouble convicing anyone in a loving God.

One of my favorite quotes: “What did Mr. Rogers ever do that would have got him crucified?”

I prefer to know people rather than thier statments of beliefs.

This can be problematic in a Church whose faith is simple but whose theology has been contending with the world, the flesh and the devil for two thousand years. Go with what the Church teaches, not with individual interpretation. The Teaching Church is guaranteed by the Holy Spirit to be free from error in doctrine, but the Church we live in is full of sinners.

I find a difficult crossroads. I know i am right. I have found God, i know that distinctly. Yet many of the catholic’s I’ve talked to seem like good christians. So this leaves two choices. One, people are faking it(i find that not very probable), people don’t really know what God really is(kinda like faking it, more innocent) or telling the truth. And if it’s true, and you can reach God through the catholic church, and you can reach God through the protestant church, then at some point, our fundamental beliefs should be the same, if not very similar. But the more i search, the more it seems like we have different requirements for salvation. One of us must be wrong. For it to be in my church, I can’t see God laying his hand of blessing on something so terribly wrong. Anyone else make sense of my dilema?

I really don’t understand the question.

A final note, regarding the importance of doctorine; Yes, it’s important. But the question is how important.

For me, Joe Sixpack, basic doctrine is important to a degree in order to approach Christ on his terms. I do not need to know all the refinements of the doctrine of the hypostatic union to live my life in Christ. However, it is VERY important that the CHURCH have a grasp of these critical issues, and because Our Lord has promised that “the gates of hell will not prevail against it,” I can relax and leave the theologizing to those who have that calling.

. . . what is most important, someone’s salvation.

 

[Katholikos]

-------------------------------------
Ahhh…but see how he described the “lost” soul?
You are a kind and trusting person.
When I read this unkind and unloving comment I decided this particular thread was a just a guise for more catholic-bashing.

Catholics are UNLOVING you see? And they’re hellbound to boot!

I second the motion, Lorarose. I read Egg4Christ’s posts carefully, with a Protestant filter (it takes one to know one), and I suspect that his plan was to try to find a priest not to inquire about Catholic doctrine, but to confront him with “Bible truths” and show him the error of his ways. ‘Cause out of all the thousands of Protestant denominations, his biblical interpretation is the TRUTH, and nuthin’ but the TRUTH, don’tchaknow. Betcha.

Egg, if you’re still with us, hang around. There is only one correct interpretation of the Bible – and that’s the one the Apostles taught. You’ll find it here – in the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church founded by Christ for the salvation of the world.

Peace be to all who post at Catholic Answers.

JMJ Jay
Ex-Southern Baptist, ex-atheist, ex-agnostic, ecstatic to be Catholic!

 

[gardenswithkids]

-------------------------------------
Ahhh…but see how he described the “lost” soul?
You are a kind and trusting person.
When I read this unkind and unloving comment I decided this particular thread was a just a guise for more catholic-bashing.

Catholics are UNLOVING you see? And they’re hellbound to boot!

Let’s just suppose for the sake of argument that Lorarose and Katholikos are right and this post is just another excuse for Catholic bashing. So what.

Sadly, I think I have met some unloving Catholics who might be hellbound too. And as I hold to Catholic doctrine and believe that we can forfeit our salvation, I pray that I am not one of those.

Even if this thread was started to bash Catholics (which I doubt), it serves as a reminder that we are called to be charitable at all times to all people, including those who persecute us.

 

[Katholikos]

gardenswithkids:

Even if this thread was started to bash Catholics (which I doubt), it serves as a reminder that we are called to be charitable at all times to all people, including those who persecute us.

Hi, GWK, I fail to see how acknowledging that I recognize what *may *be Egg’s intention qualifies as being “unloving” or “uncharitable” toward him (or her).

I learned the lingo and recognize the clues from my own experience, having been brought up on hatred, disgust, and mistrust of the “Whore of Babylon” (the Catholic Church) led by the “antichrist,” (the Pope). Much Sunday School time and pulpit preaching was consumed denouncing Catholics who were assuredly “hell-bound” unless they left their apostate Church and became true “Bible-believers.” I was fed a steady diet of anti-Catholicism for many years.

But I don’t reciprocate. Since my conversion, I have never presumed any Protestant (***or ***Catholic!) to be “hell-bound,” since the Church teaches that God alone knows the heart and is the judge of souls.

Egg hasn’t posted in a while; he seems to have disappeared. Perhaps this was a “hit and run” thread. I hope not. I sincerely wish all Protestants would learn what the Church actually teaches.

As Bishop Sheen wrote, “There are not over a hundred people in the United States who hate the Catholic Church. There are millions, however, who hate what they wrongly believe to be the Catholic Church – which is, of course, quite a different thing.”

God bless and Mary keep, Jay

 

[Katholikos]

gardenswithkids:

Even if this thread was started to bash Catholics (which I doubt), it serves as a reminder that we are called to be charitable at all times to all people, including those who persecute us.

Hi, GWK, I fail to see how acknowledging that I recognize what *may *be Egg’s intention qualifies as being “unloving” or “uncharitable” toward him.

I learned the lingo and recognize the clues from my own experience, having been brought up on hatred, disgust, and mistrust of the “Whore of Babylon” (the Catholic Church) led by the “antichrist,” (the Pope). Much time in Sunday School and preaching from the pulpit was consumed denouncing Catholics who were judged “hell-bound” unless they left the Church and became true “Bible-believers.” I was fed a steady diet of anti-Catholicism for many years.

But I don’t reciprocate. Since my conversion, I have never presumed any Protestant (***or ***Catholic!) to be “hell-bound,” since the Church teaches that God alone knows the heart and is the judge of souls.

Egg hasn’t posted in a while; he seems to have disappeared. Perhaps this was a “hit and run” thread. I hope not. I sincerely wish all Protestants would learn what the Church actually teaches.

As Bishop Sheen wrote, “There are not over a hundred people in the United States who hate the Catholic Church. There are millions, however, who hate what they wrongly believe to be the Catholic Church – which is, of course, quite a different thing.”

God bless and Mary keep, Jay

 

[gardenswithkids]

As I thought about my previous post, I fear that I may have inadvertantly sounded unloving to my fellow Catholics who seek to defend the honor of our Savior’s mother. Yikes! Oh, this charity stuff is hard work.

Katholikos:

I fail to see how acknowledging that I recognize what may be Egg’s intention qualifies as being “unloving” or “uncharitable” toward him.

I’m sorry. I did not mean to imply that you personally were unkind. I believe that whatever Egg’s motives, he did remind us of the important Christian virtue of charity.
It’s sad to read about the type of Catholic prejudice you (Katholikos) learned as growing up. Given that background I can see why motives might be questioned. I’ve had much more pleasant dealings with Protestants. I credit some very wonderful, devout Protestant friends for helping me to grow in my faith and love for Jesus. They helped me to become a better Catholic. (But I could still use help with that whole charity thing.)

If your still out there, Egg4christ, please feel free to join in the discussion.

 

[Egg4christ]

Yeah, i’m still around. I tell ya, Junior year of high school is like a roller coaster. One minute i have all the time in the world, the next i have to give up breathing time to finish all my homework. Go figure.

So, there have been some inquires as to whether or not i am “catholic bashing”. Uh, i’m not. I’m really trying to figure this out. Like i said, i have an odd passion for learning about other faiths or denominations. And, within my school, i am looked upon as somewhat of a spiritual authority(scary), i feel it’s important that i know what different religions practice, so i can explain to people when they ask.
This really is a series of innocent questions. I have been told i’m a good debator, but i am coming in with the best of intentions.
So let’s lay it out. Currently, i believe the catholic church is wrong. I believe much of their doctorine, including salvation, to be incorrect. I acknowledge that i don’t have all the facts. I hope, that by learning the facts, and the details of the catholic church, i can drop this disbelief. I keep a sort of mental checklist of good and bad points of each denomination. SDAs for instance, have very good empahsis on the sabbath. They are also a very pure faith, strict. Good stuff. On the other hand, they can lose sight of the important goals, and have a few strange belifes and practices.
I’m hoping to shrink the bad catholic list, and grow the good catholic list. If i could have peace of mind that catholic friends will make it to heaven, and that they know God like i do, then i wouldn’t worry so much about the little things.
I’m not trying to destroy you, just understand you.
so, time for a new question. We both describe a relationship with a creator. While i relate my devotional time, you respond with the euchrist. I took my first communion (didn’t get into protestant church until 4th grade). maybe i was too young to get it, but can someone describe this relationship through the euchrist.

 

[Lisa4Catholics]

The Eucharist Manna from Heaven,food for the journey,the body,blood,soul and divinity of Jesus.The Eucharist can not be described in mere words.The Eucharist can bring you to tears of joy and awe:heart: Egg, please read St.Teresa of Avila interior Castle,Eucharistic miracles.I was protestant Church of Christ who said they were non-denominational,I am home in the Church Jesus started.There is nothing this side of heaven to compare with it, nothing this side of heaven and I pray that you find your way home God Bless you

Ps.read this by Saint Faustina
our.homewithgod.com/divinemercy/preface/

 

[Lorarose]

We both describe a relationship with a creator. While i relate my devotional time, you respond with the euchrist. I took my first communion (didn’t get into protestant church until 4th grade). maybe i was too young to get it, but can someone describe this relationship through the euchrist.

Excellent question - and you’ll probably receive as many answers to this as there are catholics.

First of all - there is not an “either” “or” situation between devotional time and eucharist.
Many catholics, I’m sure, would tell you they spend time in prayer and in reading the scriptures as well as receiving eucharist.

The eucharist is a beautiful gift Jesus left us. The gift of Himself.
It is such a profound gift - it is difficult to wrap the brain around it.

We believe we are receiving the true body and blood of Our Lord - and as we nourish our body and souls with His body and soul, we become united with Him and each other in the mystical body of Christ.

“Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day. For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him…” (John 6:53-57)

 

[Mickey]

Egg4christ:

If i could have peace of mind that catholic friends will make it to heaven, and that they know God like i do, then i wouldn’t worry so much about the little things.

It’s not your job to know that your Catholic friends are going to heaven. You can attempt to plant fertile seeds, but only God knows their hearts. Also remember, when studying Catholicism be sure to separate the doctrines, (2000 year old truths), from the sinner,(personal opinion of certain Catholics- not based on doctrine).

 

[Lorarose]

Good point Mickey.
You remind me…it is not possible either to see if others know God “like I do” - or if others know God like you do…and so on.

God has a unique relationship with each of us.
Who is to say who knows God - or in what manner?

No one except God!

 

[JP2Admirer]

Egg,

Keep searching, the Truth never hides. It may not be what you want it to be, but it is what He wants it to be.

You keep bringing up Catholic doctrine, but never specifically cite what it is you have trouble with. There are many experts floating around this board who would be happy to expound upon any doctrines you have trouble with. Please let us know what doctrines you have trouble with. As long as you keep your inquiry honest, I don’t think you will run into divisiveness.

Peruse through this very website’s library, I think it provides numerous answers to the usual challenges to Catholic doctrine.

Here is a link to Biblical backing for some of Catholic doctrine.

catholic.com/library/Scriptural_Reference_Guide.asp

Probably the most challenging thing for many Protestants is the idea that the Eucharist is the actual body, blood, soul, and divinity of Christ as opposed to a symbolic representation. Read through John 6 and honestly reflect on the reason many of Jesus’ disciples left Him at that time. The truth of what He was speaking was too much for them to handle, so they left Him.

Also, in the OT when people used the hyperbole of eating flesh it was an insult. If Christ was using hyperbole in John 6, it means He essentially was saying, “Unless you insult me, you do not have eternal life.” Doesn’t make much sense if we understand Him to be using hyperbole. Anyway, I hope this sheds light on the most challenging of doctrines.

To be honest, the Eucharist is still a mystery to me. I like to think that if I were an apostle listening to Jesus, I would have known who He was (i.e. God.) But I think I would have had difficulty understanding this teaching. I still have difficulty understanding it, but I believe it because that’s what Jesus said we should believe. I understand how the Eucharist works in our lives, but I don’t understand why His fiat was to eat Him. Maybe someday He’ll tell me.

Please let us know what doctrines you have trouble with.

 

[Katholikos]

Egg4christ:

i have an odd passion for learning about other faiths or denominations. And, within my school, i am looked upon as somewhat of a spiritual authority(scary), i feel it’s important that i know what different religions practice, so i can explain to people when they ask.

To be a spiritual authority, an admirable goal, you must understand any religion as a practitioner – not an outsider – understands it. So don’t just give it a superficial once-over and expect to be able to explain it to others. Okay? The study of religions is a lot of work – work of both the head and the heart.

This really is a series of innocent questions. I have been told i’m a good debator, but i am coming in with the best of intentions.

Then we welcome you in the same spirit.

So let’s lay it out. Currently, i believe the catholic church is wrong. I believe much of their doctorine, including salvation, to be incorrect. I acknowledge that i don’t have all the facts. I hope, that by learning the facts, and the details of the catholic church, i can drop this disbelief.

Tell us why you believe the Church is wrong. Jesus Christ founded the Catholic Church for the salvation of the world, as an extension of Himself when he returned to heaven. The Church teaches what the Apostles taught. You probably didn’t know that. You probably also didn’t know that the Catholic Church wrote the New Testament and then formed the first Bible when she was nearly 400 years old. Perhaps now that you’ve been told that, you’ll at least be willing to find out whether it’s historically true or not. And you probably don’t know what the Church actually teaches, but only what you’ve heard about it from Protestant sources.

I keep a sort of mental checklist of good and bad points of each denomination. SDAs for instance, have very good empahsis on the sabbath. They are also a very pure faith, strict. Good stuff. On the other hand, they can lose sight of the important goals, and have a few strange belifes and practices.

Was the SDA church founded by Jesus Christ? Nope. It was founded in 1844 by Ellen Harmon White, based on the teachings of William Miller, in New Hampshire, U.S.A. All Protestant denominations had human founders – ordinary men and women. Only the Catholic was founded by Christ, in 33 A.D., in Jerusalem.

I’m hoping to shrink the bad catholic list, and grow the good catholic list. If i could have peace of mind that catholic friends will make it to heaven, and that they know God like i do, then i wouldn’t worry so much about the little things.

If you are worried that the Catholic Faith may lead us to perdition, you’re wrong. We’ll only land in hell for failure to practice the Catholic Faith that comes to us from the Apostles.

It went down like this: Jesus taught the Apostles for three years; He founded the Church upon Peter and made him Chief Apostle; He made all the Apostles leaders of the Church; the Apostles taught the Church and ordained others to replace them. The Catholic priests and bishops of today can trace their ordination in an unbroken continuum, back to the Apostles.

so, time for a new question. We both describe a relationship with a creator. While i relate my devotional time, you respond with the euchrist. I took my first communion (didn’t get into protestant church until 4th grade). maybe i was too young to get it, but can someone describe this relationship through the euchrist.

Do you mean that you were baptized a Catholic and later left the Church and become Protestant when you were in the 4th grade?

To understand the Eucharist, you must learn of it in the context of the Catholic Church. Go here and read this little booklet; it won’t take long. Then you’ll be ready for a fuller explanation of the Eucharist. We’ll be glad to 'splain it.

catholic.com/library/pillar.asp

Peace be with you.

Jay Damien

 

[Exporter]

Egg4Christ,

Egg4 you wrote this in the first post of this thread.“I decided to look into the catholic faith. I used to be catholic, but we changed faiths. I’ve come to believe that catholics can experience God in the same way I do, that it is very possible catholics have a relationship with Jesus”

---

You say you are “looking into” the Catholic Faith ( the word Catholic is with a capital “C”.) Catholic with the lower case “c” meams univeral.

OH BOY! You say,“It’s POSSIBLE that Catholics have a relationship with Jesus Christ” ARE YOU KIDDING, OR WHAT?

Who do you see behind the altar in a Catholic Church? Who started the Catholic Church? See Matthew 16: v18 -19. So you say Catholics MAY let Christ into the Church, huh? Your knowledge tank is showing Empty!

If you came here to Learn the Catholic Catechism you came to the wrong place. We will not teach you what has to take an entire year for Catholics. You will not learn about Catholics on a Forum. Go but a Catechism of the Catholic Church at Wal-Mart ($9.00)

 

[mercygate]

Egg4Christ,

You say you are “looking into” the Catholic Faith ( the word Catholic is with a capital “C”.) Catholic with the lower case “c” meams univeral.

OH BOY! You say,“It’s POSSIBLE that Catholics have a relationship with Jesus Christ” ARE YOU KIDDING, OR WHAT?

Who do you see behind the altar in a Catholic Church? Who started the Catholic Church? See Matthew 16: v18 -19. So you say Catholics MAY let Christ into the Church, huh? Your knowledge tank is showing Empty!

If you came here to Learn the Catholic Catechism you came to the wrong place. We will not teach you what has to take an entire year for Catholics. You will not learn about Catholics on a Forum. Go but a Catechism of the Catholic Church at Wal-Mart ($9.00)

Exporter, you have a gift.

 

[Sir_William]

If you have a specific question(s) you should ask it. If there is something about Catholicism that you were taught that you are concerned about, bring it up.

You will find that either you were misinformed, or that it is a reasonable belief with the context of orthodox Christianity.

If you are honest with yourself, you will realize that other other schisms, sects, and religions are castles built in mid-air; they don’t have anything to support them.

You can be content with the feelings you have about your current walk. It’s great that you feel the way you do, however, understand this: If the actual basis for what you believe is not grounded in history and is not consistent with natural law as well as Scripture, it is a deception; period, end of story.

Does that mean it’s a waste of your time? No, definitely not and you could find yourself in heaven, but the only reason you would be there is because of the Catholic Church. Without her, you would have no Bible at all (even though yours is missing a few choice nuggets in the Old Covenant era thanks to a well intentioned though over-zealous and less than humble former Catholic Priest).

Think about that. This institution which is solely responsible for the collation, reproduction, and safe-guarding of the Holy Bible for, at the very least, 12 centuries, is also the one that is so careless about what’s written in it to distort it, add to it and disregard it; is that feasible? The Catholic Church is the sole guardian of YOUR faith for over a thousand years, and yet at the same time has become something completely alien to it.

That should be your starting point. What do YOU believe. You claim to believe what is written in the Bible. How well can you answer WHY? (all warm and fuzzy feelings aside, and apart from any possible charisms you may have received). If you can demostrate its authenticity, accuracy, and authority apart from the Catholic Church then I think you would be the first person in history.

I apologize if you are not feeling an outpouring of unconditional love here. I intend it, believe me, but I sense from your post that you have some fairly entrenched negativisms about the Catholic Church that make me suspicous of your motives for being on this forum. Here’s why: (continued on next post)

 

[Sir_William]

In post #44 you said this:

“I took my first communion (didn’t get into protestant church until 4th grade).”

And in Post #17 you said this:

“I loved to debate, and my dad made sure to teach me a very important lesson for approaching evanglelistic debates.”

So either your dad was a Catholic and taught you to debate when you were vary young (less than 9 years old). Or he taught you to debate at some point after a conversion process your whole family went through (you say you didn’t get into the Protestant church until 4th Grade). Or your mother met your dad and converted sometime between Grades 1 and 4.

If your dad were Catholic and teaching a kid under 9 the finer points of debating with Evangelicals, I doubt you would have the vague grasp of the Catechism you claim to have right now. Plus, kids under age 12 tend to be fairly weak in the debating arena.

If you went through some kind of a familial conversion process before Grade 4, then your family (or the Catholic part of it) had a very weak grasp of the Cathecism (which is too bad). In which case someone or something converted you or your parents or at least one of them from Catholicism to whatever. Usually when someone leaves a Church behind, they have either good reasons to, or good rationalizations for it. So after this conversion process of leaving the Catholic Church your skills in the finer points of religious debates begins.

Your Post #17 continues:

“He said to always remember what is most important, someone’s salvation. You can spend hours with someone, debating wether or not mary is worthy of anything, win the debate, and still be left with nothing but hellbound soul, who believes mary is important.” Now, the axiom offered up by your Dad is one thing (which is probably a valid point when taking someone to task on their belief system); however, the sentence after that tells a great deal. Firstly, if it was part of ‘rule #1’ passed along by Dad, then obviously he had some major issues with Mary. If it is an included ‘for instance’ on your part, it tips your hand that Marian doctrines are something you don’t agree with, and moreso, are injurious to ones salvation. This is really an understatement, because your statement is more of an offense than an implication (whether you intended it or not). Perhaps you would be happier if she were taken out of the Gospel’s altogether, let’s face it, she’s not important anyway, then there would be nothing to debate (unfortunately there would be no agency for the fulfillment of the scriptures and therefore no salvation either). I realize that I have taken a slightly critical bent on this, but it’s hard not to suspect that the initial overtures of this poster of merely wanting to ‘know more’ were mere platitudes concealing an attitude that Catholics are rarely ‘true’ Christians because they don’t sound and look like Evangelicals. If I am being uncharitable, I apologize and will stand corrected.

Let me restate this: if Egg4Christ is merely curious yet sincere separated cradle Catholic, then state your questions and/or objections clearly and succinctly and then check out the answers you get with other sources to see if they are true. Once you’ve done that, you can sign up for RCIA at your nearest parish.

 

[papist1]

Egg 4 Christ, thank you for your honesty and (name removed by moderator)ut, I feel for you as I was once in your shoes.

 I attended about 18 different non denom and protestant denom churches.

I ended up studying church history and found there was no other church before the 16th century except the Catholic Church and therefore this was the one Churh Christ built upon cpehas(peter, rock) and called it to remain one as He and te father are one, perfectly.

  What you have mentioned about coming here is slightly true, yet if I go to Chrisianity.com, I cannot mention the word "catholic" or I will get a warning that they will ban me from the sight.

they have done that.

I cannot say anything about the early church fathers or anything. At least you can speak your mind in here.

Go to Biblenet.net and go to forums. I am constantly attacked by insane protestants, ranting their scientific doctrines and their prophecies from isaiah. Talk about an uncomfortable place.

You will find this occurring in pretty much every protestant site with a forum.    I think things here are pretty easygoing.

Not quite as easy being a protestant non denom in here, but hey, at least your learning what your church cannot teach you, and that is the teaching of the church in the first, second, third fourth fifth six 7th 8th 9th 10th 11th 12th 13th 14th 15 th16th centuries.

They can’t teach you this because it was all catholic egg.

peace to you egg, and remember, church is not a pep rally for Jesus where you make Jesus make you feel good. Church is the highest form of prayer in the universe where everything surrounds our Lords Flesh and Blood and his giving Himself to us to put into our bodies and become partakers of the Divine Nature as scripture states. The true Presence of Jesus Christ is in every single Catholic Church in the world, and is being given in a mass every second of every minute of every day somewhere in the world. Now that is what I call a UNIVERSAL CHURCH(catholic).

 

[Egg4christ]

wow. nice posts, thank you everyone.
Sir_William, i can’t help snickering at your confusion. I’m sorry, i don’t mean to make fun, you just have things so incredibly backwards, i have to laugh.
So, let me set things straight. I was born, baptised, and had my first communion as a Catholic(by the way, i meant no offense in lowercasing it. just to lazy to fix it.) then, somewhere around 5th grade i think(time’s not entirely clear), i attended a promise keepers conference. Although pretty much universally christian, it leaned more towards protestant in presentation. We liked it, felt there were something lacking in our catholic church, and our family began a search for a new church. I believe God led us to our current church, The chapel. Now, before this time, i had considered becoming a priest, but in reality, the rest of my family wasn’t terribly involved in church. More involved than most, but we still didn’t get much out of it.
After the change, sometime in freshman year of HS i believe, my dad noticed that i was becoming quite a debator, and i came home from theological debates(held by certian clubs after school) really excited. He cautioned me not to lose sight of the ultimate Goal when debating with these people(most of them were athiest, agnostic, and any other faith you wanted to throw in.) he DID NOT include anything regarding mary. I threw that in for presentation purposes, so it would relate to the very topics we are discussing here.

Everyone keeps asking what problems i have with the catholic church. I guess i haven’t specified because i haven’t yet been able to pin down exactly what it is that troubles me. i guess right at this moment, it’s that you seem to be telling me i’m wrong. But i can’t be. pompus, i know, but “let no man boast in anything, except that he knows christ”. I do know him. and before you jump all over it, it’s not simply warm fuzzies. God doesn’t bless lives that are far from his will. not like this at least. If i am running in the wrong direction, why does he keep giving me signals to keep running. Why are my missions trips filled with awesomeness? why does my pastor keep hitting me with the exact topic i need to hear, if my church is rooted in a split from the “true chuch”, that was against his will? It doesn’t make sense. You all sound like nice, logical people. But how can we both be right? I know i’ve expressed this before, but unfortunately, i can’t come up with a solid answer yet.

I keep coming over this verse in my quite times. It’s in romans, and it talks about going easy on the new christians. It basically asks that we settle some of our minor differences, so we don’t alienate those who feel differently. Does this apply here? if it doesn’t, that what scripture does apply here? If it does apply, then can the catholic church continue to claim no salvation oustide it’s walls?