Question in forming committed disciples

[fide]

Possibly a retreat of some kind may be in order. Is there a monastery in the area where this person can either participate in a retreat or do a self directed one?

It could possibly be God is asking this person to do something and for whatever reason the person isn’t hearing it. I am in no way saying your friend is refusing to hear, but he may not be open to whatever it is yet.

I’ve had times of spiritual dryness, times when I just didn’t know if God knew I was there. Having read about spiritual dryness and knowing it can happen I made a decision to not let it rule my life. I went to Mass faithfully, I went to confession, I continued to pray and generally the dryness was there because I wasn’t hearing what God wanted me to do.

Advise your friend to be patient through this time, trust in God, and listen.

What author(s) did you read about spiritual dryness? Did they say it was a random sort of thing - or was it part of some intelligible process?

 

[Vic_Taltrees_UK]

Does anyone bother to keep him company in his home or have him keep them company in theirs?

If he has practical troubles, does he ever hear anyone say audibly in his hearing “God send Mr XYZ help”?

Does he ever hear anyone say audibly in his hearing “God make Mr XYZ’s ministries fruitful in Your Kingdom”?

Does anyone ask him to say audibly in their hearing “God make Mr ABC’s ministries - and Father FGH’s ministries and Bishop PQR’s ministries - fruitful in Your Kingdom”?

Faith comes from hearing. If everyone freezes this man out they will starve him of faith.

Everyone has got to realise that the only crown they will get is the crown they help people like him get.

They have got to trade their talents with him. And ask him to trade his talents with them, because they are in the soup. Jesus is going to ask them questions.

The many motions you people sound as if you have got organised to go through in terms of “spirituality” or “programmes”, may have distracted from the realities.

 

[fide]

Does anyone bother to keep him company in his home or have him keep them company in theirs?

If he has practical troubles, does he ever hear anyone say audibly in his hearing “God send Mr XYZ help”?

Does he ever hear anyone say audibly in his hearing “God make Mr XYZ’s ministries fruitful in Your Kingdom”?

Does anyone ask him to say audibly in their hearing “God make Mr ABC’s ministries - and Father FGH’s ministries and Bishop PQR’s ministries - fruitful in Your Kingdom”?

Faith comes from hearing. If everyone freezes this man out they will starve him of faith.

Everyone has got to realise that the only crown they will get is the crown they help people like him get.

They have got to trade their talents with him. And ask him to trade his talents with them, because they are in the soup. Jesus is going to ask them questions.

The many motions you people sound as if you have got organised to go through in terms of “spirituality” or “programmes”, may have distracted from the realities.

Hello Vic - thank you for entering the conversation. You have put on the table several important considerations, and realities, Thank you. I’d like to focus on one sentence you wrote, because I think it could use further development:

You wrote: “Everyone has got to realise that the only crown they will get is the crown they help people like him get.”

It is relevant to include in this belief, that the “help” we offer to people - any people, all people, everyone - is dependent on what we possess. We cannot give, what we do not have. St. Paul helps us to realize the connection between our “good works” and our interior life in Christ:

1Cor 3:10 According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation, and another man is building upon it. Let each man take care how he builds upon it.
1Cor 3:11 For no other foundation can any one lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
1Cor 3:12 Now if any one builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw—
1Cor 3:13 each man’s work will become manifest; for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done.
1Cor 3:14 If the work which any man has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward.
1Cor 3:15 If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.

And to that, we must add:

Eph 4:11 And his gifts were that some should be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, some pastors and teachers,
Eph 4:12 to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ,
Eph 4:13 until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ;
Eph 4:14 so that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the cunning of men, by their craftiness in deceitful wiles.
Eph 4:15 Rather, speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in every way into him who is the head, into Christ,
Eph 4:16 from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by every joint with which it is supplied, when each part is working properly, makes bodily growth and upbuilds itself in love.

An important question each zealous worker in the Gospel - for example one who wants to “help” a man such as in my OP example - ought to keep asking himself is, “What kind of help am I really offering? Am I offering that which will endure - that which will survive Christ’s test of fire on the Last Day? Or am I “building”, yes, but building merely of “wood, hay, or straw”?”

The fire will test our “good works”. I suggest that this man of the OP needs guidance - but not merely sincere guidance, not merely well-intentioned or well-meaning guidance, but guidance led by real wisdom - supernatural wisdom, and prudence. There is a radical difference between natural wisdom and supernatural wisdom; and between natural prudence and supernatural prudence.

How we need to grow in Christ! We need the wisdom, and prudence, and holy love that comes only from Him - that which the Holy Spirit gives in the soul.

Thus I have asked several posters so far, and so far no one has answered either way: are you involved with any of the programs/books/spiritualities current today in the area of “Renewing the Parish” - such as Rediscover Catholicism, Forming Intentional Disciples, ChristLife, Alpha, From Maintenance to Mission, or any of the many others being embraced and followed today? If so, what does your training teach such a man needs, and what is the source of that understanding?

If we are building on the one foundation (of Christ!), let what is built be worthy of Him, true and eternal.

 

[Rosebud77]

I saw this happen to an old uni friend, he was on fire with his faith but upon graduation couldn’t find a church where he could serve. On speaking to him recently he said that he doesn’t think church is a bad thing but it’s for other people. For many a faith that’s not put into practice will wither and die.

I agree with both above comments that this person needs to find some work to do.

Faith is in God. Putting faith into practice does not need a Church. I agree with him and all the years I lived either where there was no Church near enough or rejected when they believed the drs that I was mentally ill? My faith grew and deepened as it does now.