Question: Is gay marriage sinful?

[theCardinalbird]

You evidentially don’t believe in objective morality or you wouldn’t keep arguing that a person’s time and society can influence whether their action was moral.

I keep arguing that a persons time and society can explain why they thought their actions were moral, and to leave it as that after explaining that we have thankfully moved from that. You keep on condemning people who would be deemed innocent in their society but refuse to understand that Christians were born in a world that was devoid of the understanding that all humans should be given rights (thankfully our society has done that).

I don’t hold them blameless, I only see them as human (broken beings who need God) who are desperately trying to find the truth in a world that wishes it weren’t so. You hold no sympathy for those who had to live in such a society, believing that everyone could have behaved the same forever without their sinful nature coming into effect. People aren’t perfect, and those in Augustines time were only trying to deal with a world that was suffering from thousands of years of broken morals.

I am done here. I dont believe slavery is right and I dont believe people had all the right morals back then. I am only saying they were trying to do what they thought was right and that is what we are trying to do today through the ministry of Christ and with the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

I am done here

 

[OsculeturMeOsculo]

You used that argument many times already before.

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

You evidentially don’t believe in objective morality or you wouldn’t keep arguing that a person’s time and society can influence whether their action was moral.

I keep arguing that a persons time and society can explain why they thought their actions were moral, and to leave it as that after explaining that we have thankfully moved from that. You keep on condemning people who would be deemed innocent in their society but refuse to understand that Christians were born in a world that was devoid of the understanding that all humans should be given rights (thankfully our society has done that).

I don’t hold them blameless, I only see them as human (broken beings who need God) who are desperately trying to find the truth in a world that wishes it weren’t so. You hold no sympathy for those who had to live in such a society, believing that everyone could have behaved the same forever without their sinful nature coming into effect. People aren’t perfect, and those in Augustines time were only trying to deal with a world that was suffering from thousands of years of broken morals.

I am done here. I dont believe slavery is right and I dont believe people had all the right morals back then. I am only saying they were trying to do what they thought was right and that is what we are trying to do today through the ministry of Christ and with the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

I am done here

I see no reason to make excuses for past sins.

 

[Alex337]

You used that argument many times already before.

After people claimed something was “well known” to prove a point.

 

[theCardinalbird]

I see no reason to make excuses for past sins.

I see no reason to not understand Context and forgive where one can learn from this.

Which is that only God is perfect and that man is not perfect

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

I see no reason to make excuses for past sins.

I see no reason to not understand and forgive where one can learn from this.

Forgiving is different to making excuses for them, which is unfortunately what you have been doing. I’ve said a few times that the time period accepted it, but that doesn’t magically make it any less wrong.

 

[Cruciferi]

I am only saying they were trying to do what they thought was right and that is what we are trying to do today through the ministry of Christ and with the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

And we’re making mistakes today that we’ll be ashamed of tomorrow. It’s the way of things. We must move on…

 

[theCardinalbird]

Forgiving is different to making excuses for them, which is unfortunately what you have been doing

Making excuses? Is that your idea of explaining historical context? Wow is all I have to say. I was only trying to explain the realistic nature of humanity at the time.

I DO NOT HOLD THEM BLAMELESS!!!

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

Forgiving is different to making excuses for them, which is unfortunately what you have been doing

Making excuses? Is that your idea of explaining historical context? Wow is all I have to say. I was only trying to explain the realistic nature of humanity at the time.

I DO NOT HOLD THEM BLAMELESS!!!

When you bring it up multiple times in the one thread after people have repeatedly told you they are aware and still hold the person culpable for their actions: yes. It’s making excuses.

 

[theCardinalbird]

When you bring it up multiple times in the one thread after people have repeatedly told you they are aware and still hold the person culpable for their actions: yes. It’s making excuses.

I still hold Augustine culpable for his actions. I still hold slave masters culpable for what they have done. I only explain the context of that time and what they thought and how realistic things seemed to them and their society

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

When you bring it up multiple times in the one thread after people have repeatedly told you they are aware and still hold the person culpable for their actions: yes. It’s making excuses.

I still hold Augustine culpable for his actions. I still hold slave masters culpable for what they have done. I only explain the context of that time and what they thought

Then maybe stop repeating your defences. Everyone knows the history of slavery here, it looks like @Thorolfr actually knows it far better than you. It only looks like excuses for immorality.

 

[theCardinalbird]

Then maybe stop repeating your defences.

What defences specifically?

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

Then maybe stop repeating your defences.

What defences specifically?

For real? We just went over this. Repeatedly bringing up the same, known, history of the practice in a show of giving context (which was already given and known). It adds nothing and only looks like a defence, an attempt to show that their actions were moral for the time (something you have said and that smacks of relativism).

 

[theCardinalbird]

It adds nothing and only looks like a defence, an attempt to show that their actions were moral for the time

Their actions were not moral, but agrees with their society so it is really not surprising that they would follow suit and believe it was right, no?

Thankfully society moved on from that

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

It adds nothing and only looks like a defence, an attempt to show that their actions were moral for the time

Their actions were not moral, but agrees with their society so it is really not surprising that they would follow suit and believe it was right, no?

Thing is: that doesn’t matter. It doesn’t change the action from being wrong, does it?

 

[theCardinalbird]

that doesn’t matter. It doesn’t change the action from being wrong, does it?

no not at all. It only explains how society was so polluted with this dumb idea that slavery should be acceptable and therefore people at that time thought it was normal (which is understandable, when looking at society. Many tend to follow what the rest of society thinks).

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

that doesn’t matter. It doesn’t change the action from being wrong, does it?

no not at all. It only explains how society was so polluted with this dumb idea that slavery should be acceptable and therefore people at that time thought it was normal (which is understandable, when looking at society. Many tend to follow what the rest of society thinks).

It really, really, really sounds like you’re making excuses for them. Let it rest. They were wrong and everyone knows the context, many seem to know it better than your.

 

[theCardinalbird]

They were wrong and everyone knows the context, many seem to know it better than your.

Yes they were wrong. What exactly did I get wrong about the context? Those who brought context about Ancient Rome and Greece I do not disagree with

t really, really, really sounds like you’re making excuses for them. Let it rest.

Well I am not making excuses. I am making an observation on how people and society work.

 

[theCardinalbird]

I derailed this thread again. (Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

 

[OsculeturMeOsculo]

Sorry about that.