Question on faith

  • Thread starter Thread starter St_Gregory
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with Thee. Blessed art Thou among women and blessed is the fruit of Thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen

Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse.

For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world! For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world! For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world!

O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee!

Sorrowful and Immaculate Heart of Mary, pray for us!

And the Most Holy Rosary

Remember, O Most gracious Virgin Mary, that never was it known that anyone who fled to thy protection, implored thy help or sought thy intercession was left unaided. Inspired with this confidence, I fly unto thee, O virgin of virgins, my mother. To thee do I come, before thee I kneel, sinful and sorrowful. O Mother of the Word incarnate, despise not my petitions but in thy mercy hear and answer them. Amen.

Catholicism has 100% value on life. In the Holocaust, the Catholic Church is the only Church that consistently condemned such as forced sterilization of the mentally ill due to the 100% life policy. I learned this from www.jewishvirtuallibrary.com. A JEWISH site reporting on the Holocaust writes: ONLY THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH FOR DOCTRINAL REASONS OPPOSED THE STERILIZATION PROGRAM CONSISTENTLY

jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Holocaust/disabled.html
So there is no pro-catholic bias on this site. I also first learned that the Roman Catholic Church under Pope Pius XII saved more Jews than any other international aid organization combined, 860,000, during the Holocaust from this Jewish Virtual Library.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/anti-semitism/piusdef.html

They even call a CATHOLIC saint, Polish Saint Maximilian Maria, righteous among the nations because of his noble behavior. The Jewish rabbi of Rome CONVERTED to Catholicism and named himself Eugenio after Pope Pius XI following the Holocaust because of his noble actions.

Polish Saint Maximilian Maria studied philosophy, theology, mathematics, and physics as a college student, before earning a doctorate in philosophy and a doctorate in theology in Rome, while suffering from tuberculosis. He became a priest, changed his name to Maria from Kolbe to venerate the Immaculate Heart of Mary, sheltered 2,000 Jews in his friary during the Holocaust, and when taken to the Auschwitz concentration camp offered to die in place of another man since that man had family and he did not as an abstinent fiar. During his time in the cell, he led the men in songs and prayer. Finally, after three weeks of dehydration and starvation, he was injected with carbolic acid and died. He is reported on the Jewish Virtual Library as Righteous Among the Nations. No matter how dire the situation God can continue to strengthen us. jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/biography/Kolbe.html.He founded Slaves of the Immaculata, www.consecration.com, which we can fervently join. I already have a free copy of their packet 👍

The list of Rescuers is not too long: jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Holocaust/rescuetoc.html

Maybe we OUGHT to believe in the Virgin Mary because the NEW YORK TIMES reports on apparitions of the Virgin Mary and says she prophesied a “river of blood” if people did not repent, say the Rosary, the Chaplet of the Seven Sorrows of Mary. The link: query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9400E4D81738F93BA35757C0A96F958260

SHE EXISTS

THE NEW YORK TIMES REPORTS ON HER

HER PROPHECY IN THE APPARITION CAME TRUE

How else should she convince all to believe and REPENT, CONVERT, PRAY THE MOST HOLY ROSARY, PRAY THE CHAPLET OF SEVEN SORROWS, FOLLOW THE BEATITUTDES AND THE FIRST TWO COMMANDMENTS - PURSUING LOVE of GOD AND NEIGHBOR as the SUPREME goal of life than come to earth, be documented by the radio, news media, New York Times as making a prophecy that comes true of a “river of blood.” The Fatima apparitions were also seen by 50,000-70,000 people and they foretold the Holocaust. People are making a movie about these apparitions right now: the13thday.com/

Thank you for reading. I hope I have not been rude in my enthusiasm. 😦 Please forgive me if so and maybe point out how I can change:thumbsup:

O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee!

Sorrowful and Immaculate Heart of Mary, pray for us!

For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world! For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world! For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world!

Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse.

*Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with Thee. Blessed art Thou among women and blessed is the fruit of Thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen. *
 
Yeah okay thanks.

I think I just have to pray for enlightenment and hope God will make His word clear to me.

Anyway thanks loads Avesantamaria, o and call me Greg lol
 
Yeah okay thanks.

I think I just have to pray for enlightenment and hope God will make His word clear to me.

Anyway thanks loads Avesantamaria, o and call me Greg lol
Good morning, Greg,

I’ll be joining you in prayer, 2:00 AM, on the weekends. That is my hour of adoration of Jesus, truly present in the Blessed Sacrament, in our Perpetual Eucharistic Chapel.

Please don’t get hung up on your question, even though it is a very good one.

Instead prepare your heart for the coming of Jesus this Christmas. It is so easy to love a little child. And a little child’s love? That is so wonderful to feel.

The cool thing about Catholicism is that we celebrate all the events of the life of Jesus. This gives us comfort that Jesus is with us, loving us, in every event of our own life.

Blessings,
grannymh
 
Ok next small question:
I’ve explained my position to my priest (that is I cannot really believe Christianity is absolutely true: there is not enough evidence and I think it is wrong to take something as a belief without good grounds) and he was a bit shocked and also said I cannot recieve the sacraments.

Am I in a state of mortal sin? I do not know of any mortal sins I’ve commited and I do not think my doubts of Christianity are sinful because I am trying to be religiously honest — but what do you think?
 
Ok next small question:
I’ve explained my position to my priest (that is I cannot really believe Christianity is absolutely true: there is not enough evidence and I think it is wrong to take something as a belief without good grounds) and he was a bit shocked and also said I cannot recieve the sacraments.

Am I in a state of mortal sin? I do not know of any mortal sins I’ve commited and I do not think my doubts of Christianity are sinful because I am trying to be religiously honest — but what do you think?
Dear Greg,

Others will answer your question better than me.

Regarding your conversation with the priest. Could there have been a bit of miscommunication? If so, I can only offer a suggestion based on the wisdom of my Mother. She said: “There is more than one way to skin a cat.”
In other words, you might try rephrasing the above into a positive position.

Can you say something like this? I am honestly searching for… … When I find … it will improve my life because…

Then ask yourself some of these kinds of questions. What kind of proof will I accept? Are “good grounds” the same as evidence? Can other people’s words be accepted? Am I an experiential learner? Are my expectations too high?
What is my understanding of belief? What is belief based on-- Intellectual acceptance, or gut instinct or proof through reason, or using my free will to accept, or all of the previous and then some?

My Dad would say: “When I hit a brick wall, I don’t waste energy by banging my head against it. I look to the left and to the right for a way to get around it.”

I’m looking forward to reading the coming posts, yours and others.

Blessings,
grannymh
 
To St Gregory,

Quick question, so that I may better understand where you are coming from… besides England.

In your public profile, Biography lists English, Western Catholic, Sixth former. I am not familiar with Western Catholic, Sixth former. Please, could you explain a bit. Thank you.

Blessings,
grannymh
 
Ok next small question:
I’ve explained my position to my priest (that is I cannot really believe Christianity is absolutely true: there is not enough evidence and I think it is wrong to take something as a belief without good grounds) and he was a bit shocked and also said I cannot recieve the sacraments.

Am I in a state of mortal sin? I do not know of any mortal sins I’ve commited and I do not think my doubts of Christianity are sinful because I am trying to be religiously honest — but what do you think?
If Christianity is not absolutely true, then neither are the Sacraments. Of course, you cannot receive the Sacraments if you don’t believe in them. If you do believe in the Sacraments, how can you not believe in Christianity?
 
Dear Greg,

Others will answer your question better than me.

Regarding your conversation with the priest. Could there have been a bit of miscommunication? If so, I can only offer a suggestion based on the wisdom of my Mother. She said: “There is more than one way to skin a cat.”
In other words, you might try rephrasing the above into a positive position.

Can you say something like this? I am honestly searching for… … When I find … it will improve my life because…

Then ask yourself some of these kinds of questions. What kind of proof will I accept? Are “good grounds” the same as evidence? Can other people’s words be accepted? Am I an experiential learner? Are my expectations too high?
What is my understanding of belief? What is belief based on-- Intellectual acceptance, or gut instinct or proof through reason, or using my free will to accept, or all of the previous and then some?

My Dad would say: “When I hit a brick wall, I don’t waste energy by banging my head against it. I look to the left and to the right for a way to get around it.”

I’m looking forward to reading the coming posts, yours and others.

Blessings,
grannymh
Well I still meet regularly with my church for mass, eucharistic adoration (if I have time), and youth group so any mis-understanding will be smoothed out naturally.

The thing that annoyed me about my priests defence of Christian faith is that he insists it is rational; now most people agree that it is IRrational to believe something (especially very big things) without sufficient evidence and sadly I struggle to find any real significant evidence for Christianity (I know there is some, but just not enough to have eternal faith in)
40.png
Granny:
To St Gregory,

Quick question, so that I may better understand where you are coming from… besides England.

In your public profile, Biography lists English, Western Catholic, Sixth former. I am not familiar with Western Catholic, Sixth former. Please, could you explain a bit. Thank you.

Blessings,
grannymh
Roman Catholic of the Latin Church/culture
Year 12 student (Grade 13 in America I think)
M. Adams:
If Christianity is not absolutely true, then neither are the Sacraments. Of course, you cannot receive the Sacraments if you don’t believe in them. If you do believe in the Sacraments, how can you not believe in Christianity?
Well I don’t currently absolutely believe Christianity and therefore neither the sacraments
 
Dear Greg,

Hang in there. (slang-- maybe it is international slang)

I know that this doesn’t really answer your questions – but it might offer a different view.

The following shows the relationship of reason to faith.

Faith enfolds
Reason upholds
Understanding beholds

I know from experience. A 5 or 10 minute visit to Our Lord in Eucharistic Adoration is the best ever. You don’t even have to pray. Just sit quietly before Jesus. He understands.

I’m very glad I am getting to know you.

Blessings,
grannymh
 
Dear Greg,

Hang in there. (slang-- maybe it is international slang)

I know that this doesn’t really answer your questions – but it might offer a different view.

The following shows the relationship of reason to faith.

Faith enfolds
Reason upholds
Understanding beholds

I know from experience. A 5 or 10 minute visit to Our Lord in Eucharistic Adoration is the best ever. You don’t even have to pray. Just sit quietly before Jesus. He understands.

I’m very glad I am getting to know you.

Blessings,
grannymh
There’s nothing faulty with that and I have no problems with it except that, as you said, it still cannot answer my questions sadly.

As for religious experience, that’s of course incredibly subjective although I admit it is very valid for the personal believer like your goodself.

I personally tend to be a bit skeptical of trusting religious experience but that’s just me
 
The thing that annoyed me about my priests defence of Christian faith is that he insists it is rational; now most people agree that it is IRrational to believe something (especially very big things) without sufficient evidence and sadly I struggle to find any real significant evidence for Christianity (I know there is some, but just not enough to have eternal faith in)
It was the age of rationality that caused Protestantism. Your priest should have said Christianity is logical rather than rational. Thomas Aquinas’ theology was based on aristotelian logic. Logic supersedes evidence. If you find evidence of something that logically cannot be true, you have misinterpretted the evidence. Evidence is not proof regardless of what Law and Order would lead you to believe. It is merely indicative of proof.
 
There’s nothing faulty with that and I have no problems with it except that, as you said, it still cannot answer my questions sadly.

As for religious experience, that’s of course incredibly subjective although I admit it is very valid for the personal believer like your goodself.

I personally tend to be a bit skeptical of trusting religious experience but that’s just me
Hello Greg,

Yes, religious experience can be incredibly subjective. And that is valid for the personal believer as you said. I know I am a bit skeptical at times,

The experience I was referring to in the above post is more my physical and mental experience during short visits.

What I was referring to is the physical experience of walking through the door, sitting or kneeling in respect of the Eucharist, letting one’s mind relax, taking in the surroundings, maybe even thinking about what has to be done next unless that produces stress-- in other words, I can’t predict a possible religious experience for you. But I can refer to the physical and mental actions that we all do when visiting a sacred place.

Why would I say that a 5 or 10 minute visit to Eucharistic Adoration is the best ever? Because there is the possibility that it can physically and maybe mentally bring about a bit of peace for you. You have a lot of questions rolling around in your head. Sometimes it helps to take a physical break just to get some peace from all those questions asking for answers.

For me, from my own experience, if there is a possibility for a bit of peace away from the crazy world, I will do what is necessary to find it. I will make that short visit to Eucharistic Adoration.

The second reason I suggested visits to Eucharistic Adoration has more to do with Jesus, Himself. I will never underestimate the power of Jesus Christ to understand us.

By all means if your youth group goes to Eucharistic Adoration, do join them. Being with a group of friends gives a different experience than individual visits.

I admire you for going to Mass regularly.

I am rereading your post. I still don’t know how to answer the part about being irrational. Being rational usually means that one has the ability or brain power to use reason or logic to figure things out.
Often people do use reason or logic to figure things out. Students use their brains on a regular basis to figure things out all the time. They have to in order to survive and be successful in school. Harry Potter and friends use their brains quite a lot. I have just started reading book 5.

I am thinking that people do use reason or logic to support their beliefs. But I don’t know how to work in the evidence part. I’m not even sure what would be considered acceptable evidence.

I can understand that it would be irrational to believe something very big without sufficient evidence. However, I prefer to see things positively. For example, I think that one can use reason or logic to help believe something very big without sufficient evidence available.

Finally, I am glad that you know that there is some evidence for Christianity. That is a great start to finding answers.

Blessings,
grannymh
 
Faith enfolds
Reason upholds
Understanding beholds
There’s nothing faulty with that and I have no problems with it except that, as you said, it still cannot answer my questions sadly.

Hello Greg,

As it turns out, I will be traveling so I will not have easy access to a computer. Therefore, you will not be hearing from me for awhile. You are probably saying to yourself --good thing. Now granny can’t complain about her low ability to answer
questions. 😉 Just kidding!

I reread post 49 by Marsha Adams. She does make some good points. I studied some of what she is talking about while I was a student in a university. Do you have the popular TV series: “Law & Order” which she mentioned?

You might consider using logic or reason in looking for answers.

When I was in high schooI, I used a kind of logic to prove to myself that God existed. Not only was my logic far from perfect,
I didn’t have a lot of evidence. Yet it satisfied me.
I never told anyone about my doubts until I used that experience in a “letter to the editor”. The point of my letter was that it is not always necessary to have a “perfect” proof.

Best of luck using your brain…

Blessings,
grannymh
 
*Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with Thee. Blessed art Thou among women and blessed is the fruit of Thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen. *

Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse.

O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee!
Sorrowful and Immaculate Heart of Mary, pray for us!

Remember, O Most gracious Virgin Mary that never was it known that anyone who fled to thy protection, implored thy help or sought thy intercession was left unaided. Inspired with this confidence, I fly unto thee, O Virgin of virgins, my mother. To thee do I come, before thee I kneel, sinful and sorrowful. O Mother of the Word incarnate despise not my petitions but in thy mercy hear and answer them. Amen.

Greg, you may call me Francine if you might like. 🙂

Maybe you might explain to me why this New York Times article is not enough reason for faith. :confused: query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9400E4D81738F93BA35757C0A96F958260

Another thought that you might have is to go from the other way around. I have a mathematical background and so I have some small experience with proving things true. In some small sense, I may have even taken classes where I’ve learned some reasons for my faith in things such as 1 + 1. That’s a honors level class in: real analysis and have also been blessed to have been exposed to a few of the great unsolved problems of mathematics and computer science by great mathematicians, such as the NP-complete (Non deterministic polynomial time) problems. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NP-complete There’s a 1 million dollar reward by the Clay Mathematics Institute if someone can determine whether or not P = NP in a formal mathematics proof. 😃

So maybe I can help in terms of relating formal proof to Christianity. Maybe it is not possible to prove Catholicism true in the way that you hope. After all the Bible says, “For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face-to-face. Now I know in part but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known.”(1 Corinthians 13:12) But maybe it is also impossible to prove Catholicism false.

So given that: we do not have 100% evidence whether Catholicism is true or false, what should we do? Blaise Pascal, mathematician, physicist, child prodigy, religious philosopher and Catholic - from whom comes Pascal’s theorem, Pascal’s triangle, the defense of the scientific method, and a mechanical calculator at the age of 18 - among other things before his death two months after his 39th birthday en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blaise_Pascal#Last_works_and_death is also known for his his Pascal’s wager, “even though the existence of God cannot be determined through reason, a person should “wager” as though God exists, because so living has potentially everything to gain and certaintly nothing to lose.” en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal’s_Wager

Of course, he said this at a time where I do not believe existed such widespread Marian apparitions that have been captured on televelsion to the best of my ignorant and highly imperfect knowledge (the Zeitun, Egypt apparitions) or the one that I posted that was reported in the New York times - Our Lady of Sorrows in Kibeho, Rwanda - or the Fatima, Portugal miracle that is even analyzed in (again in my highly ignorant and uninformed opinin) scientific journals.

So, maybe it might make sense to switch from thinking: all 100% of Catholicism has not been proved true, so I cannot believe any of it — to — all 100% of Catholicism has not been proven false, so give God through Mary the honor of believing in him until proven wrong 🤷 😊 :eek:

Sister Lucy of Fatima. “She has given this efficacy to such an extent that there is no problem; no matter how difficult it is, whether temporal or above all, spiritual, in the personal life of each one of us, of our families, of the families of the world, or of the religious communities, or even of the life of peoples and nations, that cannot be solved by the Rosary.”

Perhaps an experiment might be in order, maybe one might say the Rosary for one year asking God through the Immaculate Heart of Mary to reveal himself to you and help you to have the gift to believe if he does in fact exist and see what happens when the year is over:) Prayerful reading of St. Louis Mary de Montfort’s True Devotion to the Blessed Virgin montfort.org.uk/Writings/TrueDev.html also might be highly recommended and **Secret of the Rosary ** montfort.org.uk/Writings/Rosary.html as well if possibly there exists any additional time 👍

Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse.

O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee!
Sorrowful and Immaculate Heart of Mary, pray for us!

*Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with Thee. Blessed art Thou among women and blessed is the fruit of Thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen. *
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top