Question(s) about Orate fratres

[Knoweyedear]

I’ve been wondering about the changes to this prayer for a while.
originally-May the Lord accept the sacrifice at your hands for the praise and glory of His name, for our good, and the good of all His Church
now- May the Lord accept the sacrifice at your hands for the praise and glory of his name, for our good and the good of all his holy Church
Why was this changed to holy Church and i’m pretty certain this change has been done in other places in the mass but I can’t state specifically.

1. What does it mean by Church?
   The people in the Church?
   Church as the bride of Christ the institution that will last until the end of time?
2. How Is holy being used?
   To differentiate?
   To praise?

I’m hoping there is something i’m missing because I don’t like any of the ways I’ve tried to understand this change.
If holy is being used to differentiate the holy church from institutions that are not so holy like protestant or even Muslim or Hindu, are we saying the sacrifice of the mass is only for the good of those at this mass and the institution of the Catholic church? This goes against the understanding of the divine mercy chaplet having the offering be, “in atonement for our sins and those of the whole world.”

This is similarly a problem if this is a differentiation of for the Holy Catholics in the church as opposed to those who are in a state of sin. I know plenty of people to whom the catholic church seems to be only for those who are holy and looks down upon sinners. This is definitely not so, but to change the offering from for the good of his church to for the good of his holy church seems to validate these people’s concerns about a rejection of those who are not so holy

The best option in my mind is if it’s a statement of praise but even then i’m not certain what the prayer is trying to say. It’s can’t be referring to the individuals who make up the church as we aren’t worth of praise only God and the things he has done. I find it odd that the sacrifice of the mass is for the good of Christ’s holy church (institution) Christ died to open the gates of heaven and take upon himself our sins. My understanding of the Holy church bride of Christ was not something that needed that sacrifice for it’s own good. The holy catholic church is like in the Creed, something to believe in as something of a perfection and it’s the individuals that are in need of the saving grace from the Eucharistic celebration.

I hope some one takes to time to try and hash out of this where I’ve gone wrong.

 

[Erikaspirit16]

Why was this changed to holy Church

Because that’s the original Latin–ecclesiae suae sanctae. The old translation left it out. it’s not a “change,” it’s simply a return to the original Latin.

As for the meaning, I think you’re over-analyzing it. “…for our good and that of all your holy church.” If you don’t believe the Church is holy, you’re not really a Catholic, right? It’s not putting it in opposition to anything–you are.

 

[Vico]

I’ve been wondering about the changes to this prayer for a while.
originally-May the Lord accept the sacrifice at your hands for the praise and glory of His name, for our good, and the good of all His Church
now- May the Lord accept the sacrifice at your hands for the praise and glory of his name, for our good and the good of all his holy Church
Why was this changed to holy Church and i’m pretty certain this change has been done in other places in the mass but I can’t state specifically.
…

Catholic Encyclopedia – year 1911:

It is answered: “May the Lord receive the sacrifice from thy hands to the praise and glory of his name, and for our benefit also and for that of all his holy Church.”

Fortescue, A. (1911). Orate Fratres. In The Catholic Encyclopedia. New York: Robert Appleton Company. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11269b.htm

 

[Tis_Bearself]

As the other people posted, this is just a return to the original, more correct language.

The Church has been considered a “holy” institution by its members since it was invented. This is not anything new, different, or requiring a huge amount of analysis.

 

[Mintaka]

Um… my OP friend… if you’re there for the offertory prayer, you got there in time to say the Creed, right?

“I believe in one holy and apostolic Church.”

So if you’ve been saying you believe it, you must believe it already, right?

It used to be pretty standard in religion class to learn about the Church and how she is holy and spotless because she is Christ’s Body. Individual members (literally, “body parts”) of the Church may sin (and get cut off from the Body forever, if they continue unrepentant until death). But the Church herself cannot sin, because she is Christ’s Body and Christ does not sin.

Obviously, the Body of Christ is holy. Everything about Him is holy. He is God made man.

So it’s not an honorific. It’s a fact. Church (“called out, assembly”) is her name, and she obviously is holy.

Does that answer your question?

 

[Georgia]

I am confused about another change in the Orate Fratres.

The people in our parish stand after the priest has said his part and as they are starting their response.
At another parish nearby, the pastor made a point of saying that people should be up before he finished saying, “Pray.” He said the time to stand changed with the new version.

We visit quite a few churches, so we try to follow the norms where we happen to be. Our parish is the only one we have visited that doesn’t stand at the beginning of the O.F.

I asked our pastor and he said everyone should remain seated until his part is said. I will do exactly that when I am at our home parish and will rise with the faithful at all the other parishes.

The odd thing is that it is very easy indeed to spot visitors at our parish. They rise, look around, and try to sit, but that’s about the time the home folks stand.

I will never argue with our pastor, but are we the exception to the regular practice elsewhere? It seems so to me, but I have been wrong before.