Question to Non- Catholics of the USA (Catholics can chip in too!)

[ltwin]

I know zero about Baptists. What’s with the different names when it comes to population of this Faith vs the Catholic Faith (in Texas)?

MJ

Southern Baptists are only one group of Baptists in this country. You have American Baptists (formerly known as Northern Baptists). You have Landmark Baptists. You have Missionary Baptists. You have the large black Baptist conventions, such as the National Baptist Convention and the Progressive National Baptist Convention. You have the moderate/liberal Southern Baptist offshoots like the Cooperative Baptists. You have the Freewill Baptists.

And you even have the Bapticostal varieties like the Pentecostal Freewill Baptist Church.

 

[MartinJordan]

Southern Baptists are only one group of Baptists in this country. You have American Baptists (formerly known as Northern Baptists). You have Landmark Baptists. You have Missionary Baptists. You have the large black Baptist conventions, such as the National Baptist Convention and the Progressive National Baptist Convention. You have the moderate/liberal Southern Baptist offshoots like the Cooperative Baptists. You have the Freewill Baptists.

And you even have the Bapticostal varieties like the Pentecostal Freewill Baptist Church.

Thanks. Looks quite complicated but I digress.

MJ

 

[ltwin]

Thanks. Looks quite complicated but I digress.

MJ

A fundamental principle of Baptists is congregational church governance, which means that the congregation is the essential unit of church government. This means that Baptist denominations exist to serve the congregation rather than the other way around. There are some Baptist churches that are members of two different Baptist conventions at the same time.

 

[ltwin]

Im an Indian of Asian descent so pls forgive me if I am ignorant of the laws of the United States. However, I happened to read an article about Stephen F. Austin (who’s name is where Austin, Texas originates) who has been stated to say

I wish the settlers to remember that the Roman Catholic is the religion of this nation. I have taken measures to have Father Miness formerly of Nachitoches, appointed our Curate, he is a good man and acquainted with the Americans–and we must all be particular on this subject and respect the Catholic religion with all that attention due to its sacredness and to the laws of the land…

Source: digitalhistory.uh.edu/disp_textbook.cfm?smtID=3&psid=541

Pls note bolded part.

Is the Roman Catholic religion the religion of the State of Texas?

Thanks in advance for any clarifications.

Peace

MJ

You already did get great answers. I just wanted to add that before Texas became a part of the United States, it was a territory of Mexico. There was a large influx of Anglo-Americans into the Mexican far north in the 1800s, and the Mexican government really wanted them to become integrated into Mexican society. One way to do this was to require that they convert to the Catholic Church in order to gain citizenship. The Anglo settlers did do this, but few were serious about.

That is the context in which Austen wrote the above passage. You will notice that this statement seems to imply that the settlers were not observant Catholics, and that certainly was the case. There was even attempts to bring in Irish priests for the settlers, since it was thought that they would be more relatable to the Anglos.

And it should be pointed out that if anything, the religion of the United States at the time was evangelical Protestantism, most expressly Methodism and Baptists. Catholics were a minority and in many respects marginalized.

 

[Zosimus41]

Not around here. True there is no official state religion, but try buying a drink west of I35, orgoing to a foot ball game and not having a Baptist "dear heavenly Father, in Jaysus name aymin baptist prayer shoved down your ears in impossible.

Andrew,

I laughed while reading your post!

Reason why is because I work in a Christian… lets call it a “facility” started/founded by Catholics but was overrun so to speak by protestants. So we have all the Catholic art work throughout the building with protestant flare teachings and prayers and listening to cheezy light rock Christian music all day long.

For me its torture!

 

[Zosimus41]

So then the question becomes are there 900,00 members of the Missionary Baptist and other “Baptist” named organizations in Texas

4S,

Not sure about that but even a so called “non denominational preacher” is licensed baptist preacher.

 

[ltwin]

According to The Association of Religion Data Archives statistics for 2010 there are 4,673,500 Catholics in Texas. There are 17 Baptist denominations in the state of Texas with a total listed membership of 3,958,751. That’s a difference of 714,749 people.

The SBC is the largest with 3,721,318 members. Next are:

National Baptist Convention of America, Inc. (historically black), 89,050
National Baptist Convention, USA, Inc. (historically black), 59,529
The American Baptist Association (Landmark Baptist), 39,354
National Missionary Baptist Convention, Inc. (historically black), 33,990
American Baptist Churches in the USA (mainline Protestant), 7,172
National Association of Free Will Baptists, 3,111
Progressive National Baptist Convention, Inc. (historically black), 2,683
Converge Worldwide (originally the Swedish-American General Baptist Conference), 1,320
North American Baptist Conference (founded as a German-American fellowship), 1,157
Seventh Day Baptist General Conference (sabbatarians), 67 (only 3 churches)
Alliance of Baptists (mainline Protestant) 9 churches, members not listed
Association of Reformed Baptist Churches of America, 3 churches
Conservative Baptist Association of America, 1 church
Full Gospel Baptist Church Fellowship (apparently Bapticostal), 52 churches
General Association of Regular Baptist Churches, 6 churches
Independent Baptist Fellowship International, 258 churches
Reformed Baptist Churches, 27 churches

 

[KendraDZ1902]

Not around here. True there is no official state religion, but try buying a drink west of I35, orgoing to a foot ball game and not having a Baptist "dear heavenly Father, in Jaysus name aymin baptist prayer shoved down your ears in impossible.

This has been bugging me.
Why in the world would you think it was ok to mock someone’s prayer? Would you rather have them not pray? What gives YOU the right to be ugly about how someone prays? I find this nasty, little post you have made to be very arrogant and rude.

 

[andrewstx]

This has been bugging me.
Why in the world would you think it was ok to mock someone’s prayer? Would you rather have them not pray? What gives YOU the right to be ugly about how someone prays? I find this nasty, little post you have made to be very arrogant and rude.

I find it innapropriate and unconstitutional to have sectarian prayers said at any tax-supported function in the non-sectarian public schools. And yes I would rather they not pray under those circumstanses. I find baptists arrogant and rude when they shove their teachings down everyone’s ears.

Baptists and other evangelical/fundamentalists have no repect for the laws of this nation, and often defy the laws when they have a majority as they do in west texas.

I went to so called “public” schools all of my life. Every day I had Baptist prayers shoved down my ears in what was in reality baptist parochial schools funded by the tax payers. Never once in 12 years did I hear an Our Father or Hail Mary, it was unthinkable.

I do not hate baptists or harbor malice toward them, but I am not baptist, never have been and never will be.

 

[ltwin]

I find it innapropriate and unconstitutional to have sectarian prayers said at any tax-supported function in the non-sectarian public schools. And yes I would rather they not pray under those circumstanses. I find baptists arrogant and rude when they shove their teachings down everyone’s ears.

Baptists and other evangelical/fundamentalists have no repect for the laws of this nation, and often defy the laws when they have a majority as they do in west texas.

I went to so called “public” schools all of my life. Every day I had Baptist prayers shoved down my ears in what was in reality baptist parochial schools funded by the tax payers. Never once in 12 years did I hear an Our Father or Hail Mary, it was unthinkable.

I do not hate baptists or harbor malice toward them, but I am not baptist, never have been and never will be.

What exactly is a “Baptist” prayer may I ask?

 

[KendraDZ1902]

I find it innapropriate and unconstitutional to have sectarian prayers said at any tax-supported function in the non-sectarian public schools. And yes I would rather they not pray under those circumstanses. I find baptists arrogant and rude when they shove their teachings down everyone’s ears.

Baptists and other evangelical/fundamentalists have no repect for the laws of this nation, and often defy the laws when they have a majority as they do in west texas.

I went to so called “public” schools all of my life. Every day I had Baptist prayers shoved down my ears in what was in reality baptist parochial schools funded by the tax payers. Never once in 12 years did I hear an Our Father or Hail Mary, it was unthinkable.

I do not hate baptists or harbor malice toward them, but I am not baptist, never have been and never will be.

I don’t know how anyone would differentiate between different denomination’s prayers. Not every Protestant is Baptist. I would never say “ew, I’m not going to participate in this prayer because gasp the person saying it is Methodist. The NERVE!”
If this “Baptist prayer” is unconstitutional, then so is praying an Our Father or Hail Mary before the football game. You can’t say Protestant prayers or in your case “Baptist prayers” are unconstitutional, but Catholic prayers are not.

By the way, public schools do say Our Father. I played softball in HS and that was always our team prayer before the game. That would also be the prayer that we would say with the opposing team after the game. There wasn’t one Catholic in my HS, so maybe we shouldn’t have said it. The nerve of little Protestant girls praying a Catholic prayer. gag

I have never been Baptist, but from reading, my understanding is that the Catholic Church view protestants as brothers and sisters in Christ. So, using my context clues, “Baptist prayers” are ok to hear.

 

[ltwin]

I don’t know how anyone would differentiate between different denomination’s prayers. Not every Protestant is Baptist. I would never say “ew, I’m not going to participate in this prayer because gasp the person saying it is Methodist. The NERVE!”
If this “Baptist prayer” is unconstitutional, then so is praying an Our Father or Hail Mary before the football game. You can’t say Protestant prayers or in your case “Baptist prayers” are unconstitutional, but Catholic prayers are not.

By the way, public schools do say Our Father. I played softball in HS and that was always our team prayer before the game. That would also be the prayer that we would say with the opposing team after the game. There wasn’t one Catholic in my HS, so maybe we shouldn’t have said it. The nerve of little Protestant girls praying a Catholic prayer. gag

I have never been Baptist, but from reading, my understanding is that the Catholic Church view protestants as brothers and sisters in Christ. So, using my context clues, “Baptist prayers” are ok to hear.

I’m putting all Catholics on notice that I have applied for a patent and have filed applications in several states to trade mark the Lord’s Prayer/Our Father as an exclusively Pentecostal prayer.

I’m also putting all you Baptists on notice that I am registering several Baptist prayers with the office of the South Carolina Secretary of State.

So Catholics and Baptists, keep your mouth’s shut.

 

[AveChriste11]

There are no “state” religions in the United States, unless one calls secularism a religion.

Traditionally it was the Church of England, which later became the Episcopal Church under the guidance of Samuel Seabury and others.

 

[ltwin]

Traditionally it was the Church of England, which later became the Episcopal Church under the guidance of Samuel Seabury and others.

Not entirely factual. Each of the Thirteen British Colonies had their own established church.

Connecticut - Congregationalist (Puritans)
Delaware - no establishment
Georgia - Church of England (later the Episcopal Church)
Maryland - Church of England
Massachusetts - Congregationalist
New Hampshire - Congregationalist
New Jersey - none
New York - Church of England (but the Dutch Reformed Church was also semi-established due to New York having originally been a Dutch colony)
North Carolina - Church of England
Pennsylvania - none
Rhode Island - none
South Carolina - Church of England
Virginia - Church of England

You can see a definite pattern. In New England, unsurprisingly, the descendants of the Puritans dominated. In the South, Anglicanism was the establishment. And in the middle colonies, there was a tendency to have no state church.

 

[AveChriste11]

Not entirely factual. Each of the Thirteen British Colonies had their own established church.

Connecticut - Congregationalist (Puritans)
Delaware - no establishment
Georgia - Church of England (later the Episcopal Church)
Maryland - Church of England
Massachusetts - Congregationalist
New Hampshire - Congregationalist
New Jersey - none
New York - Church of England (but the Dutch Reformed Church was also semi-established due to New York having originally been a Dutch colony)
North Carolina - Church of England
Pennsylvania - none
Rhode Island - none
South Carolina - Church of England
Virginia - Church of England

You can see a definite pattern. In New England, unsurprisingly, the descendants of the Puritans dominated. In the South, Anglicanism was the establishment. And in the middle colonies, there was a tendency to have no state church.

Wasn’t the dominant Church among the Pennsylvanians, the Quaker Church? I’m not sure that they could be called a “Church” back then though? I do remember that Quaker philosophy played an important role in Pennsylvania’s relationship to the other states.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Southern Baptists are only one group of Baptists in this country. You have American Baptists (formerly known as Northern Baptists). You have Landmark Baptists. You have Missionary Baptists. You have the large black Baptist conventions, such as the National Baptist Convention and the Progressive National Baptist Convention. You have the moderate/liberal Southern Baptist offshoots like the Cooperative Baptists. You have the Freewill Baptists.

And you even have the Bapticostal varieties like the Pentecostal Freewill Baptist Church.

You left out the Footwashin’ Baptists…

 

[ltwin]

Wasn’t the dominant Church among the Pennsylvanians, the Quaker Church? I’m not sure that they could be called a “Church” back then though? I do remember that Quaker philosophy played an important role in Pennsylvania’s relationship to the other states.

William Penn, the founder of Pennsylvania was a Quaker and many Quakers fled persecution in England for Pennsylvania. They were the majority religion for a while and continued to dominate the state government for even longer. However, the Religious Society of Friends was never legally established. It had a lot of influence by being the majority religion, but it had no legal relationship to the state. The colony’s charter guaranteed liberty of conscience.

It’s similar to Maryland. Maryland was founded when Charles I granted George Calvert, English secretary of state, and his son Cecil Calvert a charter in 1632. The Calverts were recent converts to Catholicism, and under their leadership many prominent Catholic families settled in Maryland. Under the rule of the Calvert family, Maryland had no state church and all Christian churches were tolerated. Then in 1689, the original charter was revoked, and in 1701 the Church of England was established. Eventually laws were passed disenfranchising Catholics and barring them from holding public office.

In addition, both the British territories of West Florida and East Florida had an Anglican establishment, until Britain ceded the territories back to Spain after the American Revolution.

And as has already been said, Utah was founded by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and for its early history had no distinction between church and state.

 

[cat3gs]

Not entirely factual. Each of the Thirteen British Colonies had their own established church.

Connecticut - Congregationalist (Puritans)
Delaware - no establishment
Georgia - Church of England (later the Episcopal Church)
Maryland - Church of England
Massachusetts - Congregationalist
New Hampshire - Congregationalist
New Jersey - none
New York - Church of England (but the Dutch Reformed Church was also semi-established due to New York having originally been a Dutch colony)
North Carolina - Church of England
Pennsylvania - none
Rhode Island - none
South Carolina - Church of England
Virginia - Church of England

You can see a definite pattern. In New England, unsurprisingly, the descendants of the Puritans dominated. In the South, Anglicanism was the establishment. And in the middle colonies, there was a tendency to have no state church.

Wasnt Maryland Catholic until the protestants came in and took over. If I remember correctly the first American Bishop was in Baltimore? Correct me if Im wrong Again…if Im remembering correctly… Catholicism was outlawed on pain of death?

 

[babochka]

Yes, Ive got some good answers.

I suppose these kind of developments would mean names of places such as Corpus Christi would eventually have no meaning.

MJ

Sadly, yes. I live in another city, in a different state, but also named for the Blessed Sacrament. Very few are aware of its meaning.

 

[SummitJim]

California, with its strong Mexican history, has a LOT of places wth “religeous” names. We have a small movement here which wants to secularize all place names. What a job that would be, and they have no idea. Just count the number of cities starting with San or Santa. And let’s not forget our state capital: Sacramento. Can we not just get over it?