Questioning Mary

[Church_Militant]

Originally Posted by Joseph Smith

To answer your question you need look into what the holy scriptures teach on such. Yeah that would work, except that the Holy Scriptures never teach that they alone are the source for all that Christians believe.

It is written that we have one mediator between God and man that being the Lord Jesus Christ.

True again, except that intercessory prayer is part of the mediation that all believers do for the whole world. Unless of course you really don’t care if your friends and neighbors and family members go to hell…

Also it is writen that all have sinned and fallen short that all also includes Mary.

Yep it says that… but does that mean that your newborn infant child has sinned already? Mary’s Immaculate Conception is different from any belief that she may not have sinned during her life. That is not a dogmatic Catholic teaching. Nice thought, but not something that we have to believe. I suggest that you stick to actual Catholic doctrines… [QUOTEMary is not once refered to in the bible as mary the Mother of God this is a latter added by the catholic church.
[/QUOTE]Here, you are dead wrong.
Luke 1:
39: In those days Mary arose and went with haste into the hill country, to a city of Judah,
40: and she entered the house of Zechari’ah and greeted Elizabeth.
41: And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit
42: and she exclaimed with a loud cry, "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb!
43: And why is this granted me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? The word Lord in this verse can mean only one thing and since Elizabeth was speaking by the power of the Holy Spirit. Lord is only used to refer to God. Hence you err not knowing the scriptures or the power of God.

God from the beginning said you shall not worship any other God. So in praying to mary which is a from of worship you sin against God.

Prayer is nowhere in the Bible stated to be a form of worship, and you cannot provide scripture to support that statement.

Mary did not die on a cross.

Nah! Really!? I don’t recall any Catholic authority ever saying that she did.

Nor is she any different then any other created person with the execption of being allowed to carry Christ Jesus as a child and to be his earthly mother for a short time.

Here is where you are dead wrong again. In reading the passages of the Bible that apply to her, (Beginning with Genesis 3:15) you will find that she is indeed the most unique soul in all of human history. You won’t find anyone else greeted by and archangel with “Hail full of grace”. (You’ll need to find out what the Greek means in that phrase right there.) [QUOTEYeat even Christ in a manner denounced her at the cross and on one other occasion.
[/QUOTE]Christ never denounced the Blessed Virgin and most especially not from the cross. You have misinterpretted scripture terribly or simply been subject to false teachings.

Do we honor mary? yes. Do we pray to mary? NO
She can’t answer she is in a state of sleep.

This is also error. If the saints are in “a state of sleep”, then how can they fulfill Hebrews 12:1 and surround us as a “great cloud of witnesses” to our race to the Kingdom of God? I never seen a race of any kind where the “witnesses” (most often called “fans”) just sat there and stoically did nothing, have you? How much more would those already in heaven cheer us on and intercede for us in our race that has such eternal consequences.

Do we put her on a pedistiol indeed no. She is a created sinner just like us all. A person that has found grace just like all believers in christ.

That’s your loss…You cannot provide a single verse from the Word of God that charges Mary with any sin.

Mary’s grace was complete (back to that Greek study again…) and again, you make unsupportable statements about the Blessed Virgin.

From your username? are you Mormon?
Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.

 

[rr1213]

With all due respect…

Blah, blah, blah, yadda, yadda, yadda, same old same old.

This is all so basic and juvenile and has been refuted so many times, since you have all of 6 posts here, I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt of just having fallen off the apple cart on this topic. Please visit the main Catholic Answers page here:
catholic.com/library/mary_saints.asp
Then come back here at least somewhat able to make an informed comment.

Fidelis, I fail to see what is juvenile about Joseph Smith’s posts. He clearly has a different perspective than you do on the subject but you’re Catholic, he’s non-Catholic and, to boot, you have been posting on this forum for two years. Joseph Smith joined today. Not everyone has had the benefit of learning from the erudite apologists who post here. Give the newbie a break.

 

[rr1213]

Mary’s Immaculate Conception is different from any belief that she may not have sinned during her life. That is not a dogmatic Catholic teaching. Nice thought, but not something that we have to believe. I suggest that you stick to actual Catholic doctrines…

That has not been my understanding from what I’ve read. I would be quite interested in hearing from any Catholics who would care to comment on whether it is dogmatically required by the Catholic Church to believe that Mary lived her life without any sin. According to the CCC:

**The Immaculate Conception

490
To become the mother of the Savior, Mary "was enriched by God with gifts appropriate to such a role."132 The angel Gabriel at the moment of the annunciation salutes her as "full of grace."133 In fact, in order for Mary to be able to give the free assent of her faith to the announcement of her vocation, it was necessary that she be wholly borne by God’s grace.

491
Through the centuries the Church has become ever more aware that Mary, “full of grace” through God,134 was redeemed from the moment of her conception. That is what the dogma of the Immaculate Conception confesses, as Pope Pius IX proclaimed in 1854:

The most Blessed Virgin Mary was, from the first moment of her conception, by a singular grace and privilege of almighty God and by virtue of the merits of Jesus Christ, Savior of the human race, preserved immune from all stain of original sin…

493
The Fathers of the Eastern tradition call the Mother of God “the All-Holy” (Panagia) and celebrate her as "free from any stain of sin, as though fashioned by the Holy Spirit and formed as a new creature."138 By the grace of God Mary remained free of every personal sin her whole life long.** (Emphasis added).

usccb.org/catechism/text/pt1sect2chpt2art3p2.htm

 

[Fidelis]

Fidelis, I fail to see what is juvenile about Joseph Smith’s posts. He clearly has a different perspective than you do on the subject but you’re Catholic, he’s non-Catholic and, to boot, you have been posting on this forum for two years. Joseph Smith joined today. Not everyone has had the benefit of learning from the erudite apologists who post here. Give the newbie a break.

Hey, I let him off easy because, as I said in my Post, I was giving him the benefit of the doubt because he was a newbie.

I totally don’t mind that he has a different perspective on it-- this forum would be boring if we all thought the same – but there’s no excuse for being uninformed about the Catholic Faith when there is a veritable library one click away that would put to rest his crass misconceptions – or at least clue him in that this wasn’t the first time we’ve heard this schlock and that —surprise!— there’s a ready source that’s at least worth looking at before he spouts off.

 

[Eden]

I’d be careful with this argument, knowing as we do that even the devil quoted scripture. Uttering the words of God is not necessarily a sin nor a blessing. It is what is in the heart at the time of the utterance that determines the answer to that question.

So you are comparing the use of the quotation from Luke 1:28 in the beginning of the Hail Mary to satan quoting Scripture? That’s interesting that you would even say such a thing in the context of uttering the Hail Mary, considering satan is Mary’s enemy. I’m sure if satan said these words, he would do so in a mocking and vulgar tone and perhaps add “Mary had sex, she had children, and she was a sinner” to bring God’s children into his ugly world of deception.

Emnity between satan and the woman:

Gen. 3:15 - we see from the very beginning that God gives Mary a unique role in salvation history. God says “I will put enmity between you and the woman, between your seed and her seed.” This refers to Jesus (the “emnity”) and Mary (the “woman”). The phrase “her seed” (spermatos) is not seen elsewhere in Scripture.

Gen 3:15 / Rev. 12:1 - the Scriptures begin and end with the woman battling satan. This points to the power of the woman with the seed and teaches us that Jesus and Mary are the new Adam and the new Eve.

John 2:4, 19:26 - Jesus calls Mary “woman” as she is called in Gen. 3:15. Just as Eve was the mother of the old creation, Mary is the mother of the new creation. This woman’s seed will crush the serpent’s skull.

This is how Joseph Smith, who claims he honors Mary, speaks about the woman whom “all generations shall call blessed” (Luke 1:48)

Mary had sex, she had children and she was a sinner

 

[Eden]

Mary is not once refered to in the bible as mary the Mother of God this is a latter added by the catholic church.

It’s becoming rather obvious that JS has not read the Bible:

Luk 1:43 (KJV) "But why is this granted to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

Luke 1:43 - Elizabeth’s use of “Mother of my Lord” (in Hebrew, Elizabeth used “Adonai” which means Lord God) is the equivalent of “Holy Mary, Mother of God” which Catholics pray in the Rosary. The formula is simple: Jesus is a divine person, and this person is God. Mary is Jesus’ Mother, so Mary is the mother of God (Mary is not just the Mother of Jesus’ human nature - mothers are mothers of persons, not natures).

 

[Writer]

I would suggest a couple of things. The first would be to go online to the “Baltimore Catechism” and look up all of things that it says about worship especially the terms dulia, hyper dulia, and latria. These are the terms the church has always used when it comes to worship and veneration and they distinguish between what is vereration and what is the worship that is reserved for God. Point out that the Baltimore catechism is an old catechism and therefore shows what the church has always taught and still teaches today.

See if you can get this person to read Scott Hahn’s book Hail Holy Queen. This will be very helpful because it delves into scripture and puts things into a beautiful perspective.

Also point out that we never offer the most beautiful sacrifice of the mass to anyone but the Father. Jesus is the most perfect sacrifice and all can agree on this. Malachi 1:11 says, “For from the rising of the sun to its setting my name is great among the nations, and in every place incense is offered to my name, and a pure offering; for my name is great among the nations, says the Lord of hosts.” This is one of our Eucharistic prayers and clearly illustrates who it is we worship.

If the mass was offered up to Mary then someone might have a legitimate claim that Catholics somehow worship Mary as God or as a god. Clearly nothing could be farther from the truth.

I hope these suggestions will help.

I’m with you 100%, except I am not sure that Scott Hahn book is the best choice for someone in RCIA. Unless I am mistaken, that is the book in which Hahn is suggesting that the Holy Spirit is feminine, and, if indeed I am correct in my understanding of Hahn’s point, that would be contrary to Catholic understanding of the Trinity.

 

[rr1213]

So you are comparing the use of the quotation from Luke 1:28 in the beginning of the Hail Mary to satan quoting Scripture? That’s interesting that you would even say such a thing in the context of uttering the Hail Mary, considering satan is Mary’s enemy. I’m sure if satan said these words, he would do so in a mocking and vulgar tone and perhaps add “Mary had sex, she had children, and she was a sinner” to bring God’s children into his ugly world of deception.

Maybe and maybe not. What tone of voice did Satan use when he quoted Scripture to Christ? We don’t know do we? I think it is also dangerous to assume that it would be in a mocking and vulgar tone of voice. When that tone of voice is used, it is a warning sign to the listener. On the other hand, when a silky, pleasant and seductive tone of voice is used, the listener is more easily deceived. Satan is deceptive, seductive and quite intelligent. You get more flys with honey than vinegar and I suspect that Satan has more use for honey.

 

[Eden]

Maybe and maybe not. What tone of voice did Satan use when he quoted Scripture to Christ? We don’t know do we? I think it is also dangerous to assume that it would be in a mocking and vulgar tone of voice. When that tone of voice is used, it is a warning sign to the listener. On the other hand, when a silky, pleasant and seductive tone of voice is used, the listener is more easily deceived. Satan is deceptive, seductive and quite intelligent. You get more flys with honey than vinegar and I suspect that Satan has more use for honey.

Satan is repulsed by Mary and her purity and grace. Anything that contradicts her own quote in scripture “generations shall call me blessed” is from an evil source.
When the Angel Gabriel spoke the words “Hail Mary” he was delivering that message straight from God. This was God’s own pure and beautiful greeting to the Mother of our Lord.

While you insinuate that Catholics who say the “Hail Mary” could be speaking at the suggestion of satan, I would say that the fruits of praying the Rosary are entirely holy and always draw the person saying them closer to Jesus Christ. If reciting the “Hail Mary” is a deception of satan, he’s doing an awful job of at working to pull us away from God. The Rosary, as with all prayers, have the completely opposite effect.

“Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee (Luke 1:28), Blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus (Luke 1:42). Holy Mary, Mother of God (Luke 1:43), pray for us sinners (Rev. 5:8) now and at the hour of our death. Amen.”

 

[rr1213]

While you insinuate that Catholics who say the “Hail Mary” could be speaking at the suggestion of satan…

Not what I said. Read post 37 above, which is also quoted below.

You asked whether “uttering the very words of God is a sin?” My response was, since we know for a fact that Satan himself at least once “uttered the very words of God” when he quoted Scripture to tempt Christ, that whether any particular utterance of God’s word is sinful would depend on the heart of the person at issue. Think also of what Scripture says about people who preached in the Lord’s name and healed the sick in his name, yet the Lord knew them not. Again, the mere ability to quote Scripture is not determinative one way or the other…whether you are Protestant or Catholic.

My previous post:

“I’d be careful with this argument, knowing as we do that even the devil quoted scripture. Uttering the words of God is not necessarily a sin nor a blessing. It is what is in the heart at the time of the utterance that determines the answer to that question.”

 

[Joseph_Smith]

I am sure that God saw the day of the mother of God worship increasing so here is a interesting scripture. Mark VI.,3 “is this not the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James and Joseph, and Jude and Simon? Are not His sisters here with us?” Seems like Mary Was married and having children left and right. It is right to say Mary at the time she carried Jesus had no sin of her own at that time. Yeat Mary is not divine her nature is no different than any persons. We in the human race are the produce to mans sin nature that includes Mary. In refering to the scripture one must research all the scriptures to really understand the true meaning of the scriptures least be become snared in false doctrine and dogma. example the greeting “hail” is a salutation of greeting. nothing more. It does not not imply any meaing other then the common greeting could have been good morning, good evening or howdie do. The essence of the scripture has to be derived from the whole of the text of the scriptures of God and on one scriptute but the whole of the word of God. What we see in these days is a departure from the virgin birth of Jesus the Christ to a ratical teaching which comes from the femist of this day that teaching is Hail Mary mother of GOD.
Mary is not the mother of God period in this since. Mary is a blessed woman among woman. But she is not there mother. Eve is the mother of all living. Reference Genesis 3:20 Mary is not Eve. In Genesis in the creation of Adam you see that original man is made having the componets of male and female with in himself. Then God takes woman out of man. And in fact he divided man and woman from the origianl creation. Mary was not a new creature on the earth Jesus was and is a new creature. Mary is in the lintage of David. But God has said he imputs the sins of the fathers to the third and forth generations. So Mary will be accounted to sin. Weather it is origial sin, her own sin, or the sins of her forefather. And there is no way around that. God word covers it all but you have to also understand his word is eternal.
Many in this day are trying to attribute special meaing to a very simple gosple. The Gosple is good news that God has send a redeemer in the form of the person of Jesus the Christ. Mary knew that Gods son was with in her. Yeat she never called herself Mother of God. She knew the error of saying so.
Mary was highly favored of God. To be highly favored mean to favored in the sight of God. She was a chossen vessel. But does he mean she was not created. No she was created just like all the living. Her lintage being the same as all living. Mary is blessed because she has been chossen out of all the lintage of David to carry the Christ. Yeat marry is not divine. Actually she has to be 100 percent human. Mary is the human side of Christ. When the Holy Spirit overshowed mary he created Jesus in Mary. We do not know if the Holy Spirit used any part of mary for that creation. We know that God is able to do as he pleases. Mary with out a dought provided a guidence for Jesus and Jesus did learn from Mary. Does Jesus have her dna or did God even use one of Marys eggs. We can’t even really comment on these things. God created original man from the dust of the earth. So God does not need man help to creat. Jesus existed from before the earth. He is the word become flesh. He came out of the Father and he is the father. God has not beginning and no end. He has not mother or father. Human nature is to always associate what we see in the physical to what must be happening in the spiritual. Yeat it is not alwyas the case.
In the case of GOD we have GOD the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. That is all one spirit. Mary is not spirit she is flesh and bone. Yeat the spirit of Christ resided in her for a period of time. Does this make her the mother of GOD. No mary has not created Christ. The Holy Spirit created Christ. A father and a mother creat a child togeither. And even in that form of creation the breath of God is what gives the life.
So in fact Mary is a blessed vessel. And she is blessed amoung woman.
To understand Marys role in all the days of her life you have to understand Marys life. Mary is a servant unto God. Mary is not a apostle nor is she a prophet she is a follower of Jesus. She is a christian and she is allowed the priviledge of holding the Christ child for a short time. But Mary also knew that she would lose that same child. Jesus is not a baby any more. Mosus mother was not divine, Aberham mother was not divine. Mary is not divine either. Yeat she is favored of God.
Mary prayed to God the father. Mary is not going to be in hell. Jesus loved her. She is a redeemed sinner like all of the believers of Christ. A joint heir with christ.
When you exalt Mary you actually bring shame unto her. We honor Mary as she has done a great service to God. But she would vomite if she knew you prayed to her. It would be repulsive to her. Mary prayer to God the creater of heaven and earth and the christ. Mary is not a creator in any form.

 

[JonathanKinsman]

Fidelis, I fail to see what is juvenile about Joseph Smith’s posts. He clearly has a different perspective than you do on the subject but you’re Catholic, he’s non-Catholic and, to boot, you have been posting on this forum for two years. Joseph Smith joined today. Not everyone has had the benefit of learning from the erudite apologists who post here. Give the newbie a break.

rr1213:

He is not only non-Catholic, he is apparently non-Christian. He uses “Joseph Smith” as his handle: the founder of Mormonism. His profile says Protestant which is what Mormons pretend to but most of us (Catholic and Protestant) recognize them as a sect and as non-Christian as Moslems.

His perspective is juvenile. It reeks of Chick tracts boiled with the oil of Doctrine and Covenants.

It is not charity to indulge in another’s rantings. Even if they veer uncomfortably towards others in the thread

 

[water]

 Mary is not the mother of God period in this since.

so…who is Jesus?

 

[rr1213]

Mary is not the mother of God period…

“Mary is the Mother of Jesus” + “Jesus is God” = “Mary is the Mother of God”

The Church decided this one a long time ago…

 

[rr1213]

rr1213:

He is not only non-Catholic, he is apparently non-Christian. He uses “Joseph Smith” as his handle: the founder of Mormonism. His profile says Protestant which is what Mormons pretend to but most of us (Catholic and Protestant) recognize them as a sect and as non-Christian as Moslems.

His perspective is juvenile. It reeks of Chick tracts boiled with the oil of Doctrine and Covenants.

It is not charity to indulge in another’s rantings. Even if they veer uncomfortably towards others in the thread

I also suspect that he is a Mormon, but we can’t know for sure unless he tells us or expouses a doctrine that is peculiar to the LDS. Joseph and Smith are also common names in themselves.

So, “Joseph Smith”, are you LDS? Open disclosure of your affiliation would be a worthy postion to take…

 

[Joseph_Smith]

I am as much a morman as peter is a catholic! In other words I am not a mormon. Mormon are a cult that does not reley on the word of God for direction or understanding in other words they are apostate to christ and his teachings. Much like the catholic church. Buy the way I am a apostle and a prophet of the Lord Jesus Christ. I am taught by God alone. Which is fitting as God had declared a people who were not my people shall be my people and they shall have no need of a teacher for i shall be there teacher and they shall be my people. Funny is it not how the old and the two are actually one word. Never do they conflict. They confirm one another in all ways. As you are following the teachings of the catholic church you might want to consider were in the bible in revelation the catholic church is shown and the blessing or punishment of that same church. God will not hold him guiltless who proverts the word of God nor who practices lawlessness. Nor will he not punish the apostate church. Salvation is a gift that can be wasted and the catholic church promotes a salvation that is in no way the salvation of Christ. You might want to study reply 31 because it is Christ salvation. And do not forget to hail Mary Virgin Goddest of the Modern catholic femist movement of Roma the sinnless redeemer for all femist of the earth who blood was shed for no one. And i am not LDS either.

 

[Redbandito]

I am sure that God saw the day of the mother of God worship increasing so here is a interesting scripture. Mark VI.,3 “is this not the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James and Joseph, and Jude and Simon? Are not His sisters here with us?” Seems like Mary Was married and having children left and right. It is right to say Mary at the time she carried Jesus had no sin of her own at that time. Yeat Mary is not divine her nature is no different than any persons. Mary is not the mother of God period in this since. Mary is a blessed woman among woman. But she is not there mother. Eve is the mother of all living. Reference Genesis 3:20 Mary is not Eve. In Genesis in the creation of Adam you see that original man is made having the componets of male and female with in himself. Then God takes woman out of man. And in fact he divided man and woman from the origianl creation. Many in this day are trying to attribute special meaing to a very simple gosple. The Gosple is good news that God has send a redeemer in the form of the person of Jesus the Christ. Mary knew that Gods son was with in her. Yeat she never called herself Mother of God. She knew the error of saying so.
We know that God is able to do as he pleases. Mary with out a dought provided a guidence for Jesus and Jesus did learn from Mary. Does Jesus have her dna or did God even use one of Marys eggs. We can’t even really comment on these things. God created original man from the dust of the earth. So God does not need man help to creat. Jesus existed from before the earth. He is the word become flesh. He came out of the Father and he is the father. God has not beginning and no end. He has not mother or father. Human nature is to always associate what we see in the physical to what must be happening in the spiritual. Yeat it is not alwyas the case.
In the case of GOD we have GOD the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. That is all one spirit. Mary is not spirit she is flesh and bone. Yeat the spirit of Christ resided in her for a period of time. Does this make her the mother of GOD. No mary has not created Christ. The Holy Spirit created Christ. A father and a mother creat a child togeither. And even in that form of creation the breath of God is what gives the life.
So in fact Mary is a blessed vessel. And she is blessed amoung woman.
To understand Marys role in all the days of her life you have to understand Marys life. Mary is a servant unto God. Mary is not a apostle nor is she a prophet she is a follower of Jesus. She is a christian and she is allowed the priviledge of holding the Christ child for a short time. But Mary also knew that she would lose that same child. Jesus is not a baby any more. Mosus mother was not divine, Aberham mother was not divine. Mary is not divine either. Yeat she is favored of God.
Mary prayed to God the father. Mary is not going to be in hell. Jesus loved her. She is a redeemed sinner like all of the believers of Christ. A joint heir with christ.
When you exalt Mary you actually bring shame unto her. We honor Mary as she has done a great service to God. But she would vomite if she knew you prayed to her. It would be repulsive to her. Mary prayer to God the creater of heaven and earth and the christ. Mary is not a creator in any form.

Are you serious with these accusations? You are aware that the Catholic Church does not teach Mary is divine, correct? Also, "The Nestorian heresy regarded Christ as a human person joined to the divine person of God’s Son. Opposing this heresy, St. Cyril of Alexandria and the third ecumenical council, at Ephesus in 431, confessed “that the Word, uniting to himself in his person the flesh animated by a rational soul, became man.” Christ’s humanity has no other subject than the divine person of the Son of God, who assumed it and made it his own, from his conception. For this reason the Council of Ephesus proclaimed in 431 that Mary truly became the Mother of God by the human conception of the Son of God in her womb: “Mother of God, not that the nature of the Word or his divinity received the beginning of its existence from the holy Virgin, but that, since the holy body, animated by a rational soul, which the Word of God united to himself according to the hypostasis, was born from her, the Word is said to be born according to the flesh” (CCC, 466).

This is what the Catholic Church teaches on the subject. If you are going to attack the Church, at least attack “the Church,” and not some strawman created to make Catholics look bad.

 

[rr1213]

I am as much a morman as peter is a catholic! In other words I am not a mormon. Mormon are a cult that does not reley on the word of God for direction or understanding in other words they are apostate to christ and his teachings. Much like the catholic church. Buy the way I am a apostle and a prophet of the Lord Jesus Christ. I am taught by God alone. Which is fitting as God had declared a people who were not my people shall be my people and they shall have no need of a teacher for i shall be there teacher and they shall be my people. Funny is it not how the old and the two are actually one word. Never do they conflict. They confirm one another in all ways. As you are following the teachings of the catholic church you might want to consider were in the bible in revelation the catholic church is shown and the blessing or punishment of that same church. God will not hold him guiltless who proverts the word of God nor who practices lawlessness. Nor will he not punish the apostate church. Salvation is a gift that can be wasted and the catholic church promotes a salvation that is in no way the salvation of Christ. You might want to study reply 31 because it is Christ salvation. And do not forget to hail Mary Virgin Goddest of the Modern catholic femist movement of Roma the sinnless redeemer for all femist of the earth who blood was shed for no one. And i am not LDS either.

Ahh…ok. Thanks.

 

[water]

Buy the way I am a apostle and a prophet of the Lord Jesus Christ. I am taught by God alone.

I hope you are, but first drop your ignorance - You would not know anything about God if there were no one going before you. Where do you learn the Scripture from? Did you get it in the air?

Jesus did not teach you to say what you said.

 

[Eden]

Not what I said. Read post 37 above, which is also quoted below.

You asked whether “uttering the very words of God is a sin?” My response was, since we know for a fact that Satan himself at least once “uttered the very words of God” when he quoted Scripture to tempt Christ, that whether any particular utterance of God’s word is sinful would depend on the heart of the person at issue. Think also of what Scripture says about people who preached in the Lord’s name and healed the sick in his name, yet the Lord knew them not. Again, the mere ability to quote Scripture is not determinative one way or the other…whether you are Protestant or Catholic.

My previous post:

“I’d be careful with this argument, knowing as we do that even the devil quoted scripture. Uttering the words of God is not necessarily a sin nor a blessing. It is what is in the heart at the time of the utterance that determines the answer to that question.”

You neglected to respond to the specific Bible passage to which I was referring which is “Hail Mary, full of grace” and the fact that I stated that by its fruits I am quite sure that by uttering these words from God while praying the Rosary, one is not sinning.