Questions about Islam

  • Thread starter Thread starter SAINThoodSEEKER
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
S

SAINThoodSEEKER

Guest
I am a devout Catholic who is very interested in Islam (don’t get me wrong, I love my faith and am NOT leaving, I am just very intrigued by Islam considering the long, deep historical “relationship” it has had with the Middle East and with The Church). Anyway, I have a close Muslim friend and I have also taken a religion class in college that briefly covered Islam. Recently, I have been listening to Tim Staple’s audio CDs on Islam and they have been most informative. Before continuing with the CDs, I have some basic questions. All of the Surahs seem to have short blurbs of different teachings. There are some awkward, obscure “stories”, such as one about Alexander “The Great” and his travels (which Staples points out is historically inaccurate). Anyway, what is the basic context of these Surahs. Are they all containing Allah’s words to Mohammed (according to Muslim belief)? It is easy to see the context through much of it, but it does throw me off how the Koran was set up to be more entertaining than logical (I guess making it a better worship tool)by way of the periodic rhyming and the like. It also confuses me how the Koran also pays lip service to Christ, Mary, and other important Biblical figures of both Testaments. I know these are broad topics, but any info would be appreciated. Thanks and God bless.
 
40.png
SAINThoodSEEKER:
such as one about Alexander “The Great” and his travels (which Staples points out is historically inaccurate).
Click to expand...
It’s not historically inaccurate because the character mentioned is not Alexander “The Great”, but most probably Cyrus “The Great”, the ruler of ancient Persia, who united the Persian and Median empires into one.
Anyway, what is the basic context of these Surahs.
Click to expand...
Not sure what you’re asking about, nor which surahs in particular. Please clarify.
Are they all containing Allah’s words to Mohammed (according to Muslim belief)?
Click to expand...
Basically, yes.
It is easy to see the context through much of it, but it does throw me off how the Koran was set up to be more entertaining than logical (I guess making it a better worship tool)by way of the periodic rhyming and the like.
Click to expand...
The Qur’an is logical, but it’s logic is not that of a sequential narrative, but rather a focus on theme and using different analogies to allude to that theme.

But yes, a big part of the Qur’an is not just what it says, but how it says it. Its poetic, eloquent, rhyming beauty was designed to impress (and that it did), as well as to make it easy to memorize. It is after all an oral recitation. How boring it would be if it was an orally recited narrative!

This is one thing I can never forgive English translations of the Qur’an for…for ruining its rhyme and rhythm in Arabic by translating the text, which then of course reads just like plain words anybody could have patched together. For people who only have access to it in English, they can’t but fail to appreciate the effort it took not just to author the content, but to arrange it to sound the way it does. This takes away much of its power and meaning for non-Arabic speakers.
It also confuses me how the Koran also pays lip service to Christ, Mary, and other important Biblical figures of both Testaments
Click to expand...
I don’t know what you mean by “lip service”, and am offended at the sentiment. The Qur’an’s purpose, once again, is not to narrate stories about Jesus (PBUH) or other prophets. It’s mission is not inform readers, but to remind them of a few basic principles with powerful words and allusions.
 
40.png
SAINThoodSEEKER:
There are some awkward, obscure “stories”, such as one about Alexander “The Great” and his travels (which Staples points out is historically inaccurate).
Click to expand...
perhaps the inaccuracies stem from the fact that dhul-qarnain (the alexander mentioned in soorah al-kahf is not alexander the great).
40.png
SAINThoodSEEKER:
Anyway, what is the basic context of these Surahs. Are they all containing Allah’s words to Mohammed (according to Muslim belief)?
Click to expand...
yes, muslim belief is that the entire Quran is the speech of Allah’s as revealed to muhammad through the angel gabriel.
40.png
SAINThoodSEEKER:
It is easy to see the context through much of it, but it does throw me off how the Koran was set up to be more entertaining than logical (I guess making it a better worship tool)by way of the periodic rhyming and the like.
Click to expand...
the Quran was revealed over a period of twenty-three years in portions. each chapter in the Quran, particularly the longer ones, contains various passages some with different contexts from others within the same chapter.
40.png
SAINThoodSEEKER:
It also confuses me how the Koran also pays lip service to Christ, Mary, and other important Biblical figures of both Testaments.
Click to expand...
what do you mean by “lipservice”?
 
You guys answered my questions well (especially since I wasn’t quite clear about my concerns). I will have others that I hope you will address. Thanks again and God bless.

RJS
 
This is interesting,
what do you mean by “lipservice”?
Click to expand...
Gonzales, may be you forgot you still have an unfinished thread about Pararellism with Mr. Bivar and may be this is what is asked by ShS. There are a lot of story with Bible names in it. I also would love to invite Shs to learn with me from these two experts (oh, may be I should add InJesus, J Allison and Disciple of Jesus as well)

Here is the link:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=90311

Neverland
 
40.png
Neverland:
This is interesting,

Gonzales, may be you forgot you still have an unfinished thread about Pararellism with Mr. Bivar and may be this is what is asked by ShS. There are a lot of story with Bible names in it.
Click to expand...
interesting, indeed. perhaps you missed what i said in that thread as well, that i was going to observe and see where señor bivar’s “intellectual” discussion would go.

as for what sainthoodseeker meant by “lip service”, no offense, but i’d rather get the explanation from him/her, not you.

dictionary.com (emphasis mine):
lip service
n.
Verbal expression of agreement or allegiance, unsupported by real conviction or action; hypocritical respect: “Lip service continues to be paid to resolving regional conflicts, but there is no sense of urgency” (Henry A. Kissinger).
Click to expand...
i fail to see how any of the Quranic mentions of Allah’s righteous servants, such as jesus, his mother maryam, and other important “biblical” figures is “lip service”.
 
Dear Gonzales,

May be you have better English than both of us. What he meant, I believe, that why the other Prophet is not fully described in Quran, only briefly. So he doesn’t mean to offend you in anyway.

In Jesus Love,

Neveland.
 
40.png
Neverland:
This is interesting,

Gonzales, may be you forgot you still have an unfinished thread about Pararellism with Mr. Bivar and may be this is what is asked by ShS. There are a lot of story with Bible names in it. I also would love to invite Shs to learn with me from these two experts (oh, may be I should add InJesus, J Allison and Disciple of Jesus as well)

Here is the link:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=90311

Neverland
Click to expand...
Thanks for the invite
 
40.png
Neverland:
Dear Gonzales,

May be you have better English than both of us. What he meant, I believe, that why the other Prophet is not fully described in Quran, only briefly. So he doesn’t mean to offend you in anyway.

In Jesus Love,

Neveland.
Click to expand...
Yeah, what I meant by “lip service” was just a form of “general verbal respect”. This may not even be the case. I’m saying that it seems as if Jesus is somewhat important in Islam. I know that He is regarded as a great prophet, but isn’t it true that He is believed by Muslims to have a large role in the end of time…almost like a Christian belief of a “Second Coming?” Also, if Jesus is a great prophet (and only a great prophet), why is Mary mentioned in an important context by Islamic oracles?
 
40.png
Shenango:
This is one thing I can never forgive English translations of the Qur’an for…for ruining its rhyme and rhythm in Arabic by translating the text, which then of course reads just like plain words anybody could have patched together. For people who only have access to it in English, they can’t but fail to appreciate the effort it took not just to author the content, but to arrange it to sound the way it does. This takes away much of its power and meaning for non-Arabic speakers.
Click to expand...
And instead, what…? The whole world is supposed to drop all their other languages and learn Arabic, just so the Quran can sound pretty to them too? How can the world’s “true religion” be so dependent on such a worldwide hegemony?
 
40.png
exoflare:
How can the world’s “true religion” be so dependent on such a worldwide hegemony?
Click to expand...
allah knows best. true is true. no need to question it.
 
40.png
exoflare:
And instead, what…? The whole world is supposed to drop all their other languages and learn Arabic, just so the Quran can sound pretty to them too? How can the world’s “true religion” be so dependent on such a worldwide hegemony?
Click to expand...
Well, perhaps you may be overplaying what I meant. I think the Qur’an still has large potential in translation from its meanings and its message to influence non-Arabic speakers…and that’s even though I feel the past now classic translations leave much to be desired. There are millions of non-Arabs converting to Islam as we speak, so I don’t fret about it.

But from the standpoint of someone who engages in polemics, it just stinks that I can’t use the literary supremacy of the Arabic Qur’an as proof to people, Christians and otherwise, in debates and what not. Without any appreciation, or the possibility of it, of the artistic effort that went into authoring the Qur’an from the other side, it’s a lot easier for people to believe it was the work of a man, and consequently that makes my job in proving it otherwise all the more difficult. Nevertheless, as I said, there are people with eyes to see.
 
Dear Shen,

You said:
Well, perhaps you may be overplaying what I meant. I think the Qur’an still has large potential in translation from its meanings and its message to influence non-Arabic speakers…and that’s even though I feel the past now classic translations leave much to be desired. There are millions of non-Arabs converting to Islam as we speak, so I don’t fret about it.

Hmm…it’s their choice to convert. And I know there are also millions of moslems (among them are arabs) converted to other religion (or become an atheist). But too bad they must hide their identity. Why can’t they convert and live peacefully?

you also said:
But from the standpoint of someone who engages in polemics, it just stinks that I can’t use the literary supremacy of the Arabic Qur’an as proof to people, Christians and otherwise, in debates and what not. Without any appreciation, or the possibility of it, of the artistic effort that went into authoring the Qur’an from the other side, it’s a lot easier for people to believe it was the work of a man, and consequently that makes my job in proving it otherwise all the more difficult. Nevertheless, as I said, there are people with eyes to see.

That’s why we are here. We have eyes, we have heart, we have brain and we must use it to the maximum. You may start from the thread about Talmud in Quran.

Neverland
 
40.png
Neverland:
And I know there are also millions of moslems (among them are arabs) converted to other religion (or become an atheist).
Click to expand...
I don’t believe this is true, and if you do, please provide evidence.
 
what surah are you particully asking about? that has caused you not o nderstand are you talking about sorat alkahf?
anyways whatever part in the quran was not only meant for prophet mohammed but it is also meant for us, to benfit from it in our lives, to learn important lessons, and for instance the story of jesus in the quran is important to us because he is our prophet to, and it is natural that we know his storry too, we also know the story of moses and his followers in the second sorah in quran. So every sorah in quran has lessons within it…even the shortest sorah has a lesson, and even though its the shortest it is the most important sorah, why because it talks about the one rule in islam beilive in god and that he is the only one and has no sons, he is god almighty…it is the basic beilif in islam
i don’t know if i have covered it in any proper way , but i didn’t really understand what you were asking about
 
40.png
Neverland:
Dear Shen,

Hmm…it’s their choice to convert. And I know there are also millions of moslems (among them are arabs) converted to other religion (or become an atheist). But too bad they must hide their identity. Why can’t they convert and live peacefully?

you also said:
But from the standpoint of someone who engages in polemics, it just stinks that I can’t use the literary supremacy of the Arabic Qur’an as proof to people, Christians and otherwise, in debates and what not. Without any appreciation, or the possibility of it, of the artistic effort that went into authoring the Qur’an from the other side, it’s a lot easier for people to believe it was the work of a man, and consequently that makes my job in proving it otherwise all the more difficult. Nevertheless, as I said, there are people with eyes to see.

That’s why we are here. We have eyes, we have heart, we have brain and we must use it to the maximum. You may start from the thread about Talmud in Quran.

Neverland
Click to expand...
I would just like to point out to you as a muslim myself you can find muslims becoming atheist , but never converting into another religion, simply because of our beilifes its a bit hard to explain if you do not know the whole imapt of our beilif, so a muslim would never convert to another religion because he is already a beiliver at heart, but he may not stay a muslim because he is not a beiliver at heart and if he has no beilif no religion will ever fulfill him, so he becomes an atheist as you have said…but even those are a few …not millions
 
40.png
SAINThoodSEEKER:
I am a devout Catholic who is very interested in Islam (don’t get me wrong, I love my faith and am NOT leaving, I am just very intrigued by Islam considering the long, deep historical “relationship” it has had with the Middle East and with The Church). Anyway, I have a close Muslim friend and I have also taken a religion class in college that briefly covered Islam. Recently, I have been listening to Tim Staple’s audio CDs on Islam and they have been most informative. Before continuing with the CDs, I have some basic questions. All of the Surahs seem to have short blurbs of different teachings. There are some awkward, obscure “stories”, such as one about Alexander “The Great” and his travels (which Staples points out is historically inaccurate). Anyway, what is the basic context of these Surahs. Are they all containing Allah’s words to Mohammed (according to Muslim belief)? It is easy to see the context through much of it, but it does throw me off how the Koran was set up to be more entertaining than logical (I guess making it a better worship tool)by way of the periodic rhyming and the like. It also confuses me how the Koran also pays lip service to Christ, Mary, and other important Biblical figures of both Testaments. I know these are broad topics, but any info would be appreciated. Thanks and God bless.
Click to expand...
First, thank you for your nice words about Islam.

Second, the story of this man in Surah (Al-Kahf- i.e.Cave) isnt about Alexander. It is about another person. In Qur’an, there is no mention of Alexander, he is called “Thu Al-Qarnain”.

Those who try to interperet Qur’an suggested that maybe he is Alexander, but he isnt.

God Bless!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top