Questions about legion and drowning pigs

[phoenix1950]

Jesus exorcised a man which had “legion” inside of him and forced evil spirits inside a herd of swine

Mark 5:11-14
Now a great herd of pigs was feeding there on the hillside, and they begged him, saying, “Send us to the pigs; let us enter them.” So he gave them permission. And the unclean spirits came out, and entered the pigs, and the herd, numbering about two thousand, rushed down the steep bank into the sea and were drowned in the sea. The herdsmen fled and told it in the city and in the country. And people came to see what it was that had happened.

why would Jesus show mercy to spirits so evil that even animals committed suicide when they were inside of them? why not just banish them away or something (when he exorcised other people he didn’t send spirits to someone else or animal…they were just gone …not sure were but it was harmless)

and more importantly I am sure that 2000 pigs were not very cheap and their death probably caused great damage to the owner…and after the event Jesus just walked away…I am sure there must be reasonable answer to all of this

thanks in advance this is really bothering me

 

[Jitterbug]

To kill two birds with one stone, I’d guess.

He wanted to remove the demons and the pigs. Remember, Jews consider pigs to be unclean, and they were being raised in Israel, most likely by Jews. Therefore he wanted to remove the demons, and the unclean animals.

Just My thoughts.

 

[fred_conty]

What I got spiritually out of it was that Jesus wanted to demonstrate that devils are real and not imaginary. So when the devils entered the pigs and dashed into the sea, this shows them to be real beings. At other times when Jesus thru out a devil from a possesed person, there was nothing to show for it, that is, that anything really left. For with no proof, then the argument could be that the man was not possessed at all, but just mentally chalanged.

Just some thoughts.

 

[phoenix1950]

To kill two birds with one stone, I’d guess.

He wanted to remove the demons and the pigs. Remember, Jews consider pigs to be unclean, and they were being raised in Israel, most likely by Jews. Therefore he wanted to remove the demons, and the unclean animals.

Just My thoughts.

I thought so too …but the herdsman was probably not jew since he fled to the city and called for help …now if he were a jew he probably wouldn’t do this because he was obviously a criminal (at least in jewish community) and I am sure that other jews would see herd of 2000 pigs and do something about it (if they stone people for working at sabbath they had to do something about crime like this one)

 

[marlo]

Best Answer, Some would actually make this kind of argument, I remember when i was in elementary some group of protestant preachers said that the Lord did not actually make miracle when he fed the multitude of people with bread and fish, instead they explained that people would actually put food into the basket so that all were able to eat. Which of course, we kids did not buy it.

What I got spiritually out of it was that Jesus wanted to demonstrate that devils are real and not imaginary. So when the devils entered the pigs and dashed into the sea, this shows them to be real beings. At other times when Jesus thru out a devil from a possesed person, there was nothing to show for it, that is, that anything really left. For with no proof, then the argument could be that the man was not possessed at all, but just mentally chalanged.

Just some thoughts.

 

[midori]

Do you know what kind of damage pigs can do? Did you know that a grown pig can kill a man? Can you imagine what 2,000 pigs can do?

Do you think that the demons were interested in quietly sleeping and rooting for food until they got turned into bacon?

In my head, I always imagined that the demons were trying to pull a fast one, and they got the tables turned on them.

 

[phoenix1950]

Do you know what kind of damage pigs can do? Did you know that a grown pig can kill a man? Can you imagine what 2,000 pigs can do?

Do you think that the demons were interested in quietly sleeping and rooting for food until they got turned into bacon?

In my head, I always imagined that the demons were trying to pull a fast one, and they got the tables turned on them.

I believe that bulls and cows are more dangerous …still they had those too

owner was probably not a jew so he was not bound by jewish dietary law…he could have been a greek or something and those swines could have been all the income he had

 

[MilesVitae]

To kill two birds with one stone, I’d guess.

He wanted to remove the demons and the pigs. Remember, Jews consider pigs to be unclean, and they were being raised in Israel, most likely by Jews. Therefore he wanted to remove the demons, and the unclean animals.

Just My thoughts.

Actually, I thought this event occurred in a Gentile area, so the swineherds, or whatever you’d call them, would not have been Jewish.

As to why he cast them into the pigs I suppose to make more manifest to bystanders what was going on.

 

[LegoGE1947]

Actually, I thought this event occurred in a Gentile area, so the swineherds, or whatever you’d call them, would not have been Jewish.

As to why he cast them into the pigs I suppose to make more manifest to bystanders what was going on.

Why did the demons have to ask permission to be cast into the pigs? Couldn’t they just simply go?

 

[GEddie]

Why did the demons have to ask permission to be cast into the pigs? Couldn’t they just simply go?

They asked for permission to go into the pigs (presumably to use them as bodies, for their evil activities) rather than to go to Hell. Our LORD was in command, so they had to ask Him.

About the drowning:

I’ve heard it both ways. Some say HE was teaching the Jewish owner a lesson. Others hold that the region in question being mostly Greek, the owners were likely not under the Law anyhow.

This instance also demonstrates that demonism is nOt always just mental illness, as many hold today. Thousands of animals would not be affected by the illness of one human head.

ICXC NIKA

 

[fred_conty]

Why did the demons have to ask permission to be cast into the pigs? Couldn’t they just simply go?

I think permission from Jesus emphasizes all the more that Jesus is the one in control of their being cast out and to remove any doubt this all the more.

Just a thought.

 

[PacoG]

I think permission from Jesus emphasizes all the more that Jesus is the one in control of their being cast out and to remove any doubt this all the more.

Just a thought.

Jesus is God. The demons knew who He was. He was fully in control of the situation.

It’s the same situation as when Satan tempts Jesus in the desert. This shows how deluded Satan (“the father of lies”) is. He knows that Jesus is God. He is making offers that he cannot deliver.

Remember both Satan and his fallen angels (aka demons) were once in the Beatific Presence. They knew who The Second Person of the Trinity is.

Every event in which Jesus deals with evil, He shows His true power as God.

 

[LegoGE1947]

Jesus is God. The demons knew who He was. He was fully in control of the situation.

It’s the same situation as when Satan tempts Jesus in the desert. This shows how deluded Satan (“the father of lies”) is. He knows that Jesus is God. He is making offers that he cannot deliver.

Remember both Satan and his fallen angels (aka demons) were once in the Beatific Presence. They knew who The Second Person of the Trinity is.

Every event in which Jesus deals with evil, He shows His true power as God.

Okay! Got it!

 

[SweetLambs]

I believe that bulls and cows are more dangerous …still they had those too

owner was probably not a jew so he was not bound by jewish dietary law…he could have been a greek or something and those swines could have been all the income he had

I’d rather be run by a mama cow protecting her new calf than be amongst a herd of swine. Pigs will kill people and eat them- the cow just wants to rush you and possibly smash you against your truck.

I feel infinitely safer with cattle than pigs. I have scratched the necks of bulls (will never turn my back on one though). But it’s not about how dangerous they are. I assume pigs were declared unclean because they will eat anything, from carrion to manure. Ever smelled a boar at puberty or older? I don’t even like to eat pork, except for bacon and sausage…anyway, way off-topic. Sorry.

 

[Jimdandy]

Remember both Satan and his fallen angels (aka demons) were once in the Beatific Presence.

Source, please.

 

[Jimdandy]

Jesus is God. The demons knew who He was. He was fully in control of the situation.

It’s the same situation as when Satan tempts Jesus in the desert. This shows how deluded Satan (“the father of lies”) is. He knows that Jesus is God. He is making offers that he cannot deliver.

Remember both Satan and his fallen angels (aka demons) were once in the Beatific Presence. They knew who The Second Person of the Trinity is.

Every event in which Jesus deals with evil, He shows His true power as God.

Source for Beatific reference, please

 

[ColdComfort]

Jesus exorcised a man which had “legion” inside of him and forced evil spirits inside a herd of swine

Mark 5:11-14
Now a great herd of pigs was feeding there on the hillside, and they begged him, saying, “Send us to the pigs; let us enter them.” So he gave them permission. And the unclean spirits came out, and entered the pigs, and the herd, numbering about two thousand, rushed down the steep bank into the sea and were drowned in the sea. The herdsmen fled and told it in the city and in the country. And people came to see what it was that had happened.

why would Jesus show mercy to spirits so evil that even animals committed suicide when they were inside of them? why not just banish them away or something (when he exorcised other people he didn’t send spirits to someone else or animal…they were just gone …not sure were but it was harmless)

and more importantly I am sure that 2000 pigs were not very cheap and their death probably caused great damage to the owner…and after the event Jesus just walked away…I am sure there must be reasonable answer to all of this

thanks in advance this is really bothering me

From Haydock’s Bible commentary (1859):

Ver. 2. Ven. Bede gives a beautiful explanation of this miracle. He says that it represents the Gentiles, who were converted to the faith by the apostles. The legion represents the innumerable vices to which they were subject, neither restrained by the laws of God nor man, but breaking through every restraint, and wallowing in all kinds of uncleanness. (Ven. Bede) — The three evangelists agree in the expulsion of the legion of devils, except that St. Matthew makes mention of two demoniacs, and Sts. Mark and Luke only of one. The difficulty is thus solved by St. Augustine. St. Mark and St. Luke only mention one, as being more generally known, and particularly frightful in the neighbourhood. (St. Augustine)

Ver. 13. Jesus Christ permitted the devil to destroy these swine, that from their destruction, the men of that country might take the alarm, and be converted. (Ven. Bede)

Ver. 17. Astonished at the miracle that had been performed, and displeased with the loss of their herds, they refused the Saviour of the world entrance into their country. (Theophylactus) — It is observed that all Christ’s miracles, except this, and the blasted fig-tree, were of the beneficent kind. We cannot but pity the wretched blindness of the Gerasens, in driving Jesus from their coasts. As a just judgment of God, their city was the first that fell into the hands of the Romans, in the fatal war under Vespasian.

 

[PJM]

=phoenix1950;10165321]Jesus exorcised a man which had “legion” inside of him and forced evil spirits inside a herd of swine

Mark 5:11-14
Now a great herd of pigs was feeding there on the hillside, and they begged him, saying, “Send us to the pigs; let us enter them.” So he gave them permission. And the unclean spirits came out, and entered the pigs, and the herd, numbering about two thousand, rushed down the steep bank into the sea and were drowned in the sea. The herdsmen fled and told it in the city and in the country. And people came to see what it was that had happened.

why would Jesus show mercy to spirits so evil that even animals committed suicide when they were inside of them? why not just banish them away or something (when he exorcised other people he didn’t send spirits to someone else or animal…they were just gone …not sure were but it was harmless)

???] I am sure that 2000 pigs were not very cheap and their death probably caused great damage to the owner…and after the event Jesus just walked away…I am sure there must be reasonable answer to all of this

thanks in advance this is really bothering me

God can [literally] ONLY do good; but can and does permity bad things; even evil things to exist.

Here the Son of God was offering salvation! GOD WAS IN THEIR MIDST.

Rather than be concerned about their souls; they the swine hearders] FREELY choose to make money their “god.” Actions always have consequences.

What you seem to have missed here is the Grace-FILLED Blessing to the SOULS saved by the expelling of the deamons [evil spirits} that had taken possession of them And blocking there entry thereby in heaven.

Good leads to more good AND bad to more bad. It is THEE choice that God has always presented to men.

Ecclesiasticus 11:14 “Good things and evil, life and death,** poverty and riches, are from God”**.

Deuteronomy 30:19 “I call heaven and earth to witness this day, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing. Choose therefore life, that both thou and thy seed may live”

Ecclesiasticus 15:18 “Before man is life and death, good and evil, that which he shall choose shall be given him”/COLOR]

So Christ set this very choice before them. They “choose DEATH” and He granted their wish."

That said this is a MORAL story; not necessary completely factual. Numbers in the bible have “their own life”; own meanings beyond the actual count. This number means “MANY.” And the story itself could or may not have actually taken place. It is the MORAL Lesson that is being taught here.

The hidden message here is to have right priorities. By permmiting the pigs [ritually unclean in the Jewish Tradition] Christ was giving two different messages.

1. Choose well or end up like the swine: nor just dead; BUT SPIRITUALLY DEAD!
2. Could have??? been a message to not raise swine which were a forbiden food for the Jews. The FACT that they were MAY have ??? been an indication that they were by choice of greed; non-practicing; nio-religious Jews?

Have a Blessed Christmas and PLEASE, never doubt that God can only do good things:thumbsup:**