Questions concerning homosexuality

[speakttruth]

Please check out this website *www.courage*rc.net

Courage is a Catholic organization to help and support those with same sex attraction.

Yes they will help you. Don’t give in and don’t give up.
This is a temptation. Your very young, don’t be influenced by
people that have this same temptation.
Praying for you.
God bless

 

[Leegal]

Hello, my name is Heather, I’m 15 years old, and I am a dedicated Catholic. I live my faith as much as I can. I would concider myself a strong Catholic and loved in the eyes of God. But according to my religion this is all shattered by a single characteristic of mine. I am a homosexual. The Catholic belief on homosexuals is very much that it is immoral. This upsets me very much. I did not make the choice to like other women. If I had a choice, I would probably be straight like everyone else so that I could feel normal again. I have recently found a fellow Catholic who is also feeling the way I am and we are now going out as normal people do and staying chaste and taking things slow. I asked God to send me a sign and he sent me Jackie a few days after I started praying about it. So I have a few questions about this. What are homosexuals like myself supposed to do? Are we supposed to just hide it our whole lives? Live a lie? Are we not to have sex at all? Doesn’t Jesus love all of his followers, even the different ones like me? Answer these questions for me if you can, please. I’m so confused.

I’m not much for “signs” as they are easily misunderstood to mean what you want them to mean. Not that we don’t get “'signs” but sometimes they are misconstrued when they are wishful thinking.

In my signature is a link to the Vatican Letter to the Bishops on the Pastoral Care of Homosexuals.

Yes, like all unmarried people who are not called to a sacramental marriage, chastity is the only option.

I will take your word that you are homosexual, but as someone else had posted in these forums recently, for women sexuality is more “fluid” and this may, or may not, be your sexual identity. I don’t know.

 

[michelleds]

this thread was resurrected from 2004. that 15 year old is now 23

 

[timwatt]

I’m also a Catholic with same sex attractions who is living in chastity. Everyone here has already offered you great advice, but here are some additional resources that will help you:

Homosexuality and the Catholic Church - Video
youtube.com/watch?v=crfAsWacA-w

Gay Sex in the Bible
davidmacd.com/catholic/bible_gay_sex_homosexual.htm

 

[luke2219]

Sexual inclinations may be fluid, sexuality is not. It is absolutely static. Male and female he created them. I can speak first hand about how real homosexual desires can feel and how strongly they can feel like they are a part of me, somehow “the way I am”. But that is false. Male and female He created them. Once I began to surrender the identity of homosexual I began to experience true freedom. I now live in the knowledge that I am a man, a wounded man, but yet a man like any other. Not a sub-species of man or third gender or a homosexual man, but a man. Through hard work I’ve seen my homosexual desire decrease substantially and have a real hope and vision of living has a happily married family man.

Through my experience I have come to know that even more important that abstaining from homosexual activity is to surrender the identity of homosexual.

I implore all people of good will to stop reinforcing the false identity of “homosexual” by not using it as a now. There are men and women with homosexual desires, but there are no homosexuals. Once the label, the false identity, of homosexual is taken on and as long as it remains, a happy a fulfilling life is extremely difficult if not impossible.

 

[Dakota_Roberts]

So true, if only many more would listen,
God bless you and praying for all who suffer with SSA

For what purpose do you intend to resurrect a long dead thread from over half a decade? DOn’t you have other things to obsess about than homosexuality?

Sexual inclinations may be fluid, sexuality is not. It is absolutely static. Male and female he created them. I can speak first hand about how real homosexual desires can feel and how strongly they can feel like they are a part of me, somehow “the way I am”. But that is false. Male and female He created them. Once I began to surrender the identity of homosexual I began to experience true freedom. I now live in the knowledge that I am a man, a wounded man, but yet a man like any other. Not a sub-species of man or third gender or a homosexual man, but a man. Through hard work I’ve seen my homosexual desire decrease substantially and have a real hope and vision of living has a happily married family man.

Through my experience I have come to know that even more important that abstaining from homosexual activity is to surrender the identity of homosexual.

I implore all people of good will to stop reinforcing the false identity of “homosexual” by not using it as a now. There are men and women with homosexual desires, but there are no homosexuals. Once the label, the false identity, of homosexual is taken on and as long as it remains, a happy a fulfilling life is extremely difficult if not impossible.

In modern parlance sexuality is sexual inclinations. There is a difference between sex/gender and sexuality, you soul is either male or female, but sexuality can be affected by concupiscence and potentially set up at birth.

 

[luke2219]

In modern parlance sexuality is sexual inclinations. There is a difference between sex/gender and sexuality, you soul is either male or female, but sexuality can be affected by concupiscence and potentially set up at birth.

Very good observation. I add that in modern parlance sexual orientation is something that is fixed, inborn and unchangeable yet gender is something that is fluid, a choice, and can be changed. I disagree with modern parlance.

Dakota, you are absolutely correct that sexual inclination can be affected by concupiscence and potentially set up at birth. In the same what a person may be born with characteristics that lend themselves to him becoming a basketball player he may be born with characteristics that pre-dispose him to developing homosexual desires. However just as there is no gene that determines someone will be a basketball player, there is no inborn gene that determines that someone will develop homosexual desires.

You may have noticed, Dakota, that I did not use the word “sexuality” above as you did. In modern parlance sexuality means sexual inclination and so I took you to mean it that way and therefore agreed with you. However, I believe that modern parlance is wrong about that word as well. My sexuality is male. If my inclinations are to have intercourse with multiple women, a woman I am not married to, any man, or any of the many other inclinations that are not in God’s plan for our sexuality then those inclinations are disordered and the result of concupiscence. They are disordered because they to not conform to my God-given, inborn masculine sexuality and identity.

I believe, contrary to modern parlance, that sexuality is either male or female and not what my inclinations are. Any desire that is not exclusively for my spouse (who by definition is of the opposite gender) is a disordered desire. This mean just about everyone on the planet experiences disordered desires in relation to their sexuality of male or female. Well, that is not surprising, we all inherited concupiscence and Jesus came and died for us a founded His Holy Church for the very purpose of redeeming and saving us.

 

[Dakota_Roberts]

Very good observation. I add that in modern parlance sexual orientation is something that is fixed, inborn and unchangeable yet gender is something that is fluid, a choice, and can be changed. I disagree with modern parlance.

Dakota, you are absolutely correct that sexual inclination can be affected by concupiscence and potentially set up at birth. In the same what a person may be born with characteristics that lend themselves to him becoming a basketball player he may be born with characteristics that pre-dispose him to developing homosexual desires. However just as there is no gene that determines someone will be a basketball player, there is no inborn gene that determines that someone will develop homosexual desires.

You may have noticed, Dakota, that I did not use the word “sexuality” above as you did. In modern parlance sexuality means sexual inclination and so I took you to mean it that way and therefore agreed with you. However, I believe that modern parlance is wrong about that word as well. My sexuality is male. If my inclinations are to have intercourse with multiple women, a woman I am not married to, any man, or any of the many other inclinations that are not in God’s plan for our sexuality then those inclinations are disordered and the result of concupiscence. They are disordered because they to not conform to my God-given, inborn masculine sexuality and identity.

I believe, contrary to modern parlance, that sexuality is either male or female and not what my inclinations are. Any desire that is not exclusively for my spouse (who by definition is of the opposite gender) is a disordered desire. This mean just about everyone on the planet experiences disordered desires in relation to their sexuality of male or female. Well, that is not surprising, we all inherited concupiscence and Jesus came and died for us a founded His Holy Church for the very purpose of redeeming and saving us.

No, society does not seem to believe that gender is fluid, which is precisely why they are permissive to people undergoing sex change operations because they are freeing the person so that their exterior in fact reflects who they actually are on the inside.

We must distinguish male and female sexuality. Females are far more about emotions, thus since they tend to need an emotional connection it is often far more about the person than the sex leading to how females can so much more easily transition to married life (well, in between in general). True lesbians tend to be far more butch in both thinking and appearance which raises the possibility that they were simply exposed to high levels of testosterone in the womb leading to it. Males tend to be far more visual which is on so much lower and primal level causing much more difficulty trying to transition because it isn’t something they can control on a conscious level. Indeed, according to newer research it has been shown that while gays still possess a number of masculine features overall their brain structure is more like women than men and also that lesbians tend to be more masculine in brain structure than feminine, this could entirely be caused by hormones in the womb, especially in the parts that are different and are more or less cemented by birth.

you keep muddling your usage of sexuality and gender.

The key problem is that there is more to it than just sexual urges.

 

[chazk728]

I wish I could explain to you how that is not true. Chastity is a great gift.

Hi Luke 2219, could you take a few moments to explain this? I have a feeling you’d give a really good answer to this question.

 

[StevenFrancis]

What are homosexuals like myself supposed to do?

Live out your life in service to God, by carrying your individual cross, and offering your suffering to Jesus to be joined with His on the cross at Calvary like all faithful Catholics.

Are we supposed to just hide it our whole lives? Absolutely not.

Live a lie?

No

Are we not to have sex at all?

This is correct, for all persons, hetero or homosexual in attractions, outside of marriage between one woman and one man.

Doesn’t Jesus love all of his followers, even the different ones like me?

He absolutely does, in an abundance beyond the understanding of man

I’m so confused.

May God bless you on your journey, and help you to be less confused, and accepting of your chastity.

The Lord’s peace be with you,

Steven

 

[luke2219]

Hi Luke 2219, could you take a few moments to explain this? I have a feeling you’d give a really good answer to this question.

Simply put, chastity is living in accord with one’s state in life. Continence for the unmarried and monogamous relations with one’s spouse for the married. Chastity is a great gift because we are living as God created us to live which is the only way to ultimate happiness and fulfillment.

In this context, like any other sinful behavior, my continuous pursuit for one homosexual relationship after the other left me empty and unhappy. Even though it appeared that a homosexual relationship would bring me happiness and fulfillment every time it left me more empty and alone. Living a chaste life, even with the difficulties that brings in this valley of tears, is a gift because it brings true happiness and fulfillment.

It was a number of years since I first wrote that. Since then I’ve experienced such a reduction of my SSA and witnessed similar reductions in dozens of other men I’ve helped and encountered that I no longer believe that most people who experience SSA are called to remain celibate. I, for example, began to believe about 2 years ago that I was called to marriage but was not ready for it because my degree of SSA was not sufficiently reduced. Feeling that call and realizing that I was unprepared, I worked much harder to achieve wholeness and virtue thereby reducing my SSA and otherwise preparing me for marriage. Now my wholeness has increased to the point that what little remains of my SSA is not an impediment to my future marriage. So, while continuing to live a chaste life and seeking more and more wholeness and virtue, I am also actively seeking my wife and preparing for marriage.

So while like any other unmarried person those with SSA are called to continence I believe that even those with SSA are called to married or religious vocations. If in their present state they are unprepared to enter into that calling then they are called to pursue whatever wholeness and virtue is lacking. They may not achieve the calling by the end of their lifetime but sometimes God calls us to things just for the amount of growth we will achieve by perusing a calling and because He plans for us to succeed. As Mother Theresa once said, “God calls us to be faithful, not successful.”

 

[michelleds]

Simply put, chastity is living in accord with one’s state in life. Continence for the unmarried and monogamous relations with one’s spouse for the married. Chastity is a great gift because we are living as God created us to live which is the only way to ultimate happiness and fulfillment.

In this context, like any other sinful behavior, my continuous pursuit for one homosexual relationship after the other left me empty and unhappy. Even though it appeared that a homosexual relationship would bring me happiness and fulfillment every time it left me more empty and alone. Living a chaste life, even with the difficulties that brings in this valley of tears, is a gift because it brings true happiness and fulfillment.

It was a number of years since I first wrote that. Since then I’ve experienced such a reduction of my SSA and witnessed similar reductions in dozens of other men I’ve helped and encountered that I no longer believe that most people who experience SSA are called to remain celibate. I, for example, began to believe about 2 years ago that I was called to marriage but was not ready for it because my degree of SSA was not sufficiently reduced. Feeling that call and realizing that I was unprepared, I worked much harder to achieve wholeness and virtue thereby reducing my SSA and otherwise preparing me for marriage. Now my wholeness has increased to the point that what little remains of my SSA is not an impediment to my future marriage. So, while continuing to live a chaste life and seeking more and more wholeness and virtue, I am also actively seeking my wife and preparing for marriage.

So while like any other unmarried person those with SSA are called to continence I believe that even those with SSA are called to married or religious vocations. If in their present state they are unprepared to enter into that calling then they are called to pursue whatever wholeness and virtue is lacking. They may not achieve the calling by the end of their lifetime but sometimes God calls us to things just for the amount of growth we will achieve by perusing a calling and because He plans for us to succeed. As Mother Theresa once said, “God calls us to be faithful, not successful.”

That’s such a great post, I had to double the usual thumbs up! God bless you, Luke

 

[speakttruth]

For what purpose do you intend to resurrect a long dead thread from over half a decade? DOn’t you have other things to obsess about than homosexuality?

In modern parlance sexuality is sexual inclinations. There is a difference between sex/gender and sexuality, you soul is either male or female, but sexuality can be affected by concupiscence and potentially set up at birth.

I’m sorry, I didn’t realize it was an old thread, I was reading the post and felt sorry for what I thought was a young girl and I don’t think I am the only one.
Yes I have other things that I do. Why are you on this thread? Are you obsessed?
What is the problem? I guess I would be more obsessed since I have a son who has PPH and SSA.

 

[speakttruth]

This is an old Thread and I didn’t realize it. I hope this girl turned out alright.
God bless

 

[speakttruth]

Simply put, chastity is living in accord with one’s state in life. Continence for the unmarried and monogamous relations with one’s spouse for the married. Chastity is a great gift because we are living as God created us to live which is the only way to ultimate happiness and fulfillment.

In this context, like any other sinful behavior, my continuous pursuit for one homosexual relationship after the other left me empty and unhappy. Even though it appeared that a homosexual relationship would bring me happiness and fulfillment every time it left me more empty and alone. Living a chaste life, even with the difficulties that brings in this valley of tears, is a gift because it brings true happiness and fulfillment.

It was a number of years since I first wrote that. Since then I’ve experienced such a reduction of my SSA and witnessed similar reductions in dozens of other men I’ve helped and encountered that I no longer believe that most people who experience SSA are called to remain celibate. I, for example, began to believe about 2 years ago that I was called to marriage but was not ready for it because my degree of SSA was not sufficiently reduced. Feeling that call and realizing that I was unprepared, I worked much harder to achieve wholeness and virtue thereby reducing my SSA and otherwise preparing me for marriage. Now my wholeness has increased to the point that what little remains of my SSA is not an impediment to my future marriage. So, while continuing to live a chaste life and seeking more and more wholeness and virtue, I am also actively seeking my wife and preparing for marriage.

So while like any other unmarried person those with SSA are called to continence I believe that even those with SSA are called to married or religious vocations. If in their present state they are unprepared to enter into that calling then they are called to pursue whatever wholeness and virtue is lacking. They may not achieve the calling by the end of their lifetime but sometimes God calls us to things just for the amount of growth we will achieve by perusing a calling and because He plans for us to succeed. As Mother Theresa once said, “God calls us to be faithful, not successful.”

Hi,
I guess we are all following an old post, but it is good we can still continue the conversation with more information, this information is so hopeful and I hope this helps the men who are struggling with SSA. I am so happy for you and I believe your on the right path.
God bless you.

 

[speakttruth]

I’m also a Catholic with same sex attractions who is living in chastity. Everyone here has already offered you great advice, but here are some additional resources that will help you:

Homosexuality and the Catholic Church - Video
youtube.com/watch?v=crfAsWacA-w

Gay Sex in the Bible
davidmacd.com/catholic/bible_gay_sex_homosexual.htm

HI, Great information, Even thought this started with an old thread:blush: which I didn’t realize and I can see you didn’t either,
I think this question of homosexuality is on going and people need to be informed of the truth of our faith.
God bless

 

[Dakota_Roberts]

I’m sorry, I didn’t realize it was an old thread, I was reading the post and felt sorry for what I thought was a young girl and I don’t think I am the only one.
Yes I have other things that I do. Why are you on this thread? Are you obsessed?
What is the problem? I guess I would be more obsessed since I have a son who has PPH and SSA.

How did you even find the post?

 

[StevenFrancis]

Simply put, chastity is living in accord with one’s state in life. Continence for the unmarried and monogamous relations with one’s spouse for the married. Chastity is a great gift because we are living as God created us to live which is the only way to ultimate happiness and fulfillment.

In this context, like any other sinful behavior, my continuous pursuit for one homosexual relationship after the other left me empty and unhappy. Even though it appeared that a homosexual relationship would bring me happiness and fulfillment every time it left me more empty and alone. Living a chaste life, even with the difficulties that brings in this valley of tears, is a gift because it brings true happiness and fulfillment.

It was a number of years since I first wrote that. Since then I’ve experienced such a reduction of my SSA and witnessed similar reductions in dozens of other men I’ve helped and encountered that I no longer believe that most people who experience SSA are called to remain celibate. I, for example, began to believe about 2 years ago that I was called to marriage but was not ready for it because my degree of SSA was not sufficiently reduced. Feeling that call and realizing that I was unprepared, I worked much harder to achieve wholeness and virtue thereby reducing my SSA and otherwise preparing me for marriage. Now my wholeness has increased to the point that what little remains of my SSA is not an impediment to my future marriage. So, while continuing to live a chaste life and seeking more and more wholeness and virtue, I am also actively seeking my wife and preparing for marriage.

So while like any other unmarried person those with SSA are called to continence I believe that even those with SSA are called to married or religious vocations. If in their present state they are unprepared to enter into that calling then they are called to pursue whatever wholeness and virtue is lacking. They may not achieve the calling by the end of their lifetime but sometimes God calls us to things just for the amount of growth we will achieve by perusing a calling and because He plans for us to succeed. As Mother Theresa once said, “God calls us to be faithful, not successful.”

God bless you Luke. Thank you so much for sharing this with us. Your journey is inspirational, and real world, and should be of great help to all with ears to hear.

Peace,

Steven

 

[speakttruth]

How did you even find the post?

Dakota, because I got a response in my email that was still on the other question and could see it was closed, I just stayed in the moral theology section and as I was looking at the forum and thought the last meant the most recent ones and the beginning was the oldest. I switch it around by mistake and started with the oldest, and just started to read them and didn’t notice the dates. I don’t usually look at the forum that long, but I just noticed that one because it was one of the first three. Not too bright I guess. lol
God bless.

 

[speakttruth]

No, society does not seem to believe that gender is fluid, which is precisely why they are permissive to people undergoing sex change operations because they are freeing the person so that their exterior in fact reflects who they actually are on the inside.

We must distinguish male and female sexuality. Females are far more about emotions, thus since they tend to need an emotional connection it is often far more about the person than the sex leading to how females can so much more easily transition to married life (well, in between in general). True lesbians tend to be far more butch in both thinking and appearance which raises the possibility that they were simply exposed to high levels of testosterone in the womb leading to it. Males tend to be far more visual which is on so much lower and primal level causing much more difficulty trying to transition because it isn’t something they can control on a conscious level. Indeed, according to newer research it has been shown that while gays still possess a number of masculine features overall their brain structure is more like women than men and also that lesbians tend to be more masculine in brain structure than feminine, this could entirely be caused by hormones in the womb, especially in the parts that are different and are more or less cemented by birth.

you keep muddling your usage of sexuality and gender.

The key problem is that there is more to it than just sexual urges.

Dakota,
What is a true lesbian and true gay man? I don’t believe they ever found a genetic link to SSA. Guesses and presumptions. Predispositions for certain things, doesn’t answer the whole question. There are different people with different circumstances that came into their SSA. I don’t believed that what you call a real lesbian and a real gay person is correct. There are men that are foot ball players who are very attracted to other men and women who are very feminine looking attracted to women.

I know from the conference a women who left the so called gay lifestyle, was very butch. She was molested and abused. When they get abused by men they turn away from men. For men who were abused turn toward men. Do you not believe many men who later have SSA who had been molested a part of, not all the reason for some, contributed to their formation of the SSA? Usually boys who were molested unfortunately believe that because they responded to it because boys can not help it because of their anatomy, believe that they must be homosexuals.

Women on the other hand don’t respond to it and after they have had severe abuse want to look and act like a man as wanting to completely deny their femininity for protective reasons. They want to feel in control and strong like a man and they don’t want any part of them to look attractive to the opposite sex because of the abuse they received. If you look at Chasity, now Chaz, her ex girl friend ended up breaking up with her after her sex change. Most of the butches don’t realize that it is because they are women that they have women attracted to them, not because they look like a man. Some women who also have been abused who are not SSA gain a lot of weight for the same reason.

Also added to this, is about the affirmation aspect of both sex’s that have to be learned as they are developing by the age of three and that for some has not happened or been interrupted in some with trauma. Children have to be taught what is feminine and masculine and that usually is the father’s that have that role for both sexes. A weak father is not a good role model for a man or a women. Men learn masculinity from dad, but women are shown by the father how he treats her as a little girl, being protective means a lot for both sexes, and then the mother also affirms her femininity after that.

Often mistaken to believe masculinity is just a rough and tough guy. Not so, many fathers that are not a jocks, but maintains as a man of confidence, security, reliable, honesty, good qualities that unfortunately are looked down today because they don’t act or look like Rambo and are still the man of the home and are respected. I am not a scientist, but I have learned a lot of these things through the writings and talks of Dr. Fitzgibbons, among others that have worked in this area for decades, and these issues have been brought out by some of the people in Courage with SSA. As you know it isn’t really one reason people come to their SSA, but their are some common denominators that seem to be in place.

I don’t believe the issue has to do with how much testosterone the mother had when the baby was in the womb. They haven’t prove that. What kind of research says that even if a homosexual looks masculine his brain thinks like a women and vice versa? I don’t think any of this is cemented at birth. I think some of these researchers are trying to have an excuse for a person to live that way, that it can’t be helped. Just my opinion and Just my thoughts.
God bless