Questions of advise

[gardengranny]

Hi
My ? is a bit complicated.
I asked for guidance, on birth control,from a priest 40 yrs. ago. The response, it’s ok as long as you intend to have children at some point in your marriage.
This guided me for along time. About 15 years ago,when discussing the topic with a different priest, I was told, as a Catholic, it is never permissible.
Was the 1st priest wrong? Has the stance of the Church changed? Am I guilty of grave sin? How do I know when I’ve been advised correctly or incorrectly?

 

[CRV]

Hi gardengranny,

You’re right in that it is complicated.

I asked for guidance, on birth control,from a priest 40 yrs. ago. The response, it’s ok as long as you intend to have children at some point in your marriage.

Why you were told this only the priest who did tell you can answer that, I’m afraid.

About 15 years ago,when discussing the topic with a different priest, I was told, as a Catholic, it is never permissible.

That is correct.

The church has not changed it’s position regarding the use of artificial birth control methods.

Am I guilty of grave sin?

That is definitely something you should take to confession and raise with the priest, who’ll be able to advise you accordingly.

How do I know when I’ve been advised correctly or incorrectly?

Sadly I too have not always been given the right information or advice in the past, and this has deeply affected my ability to trust what a priest tells me. Thanks be to God for directing me to a good trustworthy confessor/spiritual director. It’s also meant that I’ve had to research whatever it is for myself, to know what the truth is and what the Church actually teaches.

 

[Hoosier-Daddy]

This is actually not that complicated. It is 3idely published and discussed that ABC is wrong (artificial birth control) one may use NFP (natural family planning) to space children if the need to do so is serious or just. The CCC (catechism if the Catholic church) is quite clear on this.

 

[De_Maria]

Hi
My ? is a bit complicated.
I asked for guidance, on birth control,from a priest 40 yrs. ago. The response, it’s ok as long as you intend to have children at some point in your marriage.
This guided me for along time. About 15 years ago,when discussing the topic with a different priest, I was told, as a Catholic, it is never permissible.
Was the 1st priest wrong?

Yes.

Has the stance of the Church changed?

No.

Am I guilty of grave sin?

I don’t know. I’m surprised that you didn’t hear anything else for 15 years.

How do I know when I’ve been advised correctly or incorrectly?

On this issue or on others. Basically, the Church’s Teaching on contraception is prevalent. I’m shocked that you didn’t know. Most people ignore it on purpose. They claim they don’t believe that God cares what goes on in the bedroom.

As for any other doctrine, you can look it up in the Catechism. You can talk to other priests. You can talk to knowledgeable Catholics. EWTN is a trusted source.

I hope that helps

 

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

Basically, the Church’s Teaching on contraception is prevalent. I’m shocked that you didn’t know

I’m not shocked.
There was a time when a persistent narrative was going around that the RCC wa going to change its stance on ABC “any day now!”
And lots of people were misled.
Bring it up to your priest in confession and be at peace.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

In addition to that “persistent narrative” mentioned by Scarlett, 40 years ago was kind of a screwy time for the Church, and I’m sure the OP is not the only one who may have received bad advice from a priest during the 70s and 80s.

There’s also a possibility that somehow a misunderstanding took place between the OP and the priest as to what he actually said.

It’s pretty common for people who came of age in the 70s and 80s to not be sure about church teaching on sexual matters. Despite being a practicing Catholic right up to my marriage, there were a number of areas where I myself wasn’t totally clear on all the teachings. You didn’t have Father Mike back in the day putting up frank little 5-minute videos, younger priests and lay ministers frequently disseminated wrong or confusing info, and the older priests and even older people in one’s family such as parents didn’t want to talk about sex stuff or sometimes gave out wrong/ confusing info because they were too embarrassed to be totally frank.

Just mention the situation in confession. Your confessor may tell you it’s not a sin if you genuinely didn’t know/ relied on wrong advice, but in any event you will have it off your mind. And then you can forget about it.

 

[Vico]

… How do I know when I’ve been advised correctly or incorrectly?

You must study the Catechism and other papal statements, and publications from the Doctrine of the Faith, for example.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

You must study the Catechism and other papal statements, and publications from the Doctrine of the Faith, for example.

While this is not incorrect advice, your average Catholic who wants help with an issue is not going to be plowing through documents to make sure what their priest said was correct. We see enough of that on this forum where somebody’s priest said something and the person went through a pile of documents and became worried that the priest got it wrong. In most cases, all the people responding say for the person to “trust their priest”. If the priest appears to have really gotten something wrong then the response is usually for the person to talk to a different priest, not go looking up the answers on his own. There is a significant possibility that someone who tries to figure out an issue just from reading Catechism or other documents will still have questions and need to go back and speak to a priest anyway.

In general, people need to trust their priests and not be second-guessing them all the time. It is, however, probably a good idea to have a basic knowledge of the Catechism so you at least have some inkling when a priest is off base. I don’t think it’s necessary to be looking for “papal statements” and “publications from the Doctrine of the Faith”.

 

[Hoosier-Daddy]

The age of the internet and TV is a wonderful thing. No one could have survived the modern world without knowing the Church is against birth control. Funny, one might know they have to prove health care coverage on their taxes but have been completely unaware of the Church and the Obamacare mandate for 8 years…
Finding out the Church’s stance on ABC is relatively easy. One need not plow through Latin words in documents…

 

[TheLittleLady]

Growing up in the 60’s and 70’s, not even KNOWING a single Catholic person, I knew that the Catholic Church did not allow birth control. This was common fodder for comedians and I watched the Johnny Carson show every night, for other TV shows and movies, it was simply part of the zeitgeist.

ETA Some priests do make errors. Sadly, it happens. Our OP, I’d suggest forgiving the priest and moving forward.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

In 2019 I agree with you because it has been in the news so much.

However, I can remember the 70s and 80s when you got your “Catholic news” from newspapers that in some cases people didn’t want to spend money on buying, and that in many other cases when the parish or diocese decided to just send them to all homes, people didn’t read. Obamacare was not in the news then. Birth control was a controversial and often taboo subject to discuss on TV until AIDS made condoms a household word in the late 80s. Talk radio was not prevalent either, so you didn’t have some radio host, Catholic or otherwise, spouting off about the subject every time you turned the dial. And it was rarely or never preached about from the pulpit.

It’s pretty easy for people who know all the answers and are living in this era to tell people who honestly didn’t know in a previous era “well, you should have known.” If people were able to just study catechism, watch TV and learn everything, we wouldn’t need half the subforums on this board because people would only have questions on obscure theological stuff.

 

[gardengranny]

Thank you for being so understanding. That was pretty much my situation, including the fact that my mother had been given the same advice in the 60s.

 

[Vico]

…

I have learned over time that one cannot trust one’s priest(s) for proper catechesis. It would be nice if one could, but they are not perfect and make mistakes. The Church teaches us in the Catechism:

1231 Where infant Baptism has become the form in which this sacrament is usually celebrated, it has become a single act encapsulating the preparatory stages of Christian initiation in a very abridged way. By its very nature infant Baptism requires a post-baptismal catechumenate. Not only is there a need for instruction after Baptism, but also for the necessary flowering of baptismal grace in personal growth. The catechism has its proper place here.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Perhaps they make mistakes, but if the priest makes mistakes and faithful people follow that mistaken teaching, it’s on the priest. Of course when people find out from another source the true info then they have a duty to follow the correct teaching.

You and a lot of the people on CAF are scholarly, expert, know where to look for answers, and on here we also have a built-in self correcting mechanism because if any of us regulars posted something incorrect, it would swiftly be crowdsourced to correct. However, I’ve also spent a lot of my paid career trying to write complicated topics in a way people who are not scholars will understand. The folks who seek apologetics answers are fine with reading and doing research; those who ask questions about liturgy or family life maybe not so much. We need to be cognizant of that.

 

[1Lord1Faith]

Of course when people find out from another source the true info then they have a duty to follow the correct teaching.

They have an obligation to assent to it. They don’t have an obligation to necessarily follow it. That was the important distinction on the issue of ABC 40+ years ago. It’s still an important distinction today for some Church teaching, but assent and licit dissent was written about extensively after Humanae Vitae was published.

I don’t think it’s right to say the priest in question here was necessarily wrong. Especially when considering we don’t know the specifics of the conversation between the OP and the priest, and the OP herself may not even remember. It’s worth giving the priest the benefit of the doubt rather than declaring that he was in fact wrong.

 

[Hoosier-Daddy]

I dont think culpability transfers from one person to another. An errant priest or many errant priests do incur fault for misleading. But to me a form of clericalism Pope Francis rails against is this idea that we ask a priest and then if we recieve bad info we are blameless. I’ve had priests tell me to use contraception. Many times. That does not change the fact that I am responsible for my own formation of conscience. I know we keep making this point but any informed person can figure out the sexual ethics if the Church. Including birth control. It may be unpleasant or hard or even unbelievable but it isn’t a secret. And it never has been.

Not only that but in the 60s and 70s the fight over ABC was well publicised. Practicing Catholics just cannot say they didn’t know…