"Quick" question. USCCB + church teachings

  • Thread starter Thread starter Midwest88
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
M

Midwest88

Guest
Does what the USCCB say about mmigration, gun control, the tax plan, refugees and health care (and whatever topic under the sun) count as “church teachings”?
 
No. No single bishop conference can, on its own, teach on behalf of the entire Church.

Just think about it for a moment and you’ll realize that’s the case. How can just the bishops of one country, define the faith in such a way that is binding on all the other countries?

However, when the Conference articulates Church teaching, then the Conference does indeed speak Church teaching (yes I know that sounds pretty obvious). So if the conference repeats the words of the Creed, they’re speaking Church teaching.

It’s also the case that no one can say “the bishops conference says” unless each and every bishop of that conference is unanimous. This is articulated in both the Vatican II documents that established the Conferences and in the later special law that governs them.

They can vote on all sorts of things without requiring an absolute majority. If they want to modify the Holy Days, just for example, they need a super majority (2/3 or 3/4 I forget) but not an absolute unanimous majority.
 
But are Catholics obligated to agree with bishops who share their stances on topics like health care and immigration?
 
If the bishops offer instruction or guidance on how to apply Christian principles to social issues, you should listen and seriously consider it.

I wonder, are you asking because you think USCCB or the Catholic hierarchy in general is too political? We see this type of complaint here at CAF from time to time. I don’t think they are. When they talk about caring for the needy, that’s right out of the Bible.
 
Last edited:
Midwest88 said:
But are Catholics obligated to agree with bishops who share their stances on topics like health care and immigration?
Click to expand...
To the extent that those stances are theological; to the extent that they are teaching faith and morals, yes.

As for politics, science, economics, art, or any other discipline, their opinions are just like anyone else’s except for the fact that we have to respect their offices and remember that those opinions belong to men who spend their lives spreading the Gospel (so a bishop’s word on how to deal with immigration carries far more moral weight than a teenage rock star, for example).

And please do not take that as a way of me trying to force my own bias into the discussion. I mention this because earlier today I made comments about bishops speaking about matters of theology and politics, and someone might draw a connection between my comments here and my comments there.

The same could be said about anything else, on which the bishops speak.

A bishop might teach against abortion. One might think immediately that what he has to say is a matter of faith. However, if I add to the scenario that one of the bishop’s points is that we should oppose abortion because there is a profitable baby clothes factory in his diocese, then one need not believe that his teaching about the factory is a matter of faith.

This is similar (on a smaller scale) to when we explain Papal Infallibility. We say that when he speaks on faith and morals he (can be) speaking infallibly, but on other matters he does not. So we say that no, the pope cannot predict who will win next year’s Super Bowl (at least, not beyond knowing that it won’t be the Browns) or teach that one brand of soft drink is better than the other.
 
I mainly ask because I saw this on another site:
Ask yourself: do you find yourself agreeing with the bishops when they talk about immigration, gun control, the tax plan, refugees, health care, etc? Or do you ignore all of those teachings? If you do, then you have to ask yourself why. Do you presume to be more spiritually aware than the bishops? Or do you prefer to cling to your political ideology? Because I agree with the bishops on all issues from womb to tomb and beyond— not just when it suits my partisan ideology.
Click to expand...
I suppose when he says “bishops” he means USCCB.
 
Midwest88 said:
I mainly ask because I saw this on another site:
Ask yourself: do you find yourself agreeing with the bishops when they talk about immigration, gun control, the tax plan, refugees, health care, etc? Or do you ignore all of those teachings? If you do, then you have to ask yourself why. Do you presume to be more spiritually aware than the bishops? Or do you prefer to cling to your political ideology? Because I agree with the bishops on all issues from womb to tomb and beyond— not just when it suits my partisan ideology.
Click to expand...
Good questions. Personally, I think some of those are up to prudential judgement. We don’t all agree on how best to run the world. I think in many cases, the bishops are not demanding that we choose specific policies, but rather they are reminding us of the guiding principles, like respecting life and human dignity, being good stewards of creation, and not putting wealth, pride, power, and pleasure above our obligations to love one another. Referring now to your original post, those principles are Church teaching.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
A bishop teaches his flock with authority that requires religious assent (see Lumen Gentium 25; CCC 888).

Unless granted it in special cases by the Apostolic See, Bishops Conferences have no authority on their own, unless each and every bishop makes the act of the conference his own (when this is the case, there is usually a note at the end noting it was approved unanimously by a plenary meeting of all the bishops). A spokesperson or committee head, etc. does not have authority over another bishop’s flock.

For an in-depth explanation, see here:
http://w2.vatican.va/content/john-p...-ii_motu-proprio_22071998_apostolos-suos.html
 
Last edited:
Just to add, just because something is “political” doesn’t mean the Church can’t pass judgment (in fact, politics is rife with moral questions since it involves human interaction). A bishop does so authoritatively in these circumstances:

CCC 2246 It is a part of the Church’s mission "to pass moral judgments even in matters related to politics, whenever the fundamental rights of man or the salvation of souls requires it. The means, the only means, she may use are those which are in accord with the Gospel and the welfare of all men according to the diversity of times and circumstances."53
 
Last edited:
Midwest88 said:
I suppose when he says “bishops” he means USCCB.
Click to expand...
Fr. David said it well. To this statement, I’ll just make the point that the term “USCCB” can be used in a couple different ways: one to refer to the body of all bishops in the United States, the other to refer to the bureaucracy of the various offices and committees based out of Washington DC.

Previously, this was actually referred to separately with the USCC (United States Catholic Conference) referring to the latter with the NCCB (National Conference of Catholic Bishops) referring to the former.

So I am always on guard when an article claims “The bishops said…” That can mean different things. Was it really a statement that all the bishops voted on? Was it just something that one bishop said because it falls under the subcommittee that he oversees? Or was it some statement from an office without necessarily having any bishop’s name attached to it?
 
Last edited:
I was born a Catholic 65 years ago, raised Catholic, was an altar server in the Latin Mass, learned the old Catechism, went to Catholic grade school, taught by nuns, and high school, taught by priests and brothers. I raised two kids Catholic and sent them to Catholic grade school and high school. I have been a music minister for for almost 40 years. I never heard of the USCCB, the NCCB or the USCC until not that long ago. The many clergy I have dealt with over all those years never mentioned them. I cannot recall those groups being mentioned in any of the thousands of homilies I have heard. I never signed up to worship them, so I don’t.
 
Last edited:
EXCEPT is SACRED TRADITION [up to now]; unless that “Bishop” ALSo happens to be Pope.

I’m [ME HERE] not sure that recent change will weather TIME well?

GBY
 
PJM said:
EXCEPT is SACRED TRADITION [up to now]; unless that “Bishop” ALSo happens to be Pope.

I’m [ME HERE] not sure that recent change will weather TIME well?

GBY
Click to expand...
I am totally confused by that post. Can you say that again using sentences please? Like you usually post in the 10 years or so that I’ve been reading you.
 
My friend,

I’m trying in vain to recall what I responded too? And coulds not find it.

I THINK my point is that a Bishop has great, but limited authority; one cannot change either Doctrine or Dogma, or teach in opposition to what the Ordinary Magisterium teaches on these two broad categories,. This would ALSo apply to the Pope.

SORRY about the lack of clarity:blush:

God Bless you

PJM
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top