Rainbow Eucharist

[OraLabora]

I think she’s referring to this flag

Yes that’s the one. I’m a “he” by the way!

For example, what’s the difference between a single heterosexual man who is a Catholic and celibate and a gay person who is a Catholic and who is celibate?

Easy enough to answer. the single heterosexual man (or woman) can hope to one day find a partner, marry him or her, and have an intimate conjugal, Church-approved relationship.

The homosexual man or woman is condemned by Church teaching to remaining single, and sexually-inactive, all his or her life.

A heterosexual man choosing lifetime continence in order to be in religious life or become clergy is doing so by choice. The homosexual has it imposed on him or her. A bisexual might have a bit less restriction in that he or she can always choose to not act on the same-sex tendency, but enjoy an opposite-sex sexual relationship within the context of marriage. So for a homosexual, it is a particularly tough cross to carry.

In my last statement I said that the liturgy is a place to be welcoming, but not a place to be provocative. That means, to me, “do the red, say the black”. The “red” is very specific on how to decorate an altar. The “black” has places to be welcoming, while upholding Church teaching (e.g. the homily).

 

[Lee1]

The homosexual has it imposed on him or her.

Ok, but do they though? If being a Catholic is more important than their sexual preferences then yes, but they do have a choice, no one is forced to be a Catholic after all.

I have a feeling that this same conversation must have taken place many times over. Thing is if I don’t like football but I like cricket, I don’t join a football club and try to persuade them to stop playing football and play cricket.

 

[OraLabora]

Ok, but do they though? If being a Catholic is more important than their sexual preferences then yes, but they do have a choice, no one is forced to be a Catholic after all.

I have a feeling that this same conversation must have taken place many times over. Thing is if I don’t like football but I like cricket, I don’t join a football club and try to persuade them to stop playing football and play cricket.

Bit of a stark choice no? Be lonely, or be damned.

 

[Lee1]

Now, we both know surely, that in the Catechism it states that people other than Catholics can be saved. So no, if it’s that important to them then there is an option.

I’m not anti gay I hope you understand but what is a Catholic, a person who abides by the tenets of the Catholic faith and attends days of obligation, participates in the sacraments etc. If you’re not doing those things then I don’t know what I’d call that person.

 

[OraLabora]

Now, we both know surely, that in the Catechism it states that people other than Catholics can be saved. So no, if it’s that important to them then there is an option.

Yes that’s true that people other than Catholics can be saved. But a Catholic gay person cannot claim invincible ignorance can they? And they can become guilty of the sin of presumption.

So no a Catholic gay person (or any other sinner) does not have an option other than trying be the best Catholic possible, by living according to the tenets of the faith, and by resorting to sacramental confession when they fall.

We are all called to sainthood. Not to trying our luck outside the Church.

 

[Lee1]

I try to love people, not always easy as you know, those are people men and women. I may like a man very much and so it begins to become love* but I don’t want to have sex with a man. Like wise women outside of marriage etc. So someone who is gay can love someone of the same gender but not have sex with them, that’s fine yes? That way they’re not lonely as you suggested and they have love in their lives. Just no sex. That’s the price those people pay for remaining Catholic and Ive no doubt that their pain will be rewarded many times over in heaven.

I don’t believe we should change Catholicism to accommodate them though, if we did that for everyone we’d have a club not a religion.

This is a religion after all. We worship God and we have rules. I have t time now to look at the Catechism but I’ll take your word for it and agree that it’s difficult for a gay person in the Church. That’s sad, but I don’t see how or why we should change anything.

*i am not gay, I’m speaking of agape really but certainly not sexual love or infatuation

 

[BlueMaxx]

I still like flags…

 

[Dorothy]

Everyone has challenges in their lives. For some it is chronic illness, having to deal with a difficult family member, struggling to keep a marriage together, having difficulty finding employment, etc. etc.

I do believe that the Lord gives us the graces we need to grow spiritually through our difficulties. He gives us His very self in the Eucharist, we have access to the Sacrament of Reconciliation, and we can grow spiritually in our prayer life, volunteering, etc. He does not refuse the graces we need to follow His directives. When He allows us to have great difficulties it is so He can grant us the graces we need to grow spiritually through the difficulty. We do need to ask for those graces.

With God all things are possible.

 

[OraLabora]

No problem!

 

[Lee1]

I owe you an apology Cecilia, I was a bit miffed yesterday and I apologise, sorry.

 

[Hodos]

Huh? There are Catholic parishes that have had Dignity Masses or so-called “gay pride” Masses and I have seen a few pictures of rainbow altar drapes or the infamous rainbow flag over the altar (the one that the priest in Chicago later burned). Not all bishops object to this and I’m not sure that the mere act of using rainbow decor could be called blasphemous in and of itself.

I would have to disagree. Using the altar to celebrate an act or lifestyle that God has defined as sinful is a blasphemous act (given the context you mentioned of the dignity masses you described). I cannot think of something off-hand that more directly blasphemes the name of Christ than that. That would be akin to decorating the altar to celebrate porn, or coveting, etc.

 

[Crusaderbear]

I really miss being able to enjoy the rainbow for just being a rainbow…heavy sigh.

 

[OraLabora]

I used to be so gay after seeing a beautiful rainbow!

I guess the language has changed a wee bit. Now I’d have to say « I feel so happy when I see an aerial display of all the colours of the spectrum ».

Seems to have lost some of its poetry…

No disrespect meant to gays, but I’d like the words « gay », « rainbow » and « marriage » back please. I’m willing to negotiate though, you can keep « gay » and « rainbow » if I can have « marriage »…

 

[Finn]

Indeed and Rev. Kalchik is currently in hiding, seeking to avoid ‘re-education’ at the St Luke Institue.