Ramifications of having a large family

[leonie]

Guys, you get more financial aid if you have more kids in college at the same time, not less!

 

[boppaid]

Financial ramifications? Well, without the help of a large family (built in babysitting, less work for mom and dad because children do have household chores, children helping each other in school work) you’re going to have to pay for these services (day care, child care, maid, handy-man, gardener, tutor, etc.) And of course, that goes for the care of aging parents too. No one to share the cost of caring for mom and dad. That should count too. A person simply can’t make it all alone.

Well, although I was a SAHM while my children were very young (until kindergarten), I have to disagree. As a WM, I never pay for a maid, handy-man, gardener, tutor, etc. So, I really don’t agree that there are more financial raminfications for working. Also, (and I’m not picking on anyone here) I hate hate hate the idea of “built in babysitters” with older kids. I understand that, yea, sometimes the older kids have to pitch in and sit for a bit here and there for free, but I have seen older kids become the MAIN sitters for the younger ones and it drives me crazy. It takes away from their fun with friends, other paying babysitting jobs, and homework. Again, I’m not picking on anyone here in particular, and I think kids SHOULD pitch in for free with sitting sometimes, but some people really take advantage of older kids in this area. I guess that’s why I am sensitive to this. I have seen this happen IRL two times, and it was very extreme and sad.

Now, back to the OP: I think there are a lot of things to consider when it comes to having a SAHP and/or a large family. First, make sure you are both flexible. If you decide to have a SAHP, make sure that he/she will go to work if things get tight. I was a SAHP, but when things got tough, I got part time jobs to get us through. I felt it was my responsibility to pull my weight financially, if my husband was struggling. Some SAHW I knew would NEVER pitch in and work, no matter how stressed the husband was or how poor they got. But those husbands were very resentful, and I will never forget that. It was very sad. So, make sure you and your future wife are on the same boat, and flexible.

Good luck, and whoever said to leave your parents out of it…they were right.

 

[HannahLisa]

I have eight younger siblings. This is good because financial aid loves us - FAFSA thinks we’re poor even when my dad has a good job. Since we’re all about 2 years apart, nearly all of us will have another sibling in college at the same time, which means FAFSA thinks we’re even poorer. My parents won’t be able to help any of us with college, but they’ve said that they’ll help me with loans if they can, after I graduate. I don’t really care that they can’t help - it makes it real that this is MY life, and it’s up to me what I do with it. I’m the only one I can blame for how decisions concerning my life work out, because I’m the only one making them at this point.

Do we have a big house? No. Do we need a big house? No. Do we need to each have brand new clothes? No. Do we need big allowances? No…There’s a lot of stuff we don’t need, or particularly want. We’re perfectly happy without it. If I had to pick between more stuff and my siblings, my siblings would win every single time. I’m currently sleeping on a couch because my house is small and I only live here during summers and breaks…but in effect I also have my own room when I’m home, so it works.

We also live in TX, which has a lower cost of living than, say, California, and none of us have gone to private school - wasn’t important. We were homeschooled and then headed to public school.

 

[JadensMom]

I think the term “built-in babysitter” is incredibly demeaning, and have always hated it. It implies that the girl’s only role in the family is as a laborer, and sends the message that she has no needs, she’s just a servant within the family. So when does the “built-in babysitter” ever get to be a sister?

Would you refer to your oldest son as a “built-in gardener?” Or as a “built-in garbageman” if he takes out the trash? Cuddle your son in your arms and call him your “built-in day laborer,” I dare you. When does the “built-in babysitter” get to play, and dance around, and just be a little girl? When does she get to read, or draw, or play sports, or ride her bike?

Sure, it’s important to give kids chores and responsibilities, that’s necessary. But it’s very, very easy in big Catholic families to overburden the eldest children, especially girls, with psuedo-parental responsibilities that kids really shouldn’t have to deal with at a young age, like my example of dragging older girls away from their HOMEWORK in order to make them perform household chores. (Funny how that never happened to my brother!) I can’t remember my mother hugging me or telling me that she loved me beyond very young childhood, but she sure spent a whole heck of a lot of time ordering me to do this or that.

To this day, my parents’ designation of my older sister and me as built-in family carers follows us; my older sister and I have both observed that our four younger sisters only really call us when they want us to do something for them.

I maintain; they’re children, not serfs. My son has chores, but he’s no “built in [insert job description here]”, he’s my dear little boy.

I’m not saying kids shouldn’t be required to pitch in and help the family, but that’s not ALL they’re there for.

 

[AMDGtoo]

I think the term “built-in babysitter” is incredibly demeaning, and have always hated it.

Then I promise you that I will never use it where you are concerned. And since you would probably also take offense at the terms “little woman” or “little man”, I won’t ever use them pertaining to you or yours even if the child is already doing the work of a woman or man (budgeting, meal planning and food preparation, housekeeping, childcare, landscaping, woodwork, etc.) That should settle the matter for you.

At the same time, I still believe that it would be a disservice to the child to never allow him/her “grow up” and to learn the life skills that he/she will need, and at the same time a large family appears to foster the ability to impart those skills without adding a financial burden. (I was not just considering psychological benefits.)

And since the original poster wanted to know if a large family would be a financial burden, and if it was, how much of one. I think that the posts of some of the other posters (Jennifer J, HannahLisa, and even leonie and a few others who I will not mention) were much better at explaining what I meant.

I am very sorry your experience was obviously negative, but not all experiences are negative or financially burdensome.

 

[1ke]

I find the idea of discussing children as if they are items on a balance sheet repulsive.

To the OP: I think you need to stop worrying about what your parents think and start praying for discernment regarding what God wants you to do. I also hope you will read lots of Church documents on marriage, family and children. You will find that they differ greatly from the philosophy your parents espouse.

 

[pentecostbaby]

Thanks to all the SAHMs and dads out there who posted. You’ve giving me so much hope and faith!! DH and I plan on building a big family through adoption - and we want to homeschool them all. Hearing that y’all make it work gives me so much confidence.

 

[leonie]

It really helps to have a large network of supportive friends. For example, we spend very little on clothes compared to others. I’ve let it out that we take all hand me downs–even for my dh and me. It’s fun to get a bag of clothes from cousins and friends. Occasionally we buy new–esp shoes as the kids get older, but we buy Wal-Mart not Finish Line.

BTW, babies generally need about 1/4 of the stuff that any store will try to tell you they need.

Our house is 1500 sq feet, so sometimes we feel a little squished–esp in the winter, but we have a small house payment. It’s liberating not to have large payments. We also rarely buy new furniture. My dad who loves auctions just dropped off two beautiful loveseats that he got for $15. Once he got us a piano for $30. My SIL is clearing out some furniture, and she is sending us a computer desk this week.

When we had our first two kids, we rented a cool little house on a cow farm. It backed up to a large creek. We bought a used canoe, and it was the most fun we ever had. The rent (13 years ago) was only $350. So, there are great deals out there.

I’ve done some babysitting to supplement our income, but now that I have six kids whom I’m homeschooling, I just don’t think I can work outside the home. One year, my dh took an extra Sunday job. I’d like to say we saved all that money, but we blew it on stupid things.

It really helps to have good financial habits and self control–we’re getting better.

Our income has increased as our needs have increased. When we had a couple little kids, we really didn’t have many expenses. And, we had a very small income. Now, when we have a large grocery bill, we can afford it where we couldn’t have done it ten years ago.

God is good.

We have no savings for our kids’ college education. I’m not a bit worried about it. They will be better people for getting grants, and working, and really valuing their education. Plus, God has worked everything out for us so far, so I’m sure He has a brilliant plan!

Remember, most people have one kid at a time–kids grow, income grows. It’s silly to think, "how can I afford to have six kids on 25,000 a year!!! You just take it one kid at a time.

 

[Jennifer_J]

I think the term “built-in babysitter” is incredibly demeaning, and have always hated it. It implies that the girl’s only role in the family is as a laborer, and sends the message that she has no needs, she’s just a servant within the family. So when does the “built-in babysitter” ever get to be a sister?

Would you refer to your oldest son as a “built-in gardener?” Or as a “built-in garbageman” if he takes out the trash? Cuddle your son in your arms and call him your “built-in day laborer,” I dare you. When does the “built-in babysitter” get to play, and dance around, and just be a little girl? When does she get to read, or draw, or play sports, or ride her bike?

Sure, it’s important to give kids chores and responsibilities, that’s necessary. But it’s very, very easy in big Catholic families to overburden the eldest children, especially girls, with psuedo-parental responsibilities that kids really shouldn’t have to deal with at a young age, like my example of dragging older girls away from their HOMEWORK in order to make them perform household chores. (Funny how that never happened to my brother!) I can’t remember my mother hugging me or telling me that she loved me beyond very young childhood, but she sure spent a whole heck of a lot of time ordering me to do this or that.

To this day, my parents’ designation of my older sister and me as built-in family carers follows us; my older sister and I have both observed that our four younger sisters only really call us when they want us to do something for them.

I maintain; they’re children, not serfs. My son has chores, but he’s no “built in [insert job description here]”, he’s my dear little boy.

I’m not saying kids shouldn’t be required to pitch in and help the family, but that’s not ALL they’re there for.

Okay, this is getting to be a bit off topic, but your attitude is quite attrocious to those of us with larger families that MUST have help from them to make the family run.

Just and FYI, my oldest is a boy and he often is the “designated baby watcher/younger sibling watcher” (does that make you feel better?) when I need him to be. If it’s for an extended time (like I have project that I HAVE to get done, he’ll get a few dollars). Since he’s the oldest, he does get more responsiblity and often more $$. Next oldest is a daughter, she watches the baby or younger silbings in a pinch, but I don’t leave her for long yet. At any time, they could be the “designated or built in or whatever” helper for a given task that they know how to do–just like I am. I’m the backup handyman, when dh can’t get to something–I’m quite good at fixing things . We all have titles and they change for various circumstances. I guess I just don’t see the problem with the word built-in? Do I used in day to day talking, no…don’t really think about it.

I think your family had issues that not ALL or even MOST large families have. I hug my children all the time and tell them I love them. I also call them my silly monkeys and tell my “trashman” (ds) to take out the trash. I have my oldest read and help the younger ones with homework or chores or whatever. We are a team (most of the time, sometimes they go on strike when it’s time to clean the playroom ). I’ve never seriously asked any of them to change a diaper or wipe a bottom. And until DS takes the babysitting course, he’s never left totally alone with the younger ones–he’s more like a “mother’s helper” to make sure they are safe if I have to be occupied doing something else…Anyway, I think you are taking the titles too seriously. but that’s just me.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

We were “built-in” gardeners, lawn mowers and babysitters. I have no problem with that. As adults we don’t sit around “waiting for the other guy to do it.” I find you can tell adults who came from larger families because they don’t act offended when you ask them to pitch in and help. Personally, I did diaper my younger brother and sister, and went on to babysit neighbors. Guess what? When it came time to have my own children, I was not at all panic-stricken. The idea of caring for a baby didn’t intimidate me at all.

My own children can’t say the same because they were denied the privelege of growing up in a large family and caring for younger siblings. Their sweet only-child father has instilled in them an attitude of “wait on me, I’m special” which no amount of my parenting has been able to dislodge. It doesn’t help that the woman who raised him is over there inflicting that attitude on a new generation.

I’m sorry some here found it a chore to be part of a large family. I hope others don’t get the wrong idea from that.

 

[gardenswithkids]

Okay, this is getting to be a bit off topic, but your attitude is quite attrocious to those of us with larger families that MUST have help from them to make the family run…I think your family had issues that not ALL or even MOST large families have. I hug my children all the time and tell them I love them. …

Jaden(name removed by moderator) brings a different perspective on large families. So does the op’s parents. I’ve heard a similar negative perspective on large families from an older relative who was the oldest daughter in a large family. (I even heard it once from a very crabby stranger sitting next to me on an airplane.) Not every child in a large family is always happy about having extra siblings. Sometimes they complain about the work and some may be resentful for any variety of reasons. *This might be the ultimate form of sibling rivalry. *

One of the obvious ramifications of a large family is there are more siblings. More siblings can mean more sibling rivalry if the children feel they have to compete for parental love and attention. Parents should be able to do something to prevent or minimize sibling rivalry beyond preventing and minimizing additional siblings. (The op probably doesn’t have much personal experience with sibling rivalry since he is an only child.) Because I know some people turn out bitter and resentful about coming from a large family, **I make extra efforts to give all my children the love and attention they need. **

(We sometimes even pay our older children for babysitting. )

 

[Nanny_PK]

Growing up I had three younger sisters. When I was 10, my father was diagnosed with cancer so we had a different scenario than most older children scenarios that have been mentioned. My step-mother depended on me a lot with the younger kids, one of whom was 10 months old. While I was incredibly blessed to be mature enough to help out – being left alone in the middle of the night when daddy had to be taken to the hospital and then get everyone up and off to school the next morning – it sure did make me grow up faster. Then when things were “normal,” my step-mom still relied on me heavily – I think she sometimes forgot that I was still a kid, when the other kids were allowed to go out and play I was still required to be helping out in the house.

I know there have been several posts about the Duggar family with some very similar comments. I respect them having such a large family and they generally seem like a loving and caring family, but I see some of what’s been mentioned in this post in that family – the older girls are taking on parenting responsibilities for the younger children while they’re still children themselves.

So to sum up my opinion, I think large families are fabulous and having children be an active participant and helper in the family is great; however, parents should NEVER lose sight that their children ARE children and should not have too much adult responsibility thrust on them.

Just my two cents.

 

[Jennifer_J]

I wasn’t trying to discount Jaden(name removed by moderator)'s perspective–I believe she feels she was mistreated as the oldest and I do try to have a balance in our home.

Here’s a story for ya—I have an older sister–that it her and me and she’s 8 years older than me. She had her first child when she was 18 and living with us–that made me 10 and prime “watch the baby” age, which for a while I gladly did (most 10 year old girls love babies ) However, my sister was irresponsible and often expected me to watch the baby/toddler even when she was home–but occupied by some boyfriend or another. It wasn’t watching the baby that bugged me, it was the irresponsibility of my sis. It bugged me, but I used the knowledge I gained to watch other people’s children for money and I was fairly experienced by the time my children came around (I also learned what NOT to do by watching her parent). I could continue to hold a grudge against my sister, but what’s the point? I learned skills, loved my nephew and while often put-upon, it made me a better person to take on the responsibility and deal with it. Does any of that make sense?

 

[gardenswithkids]

… I see some of what’s been mentioned in this post in that family – the older girls are taking on parenting responsibilities for the younger children while they’re still children themselves. …

…Here’s a story for ya—I have an older sister–that it her and me and she’s 8 years older than me. She had her first child when she was 18 and living with us…

NannyPK and Jennifer, your posts got me thinking about children not only raising children, but the more common problem today of children having children. Someone presented a theory that some of the teenage pregnancy problems are brought on because the girls are looking for family love–and they often end up giving birth to babies that essentially become their own siblings when the girls’ parents–the grandparents–raise the babies.

Sorry if I’m taking this thread too far off track. I’ve read all the posts with interest. But the negative experience posted by one poster drew my attention because I know someone IRL who seems resentful of her experience growing up in a large family. That person pushes the contraceptive mentality and makes negative remarks about large families, (“Don’t they know what causes that” ) Margaret Sanger was also from a large family–number six of eleven. As a Catholic and mom of seven children, I find such negative attitudes towards children highly offensive, yet I grown to suspect such childhood experiences contributed heavily to the widespread use of contraception.

I hope and pray those of you that experienced a lot of responsibility at a young age don’t walk away from the Church teachings or regard children as something other than blessings. If there was a problem in your family growing up, the problem was too much sin–*not *too many children.

Life has responsibilities and can be difficult at times. That holds true regardless of family size. God gives us what we need to grow in holiness. I sometimes wonder what God would have planned for us if we hadn’t accepted more children–and I strongly suspect that our large family is easier than whatever else He might have planned to help us grown in holiness. I read lots of lives of the Saints, and facing difficulties in life with grace seems to be what makes saints.:getholy:

I encourage those of you like the op who is contemplating family size to discern God’s will for your life and learn to trust Him.

 

[JoeBlow]

Hi, I just happened to be wondering about the ramifications - good and not-so-good - of having a large family. I am an only child, but most of the women I’ve dated come from a large family and want a large family of their own one day. Personally, I’m perfectly fine with it. However, before I jump into anything, I’d like to find out what the ramifications are, in terms of financial planning/stability, of having many kids and having the wife being a stay-at-home mom.

We have five children and will be adopting a sixth in a few months.

Not sure what you mean by “ramifications”, but it’s been wonderful for us.

On top of it, my parents are against the idea of stay-at-home moms, and I’ve had more than a few “discussions” with them on this very topic. They think that it would be way too much pressure on me, and that the quality of life would be reduced. They tend to think that a two-income family is the way to go. They also think that the SAHM will become detached from society, and so wouldn’t have much common language with the husband.

Being a stay at home mom is a lot of work and it sounds like your parents have a lot of the same misconceptions that a lot of people have.

My wife is college educated and had a pretty successful career when we had our children. She chose to stay home and be a mother to them and not a day goes by that she doesn’t say how happy she is for the opportunity to do so.

I haven’t talked to my parents about homeschooling yet, but I’m sure they’ll have their fair share of objections on that one, too.

We homeschool. Feel free to PM me with any questions you have about that.

 

[Jennifer_G]

Taking a look at my grandmother’s family (and great-grandmother for that matter - 7 kids! My grandmother was the only girl in the family!). One wonderful “ramification” is lots of cousins! You should see our family reunions! My grandmother had 6 children (2 died shortly after birth - my aunt, like my grandmother, was the only girl in the family).

Now, how do you define a large family? I think anything over 6 children is a large family. (4-6 is a medium sized family - 1-3 is small).

Anyway… here’s some family sizes from my family -

My great-grandmother - 7 kids.
My great-great-grandmother (other side of the family) - 10 kids.
My aunt (married into the family) - came from a family of 9 kids.

Things that happen (or… stories I’ve heard) -

• Food goes down fast. Really fast. Buy in bulk! Use coupons!
• “Small” houses (3 bedrooms, 2 bathrooms) - Kids will be sharing bedrooms (or basements, or even the same bed as was the case with my grandmother’s 6 brothers. My grandmother had a bedroom all to herself!).
• Having kids spread out over 10+ years means that you’ll almost have different generations. (teens, kids, babies) My little sister, who’s adopted, is 11 years younger than me. My uncle is 11 years older than me, and his oldest bother is almost 20 years older than him! (confused yet? The same uncle’s mother-in-law had a kid at the age of 47, when he and his wife already had kids) The oldest kids may or may not have as much interest playing with the younger kids (I know I found it hard sometimes to find something intersting that my little sister would like to play – she was too young for things I considered fun, like video games). The kids in the middle have 2 “sets” of siblings to play with. The youngest might not even get to remember their oldest siblings as much.
• You’ll have a lot of hand-me-downs (if they’re still in style).
• You won’t have as much money to go around.
• But on the other hand, your older kids can help out when they get part-time jobs.
• Then again, that’s during the teenage years.
• It might be hard keeping track of - or even attending - all of your kid’s events (especially when they’re all at the same time).
• Obviously tons of organization and pre-planning.

 

[GFarmer]

It’s interesting reading all the post’s. Clearly a lot of emotion in from some who have had negative feelings being the oldest or older children of large families.

I too am the oldest of 8. I changed many a diaper, babysat, played with the younger ones (lead them off into the woods, ha ha, they used bread crumbs to get home). I also have 85 first cousins, from 42 aunts & uncles. DW & I both grew up on farms with livestock & crops so are used to long days and hard physical work.

We have three children who are 21, 16 & 11.

My children have everything they need & most of what they want, We farm so they are pretty good at helping out but nothing like we did 30 years ago, but compared to their peers they work hard!

There are advantages and disadvantages to a large family. When we were married being the oldest of 8 my perspective was smaller was better, my wife being the youngest of 9 looked at things differently and said she wanted 6 kids. Being negotiator I said 2, then said let have 2 and see where we go from their. By the time we got around to having # 3 at 37 years of age she then decided that was enough. She has a full time farm business & I have a full time job.

A lot of time passed between the our wedding day & the last child. In retrospect I would have considered more…maybe 2 or 3.

There is much you learn in life from a large family that you won’t learn or experience in smaller one. The vast majority of us in the western world have opted for smaller families so we can afford them. For many of us its really about affording all the stuff we want to acquire! This is an area where I feel a little hypocritical, we have many assets that we have worked very hard for, but when I think about my parents & grandparents they were most proud of their families and their children not of their acquisitions!

 

[fellowChristian]

You know how to make God laugh?
Tell Him your plans.

After 4 kids we said “we’re done.” Then God gave us one more. A great nephew who’s mother (my niece) had been killed. I never would have dreamed of adopting, but we did. We have 5 now and know that when God calls us to parent anymore we will answer His call.

All that children need are the basics.

A roof over there head.

Clothes on their backs.

Food in their tummies.

And love for their souls.

If it is all about the things…prepare to work alot,be home less and too tired to spend time with the little people who will leave you faster then you think.

 

[mesurman]

Hi, I just happened to be wondering about the ramifications - good and not-so-good - of having a large family. I am an only child, but most of the women I’ve dated come from a large family and want a large family of their own one day. Personally, I’m perfectly fine with it. However, before I jump into anything, I’d like to find out what the ramifications are, in terms of financial planning/stability, of having many kids and having the wife being a stay-at-home mom.

On top of it, my parents are against the idea of stay-at-home moms, and I’ve had more than a few “discussions” with them on this very topic. They think that it would be way too much pressure on me, and that the quality of life would be reduced. They tend to think that a two-income family is the way to go. They also think that the SAHM will become detached from society, and so wouldn’t have much common language with the husband.

I haven’t talked to my parents about homeschooling yet, but I’m sure they’ll have their fair share of objections on that one, too. The good thing is that they ultimately just want me to be happy, and they will be accepting and supportive of my decisions once I make them. I know they do want the best for me, but it makes it that much harder to talk to them about it.

Anyway, your (name removed by moderator)ut would be great appreciated. Thank you in advance!

 

[mesurman]

Sorry for the first blank post.

Father of six here ages 24 to 7. Home schooling and catholic high schools for the past 18 years or so. Sole provider and self employed. Each baby is born with a loaf of bread in it’s mouth. My wife and I have heard it all about the size of our family, some of the rudest and crudest from family members or from complete strangers. Oh well. We both work hard and know that we are blessed. No major vacations or trips, no new cars, but we have a loving and caring family well grounded in our faith and work ethic. Heck we have to work hard just to survive here in New Hampshire.
Just put your head down and go, pray, pray and pray some more. It all works out in the end. Our children are not a burden, alot of hard work and worry but never a burden and we let that show to all who see us. Ramifications? hugs and kisses when I get home from work, seeing my oldest children become adults and getting married, having our first grandchild (another blessing). Only good things here. I have come to realize that most people who make comments about the size of my family are either ignorant or jealous, either way I pray for them and move on, no sense in worrying about what other people think, I only worry about what God thinks. Press on.